Consumer Rights - Need Some Advice on Warranty Please

kimba88 on 31/12/2014 - 13:34

Hi guys,

Here's the story. Basically i bought a Hyundai i30 2011 model in September 2011 off a dealership and the previous owners bought it in May 2011. Since then, i have had a few issues with it. I won't go into all details though. The car has 5years warranty, but the audio only has 3 years.

I have only recently discovered that my USB port does not work, as I've tried plugging it in to charge my phone (as my phone - galaxy s4 - is starting to lose charge due to it being 1 and a half years old). The USB will connect to the unit and then disconnect.. and it will keep repeating itself.. but never fully connect and hold. I have tried multiple cables - even my original Samsung cord (which they recommend you do) and none work. I have also tried multiple phones. I haven't discovered this any earlier also due to streaming music through Bluetooth and not USB.

In the past, i have replaced the radio unit through a warranty claim due to the screen turning black in heat. This was replaced in December 2012. Now, my thoughts were that something may not have been wired correctly back then.. as i know my usb use to work when i first got the car.

Technically, the 'audio warranty' would have expired in May 2014. They also give 1 year warranty on replaced parts - but as it was replaced at the end of 2012, i got till May 2014 (within my normal warranty period). I would have thought they would at least give another 6-12 months outside of that warranty period.

I went to two Hyundai service centres today and both could not figure out what was going on - even when trying their own phones or their own cables. They still insisted it was my cable though (even though it is the original). They said they would need to book it in to look at it properly to diagnose it. But i would be charged labor as it's outside the warranty period.

Do you think what they are doing is fair? Is there any way to get around this as it's only 7 months outside of warranty (not to mention the replaced radio head). Or should i just suck it up and bare their costs of $130 per hour?

Any advice would be great please

Automotive

Comments

  • mapleice on 31/12/2014 - 15:38
    +15

    Not to be a wet towel, but would it not be cheaper to just buy a cigarette lighter charger for the phone, (around $30), and continue to stream via bluetooth?

  • kimba88 on 31/12/2014 - 16:31

    Possibly, but i also would have liked the USB working so i can see what song is on. Sometimes i have to look down to see it on my phone. Not just that, i do want all parts of my car working. I am considering the cigarette charger though if the above fails :-/

    • snook on 01/01/2015 - 15:33
      +1

      this connecting and disconnecting you describe has happened with so many whatever chargers I have used over the years.

      I think it's as simple as from pulling them too tight and it's loosening up the connection. Goes on, goes off. I'd throw it away and get another and the problem was solved.

      I have since made a point of not stressing out these connections, getting longer cables etc and I no longer have this problem, so I figure that's what was causing it. User error.

    • Elee3112 on 02/01/2015 - 21:36

      I believe it is actually a Samsung issue, and not something wrong with your car.

      I cannot charge my S5 using one of those cigarette charger no matter what I do, or however many new ones I purchase. After some digging, apparently its got something to do with most phones being set up to charge iPhones, and nothing else.

      I don't understand the technical mumble jumbles, so here's something from another website (http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2751080):

      "The problem is most generic car chargers are designed to work with Apple products. Apple uses a non-standard way of telling their devices essentially "hey, I'm a charger." This makes "standard" devices not recognize the charger properly. The device tends to think it's plugged into a computer and only draw around 500mAh."

      I would imagine S4 have the same problem then.

      *Edit: Just realised your car is not picking up your phone as a USB either. But yeah, maybe its a related issue? Either way, a cigarette charger won't help you if they work anything like the S4s.

  • sp1atran on 31/12/2014 - 16:38
    +8

    I believe in some cars the usb port does not transmit enough power in order to charge the typical phones these days. It'll either not charge or not hold charge.
    Try connecting a USB flash drive with some music on it and see if it plays or read. If it does then what I said earlier is correct as the port is working fine.

    I have a 2011 Benz and when connecting my phone to the USB port to charge..it charges at an extremely slow pace anyway.
    Give it a go, at least you'll know ;)

    • kimba88 on 31/12/2014 - 17:51
      +3

      You are right. The music reads off a USB drive, but not my phone. I don't understand it. Is there a USB lead i can use that will definitely work? I'd prefer to see the song names whilst it's charging.. rather than charging through cigarette and streaming the songs through bluetooth.

      Guess i'd get nowhere with Hyundai now anyway. You probably just save me a few hundred dollars

      • muncan on 02/01/2015 - 19:05
        -1

        Time to get a 2011 phone? Perhaps an iPhone 4?

        • kimba88 on 02/01/2015 - 22:41
          +4

          Haha.. no way! At least an android!! I don't like being governed by Apple with their iTunes. Freedom is nice with Android :-P

  • Cheeper on 31/12/2014 - 18:44
    +2

    If the usb port plays music then you do not have a fault.
    As sp1atran says… just get a good cig lighter charger and use that.
    Obviously your car radio does not have enough amps output to charge or play via your phone.

    Have you tried it on other car radios? I suspect you may find the same problem.

    • kimba88 on 31/12/2014 - 20:37

      Yeah i have found the same problem on my partners 2011 mazda 3 sp25. hmmm..

      EDIT: Actually wait, it was through a cigarette lighter it didnt work. He doesn't have a USB port in his car for some reason.. and his car was made after mine. Weird

  • endotherm on 31/12/2014 - 20:28

    Sounds like it is your phone's fault. As you say it is not holding charge, it is likely that it is trying to charge itself from a USB port that is limited to 500mA, but it normally requires a higher output to charge it. This would explain the connecting and disconnecting you describe. My suggestion would be to try and find a "Y"-cable, similar to what you would use for a portable hard disk, that you plug into two separate USB ports, as one cannot supply enough power. I imagine you would need 2 USB A plugs into one microUSB plug. The idea is that each separate USB plug supplies half an amp or so of power so 1 amp or more is available at the phone. Something like this where the black USB plug supplies power and data and the red plug supplies extra power from a second port (e.g. cigarette lighter to USB port).

    • kimba88 on 31/12/2014 - 20:41

      Sounds like a good idea. I'll have to try something like that out. Except i'll need a cable that is bigger than the one you linked, as my cigarette lighter is on the dash and my USB is located in my middle arm rest console. I reckon at least a good 30cm distance between the two. Your theory does sound like it could be correct though

      • endotherm on 31/12/2014 - 20:48

        I just bought http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/141256462595, not sure how long it is. Quite a bit cheaper than the first one I linked but yo would be waiting a while seeing as it's coming from China. I'd assume most of these are on the short size, being intended for compact external hard disks, which are able to be positioned relatively close to the computer. Also there is less resistance and power loss with a shorter cable. If they are too short, you can use a USB male to female extension to extend it. Get one that is chunky, not the shoelace-thin ones as you want to carry a lot of current with minimal loss.

        • kimba88 on 31/12/2014 - 20:50

          I just realised my galaxy s1 use to connect to my car no problems via the USB port

        • endotherm on 31/12/2014 - 21:15

          @kimba88: Phones, tablets iPads etc these days require 20W/2A or more to charge, otherwise they will barely get by in trickle-charge mode to recharge. That means they can slowly recharge overnight when in standby, but may not have enough to run the screen and bluetooth and wifi and telephone and GPS etc. at the same time. They also require the proper cable (the one that comes supplied is always the best) as they are made to instruct the device to go into fast charge where available, otherwise it will only be a slow trickle charge. The method they use is different between manufacturers. An Apple cable doesn't work with Android and vice versa. It has something to do with tying the data pins with a certain value resistance, which tells the device to fast-charge. Each manufacturer looks for a particular resistance (~200ohm for Apple, ~0ohm for Android etc).

        • kimba88 on 31/12/2014 - 21:28

          @endotherm: But what i don't understand is if the phone is plugged into the USB port into the car, why can't it simply read songs even if it is already 100% charged?

        • endotherm on 31/12/2014 - 21:45

          @kimba88: I don't know either, that's how I would expect it to work. I'm just speculating the low current/bad battery is forcing it into charge mode and data transfer function is taking a back seat. That also could be explained by a bad cable (the data lines inside could be broken if the cable has been tugged hard enough or bent, with no sign on the outside). Or the data line pins on the radio socket are damaged and not making contact with the cable? (the inner two pins are for data, the outer ones carry power).

        • kimba88 on 31/12/2014 - 21:52

          @endotherm: I'll have to test it out with my sisters brand new LG G3. She got it a couple of weeks ago, so i'd assume her cable is intact.

        • toristo on 03/01/2015 - 13:02

          @kimba88:

          No phone is every at 100% charge, the moment you unplug it from the charger (or the current falls below the threshold required to be considered charging, you're automatically at 99.999x% (therefore not 100% so the phone will try to charge if it knows its connected).
          This is why some phones drop to 99% when you unplug them from a charger. It's annoying, but technically correct, otherwise it's overstating the power you had left.

  • PVA on 31/12/2014 - 22:12
    +1

    It isn't a fault. The port simply doesn't have the power to charge. It is the same in my Holden. The port is more for plugging in an ipod. Buy a usb charger that plugs in the power adaptor.

    • kimba88 on 31/12/2014 - 22:14

      My USB already plugs into a power adapter. It's the same Samsung one out of the box with the phone.

      • PVA on 31/12/2014 - 22:17

        Sorry I tried to edit to explain better.

        The usb port is only for ipods and MP3 players and can only read them. It (the usb/stereo) hasn't got the smarts or power to connect a phone and use its player.

        I just use a separate usb charger and connect via blue tooth now.

        • kimba88 on 31/12/2014 - 22:25
          +1

          Fair enough. So maybe the phone is too new for the outdated USB port in the car

        • PVA on 31/12/2014 - 22:28

          @kimba88:
          Yep. I think so. That's what I found for our Holden so my guess is its the same for you. It isn't just the usb port but also the stereo.
          I was disappointed at first, like you.

        • kimba88 on 31/12/2014 - 22:29
          +1

          @PVA: Bummer!

        • PVA on 31/12/2014 - 22:36

          @kimba88:
          Yep.
          If your stereo can do bluetooth audio just connect that way and charge with a usb/cigarette adaptor to charge the phone.

  • nimnomnimy on 01/01/2015 - 22:40

    Larger screen phones require more power. It's probably a 500ma output from the usb which is why it can't charge your phone. Phones with screen size over 4" generally need at least 1a to charge slowly and 2.4 to fast charge.

    I recommend getting a cig. Charger with 2.4a output so it fast charges your phone. As far as music on the head display goes, you can try using an OTG cable with your phone and connecting it up that way but im an iPhone user so won't be much help technically getting you there

  • This Guy on 02/01/2015 - 00:55
    +1

    A USB stick is just 'dumb' storage.

    Your phone is a computer and needs to use Media Transfer Protocol (MTP) to pass files between your phone and a laptop/desktop.

    Your car's media player may not support MTP (USB streaming) because Bluetooth already streams audio, Bluetooth is generally more useful and MTP isn't a feature that's going to sell a car. If you want MTP you might need to buy an aftermarket head unit.

    If your car has MTP (MTP printed on media player/listed feature in car manual) then try plugging your phone into your computer and copying files on and off it (like photos). If MTP only works on your computer it's your car's media player. If MTP doesn’t work at all it may be your USB cable or phone's USB data ports.

    MTP media streaming is a USB protocol. USB port power is a completely different specification.

    Sorry for the wall of text.
    tl;dr: Try Bluetooth and a fast USB car charger (2.1A or 2.4A).

    • tomleonhart on 02/01/2015 - 08:40

      I can't believe you become "that guy" in the comment section.

      • This Guy on 02/01/2015 - 13:50
        +1

        "The USB will connect to the unit and then disconnect"

        "I also would have liked the USB working so I can see what song is on"

        "The music reads off a USB drive, but not my phone. I don't understand it. Is there a USB lead I can use that will definitely work? I'd prefer to see the song names whilst it's charging.. rather than charging through cigarette and streaming the songs through Bluetooth."

        -OP

        The OP's complaint wasn't about charging, it was about the phone connecting to the media unit via USB.

        Wiki article on MTP:
        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Media_Transfer_Protocol

        Guide on connecting phones to cars (author asserts only some BMW's support MTP):
        http://www.cnet.com/au/news/car-techs-guide-to-using-your-an…

        This issue has nothing to do with warranty. Car ads sell Bluetooth, not MTP. Even so, Android phone's moved to MTP in 2011. I don't expect a 2011 car to support something that only just hit the market.

        Bluetooth is almost universal and has more features than MTP, so it makes no sense to pay staff to add MTP support when you can use staff time to make Bluetooth better.

        Android based car media players should have MTP support. They are rumoured for release late this year.

        It is hard to present specifications without coming off like a jerk, especially when it contradicts several nice, helpful people. I would not have known what the issue was if it wasn't for mapleice, sp1atran, xywolap and endotherm redefining the OP's problem and kimba88's constant feedback.

  • AG_ACT on 02/01/2015 - 11:53

    Think others have already clarified, but you can get around the issue by getting a cable that uses two power inputs; 1 to go into the 12v power source and 1 to go into the actual USB slot for data.

    Not sure if I'm allowed to post links, but I think if you got something like this: http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/USB-2-0-A-male-to-A-Male-Micro-5p…

    It'd solve your problem.

    Don't waste your money at the stealership, they will just report that there is no fault with the unit.

  • noz on 02/01/2015 - 16:26

    As others have said, the problem is likely due to USB protocol incompatibility.
    When you plug your S4 into the car's USB port, the stereo detects it as a USB data connection (not just USB voltage only) and attempts to negotiate with the S4. The S4 only supports MTP .. whereas the car stereo likely requires "USB Mass Storage". Since the stereo cannot complete negotiation is resets the USB port … causing the whole process to happen again, and so on, in a loop.
    If you just want to charge your phone, try disabling MTP, and try toggling any other USB options on the phone (such as USB debugging etc)
    If you want the phone to support USB Mass Storage mode, it may be possible if your phone is rooted, with an app like this : https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.mohammadag…
    Have no experience with the app myself.

  • sraymond on 02/01/2015 - 16:28

    Get yourself a usb stick and load all your songs onto it. Best to find out which file format your car prefers. My Mazda likes wav which is supposedly better quality. This will mean the head unit can display the song titles on the screen and your phone won't go flat as quickly. You will probably get better sounding songs too.

    I have this one which costs about $50-60 but there are plenty around.

    http://www.sandisk.com.au/products/usb/drives/extreme/

    • kimba88 on 02/01/2015 - 22:33

      Yes it does have them adjacent. I've bought a new cigarette charger and it seems to be working in my partners car. Just gota try it on my car and see if it'll keep up with my phone discharging. I'm also going to try an aux cable to see if that'll tell me song titles

      • jackary on 03/01/2015 - 13:06

        An aux cable doesn't output track information…

        • kimba88 on 03/01/2015 - 18:23

          Damn :-(

        • jackary on 04/01/2015 - 10:07

          @kimba88: As others have said I think the issue may be with the head unit itself. Are you sure that it outputted through USB before? And if so, was it with an iPhone?

          USB Audio and android are notoriously sketchy. From memory if you are on updated software on your S4 and its in MTP mode, it should be able to read the local music folder on your device. No navigation instructions, no OK Google etc. Charging is dependant on the draw used by your phone. Even on my aftermarket head unit I can barely maintain my phones charge while its connected to USB.

          I think others may have already suggested but your best bet is probably just a cigarette lighter adapter and Bluetooth. If your head unit supports A2DP/AVRCP, Bluetooth will allow your track info/steering controls. Otherwise an AUX cable will work fine, just need to control the music from the device itself!

  • praga on 03/01/2015 - 02:44

    I have a Elantra 2012 Model and I believe it has the same or similar radio panel and I encounted the same problem as well with my hTC One M8. I dont think its an issue with the radio.

  • prhino on 03/01/2015 - 08:26

    Not sure if somebody has covered this already, but the issue is more actually that you don't have a genuine Hyundai cable.

    If I use a standard Apple Lightning cable with my iPhone 6, I get the same symptoms as you.

    If I use my genuine Hyundai 30 pin cable with an old iPhone, it's fine.

    I'm guessing that during the brief moment that you can see the phone charging, the radio screen is displaying "Reading USB". This is because the stereo is effectively checking to see whether the cable has the extra wire (or whatever) that is in the genuine cable.

    • kimba88 on 04/01/2015 - 09:00

      Hyundai said it should work with my own genuine Samsung cable. But yes, it does say "reading usb".

  • KingstonTheNotSoWise on 03/01/2015 - 17:13

    A replacement doesn't reset warranty (for obvious reasons many people would abused it, in fact who wouldn't?) so unfortunately you're out of luck there. Them saying it's your cable and not the car audio is a pretty crummy move regardless of warranty or not though. But they are well within their rights.
    That being said most of the USB ports on car stereos aren't always designed for phones to be used as data devices, they're normally for charging, some cars even have 2 USB ports, 1 for charging 1 for music. But to clarify the disconnection part: is it disconnecting as in it won't charge your phone or as in it won't detect as a USB device?

    A few options I'd recommend is grabbing a spare USB stick and testing it to see how it goes, if it works just grab a cheap micro USB stick (or a normal 1 but micro is better since they won't stick out) and load the music onto that, it's what I do in my car, it's not as convenient since I have to remove the stick everytime to load new music on, but I rarely do that, either way it does the job for me.
    The other option is what some have already stated, just plug your phone into a car charger and continue using bluetooth. But try to get a non-generic 1 in case compatibility is an issue.

    If all else fails then go the $130/hr route, I understand having all items working in a vehicle, even if I don't use them that often or even if it doesn't inconvenience me that much. You paid for it, it should work, but being out of warranty as I said, not much luck there. But $130/hr is expensive just to fix a USB port which can be bypassed with options that usually cost <$50.

    • kimba88 on 03/01/2015 - 18:26
      +1

      Yep, have already tried the USB option. Just testing out the cigarette charger options now. Bought one from kmart for $6 for my partners car.. And it works there. Hopefully it'll be the same for my i30.

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