how different would the internet be today if likes and comments had never been invented?
Would social media be less addictive and less toxic, or would it never have become what it is today?
Feel free to comment your thought about it. 😂
And before anyone accuses me of blasphemy, I’m definitely not suggesting OzBargain disable its comments section. 😅
People say and do things in order to provoke the strongest reactions
No they don’t
*sits down in chair and pays for 5 minutes
@jjjaar: Righto, so, just the five minute argument to start off with, eh? That will be 1 pound, thanks.
Now, have you been here before?
No they don’t
I never said that everyone does it, just that there exist some people who do.
As long as there are some small number of people who do, then masses of people will be provoked into responding, the algorithm pushes those posts up in people's feeds, and it becomes a positive feedback loop.
You mean a negative feedback loop.
Also, I was intentionally being antagonistic. I agree with you.
Social media feeds off negativity. It gets more engagement, so they keep pushing things that will get people angry. When something is free, we’re the product.
You mean a negative feedback loop.
Negative or positive depending on how you look at it.
I meant a positive feedback loop as in the outrage drives the algorithm, then the algorithm drives the outrage…etc. Positive feedback loop in terms of engagement.
We actually had an internet without likes for a decade or two.
It wasn't that great.
Turns out most people's posts and comments aren't very informative or clever, so anything that was in some way good or interesting or useful was completely lost in the noise.
Digg and twitter and reddit were a MASSIVE improvement over that. It's easier to identify a good comment than to write one. The cream floats to the top.
The rise of performative/controversial comments came after. And that is definitely a huge problem today, don't get me wrong.
Just orders of magnitude smaller than an internet that's 99% worthless noise.
I think one of the worst things about the internet is that it's become so performative
Reminds me of my deal about W-Submarine MK3 (CINCO) $2,970,000 USD Was $4,150,000 … got like 15 likes in 10 minutes before mods pulled it as a asinine joke post, but for sure it would have gotten +1000
Would social media be less addictive and less toxic
Less addictive? I don't know.
Less toxic? Absolutely.
Hehe without likes and comments i think p websites be used more to fill in that void
I see on ozb some deals people go to deals " just for the comments"
I wonder what else people would do in replacement if no likes and comments
Maybe they would play games with chat feature more
You must be young enough that you never experienced the original internet instead of this enshitified version.
It was less owned by corporations back then, but it was also a hive of scum and villainy.
I learned a lot by pretending to be a girl on IRC. I probably should have just been collecting details and forwarding them straight to the cops (not that they would have done much back then).
but it was also a hive of scum and villainy.
Lucky there's none of that now 😂
I learned a lot by pretending to be a girl on IRC
I'm not sure that's a normal thing to do.
I learned a lot by pretending to be a girl on IRC.
Like how to run a honeypot operation?
I tend to think the end of he internet was roughly 2009 with the death of Megaupload.
Or when altavista stopped being a proper search engine.
astalavista was the best search engine, if you're old like me
The end of the internet was in 1993. Before that it was awesome. People signed posts with their real names and email addresses.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eternal_September
Now get off my lawn.
Nah memes in the internet sense weren't invented yet. So obviously you are wrong.
some old forums still have this.
I think it was ok up until about 2014
Oh no! I have seen the internet from the dial up connection days. Used a 2G phone to access internet. That is why current internet feels as polluted as sewage.
It's complete garbage. While I think the likes etc are an issue, the biggest issue is that everything has been commercialised and monetised, pay for a subscription to view etc. It used to just be people sharing ideas, thoughts, info, mp3s etc.
It was also something only smart people cared about and had access too, at least for a few years.
Even since COVID, spaces like reddit and twitter have gotten dumber as more and more people have access.
I miss OzBargain's giphy integration.
i wish i was here for that.
Aka lagfest
I’m just here for the forum drama and to enable/encourage reckless spending
enable/encourage reckless spending
you're doing a good job papi
no likes and comments
Yall remember that time in 2013 where the world was OBSESSED with the Harlem Shake? That was prob the closest we ever gon get to world peace.
before filthy frank devolved into joji
Yeah, those green kale juice type shakes and muscled up gym boy type protein and supplement shakes really stimulated quite hostile situations and rageathons at times, eh?
Kale even sounds hostile, bitter and disgusting. Anybody who ever claimed they consumed that and turned that into a healthy shake because it tasted good, I say they're lying.
Kale even sounds hostile, bitter and disgusting.
If you ever visited the Atomic forums way back then you really don't want to remember the green smoothie thread.
No, I didn't. I was not/am not even aware of the existence of those forums lol.
Even yesterday when I did my grocery order, kale was there, so apparently something people still use. blerk
I imagine those that do use it do not have any functioning taste buds and are masters of their body's natural gag reflex.
That was what made me think of it when Jimothy mentioned shakes lol.
Even yesterday when I did my grocery order, kale was there, so apparently something people still use. blerk
I imagine those that do use it do not have any functioning taste buds and are masters of their body's natural gag reflex.
The only time I've bought kale was when my rabbit was still around - he loved it.
AtomicMPC was a magazine in the old days that you could actually physically turn the pages. Their online site included a pretty active forum.
That particular post (which I just recalled was actually titled The Green Slushy) was memorable for all of the wrong reasons. It involved an ambulance call out and the ambos needing control over their gag reflex (and it wasn't involving kale).
Damn, now I have to go wash that memory away.
Comments are good or we wouldn't even be able to have this discussion. I think that it's fabulous that it is so easy to communicate with strangers who live anywhere from the next street to across the other side of the world.
So many people with so much knowledge, information and lived experience to share. Even if it's just meeting/engaging with others who have the same interests, careers or hobbies as you do.
I feel absolutely priveledged to be alive in a world where I can be a part of that. When I was a kid, most of your exposure was to a kid (or other age appropriate people) at the next desk, or in the same office building or sporting group. These days, that opportunity is extended to people all around the world.
I don't agree with the likes or negs on forums (probably different for deals) and their equivalents. It feels a lot like bullying potential to me, I think that is one of the significant negatives to accessing our global networking environment.
And as for stoic, serious discussions free from the larrikin and joking or non serious posts - meh.
Either scroll on by or hide content you object to or frequent the platforms where any kind of fun or friendship is banned.
Not everybody engages with these more generalised platforms for serious, in depth (or even meaningful) discussions all of the time (some maybe never).
Sometimes they may appreciate it (the serious stuff) whereas other times, they just want to escape from their stoic deep and meaningful environment for a while and just enjoy a few moments of joking and non complicated interactions with others.
Plenty of specific content platforms around where everybody is always on their best behaviour or has a large stick up their arsenal had a good win the other day, eh? if that's what floats your boat.
Otherwise, the content that you find undesirable is usually quite easy to ignore, cos just maybe those people who's content you object to, objects to some or all of your contributions too, but they've just put on their big girl panties and worked out how to scroll, hide or ignore it instead of having a whinge about it.
Sometimes they may appreciate it (the serious stuff) whereas other times, they just want to escape from their stoic deep and meaningful environment for a while and just enjoy a few moments of joking and non complicated interactions with others.
I think the broader issue is that places to have more meaningful conversations have largely been eroded as the internet has become dominated by social media, which is just a cesspool of algorithms pushing toxicity in everyone's faces.
Special interest forums are broadly just dead these days - I remember there used to be all sorts of forums about various hobbies and interests. I used to be on forums discussing cars, movies, computers, languages, all manner of obscure and fun things. Whilst there was obviously various shenanigans on these platforms as well, there was a certain level of thoughtfulness they encouraged.
It wasn't just "being serious", it was about trying to inform yourself about a niche topic, thinking through what you wanted to say, trying to actually engage with people and discuss something interesting…etc.
One of the issues with kids growing up in the current internet era is that it's all just shitposting and constant "in your face" attention grabbing. Every time I watch YouTube, read the news, look at anything on social media, it's always like having people yell at me, or high energy posts rammed in my face. There's no "space" - the quiet moment of boredom that prompts reflecting, thinking, understanding…etc.
It's not like reading a thoughtful response, or even watching a light-hearted "old YouTube" style video which just prompts a sense of calm and reflection.
Special interest forums are broadly just dead these days -
Probably all died from boredom because eventually the fun police drove everyone else away on the outrage bus.
Still a few around though, but exemplary behaviour at all times seems to be a pre requisite at most. Just such an overarching somber "vibe" that even John Cleese and co would be frightened to crack a joke on most, at least ones that I'm familiar with/aware of.
I used to be on forums discussing cars, movies, computers, languages, all manner of obscure and fun things.
Whirlpool seems to meet your interest requirements and they tend to frown upon anybody having fun there too (or even just suspected of having a slightly elevated pulse/heart rate). Very serious folk over there, talking about very serious things in very serious ways. Feels like walking on eggshells most times over there shudders.
I'm positive I have seen you over there or alternatively, there is an imposter with quite a similar name to yours (though not exactly the same).
TLDR?
DBSFR.
Dragon Ball Sport Fighting Revolution
@Wiadro: You posted while I was editing
As it happens, your comment probably belongs to #3.
(DBSFR = Don't Be So Reproductiving Rude).
Whingers wear nappies. If you don't like certain content, either scroll past, ignore, hide or go to a different platform.
As it happens, your comment probably belongs to #3.
look i agree
@jjjaar: So, would you like a five minute argument for one pound, or an entire course of arguments for just eight pounds?
Ask yourself in 10 years when we just consume AI generated content based on historical forum posts.
I think the world would be better if all social media had a dislike button. Ozbargain is great in that regard. Only being able to spread positive messaging is toxic for our culture long term.
And the paid comments is another beast. Companies, parties and movie studios trying to sway opinions using that.
Every single time I see him on TV I hear that in my mind.
And this man wants to be PM.
Didn’t want to update the post to add more thoughts.
Addiction drops hard. The variable reward schedule (will this get likes?) is one of the most powerful psychological hooks ever engineered. Remove it and usage becomes more intentional.
I think smartphones had the bigger negative impact, people glued to their phones, everything recorded
Smartphones gave the internet to people who can't handle the internet. That was the problem.
How different would the Internet be without likes and comments? It's like asking
All these are just communication medium to facilitate people interacting with each other. Internet would be a much worse place if only those controlling the platforms get the voice.
The laugh emojis from those too stupid to make a coherent point are a personal favourite.
😂
OzBargain disable its comments section
Perfect topic for a trial though 🤔
Hey, you got nominated as a bully in one of those review sites for which Scotty posted a link in the roundup thread yesterday. Lol.
we would less trolling, less vibe coding, and probably no penalty box.
how different would the world would be today if likes and comments had never been invented?
Fixed it because:
social media be less addictive and less toxic,
I remember the pre like / dislike internet days (damn im old.)
would it never have become what it is today?
Yes, between that like/dislike and the ability to constantly cram our brain full of happy go lucky juice from scrolling on smart phones, the world changed a lot.
People sucked before, but they suck more now 😂
People sucked before, but they suck more now
Though I think it was established in the 60's or 70's (when was movie Easyrider released - about then), that the harder you sucked, the higher you got.
Some believe also applicable in other areas such as in places of employment or where promotion type activities may arise.
It's not the likes and comments but the algorithms that push divisive posts because they drive likes and comments. The less users have control over the content they see on a platform the more toxic they are, just look at Facebook.
IMO it is more specifically the "internet fame" association that is closely related to that. Not including comments and discussions blanketly is a bit too much, as most of the negative things people think of are things like kids doing really dumb stuff they saw on the internet, but because they think it would get them the popularity as well.
It's like classic peer group pressure doing dumb stuff but now super charged because instead of just literally a 2 or 3 mates to "impress" it now includes this promise of potentially millions and wanting to go viral.
Not including comments and discussions blanketly is a bit too much, as most of the negative things people think of are things like kids doing really dumb stuff they saw on the internet, but because they think it would get them the popularity as well.
So, is the online space becoming filled with increasingly juvenile people or did I, without noticing, become old?
Lived through life before social media.
Internet was much simpler times, modem dialling to connect to the internet. Mum calls, internet drops out.
It was Geocities to find/document your interests, ICQ and MSN messenger to connect with your friends. Discovering internet/helping each other via mIRC. Napster/limewire to get music. Visiting specific forums to get helpful advice from fellow hobbyists
Feel like nowadays everyone is trying to get impressions all the time - non stop attention. Likes likes likes! People taking photos for likes instead of capturing a memory. People going out there doing dumb things to draw attention/views. Things definitely changed.
Comments?
There's quote that I wrote down because it was pretty smart:
"In order to be fully justified in holding our views, we need to know what we'd say to the most intelligent and capable defenders of opposing views."
And that's what the internet is for. To practice on easier opponents.
I love all these young people that are completely oblivious to early internet. The worst things that have ever been said to me (and my own equally vile replies) either happened on BBS, newsgroups, or emails. We were the toxicity.
I'm so old I've even had people send me spite on actual paper. I've said stuff to people on the phone that has made them hang up on me. None of this needs a 'thumbs up' to happen.
That being said, modern times are cancerous in their own unique ways. The hyper narcissism of porcelain feelings and egregious attention seeking for example. Hoeflation wouldn't exist without social media. Teenagers, liberal women, and the mentally ill being in a death spiral to see who can out degenerate each other wouldn't happen as fast without social media. And it's basically helping us to an end point of 1984 and Brave New World.
Looking forwards, I can't wait for the new and hilarious ways AI will maximalise the fall of man. Right now it's just the Affluent, White, Female, Urban, Liberals (AWFULs) leading the vanguard of mental and moral degradation, but soon enough someone's going to nail AI and put that into that loop and supercharge it. Right now they've gotten to 'romance' novels where they get rogered by a minotaur by themselves, imagine where the self reinforcement learning of machines will take that? Truly Godless times ahead.
Really? I generally found IRC and BBS to be very good because everyone was like minded and all there for the same reason. Maybe it was more to do with the groups / areas i was involved in.
i used the internet when you use IRC to chat to people, sure there was no likes and everyone chatted the subjects they like, but was still addictive playing MUDS
IRC was great for file serves too. lol
and dating, atleast i got dates with girls who knew how to use a computer, the old Average Sea Level question
I mean it wasn't that hard to use IRC…But yeah I guess lol.
1990's
For me there were two key moments when the Internet experience was degraded: Enabling comments on Youtube videos, and news articles. The latter was especially corrosive as almost no one has anything constructive to add. It's just people agreeing and disagreeing with what was written and getting into a fight with one another, which is what advertisers want. More viewing time = more money.
There are news comments sections with like and dislike options. Japan Times is one example. Most comments have a 50/50 split between like and dislike. It's just people arguing with one another over nothing substantive.
How Different Would Likes and Comments Be without The Internet?
I would love to get rid of likes and other “react” emojis from the internet.
Likes and tap-backs are engagement spam. They’re a way for the app to say “come back, look at this thing again” but providing you… nothing new. A way to nag your notifications just to lure you back on-screen.
Comments are fine. They are interactive conversation. If you don’t want to engage with them, well then why post anything to begin with?
You'd probably see a lot more crap filtering to your feed/the trending page as the only metric platforms will have to gauge popularity is if you observed the content. They should have no idea if you actually liked it or not. However I have heard that apps are increasingly using your camera/mic to evaluate sentiment. If this is widely adopted then nothing will change except for ragebait possibly disappearing.
Without comments, misinformation will likely only increase unless community notes remain, or reporting is made functional.
We'd also gradually become increasingly asocial.
There's a possibility that if you can't disagree in the comments, e-drama will rise because people will resort to making their own call-out posts a lot more.
I've often wondered what would have happened if dislike buttons were added. In hindsight it seems obvious that corporations, governments, and celebrities stand to suffer the most if dislikes were available, and were likely a significant influence on them being hidden or not implemented at all. I think if dislikes existed we'd get to see the best content - fact-based and heart warming rather than speculation and ragebait.
Biggest problem is this "engagement" is monetised and therefore leads to endless deliberately placed divisive posts and rage bait, often the same things reposted by multiple sources over and over again.
Internet used to be fun and nice.
It used to be fun
less toxic, less depression, less fights and internet beef
I used to watch endless Youtube videos from talking heads describing the internet drama of the day. What some celebrity said that caused outrage, someone's hot take on the topic, and the response videos that endlessly trail off these.
Then I ignored them.
I'm much happier and honestly couldn't give a flying.. about what some celebrity said. They simply don't matter, and on one should be paying attention.
Absolutely less toxic.
I think one of the worst things about the internet is that it's become so performative.
People say and do things in order to provoke the strongest reactions, as opposed to saying and doing what they truly believe. You almost can't have a serious discussion about anything on the internet and on forums because people are prioritising accumulating likes over being informed, thoughtful, empathetic, and understanding.
Without "likes", I think people would be much more genuine and thoughtful - less playing to the crowd, less asinine jokes, less being ridiculous.