With Delivery still works out to be $2.50 per 50ml which is cheaper than recent deals on Dettol Instant Liquid Hand Sanitizer on Amazon.
Heads, Tails & Clean Hands sanitiser contains 80% ethyl alcohol to meet the specifications of the World Health Organisation.
Your sanitiser will come in 1000mL glass bottles, ready to decant into your own smaller spray bottles and dispensers.
Pre-Order delivered in 3 weeks
Where? Hospital grade?
You must be lucky. Most places near me are still charging $10 for 100ml.
Saw some at $10 for 50ml
Kogan wants $25 for 80ml
You're negging a deal because 'some pharmacies' are selling it at the same price per litre?
ffs
cool story
ITS A TRAP!
H'es just baiting for the trolls.
There's plenty of sellers that have sanitizer for a much more reasonable price available before these overpriced ones hit the market.
(Also in 2 weeks most companies including Aeris, Zoono who have certified sanitizer and have said the market will be flooded with sanitizer…3 weeks I guarantee it as I'm selling it through a national wholesaler called L&H)
You're making out that Four Pillars is changing to survive… that's completely false and they're going very very well. They'll be around for years to come.
There is a shortage on ingredients, which are being sold via auction, because there are so many companies converting their business to making hand sanitiser. So it remains to be seen it price will go down.
No deal yet you quoted the same price? 🙄 Time to stop drinking the hand sanitisers
The deal includes $10 for delivery, so not the same
At these prices I'm wondering if I'm better off concentrating my cheap rum
good idea, how do you propose doing so? heating will evaporate the alcohol
first distilled moonshine will work… or so i was told
@squidz: Yeah I haven't thought of how, just that it could be more economical if there's a simple way
My uncle has a friend who spoke to a guy that heard that a pharmacy on Collins Street got stock of hand sanitiser for $15 per litre. He didn't remember it's name though… and my uncle says he is not sure if he trusts the guy cause he's seen no proof… I am not sure that I have the 2 hours to travel to Collins Street to check it out…
You know the pharmacy the guy heard about? Let me know.
Grabs popcorn
Serious question, what's stopping people from drinking this? Methanol as a byproduct as it likely not tested as thoroughly as their gins?
Says its made using the heads and tails of the distillation, this part is usually discarded as it contains the methanol and other things you dont want to drink..
Methanol will lead to blindness
I used to make spirits, I'd always throw the first 50-100ml of distill, that's the cat piss (methanol). It has the lowest boiling point and always comes out first.
It's actually the fores that are discarded as it contains the methanol. Head and tails just contains other byproducts of distillation that don't taste great (only the hearts are used for gin). Head and tails can be 'recycled' by distilling them again in future runs.
just to throw this out there, Four Pillars buys in pre-distilled vodka and then turns this into gin. See:
https://www.manildra.com.au/product/ethanol/
So there is very little impurities in their ethanol, such as methanol as mentioned above. What you are getting is the oils from botanicals which aren't desired to be part of the final gin. So it will be aromatic but probably not worth drinking.
as do most gin distilleries
what's stopping people from drinking this
Cleans one's guts?
People underestimate the affects of high alcohol percentage, it can lead to alcohol poisoning a lot easier because your body cannot keep up with the high alcohol content suddenly flooding in.
Umm, no. It might lead to alcohol poisoning because you underestimate the potency and decide to drink too much. But none of this rubbish about it hitting the body too hard.
I thought this was an odd question, until I realised this a not gel sanitizer, but a liquid one created by an alcohol company. I'm wondering if this would be useful as a general household cleaner for high traffic things like door knobs and car steering wheel.
Yes. It will work in the same way to kill germs and bacteria.
Serious question, what's stopping people from drinking this?
Common sense?
Not as common as you'd like it to be….
Addiction is a very serious issue. It’s not uncommon to hear of people drinking litres of mouth wash or other “undrinkable” alcohols and end up in ICU.
It’s not simply common sense - some people are so blinded and affected by the alcohol withdrawal that they go to such extreme lengths. And when they don’t get their fix I’ve seen some that have had seizures…
blindness
What’s stopping people doing anything once they buy a product?
By that time it delivers - the corona will already take over the world :-(
Such a handsome bottle!
By the time it's delivered many companies will have flooded the market. If your interested in how/why it's got to do with the base material that's being manufactured in volumes like you wouldn't believe. I suggest all my fellow bargain hunters apply extreme caution as I feel this activity is profiteering. It's a really disappointing thing to see, it's capitalising on people that are desperate to protect themselves and the margins they are applying is ridiculous.
Artisan hand sanitizer. Maybe somewhat awkward if you don't have a small spray dispenser given this is not a gel. Good to see companies getting behind the cause though
Supply and demand only, distilleries are just servicing the market, nothing especially altruistic about this.
They can also stay open and keep employees on. The demand for artisanal spirits has probably dropped off sharply.
except a fair few of them are putting profits made from hand sanitizer towards charities like Young Henrys
No doubt for some. But many stories of companies either donating or doing it at cost. https://www.theshout.com.au/news/australian-distillers-produ…
Thank you OP, it is a really good find and good to support local business.
Not as local as they've been in the past: https://www.broadsheet.com.au/national/food-and-drink/articl…
Maybe owned by Lion but the business & manufacturing remains on site and this keeps people employed. I bought a bottle to help out
Please put warning sign on the label DO NOT DRINK, coz Four Pillars gin is yummy.
distilleries definitely making some $ from hand sanitiser at the moment
I'm not sure they are - I think there is some issues with tax and alcohol content for distilleries, they need to get special exemption to operate as medical supplies. I was watching something about a distillery in QLD that was doing the same, they were hoping that the govt would retrospectively fix the tax classification.
they can apply for exemptions as its not for consumption, and much of the content is the component out of the still that is discarded or needs to be re-added to a future batch to try and refine further.
Its good they are producing it, and keeping in business, but some are charging a hefty price for it. But clearly, an unpopular comment ;)
they need to get special exemption to operate as medical supplies
The government relaxed these rules last week. They also stated that hand sanitizer no longer needs to be made with medical grade methanol, but can now be used with food grade methanol which opened the way for distilleries to use their equipment to produce it.
The delivery time is insane
Why would you want a litre ? not really easy to carry around and you dont need to sanitise at home. Office maybe?
To refill empty bottles, or create your own with a spray bottle etc
Yep. It's liquid, not gel, so I've also ordered spray bottles/atomizers to fill them in so that each one of us has one plus more we can leave in the car, office, etc.
Thanks for the reminder and the link!
Same Question to why people need to stock up on toilet paper and every other essential items?
Not really comparable. It is actually recommended to use hand sanitiser when out and about. This virus and restrictions will be in place for months if not a year. You will go through 1L hand sanitiser sooner than you think and it is so difficult to find stock at the moment.
TP on the other hand, its rate of use remains constant regardless of the virus and no need to hoard.
Yes, you obviously use the 1 litre to fill up smaller bottles to take out and about
stay home bro.
because when corona spreads to workers who make toilet paper, etc it's hard to know what the supply chain will be like …..so far we had the rush and hoarding, but a supply chain that could gear up to meet demand, but if the truck drivers get sick and can't work for 14 days, or they close the toilet paper mill for 14 days because some one had corona, that is when bigger shortages will happen.
The main wave of corona hasn't hit Australia yet, just flattening the curve so we can gear up.
I, would think, that a fair bit of the toilet paper manufacturing would be “hands off”. There are a lot of truck drivers who are currently not delivering other products that could deliver toilet paper. Where a supermarket has people sick with Covid they don’t shut the store down, for a long time, they just sanitise it. We need to ramp up current manufacture of essential products to flatten the curve, in case we do lose bits of our supply chain.
The thing I find interesting is we are finding out what is really essential and what isn’t. Not long ago someone on this website was saying that nurses didn’t deserve to be paid more, but they are our frontline people in this emergency. They will be the difference between life, and death, for some people and they aren’t just hiding in their homes, despite the risks. Let’s hope the Government remembers this later on.
Hope you stock up on water and electricity too. When coronavirus hit the people that work for water and electricity companies we will be doomed.
I'm sorry but this has to be asked….is this an April Fool's Joke?
Nearly all local distilleries are now cranking out hand sanitiser
I ordered some from Archie Rose a few weeks back and it arrived on Monday
Thanks for clarifying! The timing of this post just made me wonder
Their next batch is already sold out. Waiting for my delivery now…
65% alcohol from Archie Rose? Isn't that a bit too low?
Many distilleries around the world are making hand sanitisers to donate to hospitals and nursing homes to fight the virus together. Ours are making them to sell at high price. Did their business struggle, yes maybe, but so is everyone else. Did they get government help and salary subsidising, yes perhaps like every other business. We see restaurants and cafes offering discounted food for take aways and even free food for people in hardship.
As above, think it might be tax issues
It'greed, they're selling their sanitiser for ~ the same price as their normal product. I get that they're diversifying so they can keep operating but shouldn't be dressing it up as anything other than that.
Given the tax requirements, that might be their cost of producing - as I said, the tax is very high on spirits and distilleries would have to pay that tax no matter what they produce (unless they get an exemption). I believe the excise tax on a 700ml bottle of regular strength spirit is around $25, although that was a while ago so might be even more now. The tax on high proof would be even more.
I wouldn't go around making assumptions at this point.
@pdtmathieson: Then they should go ask for an exception. I saw someone from Archie Rose on ABC last week when asked about the high price mention their use of 'all natural ingredients', as a deflection answer. Nothing was mentioned about tax.
@pdtmathieson: Nope. Tax Free for hand sanitiser.
COVID-19
…
Distillers who already hold an excise manufacturer licence to produce or distil spirits can, without additional approvals, produce hand sanitiser and report it by using the free-rate tariff item on their Excise return.
Excise-rates-for-alcohol
For drinking, $86.90 per litre of pure alcohol (except brandy)
= $24.33 for 700mL @ 40%
= $22.81 for 700mL @ 37.5%
@dearjeffrey, if you read their email, they are already supplying industry for weeks in the background ahead of making this product. This is just a collectible for their fans.
Before they started selling it they were donating to other places, and are still supplying to hospitals.
what a rip.
This would cost about $2 to make. Outrageous
You've got to be kidding
contains 80% ethyl alcohol
Distill that for $2 and come back and let me know
$2 is idiotic but it doesn't cost anywhere near $40 to make 1L of this. $20 retail would be a decent spot given the shortages, but $40 is pure greedy.
I saw someone from Archie Rose on ABC last week when asked about the high price mention their use of 'all natural ingredients', as a deflection answer. Nothing was mentioned about tax.
There are a number of aspects here:
1) This will likely be bought by fans of the brand for their collections and never even opened.
2) This is about using available capacity to make a product in short supply. If people deem it too expensive, they are welcome not to buy it.
3) This is about helping a 'favourite' brand stay alive while pubs and bars are closed.
This costs them a heap to make, they haven't all of a sudden lowered their staffing, equipment and distribution costs, etc. They do not enjoy the efficiencies of larger operations, and they no longer have an income stream of people walking in the door and sampling/buying their products. They've also lost the custom of every bar/pub/club in the country that is closed.
I would imagine that they are going to donate a shitload of it, too.
@hammo: That's all fine and understandable but there are those from these companies, or the media trying to portray their actions as somehow helping the country in times of need, which is plain BS.
I get that they're lining the pockets (modus operandi in their business), but it should be seen and called out for what it is.
@xuqi: Here is the text from their email. It clearly states to me that they are already helping industry in the background (i.e. not with this product), and this is not for average joe and that it's a premium collectible product.
Where exactly are they taking anyone for a ride?
Paste
You've been asking for this, and we've been working hard to make it happen.
Over the past couple of weeks we have been quietly scaling up production of a simple hand sanitiser exclusively for healthcare professionals on the frontline of the fight against the coronavirus. And now, while these healthcare efforts continue, we also have a hand sanitiser available to consumers. That's you!
So here it is! Heads, Tails & Clean Hands sanitiser contains 80% ethyl alcohol to meet the specifications of the World Health Organisation. But it also makes use of the by-products of our gin distilling, making it smell great too!
This sanitiser comes in 1000mL glass bottles, ready to decant into your own smaller spray bottles and dispensers for use in the home.
We have opened for PRE-ORDERS online only, and we hope to ship in the next 3 weeks (see our Shipping page for more detail on delivery times).
Of course we want to offer our Batch No.1 Club members the chance to pre-order before anyone else… We've capped orders at five bottles per person to allow everyone to access this highly sought-after product.
Please also note that we will NOT be selling this sanitiser at our distillery door.
Your pre-order guarantees your allocation when this product is ready to ship - so thank you in advance for your pre-order and for your patience, from the bottom of our gin-soaked hearts.
While this sanitiser is 100% effective, it's also very Four Pillars!
We’re using the highly concentrated heads and tails from each gin distillation, plus a touch of aloe vera.
That means that the end product has some of the aromatic properties of our gin (but remember it is definitely NOT for drinking).
We hope this product will help keep people safe, and also help keep our business healthy enough to continue to make great gin.
They were selling for $25 to health care workers (not flavoured) + $10 delivery
They even stated that $25 was their cost price.
It's done on an industrial scale right here in Australia for less than $1 per litre.
It would take a tiny fraction of our millions of litres of bio-ethanol production to make enough hand sanitiser for everyone.
It's crazy that people are forced to pay this much.
5kg of sugar yields about 2.8L of 80% ethanol in an inefficient still. So about $4, or $1.42 per litre. Add the cost of water and yeast (cheap). The raw ingredients to make drinkable alcohol are cheap. The only reason spirits are expensive is taxation and fancy packaging.
I didnt know staff, rent, production hardware, insurance, etc, all cost $0.
@phocus: Manildra Group makes ethanol for blending into E10 fuel. Their cost including staff, rent, hardware, insurance, etc to make 1L of pure ethanol is under $1/L.
How much does the ATO take for 1L of ethanol for human consumption? $86.90/L
https://www.ato.gov.au/Business/Excise-and-excise-equivalent…
How much tax in a cheap $30 bottle of vodka?
$30 retail price for 700ml. 40% ethanol, therefore 280ml of ethanol. 0.28 * 86.90 = $24.33 of tax in that $30 bottle. Then there's the cost of production, transport, and the retailer takes a cut too.
Ethanol production is really really cheap.
@Cluster: So now you are comparing a company making 50M rev vs one that makes 1.2B?
The other option is these guys don't make it at all. Now who wants that? at least they are adding to the economy instead of taking.
@phocus: I posted how much it costs to make ethanol yet people are now arguing about company size. That doesn't make sense.
Four Pillars Gin already has all the gear required to make hand sanitizer. They're not investing any more. They don't even need a new license. Just package up their product prior to dilution and it's good to go.
I'm merely pointing out that ethanol is not some sort of incredibly expensive substance that justifies a $50/L cost. Good on Four Pillars Gin for taking advantage of the market demand and making some money of this. But let's not kid ourselves that it's incredibly profitable for them to do so.
This posting is an ad, nothing more. It's not a bargain.
@Cluster: They are having to change their production line, and make less of their core product. There is cost associated with that. So cost of producing ethanol+other business costs is what's relevant.
@phocus: diggers metho is 95% ethanol.
bunnings retail price is around $3.80 for 1 litre (usually out of stock now)
also:
"Net total cost of production $0.62/L using molasses as a feedstock"
"Feedstock generally accounts for around 75% of total production costs. The remaining costs are capital (which account for around 15%) and other inputs and labour (around 10%)."
@phocus: before the corona outbreak, isoproyl alcohol (99%) was $16 for 4 litres, will be a while until those prices come back.
Dem 3000% margins for $50 bottles
I'd hazard a guess it could be made for $2.
Check out their website on their distilling process. Their site cleverly says that their alcohol comes from bomaderry NSW- while sorta sounding like thays where their wheat comes from. It's the ethanol they're talking about, and its very likely comes from the Manildra plant there. They supply ethanol, as in E, as in E10, as in cheaper than petrol.
Gin making is a secondary distillation process, most gin distillates start with ethanol and add botanicals for flavour to create gin.
I don't know how taxation works - maybe they've already paid tax on the ethanol when purchasing.
high quality whisky might be expensive etc, but hand sanitizer is not aged for 18 years in barrels made from remnants of Noah's Ark, using barley picked by specially trained red pandas mixed with the tears of mermaids.
e10 petrol is 10% ethanol?
Metho is 95% ethanol, 5% methanol.
Ethanol is cheap to make in bulk. Australia made about 500000000 litres of it last year, looking to double supply or more. I think it costs about $1 a litre for the serious producers.
If these guys want to make few quick bucks on the hand sanitizer craze, fine by me, I'd rather they did it than the clowns raiding shops/stealing it and flogging it on eBay. At least they are adding to the supply, creating employment.
Methylated spirits in Australia is 95% ethanol, 5% water, according to the maker of Diggers
A 1L bottle of methylated spirits retails for $4, which is (close to) 100% ethyl alcohol + bitterant.
SupeNintendoChalmers on 02/04/2020 - 09:03 Comment score below threshold.
