Am I Being Ripped off? Plumber Gouging Me

singlemalt72 on 24/10/2023 - 21:07
Last edited 25/10/2023 - 09:29 by 1 other user

So, a couple Sundays ago we had a blocked sewer all the way back to the house lower level and I had to get a plumber in.
I pulled an inspection hatch in our driveway and it was gushing out black water so I resealed it.

Plumber arrives and tells me for future reference it is a council issue from the inspection point, but he can snake it with the high pressure water snake and see off it will clear.

About 35 minutes of work with the snake and it eventually cleared, I did all the cleanup myself.

$420 bill arrives today - now I know it was a Sunday and all, but 400 bucks for less than an hours work?

This is why I hate calling in tradies.

Home & Garden

Comments

  • Jimothy Wongingtons on 24/10/2023 - 21:12
    +151

    400 seems pretty cheap ? Like surely the call-out was at least $100?

    • Toph Beifong on 24/10/2023 - 21:45
      +17

      These days more like $200

    • DrScavenger on 24/10/2023 - 22:08
      +87

      Saying cheap for 400$ shows how everyone in this country should be a trade and not a doctor, engineer, IT guy etc

      • Jimothy Wongingtons on 24/10/2023 - 22:16
        +5

        What do you think it should cost then for job as per op description (let’s simplify and assume it’s a sole trader not paying himself overtime and job is indeed 1hr work, but is done on the books with an invoice).

        Also what do you think is a fair hourly rate for a skilled tradesman?

        • TightAl on 25/10/2023 - 10:48
          +6

          Mind you GPs are by the books and they invoice potentially $250-400 an hour?
          Do you think that's fair?

          • Jimothy Wongingtons on 25/10/2023 - 10:57

            @TightAl: Are you asking me or drscavenger?

          • ihbh on 25/10/2023 - 14:42

            @TightAl:

            fair

            Is that for you coming to GP or GP coming to your house (incl call out time and depreciation, petrol, etc.)?

            • TightAl on 25/10/2023 - 14:53
              +3

              @ihbh: Medicare pays $45 for the call out fee for a GP/Locum

              • Sammyboy on 27/10/2023 - 17:54
                -1

                @TightAl: Imagine if the dr could charge a $200 call out fee, there would be riots. Yet the all the trades get away with it.

                • Scrobo on 27/10/2023 - 18:11
                  +2

                  @Sammyboy: I wouldn't want to drive out, lord knows how far, to some guy's place on a Sunday and not get a pretty good pay for it. Puts a hole in your entire day. By the time you load up, drive out there, do the job, get back, unload, clean the tools, put them away, log the job, do the invoice etc. it's a fair bit of work.

                  • Sammyboy on 27/10/2023 - 19:58
                    +1

                    @Scrobo: Fair enough. But fact is no one would pay a dr $200 call out on top of consultation and meds to come out on a Sunday either. Dr is on call too, possibly late at night, driving also a far distance, bringing diagnostic equipment that also has to be disinfected, risk of getting assaulted and robbed for the basic meds they carry, and also potentially injured on site if the path to the house is unsafe and poorly lit. Ppl still expect it to be bulk billed

                    • Baghern on 05/11/2023 - 12:44

                      @Sammyboy: Thats because the Government pays for most of it,

                      and its not doctors, its registered nurses who does those calls and they're earning 200-300k+

                      We accept tradies rates because its essentially a casual rate, they only make mega money if they can book back to back calls near each other

                      A big issue with tradies is its a big mix bag of crap and good tradies, there is no regulated grade system we can pay them on

                • JIMB0 on 27/10/2023 - 21:29

                  @Sammyboy: They can get away with it due to market forces. High prices are a signal for more people to get into trades. This would increase supply and push down prices.

          • RTX9090Ti on 25/10/2023 - 16:53
            +3

            @TightAl: My medical specialist charge just $150 per visit after medicare so yeah being a tradie is better.

          • ATangk on 25/10/2023 - 20:25

            @TightAl: Quote for consult, $469 for half an hour appointment. Medicare will reimburse less than $100 for that.

          • ThadtheChad on 26/10/2023 - 10:07
            +5

            @TightAl: Are you equating a doctor with a plumber?

        • OzzyOzbourne on 25/10/2023 - 15:29
          +7

          Skilled basically means a job that pretty much anyone can learn to do, eg putting a hose in a hole, but has paid for a certificate, so I'd say about $20 ph.

        • superchroma on 25/10/2023 - 20:02
          +15

          Less than that. I will continue to do their jobs and not call these screwballs because at these prices it is cheaper for me to take the time, buy the specialist tools and make the mistakes whilst learning, than to accommodate some (usually impatient) guy who will do an average job at best.

          It's very rare that a number of these "specialists" have any particular skills or art out of reach of a patient layperson.

          They can't do my job, but I can do theirs with a little effort and motivation. They're overvalued.

          • Wiser on 26/10/2023 - 10:49
            +6

            @superchroma: You are absolutely right.
            Half skilled tradies with no ethics.
            If they are working in a private company, wouldn't last half a day.
            No language skills , poor communication and rude.
            There must be a licensing authority for these people have some basic skills and communication skills.
            Anyone can call themself a conreter, landscaper, tiler
            Carpenter or a cabinetmaker.
            A plumber and electrician needs licences. Even then you wonder how these people got their license.
            With an open market they can charge whatever comes to their mind at that moment.
            We poor customers are at the receiving end.
            Better upskill and acquire some basic equipments

      • Muzeeb on 24/10/2023 - 22:42
        +49

        To put it in perspective:

        Probably plumbers day off for church etc so if anyone is to work on their day off they would expect an overtime allowance. I get paid double for overtime so surely the plumber can expect that also.

        Travel time - let's say he drove 20mins each way plus the associated costs of running the car/SUV/RAM2500

        Tools - OP does not own a snake or other plumbing tools or need a tradies trailer to pull them around.

        Skill set - OP could not clear the drain without potential further damage due lack of skill and knowledge

        Overheads - part of the payment has to go to superannuation, offset week day staff, apprentices, bookkeeper etc etc etc (probably not towards tax though).

        • Jimothy Wongingtons on 24/10/2023 - 22:58
          +37

          Raptor gen 2 demands only the most premium of premium diesel.

          • downhillar on 25/10/2023 - 09:35
            +7

            @Jimothy Wongingtons: New Raptor's are petrol (98 premium preferred) not diesel, hence the $400 bill for OP :)

            • Jimothy Wongingtons on 25/10/2023 - 09:39
              +8

              @downhillar: Really? Wow- guess that’s what I get for being a filthy sr5 diesel hilux driver.

              98 premium

              In that case:

              HEY THAT SMELLS LIKE 95 -

              SHE NEEDS PREMIUM, DUDE- PREMIUUUUMMMMM!!!
              DUDDEEEEE!!!

        • coffeeinmyveins on 25/10/2023 - 09:34
          +6

          Skill set - OP could not clear the drain without potential further damage due lack of skill and knowledge

          What about the skillset of the doctor that studied for many years and has a huge debt as a result?

          I see way more tradies cruising around in $100+ special edition Raptors than I do doctors in Mercedes and BMWs.

          • DingoBilly on 25/10/2023 - 10:12
            +2

            @coffeeinmyveins: To be honest, I've never seen a doctor drive any car which is setting a confirmation bias.

            Fairly easy to stereotype someone driving a pickup truck as a tradie. But impossible to know whether random person driving a nice car is a doctor, barista, unemployed, etc.

          • Sammyboy on 27/10/2023 - 17:57

            @coffeeinmyveins: This is a country where people who study their asses off in school and uni are called nerds and teased. There is generally no appreciation for the hardwork the medicos have put in. Medicare has spoilt the population too with bulk billing, so everyone has been used to free medical. Actually most trade utes are worth way more than the C class / 3 series that a lot of Drs drive.

        • Montyjpm on 25/10/2023 - 10:34
          +1

          Don't forget a happy ending massage at the end of the day.

        • drfuzzy on 26/10/2023 - 03:02

          You also need to factor in the time cost of responding to complaints about the bill.

          And the cost of bad debts.

          (And insurance, advertising, registration, etc)

          I have a basement pump that requires a simple 1 hour service and it costs me $550/year. If I don't do it the pump won't stop alarming that the service is overdue. I wait until the pain from the alarm is greater than the pain from the invoice.

        • wagonweel on 28/10/2023 - 14:34
          +1

          Exactly.
          Those tools … all of them would cost more than most peoples yearly wage. Who goes to their normal 9-5 cushy office job on a weekend without expecting upto double pay on a weekend when all you are supplying is yourself.

          Which job would you rather do, a doctor who consults for 5-10mins or a plumber who also has to have the skills to diagnose what the problem is and may end up covered in poo.

          Not saying the prices are great but with harly anyone wanting to go into trades these days it's only.going to get more expensive with the increased demand.

      • rumblytangara on 24/10/2023 - 23:29
        +5

        How much would you expect a doctor to charge you for making a house call on a Sunday?

        • lordezekiel on 25/10/2023 - 06:15
          +10

          Equating a doctor to a plumber?
          Yeah nah, don't think so mate.

          • Muzeeb on 25/10/2023 - 07:42
            +16

            @lordezekiel: What about an urologist to a plumber?

          • rumblytangara on 25/10/2023 - 09:44
            +9

            @lordezekiel: Think about whatever your own job is. Would you do callouts for $400 on a Sunday?

            Saying cheap for 400$ shows how everyone in this country should be a trade and not a doctor, engineer, IT guy etc

            I'm an IT guy (which DrScavenger also bought up). I wouldn't do a callout to some rando's house for that amount. And perhaps unlike you, I don't think I'm 'better' than some tradie who has the experience and the tools.

            • buckethat on 25/10/2023 - 21:05
              +1

              @rumblytangara: Not disagreeing with you but I don't think the comparison is fair.

              Callouts to some rando's house is normal par for the course as a plumber, where it may not be for a GP/IT guy. So of course if you're not used to it being part of your everyday routine, you wouldn't want to do it for that price.

            • lordezekiel on 25/10/2023 - 22:27
              +5

              @rumblytangara: I basically live on $400 a week, so to pay someone $400+ for less than an hour's work would seem pretty rich to me. Sunday is just Sunday, you get one every week, it's not like they are giving up christmas or something…

              • drfuzzy on 26/10/2023 - 03:04
                +5

                @lordezekiel: To someone unemployed Sunday is just Sunday.
                To working people it is actually a rare time to try to recharge and get some personal tasks done.

              • Scrobo on 27/10/2023 - 18:15
                -1

                @lordezekiel: If you have kids, and have to miss their soccer game, or cancel your movie or whatever it was you do on the weekend with the family, or even if it's just hanging with your mates, it's a fair price. Include the prep time, the drive time both ways, the tool cleaning, the insurance, book-keeping time, GST etc. it doesn't leave as much in your pocket as it sounds. If it's a company they are paying him double time, and super etc etc.

        • OzzyOzbourne on 25/10/2023 - 15:31
          +12

          Not everyone can learn to be a doctor however most people can learn to shove a hose into a hole

          • brendanm on 25/10/2023 - 15:38
            +12

            @OzzyOzbourne: Sure they can, just flip a coin. If heads, refer to a specialist, if tails, give prescription for antibiotics.

          • drfuzzy on 26/10/2023 - 03:04

            @OzzyOzbourne: Is there a difference?

            (disclosure: I am a doctor).

        • May4th on 25/10/2023 - 21:56
          +2

          How much would you expect a doctor to charge you for making a house call on a Sunday?

          a lot less than $420 actually. medicare rebate is about $127 for an after hours home visit on sunday between 7am to 11pm and $150 11pm to 7am - good luck getting a plumber out of bed at 3am for less than $500, or at all

          • Sammyboy on 27/10/2023 - 20:06

            @May4th: And imagine if all drs decided to stop doing weekend and late call outs due to the crap payments. The only reason they are doing it, is because of a code of ethics and their own willingness to help the sick. At the end of the day they could probably all refuse to do this unless people pay them $500. There's plenty of work available for drs at medical centres and clinics.

      • azero on 25/10/2023 - 10:19
        +3

        This is for a paediatric ENT specialist. Straight from the document given to me by the clinic.

        Adenoids, removal of (including any examination of the… $373.75

        So the plumber cost more than a surgery.

      • GooseHoward on 26/10/2023 - 09:01
        -2

        I dunno about plumbers but a lot of tradesmen bust up their bodies by the time they're in their 40s doing hard physical labour, for what it's worth

    • HeWhoKnows on 25/10/2023 - 11:24
      +5

      And on a Sunday as well
      What does OP expect?
      OP was lucky not to be charged $1,000 for a "Sunday emergency service"
      I know others that were charged $1,000 for a Sunday callout for the same problem.

      Seriously OP - get real mate.

      Im sure you would prefer to have your sunday off work
      So does the plumber mate.

      • cunningdrew on 25/10/2023 - 16:42
        +15

        Spoken like a tradie!

      • ThithLord on 26/10/2023 - 10:26
        +3

        And he's got to deal with OP's shit

      • Widget on 28/10/2023 - 17:44

        Wel, if Plumber wants the Sunday off, take the Sunday off. Never quite understood why Sundays equals more money.

    • CalmLemons on 25/10/2023 - 12:27
      +3

      $400 is really cheap for a sunday, that normally attracts a double rate.

    • dane005 on 28/10/2023 - 22:54
      +1

      I'm a tradesman, not a plumber though. I wouldn't turn up to your house on a Sunday for $400. Would cost you at least double that. Don't forget the drive to yours, the drive home, restocking the van. The time invoicing. Getting changed, washing your clothes. Insurances, advertising, accounting, professional development. Buying the missus a gift to make up for missing whatever shit she wanted you to do.

    • Sinnerator on 29/10/2023 - 08:35
      +1

      its this kind of thinking that has partly ruined australia, they have conditioned you/us to think that these prices are ok when they are not
      most other countries trades are just a normal job without the BS pricing we have here
      business needs to be tranparent with pricing UPFRONT

  • Some Human on 24/10/2023 - 21:17
    +23

    Did you have the knowledge, ability and equipment to diagnose and fix it yourself? If not, you have to pay up.

    • star-ggg on 24/10/2023 - 21:34
      +9

      OP hates calling tradies but dosent do the work themselves

      • singlemalt72 on 25/10/2023 - 09:00
        +3

        OP does nearly all the work himself but does not own a high pressure water snake - I actually spent time with 4m of electrical conduit hooked up to the hose to try and clear it.

        • pformag on 25/10/2023 - 11:01
          +12

          OP should have checked the internet and bought one. https://www.mitre10.com.au/karcher-pipe-cleaning-kit-7-5m

          • pilchard on 25/10/2023 - 22:22

            @pformag: Thanks for pointing out these exist!

          • Jackson on 25/10/2023 - 23:20

            @pformag: Plus another 500 for a half decent pressure washer, and it's still probably not as powerful as the dedicated one, nor as easy to find what you should be shooting as those with a camera on the end

          • kiwimex on 28/10/2023 - 22:11

            @pformag: they are only good for an at home colonoscopy

        • Kangal on 26/10/2023 - 11:28

          Hey OP might I suggest more fiber in your diet?

          Prevention and not cure, or the shiitz getting clogged and you're getting screwed by the plumber like pron video. Maybe cheaper to call in a mathematician next time?

  • whatwasherproblem on 24/10/2023 - 21:17
    +24

    If you're being serious, then yes: that price sounds about right for that work.

    If you're setting up for the classic joke instead, then you've left off the punchline.

  • bohn on 24/10/2023 - 21:19
    +25

    jetskis don't fund themselves

  • Muzeeb on 24/10/2023 - 21:20
    +16

    $420 bill arrives today

    If only it was $420.69

    That would have been niiiiicer.

  • tsunamisurfer on 24/10/2023 - 21:20
    +25

    You are not just paying for his time, but his expertise, his equipment, and of course a solution.

    $400 for a Sunday fix sounds reasonable to me.

    How much do you think is reasonable?

    • hasher22 on 25/10/2023 - 00:20
      +6

      OP prob thinks $50 is reasonable given they are stating "for less than an hours work?" and has a wage mind set rather than solution, trade mindset.

      • singlemalt72 on 25/10/2023 - 09:03
        -6

        Well, seeing as my wife is a project manager and they are billed by trade plumbers at $60 an hour I am quite happy in paying double time on that plus a call-out fee $120+$100, even $50 for equipment comes to $270 which looks more reasonable to me. $300 at most is what I would consider reasonable.

        • Rahonui on 25/10/2023 - 09:35
          +22

          Then in future when you make the call, tell them that you're only comfortable being billed at $120 per hour with a call out fee of $100. You'll spend more time on the phone ringing different companies after they each tell you where to go lol

        • JIMB0 on 25/10/2023 - 09:36
          +32

          Why didn't you get your wife to call one of those plumbers then?

          • cunningdrew on 25/10/2023 - 16:45
            +5

            @JIMB0: Cause it was Sunday and they would probably charge him 400 dollabucks. :p

        • tsunamisurfer on 25/10/2023 - 12:27
          +6

          billed by trade plumbers at $60 an hour

          In Perth I have not experienced plumbers at less than $100 per hour for years.

          • cunningdrew on 25/10/2023 - 16:46
            +3

            @tsunamisurfer: Agreed. I have no idea who is billing anything, as a company, for $60 an hour…. in any industry.

            • tsunamisurfer on 25/10/2023 - 16:48
              +3

              @cunningdrew: Plumbers, electricians, roofers, in fact virtually all trades are now earning more than prostitutes.

        • stewy on 27/10/2023 - 12:23
          +1

          Yeah but if your wife called the plumber out to a project on a weekend, it's probably a minimum of 4 hours at double time rates.

          So $420 is definitely reasonable.

          Honestly when I clicked this link I was expecting you to be whinging about the like of the electrical and plumbing mob/scammers with blue vans that would have charged you thousands for a Sunday call out.

        • Vintage4 on 27/10/2023 - 13:07

          $60ph ? Hmmm… OP forgot to check with wife on Schedule of Rates like minimum 3 hour call out and all the exclusions in the commercial space which may include sewage works as addition and having minimum 2 man team onsite.

          Yes $400 seems reasonable for a Sunday.

    • capslock janitor on 27/10/2023 - 13:03

      whats the matter with sundays??

  • PissLUR on 24/10/2023 - 21:21
    +13

    Plumbers that dont demand cash on the same day are usually charging fair prices.

    • cunningdrew on 25/10/2023 - 16:47
      +4

      Good point. If OP had $300 cash on him, the guy probably would have taken it and been on his way.

  • AustriaBargain on 24/10/2023 - 21:23
    +6

    I had a plumber come and fix a tap that wouldn't turn off in the kitchen. It started running again and they sent someone else out to fix it and apologist for not fixing it properly in the first place. They still haven't sent a bill and it was months ago. I was meant to pass the bill onto the owner but no bill appeared. I even told them they didn't send a bill.

  • brendanm on 24/10/2023 - 21:24
    +30

    $420

    What a legend.

    You got someone to drop what they are doing on a Sunday, drive to your house, use specialist equipment to jet sewerage and get you sorted, and you think that was too much?

    • Muzeeb on 24/10/2023 - 21:30
      +6

      Probably went home via his dealer so he could chill the rest of the afternoon. That's how he came up with his price.

      • brendanm on 24/10/2023 - 21:30
        +2

        That's what I was envisioning.

      • DashCam AKA Rolts on 24/10/2023 - 21:32
        +4

        Phone diagnosis was charged $69.

  • DashCam AKA Rolts on 24/10/2023 - 21:31
    +17

    $420 for a Sunday call out, traveling time and dealing with someone else's sh1t…..
    O.P. would you do that?

      • DashCam AKA Rolts on 25/10/2023 - 09:17
        +8

        Wasn't the question.
        $420 for a Sunday call out, traveling time and dealing with someone else's sh1t…..
        O.P. would you do that?

          • DashCam AKA Rolts on 25/10/2023 - 09:40
            +11

            @singlemalt72:

            And yes I have often been called out Sundays for work.

            And you expect to be paid appropriately, I'm sure.

            an emergency plumber on a Sunday. He has to stop whatever he was doing, get dressed for work, travel to you (and back, you're reasonably paying for both) put tens of thousands of dollars worth of equipment (vehicle, plumbing gear) into play. Plus the cost of insurance (liability, etc). Then once he's home, clean up, etc.

            You're just salty because

            Plumbers job to deal with sh1t

            and the plumber wants to be paid appropriately for his time in travel, time on the job, on costs in equipment, licensing, insurance and inconvenience of a weekend call out.
            Your flight on the following morning had nothing to do with the plumber or his overheads.

    • capslock janitor on 27/10/2023 - 13:05

      whats the significance of sundays?

      • DashCam AKA Rolts on 27/10/2023 - 13:19
        +1

        A number of tradies I know work Mon - Fri, occasionally Saturday (usually for mates in contra deals).
        You want a tradie Sunday = Sunday rates. Those I know, do this because they've got plenty of work and want at least a day off on weekends.

  • Porker on 24/10/2023 - 21:46
    +25

    With trade, best of you adjust your mindset such that you are paying for an outcome and not the time taken.

    Is $400 okay for the outcome achieved?

    An experinced tradesperson does the job in 35 mins. An inexperienced tradesperson might take 2 hours to do the same job.

    Would you feel more comfortable with the second option? As such, pay for the outcome/product not the time taken.

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