With all these Chinese brands flooding the market could we see the end of European/Japanese cars in Australia?
How do they compete?
Some of the cars at the recent China motor show looks like it's the end for most legacy car brands. I could only see like Toyota surviving and probably Mercedes/BMW.
Same logic for Korean car makers in the 90's. You're living in the past old man.
I'd only consider older Euro or Jap sports cars.
The regular old passenger or SUV are pretty crappy.
I'd rather a DB5, but I'll take the Chinese car because I can actually afford it.
Older Japanese car is a good choice as they are cheap and reliable. Older European car lol? They make some of the most unreliable & expensive cars to maintain in the world, they only sell because they've convinced everyone with so much advertising that they are the luxury brand for people who've made it in life and can afford the finer things. Kind of like how LV sells $8,000 bags that were made in China for $200 to fools who believe that European artisans made the bag when all they did was stitch the logo on.
I'll have the Mercedes but only if the boot is full of Cash.
(Unmarked, non-sequential notes, prefer Swiss Francs).
youd rather a 2010 corolla than a new byd because?…….
I understand this and also support it because I'll need to sell my Japanese ice for an ev at some point.
peugeot lmao
pre stellantis, so like 90 or 00s they were pretty solid cars - i had an old citroen diesel that went around europe, not necessarily on roads too ; that ship has indeed long sailed even design wise.
japanese cars are ok, so are the chinese stuff, i just worry about the metallurgy, not that aus salts its roads much. a lot of people gravitate to chinese stuff as they appear best bang for the buck with all the gimmicks and shiny paint, then japanese cars have also overpriced themselves like crazy, for not much apparent reason
I've sat in quite a few byds and i was surprised how much nicer they feel to jap cars. Japanese cars feel plasticky. Idk if you sat in any. I'd get one if I needed a new car.
My Peugeot 308 has a touch of class to it
I think I threw up in my mouth a little…
well designed interior
You consider this as "well designed"?? It looks like a dated Ford Modeo interior from 2010… And that's from their top of the line GT model…
Sat in the BYD's a few weeks ago and they feel like complete garbage to me
Then you are full of shit and have not sat in a BYD. I've sat in all of them from the cheapest Atto 1 up to the range topping Sealion 7 and none of them "fEeL LiKe GaRbAgE". While I will admit that some of BYD's design choices are bold, at least they feel different to cookie cutter Euro interiors.
You still have your EV?
I was ready to laugh about it too but that's quite an elegant interior.
Peugeot…Jesus.
most people just want a car to get from A to B. so if the chinese cars can do that competently for a lower price then yeh, EUR and Jap cars cant compete.
The TK Maxx shops show the what should be five dollars can sell for $50 once Chinese have the monopoly
not just chinese, everyone does that.
Until very recently I was a super brand snob - I laughed at my boss when he bought his 1st Chinese car….. now I think every legacy automaker is literally Kodak.
I didn't take them that seriously until I drove the new zeekr, now I think the legacy manufacturers are in trouble. It was nicer than the BMW and the Audi, better spec'd and A LOT cheaper.
It hard to come up with a better comparison than Kodak.
Loads of people still believe these legacy car brands are too big and important to fail, and that they'll always be around, but they're looking through blinkers. They can't see that those brands are already dead. It's just a question of how long before they wind things up. Toyota might scrape through sheer fanboy brand loyalty, but they probably shouldn't.
I agree. Also ICE in passenger and small commercial vehicles is a sure fire way for a manufacturer to go broke.
Depends on market, look at the poor EV infrastructure Australia has , there are a lot of poorer countries with worse infrastructure and ICE will have a place there for some time to come.
@garage sale: 99% of ‘ev infrastructure’ is having electricity where you live. Australia seems to be ok with that. As for the rest. In 5 years of driving ev I have never been stuck for a charge. Despite the compulsory video on sky news each long weekend I have never waited to use a public charger on a trip. As for the poorer countries with poor infrastructure it is worth noting that even a diesel powered ev charger is more efficient and cost effective than burning the same amount of diesel in a vehicle.
Not at all like Kodak, there is a long history of governments propping up their domestic car manufacturers to keep them going, seems unlikely to stop. They might be making cheap copies of chinese cars in the future, but they'll still be there.
It's not a matter of price but brand longevity.
How many of these newbies will be around in 10+ years? What do you do about servicing, spares?
Not all of them but at this stage BYD, Geely & SAIC Motor should survive. A higher chance of them surviving than Nissan or Mitsubishi.
Even if they quit, servicing and spares will be available from the specialist and aftermarket.
If the Chinese can tool and manufacture quality aftermarket parts from BMW, they will be able to supply parts for Chinese made cars.
Nissan and Mitsubishi died a decade ago, they just don't know it yet.
You might need to do some research regarding Mitsubishi,
"By ditching sedans for high-margin SUVs and utes, Mitsubishi transformed from a struggling generalist into a profitable specialist. Its total assets grew from roughly $18.5 billion AUD in 2014 to over $24.2 billion AUD today. Despite lower sales volumes, strategic asset growth and shared alliance costs have secured a much more stable, wealthier financial future."
This is a 30% increase in the company's total value.
Quality over Quantity: They stopped trying to sell a million cheap cars (like the Lancer and Mirage) and focused on high-profit vehicles. They now sell fewer cars but make significantly more money on every Triton and Outlander that leaves the lot.
The Power of 3: By joining the Renault-Nissan-Mitsubishi Alliance, they no longer have to pay for 100% of their own research. They share the "skeleton" of their cars with Nissan, which saved them billions in development costs.
ASEAN Powerhouse: While they may seem "quiet" in some countries, they have become a dominant force in Southeast Asia, where they are a top-tier luxury and work-vehicle brand.
Mitsubishi didn’t "die"—they just stopped being a "car" company and became a truck and SUV powerhouse. They traded the "cool factor" of the Lancer Evo for a multi-billion dollar bank account and a rock-solid future.
Now in regards to Nissan,
Nissan is a much larger beast than Mitsubishi and yes its asset's have dropped significantly.
Total assets fell from $204 billion AUD in 2016 to roughly $168 billion AUD today. Global sales plummeted from 5.4 million units to 3.2 million, flipping strong profits into multi-billion dollar losses.
While Mitsubishi chose to "shrink to grow," Nissan tried to conquer the world and got stretched too thin.
How did Nissan hurt itself,
For years, former CEO Carlos Ghosn pushed for a 8% global market share. To hit this target, Nissan flooded markets with cars, often using massive discounts and "subprime" financing (loaning to people with poor credit).
Many key models (like the Frontier/Navara ute and the 370Z) went over 10 years without a full redesign.
Nissan relied too heavily on China for profits. However, they were caught off guard by the lightning-fast shift to Electric Vehicles (EVs) led by local brands like BYD.
The 2018 arrest of Carlos Ghosn sparked a "civil war" between Nissan’s Japanese leadership and their French partner, Renault.
This infighting paralyzed the company for years.
Nissan is now trying to do exactly what Mitsubishi did 10 years ago: stop being everything to everyone and just focus on making a few things well.
They are still a $168 billion AUD company so they have a very good chance at survival with good management.
@2esc: Yes and hardly seeing any new mitsis on the road now vs Chinese. The triton used to be the 30-40k go-to ute, now its lost that to Chinese market. This is absolutely the wrong way to go and the market is proving that.
@2esc: This is fair enough but you've just pointed out that they converted from being a fair company selling cars for what they are worth into a rip off company selling their cars far beyond what it cost them. That explains why the Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV sales have plummeted after being destroyed by GWM & BYD's PHEV cars that are better and cheaper. About time Aussies went back to paying the fair price for cars again instead of the huge profit margins slapped on after COVID.
I'd have more faith in any of those three than Stellantis these days. Ford and GM have turned inwards to be US focused and are being protected solely by tariffs from needing to be bailed out again. Half the car companies around have done deals with SAIC to sell cars in China, which is now the biggest car market, and probably handed over a massive amount of IP in the process.
The only way western car companies are making a comeback is if the Chinese economy collapses. At the moment I'm more worried about the American economy though.
I get some of my bmw parts from Australian dealer, seem from spareto and autodoc in Europe and some from Asia, there won’t be an issue for Chinese bigger brands. I only regard Chinese brands if I was to buy EV as they have vertical,integration for battery supply chain, and I’m not sure how, any people have the smarts to work on EV at home considering the energy stored in the battery,
People asked the same question of Japanese auto makers back in the day.
I still remember when people would say it's much better to get an Australian produced Commodore or Falcon instead of an imported Honda, Mazda or Toyota because the Aussie makers will always be around and parts would always be available and everyone can work on them…etc.
After all that, who's around today and who's not?
I'll pop these here
https://www.drive.com.au/news/chinese-electric-car-brands-co…
https://youtu.be/Hw2_s31u_4Q?si=Ya0uScsT-9e3kPEa
There is a fundamental issue with the Chinese market. We're becoming a dumping ground. It won't end well.
I'll pop these here
Yeah, look, let's not pretend like this is just anti-EV slop.
I could easily find you similar propaganda about Japanese auto makers when they were first entering Australia as well.
There is a fundamental issue with the Chinese market.
What exactly is this "fundamental issue"?
The reality is that car manufacturing has always been an industry that's been propped up by various nation states, and there are plenty of car manufacturers which would face significant financial issues if that state funding were to be pulled (or the market "realigned", so to speak).
We're becoming a dumping ground. It won't end well.
When you say that we are a "dumping ground", what exactly do you mean?
I think this is all crystal ball nonsense, just like people who claim that they can pick stocks and beat the market. Nobody has any idea what the market will look like in the future, "industry analysts" are all just talking out of their backside, otherwise they'd be making money with their predictions rather than feeding the media. It's also silly to equate all Chinese manufacturers.
I'm certainly not "defending" Chinese manufacturers, I just think the market will end up sorting things out. The ones who make the cars people want to buy will survive, and they will end up making better cars because of their profitability. No amount of scaremongering or propaganda from the media will change that.
@p1 ama: 100%. Nothing in the business world happens in a vacuum, describing entire markets as dumping grounds is absurd. The Chinese govt will do anything to ensure there is no Evergrande for the auto industry.
@BartholemewH: Haha, I know it's hilarious, what's all this dumb dumping ground talk? They are acting like there's no wait list that stretches for months for the BYD cars or something. We want more cars than they can supply! It'd be like saying, we are a dumping ground for for Toyota RAV4s. No, they are selling a product that we want, the lower the price the more Australians benefit. If they want to dump the same car for $50k instead of $60k then that's a win, if they want to "dump" it for $30k instead of $60k then that's an even bigger win. The only people that lose are the legacy manufacturers that have been ripping us off more and more ever since COVID. The winners are all Australians who get to enjoy far more luxurious cars without being price gouged.
@supersabroso: i'm glad people are calling out this sensationalist murdoch media rubbish. complaining about cheap cars when we have no domestic auto industry to protect is beyond ridiculous
10 years? Who cares. The speed of tech right now and the ultra low prices, we will all have moved on in 10 years. Possibly to vehicles as a service models. It’s just a car to move a-b, yes it needs to be comfortable ✅ it needs software that makes you happy ✅ and it needs to get you where you wish to go in an efficient manner✅. The Chinese cars on the market right now do all that very well. And they are cost effective ✅ for a more premium offering Tesla does all that superbly at a slightly higher price.
I’d pay $20,000 extra if I liked a car, so I’m not limiting myself to Chinese when I buy EV, MG have a very nice convertible the cyberstar …sure it’s $100k , but that’s what my bmw ice cost. For people on a budget Chinese ev are great value and cheaper motoring for $ per km per year over 10 years, I don’t really think of a car that was $50 new and what the resale in 10 years, like 10 year old laptop or phone, new car will be better, It’s Facebook market place for,the old one, just want it gone to make space for new car.
Have a look and see where that MG Cyberstar is made..
BMW's will survive. They're so committed to providing jobs for their employees they still employ a bloke to install indicators and indicator levers on BMW's.
If you ever feel you life is pointless, remember the was an engineer that designed the indicators, a supplier who manufactured them and a tech that installed and tested them.
I remember that there’s a lifeguard at the swimming at the Olympics
Love my bmw, I have a g20 but after looking at bmw EV, If the budget stretches it would be my next EV although cost more than BYD or Tesla.
But using the indicators on a BMW EV would drain the battery! Ahhh I see. It's the perfect transition.
But can you spoon engine them? With T66 turbos and motec system exhausts?
Don't let Hector distract you
could we see the end of European/Japanese cars in Australia?
nope.
I don't have an opinion on which car manufacturers will survive, and which will not. Even if I did, I'd put my money where my mouth is rather than just rattle it off.
However, what I do think is sad about the car industry today is the slow death of enthusiast cars. I grew up loving cars, posters on the wall, played every Need for Speed game, watched ever Fast and Furious movie…etc.
One of the things I really respected about Japanese automakers was that they were once committed to producing enthusiast cars at (relatively) affordable price points - Supra, WRX, Lancer EVO, R32 Skyline, RX-7, the Honda S2000, even the later 86/BRZ, and in a way, even the Nissan GT-R, were all cars that had such character, performance, and were accessible to the average enthusiast.
These days, the enthusiast market is completely dead, all of the automakers seem to prefer just pumping out shitbox SUVs that look dumb, are crap to drive, and only ever advertise a quick 0-100 time. The "street" heritage and culture of the regular enthusiast car from the late 80s to mid 00s have just been completely lost.
I was excited because I thought some of the EV manufacturers would bring something back - perhaps the Tesla Roadster, I saw some promise from Polestar, and potentially BYD, but in the end, the market prefers generic SUVs that people can just replace in a few years as opposed to a car that could be someone's pride and joy.
It is rare to find someone who articulates the soul of that era. You’ve hit on a grief that many of us feel: the transition from cars being an extension of our identity to cars being a disposable appliance. Roaming the 90s inner west Sydney neighbourhood was all about spotting Blue WRX on gold rims, every block had a sexspec parked on driveway.
The 90s and early 00s Japanese "Golden Era" wasn't just about the specs either, you didn't need to be a millionaire to own a piece of engineering that felt like it was designed by people who actually enjoyed driving.
some reason why the "Death of the Enthusiast" happened over last two decades.
1.The Homogenization of Design: You mentioned the "shitbox SUVs," yes, I drive too, sigh. To save costs, manufacturers now use global modular platforms. This results in "crossover-bloat"—where every car has the same high hip point, the same numb electric steering, and the same focus on infotainment over engagement.
2. The 0-100 Trap: Speed has been commodified. When any generic EV family SUV can do 0-100 km/h in 4 seconds thanks to instant electric torque, "fast" stops being special. The way a turbo spools or an RX-7 screams toward redlinecan't be replicated by a silent motor and a heavy battery.
The Heritage Gap: We went from the "Street
3. Culture of F&F, Need for Speed which celebrated tuning and individuality—to a "Lease Culture," where the goal is to have the newest screen and the lowest monthly payment before swapping it for the next generic pod.
The Small Glimmers of Hope
While the "affordable" market is largely a graveyard, a few brands are still fighting the good fight, even in 2026:
Toyota’s GR Division: The GR86 and GR Corolla are perhaps the last heir of JDMs
The Return of Nameplates: Honda Prelude (as a hybrid) and rumors of an electric Celica.
Personally, I the JDM era serves as a permanent cultural hallmark for Gen X and Millennials.
AI assisted writing.
Tbh, i think most of these "enthusiasts" cars are being killed off my people's affordability (poor sales) and also mainly the emission ratings.
So, really just blame the regulation but at the same time understand why the regulation keeps pushing car manufacturers to these boring buillds.
I'm maybe oversimplifying things but maybe eventually EVs can have more characters than they have now.
Thank grok!
Car makers don't care about enthusiasts because most enthusiasts don't buy a new car, and the days of car companies being headed by enthusiast are long gone, it's just bean counters.
It sucks seeing the roads full of soulless SUV's and Ford Rangers.
Q How do they compete?
A They cant. they are ReallyLost
We only see whats happening here.
Some claim car manufacturers like Mitsubishi are dead and just dont know it but in reality they have grown by 30% as a company in the last 10 years.
By ditching sedans for high-margin SUVs and utes, Mitsubishi transformed from a struggling generalist into a profitable specialist. Its total assets grew from roughly $18.5 billion AUD in 2014 to over $24.2 billion AUD today.
China currently has its own problems in its car industry, Nèijuǎn (involution) which describes a suicidal "race to the bottom." While hyper-competition sparked innovation, the government now fears "disorderly" price wars are destroying long-term viability. Beijing is concerned that razor-thin margins stall R&D, compromise safety, and create "zombie companies." To protect the economy, officials are now intervening to shift the industry from mindless price-cutting toward sustainable, high-quality growth.
Some experts are now speculating out of the approximately 100 car companies in China because of razor-thin margins smaller players will merge or declare bankruptcy, leaving only the "national champions" like BYD, Geely, and state-backed giants like SAIC to dominate the landscape.
The Chinese car companies that will most likely survive in ten years are Byd, Geely, Saic, Changan, GAC, Xiaomi and Huawei so if your someone that hangs onto their cars long term and keen on a Chinese made car I'd choose one of these brands.
By sheer coincidence, a few days ago I watched the BYD : The biggest SCAM of the car industry ?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tS_fJJxMjn4 that you have referenced.
This youtube video actually proves the opposite of what you are going for in your post. The headline is an intentional provocation to click on it, the video doesn't conclude that BYD is a scam. Maybe check you "cold hard facts" before you write an essay on a shoppers forum.
yep, BYD are winning through vertical integration, scale and some very smart business moves. yes they also have some government subsidies, but they pale in comparison to subsidies companies like GM, Ford and other european brands over the years.
@gromit: BYD is under threat from some of the more technologically and software advanced competitors in the chinese market. As the first vertically integrated maker, BYD had economies of scale and because of its origins as a battery maker, they had a head start with what was previously, the most important core hardware in an EV. But as battery tech became commodized, the shift to software differentiation has become a problem for BYD. The irony is that they are tackling the problem in the same way as the traditional car makers that they had dethroned - BYD has been trying to make better EVs by improving scale and manufacturing, rather than focus on software. The next 2-3 years will probably make or break BYD - everyone in their local market is gunning for L4 automous driving and vertical integration wont get them there.
@FlyingMiffy: Completely agree, dont mistake my defense of them as being a byd fan, they do have issues they need to address if they want to maintain there position, they are in almost as much danger as Tesla.
@gromit: and obscene amount of subsidies from the ccp.
hut thats okay, because its china and they are extremely ethical
It's great to see that the community here is able to call out bs like this.
Yeah I watched it too.
I hate clickbait videos, but I still click… FML
Because you provided a list of companies that were never contenders. The head of Ford smells what's up and has candidly spoken about it. If the Euros/Japanese think they can compete against vertically integrated battery/vehicle suppliers on value terms, they are crazy.
Will the other automaker die out? No. There are people that will pay for legacy brands. Will they suffer under the volume China puts out? Absolutely.
PS I dont know why anyone would NEG vote cold hard facts!
Because you're full of shit and used shithouse non-starter, bottom tier Chinese manufacturers as your examples. NONE of them were ever big players or were any serious company…
Noticed you didn't mention any of the HUGE players in this space, like GWM, SAIC, GAC, JAC, Geely, Chery, Nio, etc. just to name a few… And your BYD claim is just more bullshit.
Typical Idiot.
Atleast open the clickbit video and watch it before posting on a forum.
BYD is winning.
"Facts" Just like the real Dr Phil…
You’re about as credible as the actual Dr Phil. The MG4 is one of the most awarded vehicles out there and has stood the test of time.
The AI video you posted is a weird choice to back your opinions on.
Well i dont know about those videos but the Chinese Government is worried about Nèijuǎn (involution) which describes a suicidal "race to the bottom."
For its car industry they are now implementing many policy and regulation changes to address this.
But the people negging you cant spend 2 minutes looking for the facts.
"The most significant moment occurred during the July 2024 Politburo meeting, chaired by President Xi Jinping. The official communiqué from the meeting—published by Xinhua and the People’s Daily—contained a directive that shocked the industry:
"It is a must to reinforce industry self-discipline to prevent vicious 'involution-style' (内卷式) competition."
This was the first time the term "involution" was used in a top-level Communist Party document. It signaled to every car executive in China that the government viewed the price war not as healthy competition, but as a "disorderly" threat".
'flooding' which no doubt is accurate; is emotive.
Pretty sure the market is deciding.
Pretty sure that's capitalism.
I think the Chinese are cleaning the floor with traditional car brands.
I also think the Chinese government will threaten to remotely turn them all off when they invade Taiwan.
If that occurs, there will be life for other manufacturers.
I also think the Chinese government will threaten to remotely turn them all off when they invade Taiwan.
This is a myth. They get to pull this trigger once. Once they use it, every country will ban Chinese cars.
The Chinese car manufacturing behemoth would die overnight.
Do you think in a real war they wouldn't? If Ukraine could disable a big fraction of Russian cars they wouldn't?
I agree it is unlikely, but why do you think the USA is banning Chinese ICT gear?
The chance that a kill switch turns off routers, cars, cctv etc. is an astonishing advantage to China if there ever was a military conflict.
Do you think in a real war they wouldn't?
You have to ask yourself "What would the Chinese gain from making all those cars inoperable?" It would simply piss off the people in those countries, and massively reduce any opposition to the war.
What would China gain from this move?
but why do you think the USA is banning Chinese ICT gear?
Because their own manufacturers have far more pull than Chinese. I mean, do you seriously think the US Government doesn't do all the spying that they accuse the Chinese of doing?
@photonbuddy: I think you are still thinking "trade war" not hot war.
Of course the USA back doors everything. The joke in 2006 was get a cisco firewall to protect against the Chinese, a Checkpoint against the Arabs, Kaspersky against the Americans and (I can't remember the brand) against the Israelis.
I think also it's worth noting this Iran adventure is the first time the bulk of western allies haven't come along for the ride.
The cracks in America's power are on full display and have been incredibly weakened by this Whitehouse.
Again, I don't think China needs to fight a war, but they are very well positioned to wage one, compared to 20 years ago.
A war where America was the aggressor would definitely struggle to build a coalition, given the deep economic ties all of the world has with China, and the difficulties Europe, Australia etc. would face cutting off business with China.
Imagine a Taiwanese election where the ruling party favoured closer ties with China. America would have trouble accepting that.
That whole argument about Chinese ICT security annoys me to no end. I was unlucky enough to have been working for Australia's largest Telco prior to the 5G rollout and was part of the team that evaluated Huawei tech. Against every performance, reliability and security metric, Huawei was better. The software was more advanced and the architecture was better designed. The reason Australia pays more for crappier 5G now is because a bunch of white blokes said so. The tech leads on the Huawei side knew this, what they couldnt understand was why Australia would put its own national interest behind those of its supposed allies.
@FlyingMiffy: If you ever see the Utopia TV show scene where Rob Sitch is talking to Defence about keeping our trade routes safe from the Chinese to sell our iron ore to the Chinese it is the same. Nobody will name them and it is quite funny.
I do get why the decision was made, though. If the Americans end up fighting them over Taiwan they don't want potential allies concerned the phone system will turn off.
The problem from my point of view is we have no alternative available than potentially being dragged into a war.
At least one aspect of Trump's presidency will be to shake the thoughtlessly confident military here that we can depend on the USA.
@FlyingMiffy: That was when, 2018? Since then Huawei has been busted spying in Poland, been involved in breaking into telco execs homes in Denmark, rolling out a sub standard data center for PNG, sending data to China from Taiwan secretly from their devices. Let’s not even bring up the IP theft from Cisco etc before all this.
With hindsight, honestly, I don’t blame the people that made that decision way back then, before any of this happened.
Once they use it, every country will ban Chinese cars
Only if their competitors haven't already been significantly wiped out and any remaining competitors' manufacturing capacities remain with sufficient room to scale up quickly.
He who is prudent and lies in wait for an enemy who is not, will be victorious.
I'd be more concerned about Chinese made humanoid robots in a few years from now. It will be an army of trojan horses laying in wait.
You only need to take out a few gps satellites or jam to cause havoc, no uber eats delivery, not sure how many people still have a printed street directory or map. To turn off a car remotely, it needs to be internet connected, and someone needs to paying the sim plan, be more worried about phones being hacked and turned off, they are internet connected.
it needs to be internet connected, and someone needs to paying the sim plan
Someone must be. Most modern cars have several sim cards already built in.
https://www.aaaa.com.au/news/aaaa-news/aaaa-says-government-…
Nearly eight out of 10 drivers (78%) are unaware that their vehicle is transmitting data back to the car manufacturer about the vehicle and the driver’s behaviour,
@tenpercent: 8 out of 10, I thought it was 4 out of 5 … well if it looks like war maybe they need to turn off android auto or tethering …. Might be a Darwin moment for some, and Telstra and such like and block things if needed, google SOCI act for essential services services, we in the tech industry are working to protect against events that make you want to buy more foil for a better hat.
It is a lever that can threaten to use, and have a track record of doing already with their commodity buying shenanigans. Ill never buy a car from there. Not to mention the Chinese government are about as evil as it gets with all their organ harvesting and tibetan genocide.
@mskeggs get you facts right. You can't invade your own territory, it's ridiculous. Regardless, the only obstacle for mainland and Taiwan reunification is US.
I understand the point, but I think the Taiwanese people still have a majority favouring independence, though I am sure the current US government is causing many concerns.
As I commented above, I suspect that China can re-unify without military intervention in a couple of generations if they play it right.
Already I understand views that were strongly opposed to the mainland have softened as the older generations pass.
Probably the thing that would accelerate this would be taking a softer line with Hong Kong, and continuing to make the current separation expensive for the USA.
It sure seems the current US administration is interested in costly foreign entanglements.
My guess is this will be the Chinese leadership strategy.
I think the rest of the west is much less interested in Taiwan, despite their technical importance, and excluding Japan/Korea/Philippines who have local concerns.
Taiwanese people are brainwashed. If US lets go or is forced to abandon the media space in Taiwan, then the natural force of reunification of Chinese people will take place. I believe this is the strategy mainland China is working towards, with US trying to provoke Ukraine- Russia style war to separate the same people from each other irreversibly. For some reason I think mainland China is much smarter than Russia and will not fall for the trap.
They won't and can't take taiwan. Read about what the US will do if they take taiwan. They have a plan in place should China try take taiwan. They will simply blow up the semi conductor factory TSM
Plus in a direct war USA vs China….US will level China in a matter of days, just because you have 1.4b population or whatever it is means nothing, whens the last time china went into a war? They got no clue about anything except just stealing patents.
People need to chill making it as if china is some huge power and even if they do turn off the cars. Just makes the case more stronger for the USA to level them.
US will level China in a matter of days
Just like Iran, but faster ??
Kool-Aid is toxic man.
USA has already won the war against Iran.
They have cut off chinas supply of cheap oil both in venezula and now iran. What's chinas answer oh no they going to ban exports or export inflation. The US has already won that war as well. More and more firms are exiting china and moving operations to vietnam/india and other places.
But yeah you keep thinking china is the good guys and are winning. They will be fully ended in the next 5 years.
Like i said just because you have 1.4b population it simply means nothing quality over quantity.
The real estate market is in full collapse mode and soon the entire country will be.
The USA determines the entire planets economy. Get in line or we drop bombs on you. Thats how simple it is. Because no one has the power to stop them like it or not.
Japan was the china back in the 1980s and 90s. What happened to them? Do you think the chinese are more smart over japanese? In your dreams lol and even japan got put into its place.
@ReallyLost: I haven’t much time for the human rights record of the CCP, but I’ve got a pretty strong respect for facts, and your posts are some weird 2003 era view of the world.
Try informing yourself beyond truth social and you might find things are not as peachy for the USA these days, and there are downsides for all of the western countries because of it.
Unfortunately, it seems the USA has decided competing with China is too hard, so they will just sit back and be a self-interested isolationist.
It is embarrassing to see how belittled they are rapidly becoming.
China can just act sanely and it will be enough to see their country benefit.
Whether they will ever take Taiwan? I think it is most likely they will do so peacefully, via a multi-generational plan to integrate more closely after the USA decides Taiwan is charging them too much for semi-conductors or something and punishes them with tariffs.
They already have a fairly strong minority keen to work closer with China. When Trump treats Taiwan the same as other long term allies like UK, France, Spain, Australia, Canada etc. that support for China will grow.
@mskeggs: Trump is only there for another 3 years. Plenty of time to wreak havoc and do plenty of insider trading, sure, but I think the rest of the world fully understands he is transitory. Covid already taught everyone to become a little more independent and to not put all your eggs in one basket. Trump's 2nd presidency is reinforcing that message, which I think is the point of it. Multipolarity by 2030 required him. But he would have to be followed up with someone similarly extreme (either end of the spectrum) to cement their downfall from the #1 world superpower pedestal.
I would rather an older Euro or jap car than a new Chinese car.