HELP PLEASE! Scammed out of nearly $100K

Hi everyone,

So I'd like to precede this by saying I already feel absolutely horrible. I feel like throwing up constantly just thinking about this, but thought I would put it out there to see if anyone in the OzBargain community might have had any similar experiences or any advice.

Long story short, it appears a scammer hacked either my conveyancer's or the other side's conveyancers email accounts. and from doing so, got my details as well as the details of my upcoming property settlement. They knew the amounts due in terms of stamp duty payments etc, as well as the dates these amounts were due. They created a near identical email account to my Conveyancer, who I was emailing around 5-10 times a day and so simply didn't notice anything out of the ordinary when I received the scammer's email. It popped up only with my Conveyancer's name and the email address didn't come up as 'new sender' or anything. I know that I should have checked the email address before doing anything, but I had just answered about 3 other emails from my Conveyancer and still had about 3 to go. I had 6 emails in a row from her on different matters and it didn't at all enter my mind that 1 of these 6 might not be like the others.

In short, I transferred nearly $100K at the direction of this scammer who I believed to be my Conveyancer to the account they directed in the email. I called the Conveyancer later that afternoon to discuss another matter, and mentioned to her I had transferred the stamp duty payment for this property. It was then we both realised what had happened.

I searched the BSB and realised it was a Bank X account. I called Bank Y first (my bank) to ask them to commence a scam investigation and try recover the funds immediately. They advised the funds had already reached the other account but they opened the Scam investigation immediately. I then went to Bank X and tried to have them freeze the account the funds were received into. They said the account was already closed and for some reason, they couldn't see any details in the system about who had opened or closed it (how is that possible?). That night, I attended the Police Station and filed a fraud/scam report.

I now have the Conveyancer's insurer, the Police and Bank Y/Bank X working on this case but I'm accepting the worst and not expecting to get anything back. In the off chance anyone here might have had similar experiences and have any advice, I thought I'd raise it to the OzB community. Again, please don't pile on me. I know and I feel horrible. I've barely been able to sleep and I am just hoping there may be some avenue I haven't thought of, even if its not likely to succeed.

Thanks in advance everyone

Mod: Edited for privacy

Comments

      • This is a great point. Are they running an on premise exchange server?

      • Wake up and go to the dark web and see the millions of data on people for sale !

  • +55

    They said the account was already closed and for some reason, they couldn't see any details in the system about who had opened or closed it (how is that possible?).

    Are we just going to ignore this? That's suss as (profanity)

    • +15

      This is what really upsets me too! Surely it is negligent and below the reasonable standard the banks shoudl need to uphold to allow that. I can't believe they would allow this, especially after all the grief Bank Z went through last year with relation to money used in mule accounts for trafficking etc

      Mod: Edited for privacy

      • +7

        Having worked in large Australian companies before I wouldn’t say it’s in the realm of impossibilities sadly.

      • +15

        It would probably be against policy for them to divulge too much information to you as they don't know you either.

        • +6

          Well now that a police report has been filed, they better get a move on

          • +4

            @OzBarAnon: to be honest, a police report doesn't do much in terms of accessing personal data and disclosing it to third parties unless they take it further

        • +2

          yeah I was thinking along those lines too, i'm pretty sure they shouldn't give details to you on something not confirmed..
          But hopefully police can move something along with a warrant or similar?

          Really sorry to hear OP, absolutely disgusting for someone to steal so much cash that you've worked for.. Thats a tough one, i'd normally look for obvious scams etc, but given what was happening I dont know how you were supposed to pick that out.. I've done transfers in a similar way after conversing with a conveyancer I know by email (won't do it in future wow)

          Biggest problem would be if someone created account with a fake ID, though you'd think if it was recently created, they'd have some sort of extra checks if such a large amount was deposited/withdrawn then the acct closed.
          I know they have flags for very minor things like unusual withdrawals etc

      • +1

        yeah what nurries said. If the bank has allowed someone to create a bank account without proper procedure or collection of proper documentation, then they should be liable, as this is simply irresponsible, and they are technically a co-conspirator. They should have never allowed this to happen, and you should be able to lodge a case. I would get my full facts on what info they have and lodge this via the banking ombudsman who should be able to offer advice on whether you have reasonable case for escalation. They are completely neutral, and free.

        https://www.afca.org.au/

        • +1

          It's much more likely the account holder (entity or individual) is a victim of identity fraud and/or had their account unwittingly hijacked.

          Someone who has obtained access can just store the info for later until its utilized in an attack like this and suspension / closure of account might be due to real account holder requesting it after seeing the transaction.

    • +20

      Could be just a privacy thing. They'd get in trouble for giving out an account holder's details to a stranger.

      • -4

        Could be just a privacy thing.

        It sounds more like the bank didn't KYC the account.

        • +9

          Why the hell would you want your bank telling personal details to a random

          • +5

            @rover100:

            Why the hell would you want your bank telling personal details to a random

            Where on earth did I advocate banks handing out personal details about anyone's account to any stranger???
            That should only be provided to authorities who are conducting an investigation, otherwise it would constitute a serious breach of privacy.

            You obviously didn't read OP's post carefully, specifically the following part:

            they couldn't see any details in the system about who had opened or closed it (how is that possible?)

            If NAB had instead said we know the account holder, but we cannot divulge that information to you directly (due to privacy laws) then that is what the OP should expect to hear.

      • -7

        who cares about privacy, you lost 100k and you want to know who took it….

        • +2

          That does not matter in the eyes of the law. The privacy act does not allow their details to be divulged to a non account holder. Period.
          Only a court order or federal police can access this information if a crime/fradulent action has taken place.

          • -6

            @DisabledUser110907: So if someone stole 100k from your bank which you saved up for over 20 years (so wont be chump change like some others would think) - you're perfectly fine letting that all go because "the law says so"?

            If someone broke into your house and stole your wife, you would be like "Yeah ok, take her I don't care either way, the law says I can't harm you to save my wife."

            If someone broke into your house, stole the keys to your 80k high yield investment vehicle which you had some attachment, mostly due to the value it will become once you sell it off later, and drove off in it; you'll be like "Fine, I don't care about the car anyways coz the law says I can't find out who stole my car."

            • +2

              @Zachary: No need to over-exaggerate, all I said is that it is the law, a Bank cannot break the law and divulge personal information to a non-account holder, is really is that simple.
              As I and many others have stated, the Federal Police are the only ones that can access this information via a Court Order when a criminal investigation has been lodged, you can't take matters into your own hands and expect a bank to give you the account holders information.
              If a staff member is caught exposing the personal information to a non-account holder (legal entity) they will end up losing their job, in court and a criminal record, along with a hefty fine for the bank itself.
              Anyone that works in banking knows how tight the Privacy Act is and what will happen if they break the law.
              Surely you understand basic law, such as the Privacy Act? There is no arguing it, it's set out in stone.
              No one is suggesting what has happened to the OP is not terrible, it is, and it would be very upsetting, and of course I wouldn't be happy letting it go, but it now needs to be left in the hands of the police, which is where it is now.
              The OP must now deal with the Police and get them moving on it as quickly as possible and I wish them the best of luck at getting the funds returned,

              • @DisabledUser110907:

                No need to over-exaggerate

                Isn't "over-exaggerate" an over-exaggeration?

              • @DisabledUser110907:

                No need to over-exaggerate, all I said is that it is the law, a Bank cannot break the law and divulge personal information to a non-account holder, is really is that simple.

                It won't be if you were the one they stole 100k, wife or car from…..

                Surely you understand basic law, such as the Privacy Act? There is no arguing it, it's set out in stone.

                No I don't and if someone stole my 100k, wife or car, I will hunt them down….

                • @Zachary: lol, okayyyyyyy enough said.

            • +1

              @Zachary: It's not your job to investigate and get it back, whether you believe in the relevant authorities or not.

              • -1

                @Serapis: Officer: "Sorry, I couldn't get back your 100k, I guess this is a lesson learnt to not hand over money so hastily."
                You: "Wha-what? I thought I believe that you could??! Now 100k is gone for good/!??!!?"
                THE END.

        • +2

          hey it's me ur customer's scam-ee, can i hav the bank details of ur this acc pls?

      • +2

        They'd get in trouble for giving out an account holder's details to a stranger.

        Then the answer would rather be " Sorry due to privacy policy, we cant give you the detail of that accounts" Instead of what they gave OP. Certainly, no one in their right mind and speaking/understand English would spin it to "Could be just a privacy thing" LOL. Sorry for the broken gramma, English isnt my native language …

    • +14

      Banks are absolutely complicit in these things and basically just say the money is gone. Push them harder and you’ll get excuses about privacy and blaming the other bank, just pointing you to the police.

      Imagine if it was the banks money lost, all hell would break loose.

    • +3

      Privacy Act. They can only give details of an account to the Police or your bank and your bank can't tell you either.

      • -1

        On what basis do you think they will suddenly be more helpful with the police? Are you conflating police with courts?

        the entity must not use or disclose the information for another purpose (the secondary purpose) unless:
        6.2(b) the use or disclosure of the information is required or authorised by or under an Australian law or a court/tribunal order

        • Usually the police operate within the law and follow the law (such as an information request allowed under an act). Obviously the bank would insist on lawful reasoning.

          • -1

            @surg3on: Usually? Obviously? What is this mysterious law you’re talking about?

    • +3

      Are we sure he called NAB and not the scammers?

  • +18

    Wow my absolute condolences OP. No amount of reassurance from us is going to make you feel better until you can recover that money back. Could you trace how the theft happened and how they spoofed your conveyancer's details? If there ever was a need for a police cyber crimes unit, this would be it.

    • +8

      This is definitely in progress with Insurance Comp A. They are analysing both the servers of my conveyancer and the other side's too. Unfortunately the Police have been SO slow. I've been so disappointed by how slow they've been!

      Mod: Edited for privacy

      • +2

        Time for both of you to consider using end-to-end encrypted emails with signature signing. Emails from unverified senders will warn you.

        There are providers like ProtonMail and Tutanota to get started.

        • +6

          That would only help if the scammer was spoofing the conveyencer's email. More likely they actually got into their account given they knew enough information to make such a convincing email.

          • @Quantumcat: Jeez, the conveyencer has more serious problems and shouldn't be doing business. If the endpoint has actually been compromised, it's already game over.

          • +5

            @Quantumcat: Not the case. If you read the OPs full description, they state that it came from an email address almost identical to the conveyancers - not the same email address.

            • +1

              @trankillity: @celtics889345 can you clarify whether the email address was the same as your conveyencer's or different? If they didn't get into their email account it is hard to see how they would have the information needed to craft that email

              • @Quantumcat: Surely either the conveyancer or OP's email was directly accessed to get this info - even if they made a fake domain with a 0 for an o or something, they still got all the info to fake the email somehow. So one of the two endpoints or servers in between has to be compromised, or an inside job from someone at the working for the conveyancer perhaps? Whether their staff or an IT contractor

                • @smashman42: OP said he was using 2-factor. And there are loads of hackers trying to get into office 365 tenancies targeting businesses so that seems more likely than someone putting in the effort to get into a random individual's Gmail or whatever with 2 factor enabled and whom they have no idea whether there's a chance of getting any money from. Plus OP never mentioning any phishing attempts on him he noticed (that would mean the very first attack they ever try works and it was so good he has no memory of it). Vs a conveyencer that might be using office 365 and who deals with large sums of money regularly so good chance of hacking them being worthwhile, and easier to get into.

  • +2

    Damn :/

  • +12

    I just had settlement for my property on Friday. My heart goes out to you, OP.

  • +11

    Yeah that’s shit. Really hope you get it sorted. Please keep us updated

    • +6

      Thanks mate and will do!

  • +8

    That's rough
    Hopefully NAB shuts it down before it happens.

    I work in the government sector and this is becoming a huge issue as computer fraud/hack protection gets better the scammers find the next weakest link which unfortunately is the human brain. It's quite surprising how easily they can get access to your account through a few checks of your facebook, instagram or anything else freely available without you knowing.

    This exact scenario was played out to us and it's remarkable how they plug information from your life into hacking your account on the backend or even guess your password from a combination of your pets/parents names and birthdays. They then just sit there waiting for months, even years reading emails until the appropriate time to substitute out the bsb and account number.

  • +3

    hmm i heard / read similar case about a year ago?…. but the hacking part is on the convey side something like that.

    • +2

      It happened to Mike Sheahan (AFL journo) a couple of years ago, there's articles on the net

    • +4

      This is the article you are referring to: https://www.9news.com.au/national/masterchef-contestant-dani...

      • 8:04pm Jun 27, 2018

        One would like to think that PEXA could have implemented ways (by now) to further reduce the risk for their clients from fraudsters.

        OP, hopefully you can in some way “recover” you money.

        • +5

          PEXA have. This is unrelated as it appears to be a transfer direct to the (purported) conveyancer's trust account in order to pay stamp duty.

  • +39

    Ouch. My condolensces. Makes me feel better than when I had to pay the deposit for a house I bought over the phone (i was travelling), I didnt just take the word of the agent's SMS with bsb/acc numbers, I called the actual real estate office where he worked and asked them to confirm payment details for their trust account - which were the same.

    At the time I thought I was being paranoid. Turns out, Paranoid is the way to be !

  • +12

    Have a read of the following pages and go through with making the complaint(s) ASAP:

    https://www.ausbanking.org.au/for-customers/how-to-complain/
    https://www.afca.org.au/

    Good luck.

    • +10

      Yes making the biggest stink you can as quickly as you can is the best bet - going to be easier to get your money back if it hasn't yet left the country.

    • Thank you Andy!

  • +3

    Dear lord.. that's terrible.

    They said the account was already closed and for some reason, they couldn't see any details in the system about who had opened or closed it (how is that possible?).

    This certainly shouldnt be possible.. Either way, with the authorities involved, I hope it gets resolved and you get your money back in full.

    Best of luck! My prayers are with you, 100k is an immense amount of money to lose.

    • +1

      Thank you mate!

    • +11

      The bank just bamboozles you with these red herrings to keep your brain occupied with mysteries and conspiracies then two weeks later will say “sorry that wasn’t quite correct, turns out we followed process and there isn’t anything we can do”.

  • +58

    Yep happened to my mum about 2-3 years ago where she lost double that… Ended up going through the conveyancer insurance as bank and pexa wouldnt take responsibility.

    They traced the issue back to the real estate agents email which was hacked…

    In our case it was found and charged a mule (in Sydney where we are Melbourne based) that opened an account and transferred the money over to Thailand. He was charged and sentenced.

    Good luck OP, was a pain and very stressful time for us, its more common than people think…

    • +9

      Thanks Paul. This gives me some hope and hoping I have a similar outcome to your Mum!

    • +7

      did they get the money back?

      • +22

        Yes we did.

        Cba was great to work with, nab and anz were terrible. CBA was able to stop the transfer and freeze the account to reverse the transaction sp was able to recover some money quickly.

        The other 2 however were terrible and didnt want a piece of it. Had to go via the conveyancers insurance to lodge a claim which took almost a year to come through.

        We actually interviewed with a few news agencies as at the time it was when PEXA was being deployed. Im sure you could uncover the article if you really went digging.

        • +2

          I remember your story. Glad it worked out.

    • +1

      First time I’ve read about this. That is (profanity), stupid real estate agents can’t even keep their emails secure, probably too busy browsing porno websites instead of doing actual work.

      • +1

        It was the conveyancer and not the real estate agent. Something list this happens a lot in Australia and is generically called "Business Invoice Compromise" by bodies like IDCare.

        • +2

          paulpavs said it was the agent:

          They traced the issue back to the real estate agents email which was hacked

          • @abb: That’s what google entries described too when I googled this scam.

            Some people had issues where their conveyancer was the problem and some had issues with their real estate agent. As per OPs comments they mentioned the REA.

  • +4

    Did the banks/conveyancer/police indicate whether this kind of hacker attack has happened previously?

    I only ask as I recall a 2018 media report where hackers stole $250,000 from the proceeds of their home sale while it was being settled on Australia’s new online property transfer system, owned by the big banks and state governments

    • So my conveyancer said its become fairly common in the industry but it was the 1st time its happened to them. They're trying their best for me to get me cover under their Insurance Comp A insurance which includes protection for Cybercrime. Unfortunately, it may only cover the insured party (them) and not include 3rd parties like myself, but they are trying their best

      Mod: Edited for privacy

      • I can only imagine the stress you are feeling over above the usual stuff when making a property purchase and all that it involves. Hopefully, your money will be recovered and soon.

      • +12

        You’re not covered directly.

        I’m only guessing but it seems like they were hacked. So you sue them, then they’re covered. Maybe.

        Might be worth seeing with a lawyer if there is any merit in this.

        • They may not have been hacked it could have been OP being hacked - but typically they would hack conveyancers and monitor the email and strike when the time is right.

      • +4

        If their insurance only covers them, then you make a claim against them since the hacker was very, very likely sitting on their side on their compromised system waiting for opportunities.

      • +7

        It seems odd if you contacted your Bank within the day it happened. Banks transfer money in batches, electronically, and not usually during the day. It may “leave” your account immediately, ie you don’t have access to it, but typically the transfer inter Bank happens later that night. My Mum was the victim of a scam a few years back, (older citizen, thought she was talking to Optus), but my brother walked in, they called NAB, froze the outgoing monies to Westpac. Your question for your bank should be, when did they release the money, and if this sum is unusual for your account, why did they not contact you to verify the transfer? Sorry for the difficult position you were in, but squeaky wheel etc here may pay dividends ( pun intended).

        • When I send over 2k it takes over a day. For 100K it should have taken at least 2 days to clear surely…

          I reckon the scammer was hoping OP wouldn't realise for a couple days? Will be following this story

      • How do you know it was your emails hacked, and not your conveyancers emails?

  • +6

    Have you reported it to:
    https://www.cyber.gov.au/acsc/report

    • +2

      Thanks mate. Yes I have. Haven't received any update as yet from these guys nor from NSW Police or Bank Y :(

      Mod: Edited for privacy

  • +12

    You poor thing! I hope you can recover the money! It sounds like you've done all you can. Don't accept getting fobbed off, keep calling all the banks and the police to try and get any new info and if there's anything else you can do. The more annoying you are to them the more likely they are to do what they can. I think CBA are usually pretty good with this sort of thing. Hopefully they'll put enough pressure on NAB for them to act promptly. Maybe even make an appointment to see someone in your local commonwealth bank branch.

  • +110

    Thanks everyone. To answer a few of the questions, yes indeed everyone in the fraud detection professional that I have spoken to has told me the same thing - that apparently where someone transfers out an amount of over $10K and then seeks to close the account almost immediately, it should trigger a fraud warning. Unfortunately, Bank X either didn't uphold this or ignored it and allowed this person to close the account. I also find it INCREDIBLE to imagine that they don't have any ID on file for the person who opened the account and then closed it, and to then not be able to retrieve any info about it, seems beyond belief.

    Funnily enough, the scammer emailed me again yesterday informing me 'your final payment before settlement is due this Friday.' Knowing the Bank X account is now closed, I asked them to confirm if it was the same account. They advised it is a 2nd 'trust account' and this one is a Bank Z account from a BSB check. I called Bank Z to plead with them to put an alert on this account to flag 'suspicious activity' and thereby prevent it being allowed to be closed. They said they cannot take my word (understandably) and either the Police or my bank need to make the request. Unfortunately, since filing the scam report with the Police and Bank Y last Tuesday, I've heard barely anything despite following up multiple times a day. One member of Bank Y told me 'please just relax and wait 21-45 days for an update.' Surely they can understand how much this hurts!

    Thanks everyone for the suggestions and the kind words/wishes. It is greatly appreciated at such a difficult time. I've saved since I left uni 6 years ago to be able to buy my first home and so this is just incredibly deflating. I'm not someone who wastes money, I've done my best all my life to help others and in fact most of the money that didn't go to this deposit went to a charity myself and some friends founded and run. So more than anything, I just feel I've done my best all my life to help others only to have life deal me a cruel blow, so just hearing words of comfort has helped. Thank you

    Mod: Edited for privacy

    • +30

      Unfortunately, NAB either didn't uphold this or ignored it and allowed this person to close the account. I also find it INCREDIBLE to imagine that they don't have any ID on file for the person who opened the account and then closed it, and to then not be able to retrieve any info about it, seems beyond belief.

      Methinks it's a two-person job with an insider at NAB or the person who scammed you also works at NAB

      • +26

        Yep, something definitely seems fishy at NAB.
        100 points of ID needed to open an account.
        Transfers over $10k need to be reported to AUSTRAC.

        Surely there's got to be some info there.

        • +22

          AUSTRAC reporting i.e. TTR is not applicable in this case as no cash is involved in bank transfer.

          As others said, this transaction and account closure should have breached transaction monitoring rule and NAB should have triggered ECDD straight away. It's a clear failure on OCDD requirement of AML/CTF Act. NAB failure to do their due diligence or NAB employee is involved here.

          OP, lodge a complaint with AUSTRAC that NAB didn't KYC customer who scammed you for $100K and allowed to close an account without any red flag. They might not help you but this is definitely AML/CTF Act beach, so they will reach out to NAB separately for an explanation.

    • +8

      21-45 days! That's awful in itself - not only such a long period of stress but you might lose your dream property that you carefully decided on.

      • +6

        21-45 days

        What a joke! By that time, the money will be beyond recoverable.
        OP, you should also report NAB when the dust settles for their egregious lack of compliance with AML legislation.

    • +3

      really sucks. Banks service here is bad. NAB should have checks in place to stop this crap

    • +20

      Without revealing too much about myself, I do know a bit about banking practices and normally trace and transaction reversal requests are handled between bank to bank, so in your case CBA to NAB. CBA should be doing whatever it can to resolve the situation with NAB. Usually this involves both banks talking to the owners of each of the respective accounts and relaying the information to each other. In the first instance, the recipient bank normally contacts their customer to politely ask for them to return the funds. If this fails, I recall there was a mechanism by which repayment could be enforced if the recipient bank could be provided with enough evidence to suggest the transfer was a genuine mistake. There were some grey areas too unfortunately. For instance, if the recipient is on Centrelink, the law basically protected them in the main from having to immediately repay money accidentally paid to them. I was going to say something fairly political but I will refrain… Sorry for rambling, but essentially the rules that govern how these things are handled are in the Bulk Electronic Clearing System (BECS) procedures that can be found here: https://www.auspaynet.com.au/resources/direct-entry. Unfortunately the copy that is made available to the public has had some of the confidential information removed, which unsurprisingly includes Recall Requests at 5.14 because things tend to get fairly sensitive around these. You could try to look around for an unedited copy but it might be fairly difficult to obtain without the right credentials. I did however find this summary on the Australian Payment Network's (formerly APCA) web page that does spell out the basic details: https://auspaynet.com.au/resources/direct-entry/mistaken-pay.... It talks about the ASIC ePayments Code, so that is another lead if you are looking for further ammunition for your cause. I am concerned because there are some key dates that do not line up with those that you have been provided. For instance certain actions are required to occur within 5-10 days. From what I recall, the key response timeframes regarding complaint resolution are generally around 21-45 days, so for some odd reason your matter may actually be going through as a complaint or both. Someone at CBA might have their wires crossed if that makes any sense?

      This business of the account being closed and having no KYC in place really does expose NAB and while this is a breach of the law via which ASIC and APRA may seek to impose fines, concentrating on this failure does not exactly confer liability upon them to refund the monies to you directly, so you're better focusing initially upon your consumer rights. Whether the money is laundered or used to fund terrorism is by-the-by in terms of your immediate concerns. As others have stated, you could try and get some data from your email host but it would probably only help to assist the police and forensic accountants to investigate. Perhaps the money may still be in the country but I'd bet they'd be trying to get it offshore ASAP. To do this, they might have transferred it to another local account with the right permissions to transfer large amounts overseas without question. If the money is gone, there may still be avenues of recovery and many are cost effective. NAB's own investigation may find that their own processes were deficient and they were in breach of the BECS Rules, leading to reimbursement. If they aren't so forthcoming, you could try exerting pressure on CBA to enforce the rules and recover your funds from NAB. Failing that, you could go to the Australian Financial Complaints Authority (AFCA), which is the replacement for the old Financial Ombudsman Service. The police may come up trumps and if the money has headed offshore, you might be lucky if it is domeciled in a country that will enforce the law and repatriate your funds. There are many nations that won't or can't though and these are the places a lot of the scammers tend to lurk. Going to the media and pursuing your conveyancer's insurance provider would then appear to be the next free options before seeking legal advice. There is quite a lot of legislation and regulation surrounding financial services and I have found from time to time there is more than one way to skin a cat when it comes to proving a breach of fiduciary duty to the customer. I hope what I have said is useful and that I'm not doubling up on comments already made but the devil is always in the detail. I really wish you well in recovering these funds and really have to shake my head in disbelief if what you've heard from NAB so far is the whole truth. I have to say though that some of the software upon which many banks operate is fairly archaic and lack functionality. You may find that your request might need to be escalated to people in the Bank with the right access or the ability to do stuff like interrogate the back end database. It still seems highly unusual based on my experience and common sense of course regarding the way in which banks are expected to run, as everyone here has already pointed out.

      • +3

        Appreciate your time to share your knowledge 👍.

      • +4

        Yes as icantremember said, really appreciate your time to share your knowledge. So valuable and greatly appreciated!