Linux Is Free. Why Does Nobody Use It?

RefusdClassification on 01/05/2024 - 08:59
Last edited 02/05/2024 - 10:00

People love free stuff, with the sole exception of Linux. Yesterday there was a post where you could claim a few images linked to your Steam account for free. "[Steam] Free - 2 Animated Stickers, Avatar Frame (Steam Farming Fest)". 114 upvotes (including one from me; I average 3 upvotes a day), and 2028 click throughs. Linux just isn't a few mediocre images; it is an entire, fully functional Operating System. But ordinary people (ie non-programmers, people without jobs in IT, people who aren't running or administrating servers) don't want anything to do with it. Why hasn't Linux taken off?

I think about my personal history. I guess you could say I am locked into the Microsoft Windows ecosystem. Most of the programs I run are Mfc compiles, but there are also some .Net, some Java and a few annoying Python programs that I generally have to run from the Console, like gallery-dl (+ Chainner, which has a proper GUI). I started with DOS, then Windows 95, 98 2000, XP, 7 and now 10. If I wanted to switch to another OS I would need an OS with either native versions of all the programs that I use, or seemless Windows emulation (no having to start an emulator and tweak it for every program I wanted to run, like say Dosbox). It's different for Zoomers or younger Millenials, since they haven't become ossified like me over 3 decades. They don't really have an excuse for not using Linux.

Lastly, for people familiar with Linux, what is the best version of Linux for Windows users to try (for one who hates the Terminal/Command line/Console or whatever the proper name is)?

Real world figures (the people commenting here don't seem to be a representative sample): "For desktop computers and laptops, Microsoft Windows is the most used at 72.99%, followed by Apple's macOS at 16.13%, and Google's ChromeOS at 1.76%, and desktop Linux at 3.77%. Since ChromeOS is a Linux based OS, it can be added to the total desktop Linux share bringing it to 5.53%." I'm not bashing any OS, just saying what the reality is. I'm not a Microsoft shareholder, so I have no vested interest in hyping Windows. People jokingly talk about downloading Linux ISOs, but of course what they are doing is downloaded pir8ted films and/or pornography. Raid arrays on NASes with 4 x 16TB hard disks aren't used for storing and serving distros. Lots of Windows users use free software like JDownloader2, XnView, Thunderbird for email, Qbittorent, VLC, IrfanView, 7Zip, Audacity, CCleaner, and of course Chromium based browsers (at the moment the only non-Microsoft payware exe running on my system is Total Commander, a fantastic file manager than is infintely superior to Windows explorer). Windows users like freeware; they just don't like Linux.

Poll Options expired

  • 627
    My primary OS is Windows
  • 126
    My primary OS is Linux
  • 156
    My primary OS is MacOS
  • 6
    I use another OS
  • 4
    I don't use a desktop OS; all I need is a cell phone
  • 4
    What is an OS?
Computing Linux Operating System

Comments

        • juns on 02/05/2024 - 10:25

          Good point, the only "major?" browser I can see that will do this by default would be Firefox. But I think Linux+Firefox combo has so little amount that the number won't matter in the grand scheme of things.

    • smartazz104 on 02/05/2024 - 16:52
      +1

      Who's using ChromeOS, come on hands up…

  • realaaa on 01/05/2024 - 12:49
    +3

    ahah we were talking about this in 2004 and STILL talking about it in 2024 :)

    it's not going to change mate, Linux and GNU are for tinkerers and who have time for this, all the rest just want something that works out of the box

    Ubuntu I guess is still going strong? Or Mint Linux seems to be optimised for general use.

    However now with WSL this is kind of overkill also, and it is actually more convenient to run Linux on Windows, than it used to be otherwise - Microsoft hasn't been sitting idle in the last decade !

    ChromeOS is also practically an optimised Linux by Google, but of course a very limited use case therefore mostly schools and unis etc

  • EightImmortals on 01/05/2024 - 12:51
    +1

    I know what you mean about being stuck in Windows, I've been using it since 3.1(?) but over the it has steadily moved to being fairly painful in a number of ways, the recent forcing people to an MS account to activate Windows 11 (in an upcoming release if you don't have it already) for e.g. On the other hand it's functionality has improved a LOT over the years as well.

    Have dabbled with Linux over the years and found it too much of a learning curve and a bit of a pain to get it to do stuff I can do in Windows with ease, it's improving but not quite there yet for the average user IMO. Having said that I have recently installed DeepinLinux ( https://www.deepin.org/index/en ) and found it to be pretty usable right out of the box. had to do a bit of googling for a couple of things but not too bad. The V23 Beta version is still a bit buggy but the previous 20.9 version is pretty good. Have only used it for desktop stuff and no gaming so far. Tried Linuxmint around the same time and wasn't happy, IIRC it wouldn't even drag and drop files properly at the time.

  • Forfiet on 01/05/2024 - 13:03
    +2

    I have 4 linux only systems, 3 windows only systems and 3+ android devices…..

  • trapper on 01/05/2024 - 13:18
    +1

    Windows is essentially 'free' for most people as it come pre-installed on the computer they purchased.

    • Chandler on 01/05/2024 - 15:53
      +4

      And herein is the primary issue. Linux doesn't come pre-installed. People don't want to install an OS - they want to buy a PC, turn it on, do some basic setup and get working/gaming/etc.

      Consumer hardware is generally Windows by default, and because of that corporate hardware is generally Windows by default, since most users (and importantly those controlling corporate purse-strings) will want to stick with what they know.

      Linux does come by default from some niche OEMs (i.e. System76) and optionally from some mainstream ones (i.e. Dell), but usually for only a few particular system configurations. Need to start seeing it available for most configurations available for purchase - especially lower-cost ones - and from more vendors before you'll really see it eating some market share.

      • WinterStar on 01/05/2024 - 19:34
        +2

        Pretty much this. About a year ago my old laptop's HDD died and I just got sick of having to spend hundreds to take it to a shop to get it fixed because I knew nothing about OS and storage devices, and boy did I have a bad time. I spent 2 months learning about everything I required and ended up learning I had to start from scratch because the HDD had gone past being able to be cloned. At this point I just wanted to give up and pay the hundreds but my pride just didn't allow it.

        So I learnt about installing OS, buying a new HDD, speaking with companies and getting advice, setting it back up to what I first got and after those 2 months, I was finally able to get everything back to how it was before the old HDD died. Don't get me wrong, I'm bloody glad I was able to learn more about laptop's so I know what to do in the future but man, the time spent not being able to use a computer and having to learn from scratch was dreadful, I just wanted to boot it up and use it, not spend so much time learning something new. Not to mention opening the laptop so many times actually destroyed the hinges and plastic on the bottom.

  • md333 on 01/05/2024 - 13:22
    +4

    I've found Linux to be lacking a middle ground.
    It seems to be great if all you want to use is the stuff built into the version you are using.
    If you are happy diving into the command line and compiling your own software etc it is very powerful.

    When you just want to run an application that is not in the standard distribution it can become very confusing.
    That then leads me to not run it often enough because windows is easier, leading to more issues as it gets too out of date and every time I do run it the repositories I need to update have been taken off line.

  • USER DC on 01/05/2024 - 13:27
    +2

    Windows is technically free too, (ofcourse just unlicenced)

    • Chandler on 01/05/2024 - 15:58
      +1

      Well it usually comes "free" with the PC you bought, so generally licensed.

      I don't think I've ever bought a Windows license personally. Have paid for some upgrades (2000→XP→Vista, maybe even up to 7…?) and had some free ones (8→10). Although I think the 2000 was keygen'd,

    • BBear53 on 04/05/2024 - 14:37

      Windows actually can be free if you use Massgrave.

      It's kind of a grey area but it's hosted on Github and Microsoft owns that and hasn't taken it down so draw your own conclusion from there.

      End of the day I don't think they really care about selling Windows licenses given the free upgrade from 10 to 11 and that 11 is effectively free with the unlicensed version anyway. They seem to just want everyone on the same version.

  • Godric on 01/05/2024 - 14:57
    +3

    Accessibility, Compatibility, Familiarity

  • Roddi on 01/05/2024 - 15:20
    +2

    I use Linux mint for my non-work PC. Just web and email so it's fine.
    Problem is that the noticeable improvements Linux gives you are just nice to have and don't really sell it over Windows: better updates, smaller install, less memory use.
    While Linux's problems are more annoying: some Steam games are flakier on Linux but run fine on my identical Win box, Office compat is not perfect (this is a big deal if sending a resume), and command line buggery from time to time to get something working.
    So I'd say Linux is more efficient than Win, but that doesn't really matter in the age of 16GB RAM, TB hdds.

    • o53djz7qTPY4der on 02/05/2024 - 10:11
      +2

      Problem is that the noticeable improvements Linux gives you are just nice to have and don't really sell it over Windows

      I disagree with this.

      Linux does just give you nice to haves. Functionally it excels where Windows doesn't. It's snappier and less annoying than Windows. It doesn't bug me to update. And, most importantly, it doesn't spy on me. I think, where we may differ, I don't play games so I don't notice any issues there. I also don't use MS Office for work - we are wholly Google so everything is web based and if sending a resume I convert to PDF. Essentially I live my life inside a browser aside from a handful of times I might open LibreOffice to view a spreadsheet locally.

      • Roddi on 02/05/2024 - 14:13

        Both my linux and win boxes are ryzen 3600 with 16GB. They're about the same in terms of snappiness and even boot times. I've definitely seen Linux running better on Win on older hardware - but we're talking early Core i5 here. Now CPUs are crazy fast - 12 cores! - and RAM is plentiful so I've seen the observable difference diminish. My wife uses Win on one of those cheapo SFF PCs we get here - 8GB RAM and a crappy i5 4750T which is 1/6 the speed of my ryzen - and it works fine.

        The spying one is interesting. I don't trust MS particularly, bur but I trust them a whole lot more than I trust Google. So I use Firefox/Chromium rather than Chrome (hell, I'd rather use Edge rather than Chrome). And a paid email provider for all my personal and financial email, and use the Thunderbird desktop client. I doubt that MS is sniffing SMTP (email) network traffic.

  • Nillionaire on 01/05/2024 - 15:33
    +1

    because almost everything I do is inside a browser, I don't really care which OS

  • rumblytangara on 01/05/2024 - 15:42
    +2

    Windows or MacOS comes preinstalled on any computer that is bought, so why on earth would any normal, non-enthusiast geek spend a hour downloading ISOs, prepping boot USB sticks and then another hour or more setting up Linux on the desktop?

    Most people want the path of least resistance, which doesn't involve reinstalling an OS.

  • R4 on 01/05/2024 - 18:06
    +1

    A non-issue to anyone other than a computer geek. Windows comes preinstalled on most computers so just go with that. It's really cheap to buy if you don't already have it.

    Go with what makes you happy.

  • maverickjohn on 01/05/2024 - 18:07

    I tried Linux when it was redhat… Hated it. Just never got back into it. I love windows it just works for me and my primary purpose for PC is watching shows and gaming. Pretty happy with windows for those two features.
    Gaming has to be windows for best compatibility so unless compatibility increases for Linux then I'll stick with windows.

    • Forfiet on 01/05/2024 - 20:06
      +1

      Depends what you regard as 'increased compatibility'……

  • bygones on 01/05/2024 - 19:17
    +1

    I think we prefer to use the product which we are familiar with. From childhood, we start learning Windows OS, so feel more comfortable using that. Overall people prefer easy, and those who don't want to bother about configuartion of tech product - they always prefer what they feel simple. So people don't want to switch to Linux.

    However, I guess the main reason is application support, primarily MS Product. If Microsoft makes MS Office package for Windows, it would surely lose good number of users. Although there are many alternatives/web version of MS products like Google Suite, Libre or Open Office - nothing can beat desktop version of Excel. I personally use Google Docs/Sheets, but this can never replace MS Excel for official use.
    Now even Microsoft Teams is also not available for Linux, though can use Web version.

    The second is Photoshop or any other professional tools.
    I have 2 laptops at the moment - In one laptop where I use Debian (I am commenting from Debian right now), and the second laptop with Windows 11, where I have installed Adobe Photoshop, Autocad. So, my regular go to is my Linux one, but need to move to Windows if I need to use Photoshop. I have tried GIMP, but it's too much to learn or no enough tools like in Photoshop. So, if I had just 1 laptop - I'd surely use Windows over Linux.

    So those who are not tech savy would prefer to use Windows. Most of laptop companies ship products with Windows, although we had seen Dell with Ubuntu as well. Installing Linux needs at least a bit technical knowledge, Ubuntu is simpler - others are probably not. As Ubuntu is forcing to use snap by default, now I have already switched to Debian.

    For normal people: If you use laptop just for using Browser/watching movies - then why to bother installing linux.
    For Gamers: Unless you are Linux fan, why to bother use Steam.
    For Heavy application Users: Linux alternatives are limited or not available.

    • Droz on 03/05/2024 - 13:52

      For normal people: If you use laptop just for using Browser/watching movies - then why to bother installing linux.

      Your points all hit, but for the first there is exactly one reason why you would: Not a windows computer, therefore waaaaaaay less chance of viruses. .exe files aren't running. Worth it just for that people I would say!

  • Rako on 01/05/2024 - 19:24

    MXLinux is brilliant, superfast, & free

  • pahuang on 01/05/2024 - 19:50
    +3

    OP should add one more option: I use more than one OS.
    I have linux running windows inside a VM. I also have dual boot machine and a mac from work. There is no perfect OS just different OS that sometimes is better at something than others.

  • arkanis50 on 01/05/2024 - 20:52
    +4

    I haven’t paid for a copy of Windows in probably a decade or more.

    • apey2000 on 01/05/2024 - 22:09

      Came here to say this. Do people actually pay for Windows!? o.O

    • ak47wong on 03/05/2024 - 01:38
      +1

      The last version of Windows I paid for was 8 and that was a decade ago. Upgrading to 10 and 11 was/is free.

  • UltimateAI on 01/05/2024 - 21:30
    +2

    My main PC is Windows but I have many vm’s locally on hyper-v and in the cloud, all running Linux. Many of your home appliances will be running Linux, router, robot vac, nas.

  • DemocracyManifest on 01/05/2024 - 21:39

    Fedora Workstation is probably the best for an end user but the occasional bug with the software updater, or a kernel update error, isn’t great for a newbie. The software update issue is probably more of the GNOME desktops faults then anything else but yeah…I updated my system in the end regularly with the command line. Alternatively run the KDE desktop, it’s not as pretty but it works well. But that’s basically the best if you want to run games on steam, it’s pretty much bleeding edge. I had too many issues with Ubuntu, can’t recommend it. Don’t use Manjaro. At the end of the day bugs will get ironed out quicker with Red Hat/Fedora.

    Saying that, a bad or incompatible update from Microsoft can stuff you up too and you’d probably have to boot up with a Linux system to retrieve your files anyway. Or end up in a command line environment to save your bacon. Pays to learn how to use your pc!

    https://fedoraproject.org/workstation/

  • SpicyStew on 01/05/2024 - 22:01
    +2

    android is linux

  • Randolph Duke on 01/05/2024 - 22:15

    I hope we get an Android vs iOS thread next.

  • flopsy on 01/05/2024 - 23:13

    "I'd just like to interject for a moment…"
    Switched to PopOS after frustrations with Windows 11. Many initial issues but I had lots of free time to learn.
    No interest in returning to Windows in its current state (despite superior support and reliability).
    Would probably run MacOS if there was a version without restrictions.

    • Droz on 02/05/2024 - 01:08
      +2

      I'm running a "hackintosh" on one of the cheap Dell Optiplex 3050s that kicks around - it runs great!

      If your hardware matches up with a Mac of the past, you can too… Some even get them running on Ryzen chips, if you want to muck about learning a whole bunch of interesting stuff.

      • flopsy on 02/05/2024 - 03:38

        Nice. I'm actually using a MacBook Pro, just don't personally like security restrictions on MacOS (even if it's working/justified).

        • Droz on 02/05/2024 - 09:08
          +2

          Looks like I interpreted your initial comment incorrectly then!

          I find windows and Linux both have the same security restrictions as macos however? Kinda the same as my Samsung phone asking me for permissions for a whole host of stuff if an app hasn't been used for a while and needs access to GPS, NFC, etc.

          • flopsy on 02/05/2024 - 13:27

            @Droz: I won't speak for Windows since it's not as directly comparable, but MacOS absolutely has restrictions relative to "free" Linux distributions. Even disabling SIP entirely, users still have to jump through hoops to run software without extensive approval (and fees) from Apple. Kernel modification is severely limited and while extensions are still permitted, significant user intervention is constantly required in the name of security.

            These are justified and reasonable measures for their product but I prefer the option.

  • fairyflossgrapes on 02/05/2024 - 03:33
    +4

    Compatibility for people who value their time over tinkering. I loved tinkering when I was younger, but now I don't have the time.

    • arkanis50 on 02/05/2024 - 09:07
      +1

      Exactly - I just want something that works straight out of the gate with all of my apps. Granted Linux has come a long way since I last played around with it in the early 2000's… but I value my time a lot more in my 40's.

  • FW190 on 02/05/2024 - 07:25

    "why no one use Linux?"

    IMHO, for the majority of end users, where their school/workplace would most likely be using either Windows or MacOS, there is really no reason to spend the time and effort to learn a new OS just for kicks.

    Personally, I dabbled into a bit of CLI Linux around the turn of the century, (when "learn Linux and stick it to Bill Gates" was all the rage), I didn't bother with it anymore after I ended up working in networking instead of systems, so no further reason to spend any more time on it.

    These days, I still use some Linux at work, 100% CLI, usually for jumphost and backup servers for logs and configs, I have retained enough knowledge to find my way around, and write some simple scripts here and there. Never tried any of the GUI versions of Linux though.

    For my home PC, I use Windows, as I only use it to play games and surf the internet, so, again, no pressing reason to switch to Linux, IMHO.

  • MisplacedGaijin on 02/05/2024 - 07:33
    +1

    Office workers and bureaucrats use Microsoft Office on Windows machines. Gamers use Windows. Pre-build PCs (bar Macs) are pre-loaded with Windows.

    That's because Micro$oft make agreements with manufacturers to pre-load only their bloatware.
    Good marketing, poor product.

  • jwh on 02/05/2024 - 07:51

    Windows 11 on my main PC, but still run Linux on my old HP Mircoserver. Still ticking along after 10 years on that same install. Still updates, still runs modern programs, generally set and forget.

    The issues is when something does go wrong, or if you need to install software that requires manual installation and configuration, you can spend a bit of time in the terminal. I just SSH in for most things, but most people don't have time for that.

  • figarow on 02/05/2024 - 08:41
    +2

    I run are Mfc compiles, but there are also some .Net, some Java and a few annoying Python programs that I generally have to run from the Console, like gallery-dl (+ Chainner, which has a proper GUI). I started with DOS

    Why hasn't Linux taken off?

    Because average Joe and average Jane use a browser, watch movies and copy photos from phone.

  • trankillity on 02/05/2024 - 09:08
    +1

    I've actually just started seriously investigating Linux as an alternative to Windows.

    The two things that have pushed me to do this are:
    - Microsoft deeming it OK to put advertising in a freaking paid-for OS.
    - WINE/Proton being bloody good at running games these days.

    Over the weekend I evaluated a few distros and ended on EndeavourOS. It wasn't my first choice, but I have some specific hardware requirements that I couldn't get working in other distros without needing an intimate knowledge of Linux.

    I've been pleasantly surprised with the experience since installing it however. It's come a long way in the last 25 years and is much more friendly to the end user with things like app stores/graphical package managers. It helps that almost all of my hobbies/interests are in the open source space (3D printing, analytics, custom mechanical keyboards, drones), so they all have native Linux apps. Aside from those niche apps, the other main ones I use for day to day (Vivaldi browser, Plexamp, Discord, Telegram) also all have native apps.

    If anyone's curious, I recommend putting an ISO on a USB stick and booting it up. They almost always boot into a Linux desktop environment preconfigured with frequently-used apps so that you can try it before you install.

  • beefmaster on 02/05/2024 - 09:09

    More interesting question would be why anyone uses Linux outside of Corp IT infrastructure and development.

    To be fair, I have a raspberry PI for Pi-Hole and Deluge Bittorrents. I cannot find any other home use for it.

    • BrettSh on 02/05/2024 - 10:23

      That is a good question. Being a web software developer (and total nerd) I use Linux on my laptop and my Raspberry Pi's. I love it. I would be less productive using Windows or macOS.

      However, I would never put Linux on my mum's computer.

      At the time I'm writing this, there are 62 Mac users and 52 Linux users. I'm actually a bit surprised there are almost as many Linux users as Apple users.

      • Crusader on 03/05/2024 - 23:18

        No, but you could easily install FlexOS or provide a Chromebook. ( running linux )

        Not only will it be more secure, it's a whole less maintenance.

        • BrettSh on 08/05/2024 - 15:06

          Hmm, FlexOS would be interesting.

    • Droz on 02/05/2024 - 11:11

      I've installed ZorinOS on older hardware, like 8th Gen ex-corporate Dell laptops, and the OS absolutely flies and is a pleasure to use.

      Basically, resurrecting systems that were otherwise dead due to hardware requirements of ever thirstier OSes

  • Scumbag on 02/05/2024 - 09:26

    This week I've installed Linux (Ubuntu server), so I can squeeze a bit better render performance out of Blender. Yes, I still use Windows as my daily driver.

  • cobknob on 02/05/2024 - 09:54
    -1

    Just a matter of time till Linux replaces Windows Update.. Then Windows

  • ChickenLips on 02/05/2024 - 09:57
    +1

    My rig is primarily for gaming. I run a gaming oriented distro primarily BUT online games require invasive cheat detection that doesn’t work in Linux. I want to be free of windows but literally can’t. I can imagine those gamers who care less would just go with the easiest option even though it costs money.

  • mrhugo on 02/05/2024 - 10:41

    What I see at sites out in the enterprise; ever increasing footprint in Chromebooks. Even the MacBook foot print is growing in some depts. Windows still 80% or more.

    Maybe for some niche groups, but I can't see Linux being used by anyone other then people who can support their own OS.

    I know a few pen testers who use a linux disto, honestly thats about it. But they also have a MBP for Office/Teams etc.

  • jaimex2 on 02/05/2024 - 10:43

    It's beyond most people. Installing it isn't easy as all the modern BIOS security stuff needs to be beaten into submission.

    My wife uses Linux and loves it. She has no idea she's using Linux. Her friends have asked about it but I'm not offering tech services.

    Honestly some people pay a lazy tax on life. If you're not interested in maintaining your own things and happy to pay trades/services a lot of money for simple things that they could have Googled that's on them.

    To quote Ace of Base. No ones gonna drag you up to get into the light where you belong.

    • ratoloko on 02/05/2024 - 10:56

      Installing it isn't easy

      That isn't true, even OPNSense router/firewall running FreeBSD I have running at home over JB-HIFI crappy solutions provide you step by step.
      Linux used to be hard asf to install, it isn't any different than Windows unless you are installing some weird version.

      • jaimex2 on 02/05/2024 - 16:19

        It's crazy hard for someone new to it. I've been using Linux for over a decade and even I run into wtf situations.

        New user, they have a Windows laptop from the store. It has Secure Boot, UEFI, Bitlocker and Fastboot.

        They are probably going to want to dual boot if they're trying it out which means dicking around with partitions.

        They're going to mess something up, royally. You already need to be a computer person to get this far.

        God help them if they have an nVidia card.

        The only way out of this is if the PC came with Linux pre-installed and ready to go.

  • ratoloko on 02/05/2024 - 10:53
    +2

    Because laptops and computer sold with Linux run the worst broken Linux operation system making people to think that Linux is nothing but a legend and lies.

    I run Linux on my homelab stuff and have been running Linux Mint Cinnamon for the recent years after using Ubuntu for like 10y or so which unfortunately has become Windows version of the Linux world.
    Keep in mind that I have a Lenovo Legion 5 PRO gaming laptop with WiFi6, RTX GPU, you name it and Linux Mint Cinnamon just runs.
    Drivers?? What drivers?? Linux kernels/system got you covered.

    I use my laptop running Linux for:

    • WFH: Lots of CLI ( command line task )
    • Browsing
    • CAD design ( Plasticity )
    • Manage/use my Vorons 3D printer
    • Play games but it have my Series X so I don't bother as much
    • Edit videos
    • Any task a Windows/Mac system can do but better without being locked

    Mind you, the internet you know and this very server is running on Linux.
    96.3% of the top one million web servers are running Linux. (ZDNet)
    47% of professional developers use Linux-based operating systems
    SpaceX runs Linux on their mission, good luck trusting that with Windows.
    Android (Linux) is far better than iOS but people like status over functionality.

    Answering your question:

    • Windows and Apple are idiot proof: Those system will do everything for you while locking your soul within their ecosystem.
    • People are willing to pay for the so called "computer repair shop" who replace hardware, fix nothing but charge you a kidney.
    • Windows/Mac users are okay with basics. Those users will use what the system has to offer, browser, ecosystem, etc. Some can barely open a browser.
    • If you ever cross some problem which is rare, you will need to visit forum to check for solution just like Windows and Mac
    • Again, hardware sold with Linux sucks so why bother????
  • payless69 on 02/05/2024 - 10:55
    -1

    I absolutely love it!

    But Gerry's dog does not…

    Some systems boot from a stick, some from a drive all great fun!

  • juzza87 on 02/05/2024 - 10:59
    +3

    I've tried so hard to use Linux for work and home but just can't do it.

    For work we have a corporate proxy and use notebooks, to use it for everything it needs to be configured in the GUI network manager, added as an environmental variable for the user, configured to work with sudo, manually added into particular applications like apt or dnf config files (they have their own configuration files and ignore environmental variables) then it'll work well. Until I need to use the notebook at home. It'll take minutes undo all of the changes so the internet is accessible again. Yes I could probably set up a forwarding proxy server on the notebook and turn it on or off when I'm at work/home, or create bash scripts to do most of the work for me, but why should an end user have to go through such hassles? There is a Linux distro that has thought of this called Clear Linux and for all intents and purposes it's just one button in the GUI however it's a rolling distro with limited package selection compared to the other distros. Proxy issues combined with defunct alternatives to the software required for work make it a non-starter (though I do try every few years).

    Then there's the general issues, people will say GIMP is a FOSS alternative to Photoshop - if you don't value your time maybe it can achieve the same results but it's a lot more work. For example if you want to put a stroke around some text, in PS you would just stroke the layer and any adjustments would happen on the fly. If you want to stroke text you'll need to re-do the stroke after adjusting the text size/font/etc. Steam compatibility is getting good but it's much more involved requiring adjusting files and settings, and things like proprietary drivers which need to install kernel extensions, if you upgrade your kernel then you risk breaking your system. Flatpak's are a cool concept but some of the big projects are packaged up by people not related to the projects, this could lead to potentially unwanted behaviour or lack of support, and repos are either going to be stale (but STABLE) versions of software, a nice balance between tested and recent or bleeding edge (you're on your own).

    Also not FOSS or Linux fault, but a lot of projects are maintained by one person or a small team and while they may have great skills at making the program do what it's meant to they're not designers and you'll often see a wonky mismatch of different interface cues and visuals (even when it's done well and you end up with KDE and GTK interfaces all over the place). As much as I hate Microsoft and Adobe, FWIW they have thousands of people working on their products and a consistent design language. Display scaling is also horrible with certain DEs, if you have a 4K display in a notebook, RIP.

    • cannedhams on 02/05/2024 - 23:46

      This is the best answer in the thread. If you're a noob, you're not going to want to get your head around a new OS. If you're a power user, you're eventually going to run into something. I would always encounter at least one hardware problem, usually sourcing a driver for the webcam or bluetooth adapter.

      The truly terrible days of Windows circa late 90s/early 2000s when virtually everyone had to run Malwarebytes just to keep the horde of worms and trojans at bay was Linux's best chance to get a foothold. I had a machine running Ubuntu at my workplace mainly just to connect hard drives with badly compromised windows systems to either try and save them or at least back up necessary files. I doubt that we are going to see any major movement now.

  • ScaryMagus on 02/05/2024 - 11:03
    +2

    Linux has been successful in the server space but has failed to penetrate the consume market. My conjecture as to why its failed to be adopted by consumers:
    - You need to shift people off windows - I don't think being "good" is sufficient. You need to be demonstrably better.
    - Most people don't pay for windows directly, so being free is mostly irrelevant.
    - It has almost no marketing compared to windows and even chrome OS.
    - It does have a perception that it is harder to use.
    - It doesn't run my apps. People are correct that most people just need a word processor and a browser, but when making purchasing decisions they tend to like "having the option". See also marketing offroad capabilities for 4WD's that most purchasers will never use. Also "equivalent open source" just sounds like a balls ache to me and I'm a power user.

    • Droz on 02/05/2024 - 11:06

      Great points - at work we need to use the Adobe suite, so believing something like "GIMP is just as good as Photoshop" (when it absolutely isn't) doesn't get around the fact that we are slaves to the Adobe Cloud, and therefore can't use Linux.

    • BendBridge on 05/05/2024 - 08:19

      All very good points. I think MS Office should probably be mentioned as well. While there are many free office suites out there, none is as dominant as MS Office. Most kids use them at schools, so it’s natural to stick to it once they start working. While I was in the work force, to ensure documentation compatibility, all vendors agreed to use MS Office. Now that I am no longer working, I just use the free Google Office Suites.

      • Droz on 05/05/2024 - 09:54

        The web versions of the MS Office 365 programs are quite good, so most corporations that have office will definitely have this subscription.

        For instance Outlook for the web is lighter, faster, and has better features than the native version.

        Same goes for Word, but for challenging excel spreadsheets I still think native is better.

        • ScaryMagus on 06/05/2024 - 08:47

          I can't agree Word is better. It has a couple of nice commenting/collaboration features, but has significant formatting issues.

          PowerPoint is also not great in the browser version.

        • BendBridge on 06/05/2024 - 09:16

          As for getting AXS stock values, Google Sheets provides them for free but I don’t think that’s the case for Excel.

  • PeelThis on 02/05/2024 - 11:07

    Like others have said, Linux is everywhere and pretty much runs the internet but from a consumer point of view for desktops and laptops you need to make a conscious choice and put in effort to switch over to using Linux.
    The average person won't see any benefit from doing so when they mostly use a browser and a handful of apps.
    Add on top of that the niche apps and games that are only developed for Windows or OSX and I can't justify it myself, unfortunately as it is today I need to run Windows for what I apps I use as there is no Linux support, so Linux would be used in addition to this.

    I don't love Windows, especially the way things are heading but that's the reality today.
    If there was parity of apps and driver support on Linux then yeah sure I would switch in a heartbeat but for me it's about the apps and compatibility, any other minor benefits from the OS itself just aren't worth the tradeoff.

  • Droz on 02/05/2024 - 11:12

    Honestly, macOS is essentially the consumer-friendly Linux that removes most hardware issues because the person that made the software also made the hardware.

    Why target every component in the world when you just have to support 6 in your lineup?

  • morebunnings on 02/05/2024 - 12:03

    But ordinary people (ie non-programmers, people without jobs in IT, people who aren't running or administrating servers) don't want anything to do with it.

    I've been a software developer for almost 20 years. Every time I've tried to use it for home desktop/laptop use its been a terrible disappointment.

    The amount of driver issues you have to get through is a mission. Then custom keyboard buttons still wont work. Things just seem to break all the time. Then heaps of apps you use everyday don't have usable alternatives, or the alternatives are so different that they take ages to configure and set up.

    Take my media PC for example. It runs Windows 11 + NordVPN + qtTorrent + VLC + Chrome. On an AMD Ryzen system with a 5600g CPU.

    Linux cant even wake up from sleep properly with this CPU. Setting up NordVPN requires command line knowledge. Windows 11 just works, and a legit windows key costs like ~$3. 30 minutes of stuffing around it'd take to get nordVPN working vs $3 is a no brainer.

  • dfg555 on 02/05/2024 - 12:12

    try deploying linux in a school environment and watch yourself get fired

  • Rockets84 on 02/05/2024 - 12:13

    An OS is a tool nothing more. Use the right tool for the right job. I've used Linux, OpenBSD & FreeBSD as servers or appliances since the late 90's. I've got multiple Debian Linux servers running on my home network for various tasks but I still use Windows on my desktops because it's the OS with widest compatibility with applications I need to do my job or for my home use. I've tried switching to Linux for my desktop multiple times now and it mostly goes smoothly till I hit that one piece of software or peripheral that just refuses to play ball and I switch back.

  • qaz182 on 02/05/2024 - 13:55

    If the software I used (particularly video games) ran on Linux not Windows, i'd use Linux

    • ESEMCE on 02/05/2024 - 15:46

      (particularly video games)

      they probably do!

    • lunchbox99 on 03/05/2024 - 11:26
      +1

      Steam deck proves this is possible. It runs SteamOS which is Valve's custom Arch linux distro.

  • cobknob on 02/05/2024 - 14:08

    People love free stuff, with the sole exception of Linux.

    No. People only love the free stuff, when

    1. Its physical
    2. It costs money before
    3. Etc

    Pretty sure people would be happy to get enterprise level Linux (paid) for free, maybe not the plebs, but businesses would

  • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 02/05/2024 - 14:17
    +1

    Same reason most people drive cars rather than ride motorbikes.

    That said, Linux and motorbikes rock.

  • Mparadox on 02/05/2024 - 14:27

    I run Linux (Ubuntu) dualboot with Windows 11. I swapped over to Linux last year as my research (ML) required lots of dependencies that only run on Linux. Tried popOS but lots of issues. Switched over to Ubuntu which I found to have just more support for most things in general.

    My main gripe with Linux and the reason why I now run dual boot - is that for non research / programming work, it really has poor support.
    There's no office (don't tell me open office is the same, it's not), onedrive integration is tedious, zoom is buggy, slack is a beta version, citrix just straight up doesn't work properly.
    In short, if you work in a professional environment where the focus is not software engineering / research / data science - a lot of common programs are poorly supported or unsupported on Linux.

  • johnfuller on 02/05/2024 - 14:35

    usability / support / apps etc

  • newbo on 02/05/2024 - 15:42
    +2

    I don't use it as my desktop, but I use it for servers.
    If it did everything and had all the apps I use out of the box, I'd enjoy doing it.
    And games, graphics card drivers, that whole thing.
    But really, it has always felt like work whenever I have used it as my main OS.

  • plastererJazz on 02/05/2024 - 15:44

    Doesn't worth the hassle to reinstall OS.

    Window/MacOS works just fine.

  • kogi on 02/05/2024 - 16:09

    I think it's better the devil you know

    I have linux on desktop
    Mac on notebook
    Boot into windows for games

  • haemolysis on 02/05/2024 - 18:04

    Installing an OS (Linux or otherwise) has been, and remains, one of the most daunting technical challenges for newbie to do.

    Most will never do so, never know where to begin, and even with simple wizards like Ubuntu, the process is still complex requiring making isos, getting through the bios, having some vague understanding of what drive partitioning is, etc.

    Alternative OS only ever become viable when they are sold pre installed. Like android phones and chromebooks are.

  • MindGrenadius on 02/05/2024 - 18:15

    Just the lack of compatability/software for it. Many things have alternatives but they're just not the same standard and often a stuff around to try and use professionally. E.g everyone in the pro photo or design/creative world pretty much uses Adobe. If you try and use some freeware alternative you're always going to run into "oh sorry we can't open this file" and vice-versa.

    Cool concept but it just doesn't work in the real world for a lot of people

  • BendBridge on 02/05/2024 - 19:17

    "Windows users like freeware; they just don't like Linux.", well said.

    I am a retired software designer. I started with Unix and Windows, then Linux came along. In fact, we did almost all our development work on Linux platforms for Linux based servers. But we wrote our documents with MS Office and read our emails with Outlook in a Windows PC. That's just the way it was.

    I'm glad you mentioned Total Commander. I'm user #580 :)

  • PhilosophicalTurtle on 02/05/2024 - 20:15

    Without any or much fiddling
    - I want to use my mouse to work seamlessly across different computers.
    - I want my watch to be integrated with my computer
    - I want my mobile phone to work seamlessly with my computer
    - I want my wireless headphones and mic to transfer across seamlessly when someone calls me.

    I have linux but it is for running web servers and experiments. It is not my daily driver.

  • scooba on 02/05/2024 - 20:18
    -1

    Why don't more people use linux, well that's easy to answer, first off all because we're lazy and secondly "muh gamezzz".

    Linux takes work to setup and get running but once it is, it's a beast of an OS depending what distro you pick. But most people don't want to put the effort in, myself included, they just want to buy a machine, turn it on and use it.
    Hell, most people don't even update their OS, apps and drivers anymore and wonder why they get infected after surfing their favourite adult anime website, so they're not going to be bothered installing linux if they can't be bothered doing those three things.

  • kaleidoscope on 02/05/2024 - 20:31

    Linux Is Free. Why Does Nobody Use It?

    No free lunches… for me this would be lack of software support and accountability. (Things may be different in 2024, but i made this decision way back in early 2000s). I do experiment with linux mint here and there but hasn’t convinced me to go full on as daily driver.

    Ymmv ofcourse

  • pr0o on 02/05/2024 - 20:50

    I never paid for any windows version, Linux is not the only free OS out there!

  • plmko on 02/05/2024 - 22:09
    +1

    I'll say what everyone wants to say but won't, Windows is "free".

  • infinite on 02/05/2024 - 22:35
    -2

    People are still paying for Windows ?

  • rickdwp on 03/05/2024 - 01:50
    +3

    You really mean Linux desktop, and as someone who does daily both Linux & Windows desktops + works on Linux and Windows servers, the answer is purely ease of use. Windows as a desktop OS generally just works but more importantly everything else works with it, plus of course Office which is a pretty big requirement for School, Uni and alot of work. Sure you can use open office, google docs or even now Office 365 online but they are not even close to desktop Office apps.

    Linux is also highly fragmented, there is a million distros with dozens of GUIs and different package managers. There has for quite some time been the notion of "Is this the year of the Linux desktop?" - I do think we're getting there, Microsoft own GitHub so they could quite easily have shutdown Mass-gravel activation scripts if they wanted to (even if they didn't own GitHub) but they don't, I do think part of the reason is they don't want people looking for alternatives and even if people aren't paying for Windows directly they have baked in so much crap in the form of the Store, Ads and now AI nags that they'll get you one way or another.

    With the rise of Macs and now Chromebooks I could see Linux become commonplace in the next generation of adults so 10-20 years, hopefully. Funnily enough if you google "Install Linux" the first result is a Microsoft page which does actually tell you how to install linux either as a WSL, Cloud or bare metal via USB

  • Widget on 03/05/2024 - 03:28
    +1

    I've always been a PC gamer. Primary reason I use Windows OS. If I could play games on Linux as easily as Windows, I'd consider moving over.

  • qwijibo on 03/05/2024 - 07:39
    +1

    Linux is only free (as in money) if your time is worthless.

    Having said that, the latest Ubuntu and even Debian aren't too bad as a desktop, if you don't have unrealistic expectations that they're going to be as smooth and easy to use as MacOS or Windows.

    • akl977ad on 03/05/2024 - 08:20

      Office 365 enterprise e3 or e5 isnt even that expensive. Comes with teams, dial in number if you want, 1tb of OneDrive storage, windows and intune licence.

      The whole lot. Even the most incompetents know how to navigate windows.

      I've had fellow IT staff just literally not do their job because it was RHEL because these days good IT staff that can command line is getting rarer by the day. Many staff fail to do even the simplest of tasks e.g. cat, tail, vim.

      Oh and RHEL licences are expensive and far from free unless you're using as a single person developer.

  • this is us on 03/05/2024 - 07:46

    Anyone who is not tech savvy will hate the process to get Linux ready to run, and it will never be smoothly unless you don't ever install new software. I also play games and use softwares that are not available for Linux, and am quite happy with both Windows and Mac OS. It's not about being free or not, it's about being functional and user friendly in the long run, which even the best Linux GUI is not when you need to to anything different. I haven't touched Linux for many years, so I might be outdated, but I hear "why not Linux?" since the 1990s and the answer has always been the same.

  • akl977ad on 03/05/2024 - 08:15

    If going by what I see at work the amount of people competent in RHEL has gone down significantly over the past 10 years.

    People just can't command line these days. Even windows back in the day you had to deal with CMD not anymore.

    I learnt it myself but most other people are lazy.

    Also lack of driver and app support.

  • JPMelb on 03/05/2024 - 08:36

    I play with vm's of Linux, the gap is small. If there was a native version of office is go there.
    Office365 online is getting closer and steam works nicely for some games.
    Linux Mint is probably my preferred

  • ndoan on 03/05/2024 - 08:57
    +1

    Phone, Car, Smart TV, appliances, Modem, Router etc are based on Linux. Many people are using Linux everyday but not aware of this.

  • turnip on 03/05/2024 - 09:48

    I use windows as my daily and use a ubuntu/mint live USB when I need to fix my windows.

    For gaming I still prefer to use my windows as the drivers are just better from past experience.

  • PurchaseAnxiety on 03/05/2024 - 10:43

    I'm a techie, and I decided to give Linux (Mint) a go for a while a 5 or so years ago. I quite liked it, and it does feel nice using an OS that doesn't feel like it's trying to exploit you at every step. But there were a bunch of fairly small but nagging issues that I just kept running into, many of which I just couldn't find answers for. Plus there's the fact that many devs build for Windows and Apple first, and finding Linux alternatives was rarely straight forward. Eventually, it all added up to feel like the OS was getting in the way of me being productive, so I reluctantly switched back to Windows.

    With that being said, I have been feeling the itch to dive back in, probably with a different distro.

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