"We Guarantee We Will Find You a Solution Today"

High on 06/04/2015 - 15:44
Last edited 06/04/2015 - 15:48

I walked into IKEA Logan today to return a JÖMNA matress only to find out I couldn't return it because it was already used. Near the returns desk they had a screen with ticket numbers and etc and it said "We Guarantee We Will Find You a Solution Today" so I mentioned it, and the manager explained, they guarantee me a solution "only if the product fits the terms and conditions of returns" and as there was no term like that on the screen I wanted to look up further so I ran a voice recording program on my phone, held it out to her(making it clear I was recording the conversation) and ask to repeat her explanation, and she said I can't record it, it's illegal, I need to leave, and she is calling security and walked away.

Ok so two things I want to ask:

Is it OK to advertise something like
"We Guarantee We Will Find You a Solution Today" when in some cases they can't provide a solution?

Is it really illegal to record a conversation? FYI this is Queensland and I couldn't find any evidence recording itself is illegal, though use of the recording may be limited.

General Discussion

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Comments

  • Adz81 on 06/04/2015 - 15:55
    +2

    Could it not be argued that IKEA would find you a solution to the problem of their choice?

    This just sounds like as whole lot of pain in the ass.

  • indium on 06/04/2015 - 16:00
    +25

    Well she found the solution to the problem, they don't accept returns for used items.

    Also stores can have conditions of entry to their stores eg. that you have to show your bag for inspection upon request or that recording devices cannot be used in the store. This is just store policy so it is not illegal but if you do not adhere to them you can be removed or banned from the store.

    Here is the return policy

    It clearly states:

    Sorry, we cannot accept returns on cut fabric, wooden blinds cut to size, *unwrapped mattresses, kitchen appliances, or goods ordered to your specification (such as custom-made worktops).

    They do seem to have a 'Love it or Exchange it' policy for mattresses but

    *The Love it or Exchange it policy excludes bed bases, bed slats, JOMNA mattresses, IKEA PS 2012 mattress & pillows, and pillow and mattress protectors.

    • [Deactivated] on 06/04/2015 - 23:12
      +4

      SA & WA IKEA stores are run by a different company than the east-coast stores. They have slightly different return policies.

  • djones145 on 06/04/2015 - 16:03
    +26

    well they did find a solution, that u cant return it

    it doesn't say "We Guarantee We Will Find You a Solution that you like Today"

    they find a solution, whether it is in ur favour or not, its a solution

  • scrimshaw on 06/04/2015 - 16:03

    In Queensland, it is only legal if all parties know the conversation is being recorded at the commencement of the conversation. If that criteria is not met, then it is not legal to use the recording.
    Obviously, using a recording device discreetly without the other person knowing as this a breach of privacy law.

    Also, as I used to work for a homewares store I can say it's typically not possible to return used bedding — products such as mattresses, pillows, quilts, underlays, protectors (for quilts/ mattress/ pillows) cannot be returned once it has left the store. It's mostly a OHS / Hygiene issue.

    • iratepirate on 06/04/2015 - 17:31
      +4

      WRONG!! Under the privacy act in Queensland you may record any conversation you are a party to. You do not have to inform the other party that you are recording…look it up.

      • ozhunter on 06/04/2015 - 21:00

        Do you mind providing the link?

      • Logical on 07/04/2015 - 21:33

        as far as I know All QLD police officers that pull people over for speeding etc record the conversation and do not state that they record it. I have received recorded conversations from police when preparing for cases.

        • iratepirate on 07/04/2015 - 22:14
          +4

          Correct. Also if you have ever made a complaint about police conduct you will have been flagged on the QPrime system and when an officer comes in contact with you they will be cautioned to record all conversations with you.

    • JimmyF on 07/04/2015 - 19:48
      +10

      you never explained what was wrong with your USED mattress?

  • Davo1111 on 06/04/2015 - 16:35
    +10

    "we're not going to refund you your money"

    That's a solution

  • djones145 on 06/04/2015 - 16:52
    +18

    its a slogan, pretty much everyone slogan never happens!

    officeworks, lowest prices, will price match (not always the case, don't price match all the time)

    burger king "burgers are better at hungry jacks" but the burger at rockpool bar is better (as per SMH guide)

    bunnings, "we have materials for every project", I want to build a nuclear power plant, u got any uranium??

    • cloudy on 06/04/2015 - 19:16

      Ha too true.

      I was at the good guys, they have a massive sign saying "Never beaten on price". So I asked them to beat a price I found online, and they said nar, can't do that. But could give me $xxx which was $200 more than what I wanted.
      The salesman even was dumb enough to ask if I wanted it

      • Agret on 09/04/2015 - 09:20

        Dumb enough? Some people would rather part with their money than wait for something to be delivered. Especially if it's a job for a client.

        • cloudy on 09/04/2015 - 12:07

          Good guys offered to deliver to me next day.

          I got my fridge from online the next day, installed, old frfidge removed. All done in less than 24 hours. So I dunno what you are talking about mate when you said wait for something to be delivered, good guys have to deliver it too you know, u don't just chuck a fridge on the bonnet of ur car and drive off.

        • Agret on 09/04/2015 - 12:44

          @cloudy: sorry you never mentioned what the item was, if it's a fridge then yeah delivery is a must

    • retiredfeline on 06/04/2015 - 19:35
      +5

      Some friends and I have a chuckle whenever we see There is only one Jeep. We imagine some magic of quantum physics allowing a single Jeep to manifest itself in multiple locations simultaneously.

  • minniethemoocher on 06/04/2015 - 18:32

    You haven't said why you want to return it. For example if it's faulty you can return a used mattress.

  • High on 06/04/2015 - 18:45
    -8

    @minniethemoocher actually matress was fine, I bought it for my roommate who insisted he could feel the springs on his back and couldn't sleep on it, I felt the matress and agreed indeed its a little bit hard to sleep on so I brought it back… the returns person said we were using it upside down, so matress itself had no problem. Just its upside and downside looked identical and there was no mention on the instructions. I might have just taken it back happily if I hadn't already got another mattress from elsewhere…

    • [Deactivated] on 06/04/2015 - 23:26
      +5

      Were you asking for a refund, or an exchange?

      IKEA Logan's Returns & exchanges policy says you can exchange the mattress:

      Love it or exchange it
      You may exchange your mattress or mattress pad once within 90 days of your original purchase if you don’t love it.

      How do I exchange my mattress if I don't love it?
      Take your mattress or mattress pad, in a hygienic condition, with your original receipt to Exchanges & Returns at your local store.

      Can I upgrade my mattress or mattress pad?
      Yes, you just need to pay the difference between your original purchase and your new choice. If your new choice is lower in value, we will credit the difference to an IKEA refund card. Refund cards are not redeemable for cash.

      If the mattress is in hygienic condition, print out the this policy and go back to the store.

      The policy doesn't state the exchange has to be for another mattress, so a cheeky person might try exchanging the mattress for a different type of product (or the cheapest item they can find and the rest on the refund card).

      You might try emailing IKEA first explaining the issue and ask for assistance in getting IKEA Logan to honour their published exchange policy.

      Edit: It sounds like you've bought another mattress and want a refund on the IKEA one, so an exchange probably isn't what you're after.

      • High on 07/04/2015 - 10:52

        I didn't notice there were two versions of policies! I remember seeing this "better policy" when I googled before I went to the store… just got too emotional by their response and couldn't think clearly. "hygene condition"? They said yesterday they can't resell it due to hygene issues so why do they need it in "hygene condition"? Ridiculous…

        Thanks heaps thrift, I would definitely exchange with a pillow.

      • ronnknee on 10/04/2015 - 00:22

        Yea, I had this policy in mind when I was reading the post.

    • [Deactivated] on 07/04/2015 - 23:57

      +1 for being honest. You should have opened with that and said you know you made a mistake but you're only human. I don't know if I'd record someone to try to get the return through though.

      Why not just sell it "as new"

      • High on 08/04/2015 - 01:24

        Yeah that's what I would do actually… IKEA is pretty far from my place and I don't want to drive on the highway with my matress strapped to my cars roof anymore…

    • SirFlibbled on 09/04/2015 - 10:24

      So you decided you didn't like the mattress. You bought a new one before you returned it. Because you were using it incorrectly, it wasn't faulty and therefore it's a change of mind return.

      You should have returned it and THEN bought a new mattress.

      Or you could get your housemate to buy their own mattress.

  • grog on 06/04/2015 - 19:46

    Ikea have no idea what a solution is, they have been hoodwinked by a word imported from north america, they have no idea.

    Us fair dinkum aussies all know the a "solution" is a mixture of brake fluid and whisky mixed 50/50 in a large glass that the bikies in Darwin used to drink.

    Us fair dinkum aussies will not be swayed by an a north american word that ikea reckon means something else…

    If we did, we would be hoodwinked as well…

    Come off the grass…

    • johnno07 on 07/04/2015 - 19:21
      +2

      Appropriate username, it seems.

    • belongsinforums on 07/04/2015 - 22:11
      +1

      it may amuse you to hear that 'dinkum' is an imported word from chinese :D

  • spackbace on 07/04/2015 - 11:11
    +11

    Maybe it's fraud :P

  • [Deactivated] on 07/04/2015 - 18:09
    +4

    Ikea Customer Service is a joke. When I went there they offered to give me a free soft serve if I agreed to help them with a survey and pointing to the sign showing soft serve with a piece of chocolate in it.

    The survey was actually quite tedious taking 15 minutes and then at the end when I went to get my soft serve they wouldn't even include the piece of chocolate I was led to believe that it did.

    I offered to pay the price difference between a soft serve with chocolate and one without and they wouldn't even do that.

    The Ice Cream incident left a bad taste of IKEA in my mouth so to speak.

    • cloudy on 07/04/2015 - 19:12
      +3

      Thats pretty poor. A 15 Min survey is easily worth more than a 100x soft serves.

  • juventino on 07/04/2015 - 19:06
    +2

    ZOMG !!! Another episode of ' things don't go my way, I am gonna call it fraud, scam and whatnot"

    • cloudy on 07/04/2015 - 19:14
      +1

      Did u read the Op? No one said fraud was conducted, Ikea is the one who claimed illegality by Op by using their phone.

  • Ridiculous Panda on 07/04/2015 - 19:27
    +24

    Putting a recording device to someone's face, while trying to come to an agreement, is a dick move, whether legal or not.

    • Azn310 on 07/04/2015 - 20:24
      +10

      Agreed. And the manager went out of her way for a second solution for OP, security. Perhaps she deserves a promotion for the extra work.

  • Repi on 07/04/2015 - 20:54
    +3

    Nothing to do with Ikea, but the Salvos refused to take almost new mattresses from our house cleaning, so why would Ikea take back a used mattress?

    • Logical on 07/04/2015 - 21:37

      put it on display and sell 'as is'

    • [Deactivated] on 07/04/2015 - 21:43
      +1

      How about because IKEA advertise they do take them back?

      • ozhunter on 07/04/2015 - 22:50
        +1

        If it's in a hygenic condition, which likely means unopened and unused.

        • [Deactivated] on 07/04/2015 - 23:59
          +1

          I just realised why people wouldn't want an opened mattress, I feel dumb now.

        • [Deactivated] on 08/04/2015 - 00:28
          +3

          The policy does not say anything about unopened or unused nor does it define or limit 'hygienic' in any way. There's certainly no statement of "as long as you don't open the plastic wrap."

          The criteria is simply within 90 days and if you don't love it. That suggests the purchaser will use the mattress in order to evaluate it.

          "You may exchange your mattress or mattress pad once within 90 days of your original purchase if you don’t love it."

          It doesn't sound like OP loves the mattress.

          As for 'hygienic condition', a toilet seat can be kept in hygienic condition. And if hygiene is such an issue for returns, why aren't mobile phones and computer keyboards (shown to be typically worse than toilet seats) harder to return? Even cash (or your credit card) is likely less hygienic.

          Some people here might not like the attitude or behaviour expressed in OP's post, but IKEA have a published policy on accepting mattress returns under certain conditions, and it sounds like OP meets those conditions.

  • gimme on 08/04/2015 - 00:28
    +4

    I don't like whingers but in this case unless your mattress stinks or has visible stains it should satisfy the basic hygiene condition so they should take it back. In most cases I find that these sorts of stiff happens when there's inexperience on both sides. CS stuff don't understand their own policy and customer lacks basic problem solving skills (e.g gimmicky ideas to record conversations etc which simply puts people offside OR focusing on BS taglines instead of the T&Cs). You need to be assertive, polite and focus on the problem and not the person.

    • High on 08/04/2015 - 01:17
      -6

      I felt the manager was giving me irresponsible excuses/comments to avoid the situation at the moment. (What she told me was "we will provide a solution ONLY if the product meets our criteria" whereas the ad just says "we will provide a solution") yeah it may be just a BS slogan but I had to try… didn't want to carry the mattress back home strapped to the roof of my car. I thought the manager was representing IKEA and should be responsible for what she says and I showed her the recorder to make that point, and also to use as personal reference in case I would make a claim. Maybe next time I will ask for a writing instead as that will apear less rude? What made me emotional was her response…

      • sunarde on 09/04/2015 - 01:40
        +2

        Going to be a bit harsh but imagine if you were in her shoes and you knew that there were policies regarding certain returns. On top of that it's stated clearly on their website that for returns of mattresses they can't be used.

        Follow that up with a customer going on about a slogan that has said terms attached shoving a mic in front of their faces saying "I will be recording this convo"

        Sure she could of handled it better by saying that they can't return it but can offer you an exchange for a different mattress (love it or hate it deal)

        That's what I would've said to you. If you were nice or came up with a sob story than maybe even a store credit just so I can get on with day operations.

        • [Deactivated] on 09/04/2015 - 02:24

          On top of that it's stated clearly on their website that for returns of mattresses they can't be used.

          Care to point out where that is stated on their website?

        • High on 09/04/2015 - 09:41
          -1

          She never said yes to exchange either. I also had asked if I could get an exchange. The reason was the "love it or exchange it" policy only applied to their Sultan range and excludes JOMNA, that is "just a cheap one" and therefore one can't expect to have it exchanged.(The exact words one of their managers said)
          And it turns out their policy stated on their website (not WA/SA one) doesn't mention exclusion of JOMNA matresses.

        • sunarde on 09/04/2015 - 21:15

          @junoz86:
          No idea why you were negged on this one lol..

          That's interesting - I didn't know it excluded certain brands of mattress. Very odd….. Though I only ever bought one mattress from ikea.

          Well put it this way, lesson learnt? Usually items which are usable like quilts, underwear, earrings, toothbrushes etc are really hard to return as a 'change of mind' when opened. Just remember next time that if you are not 100% certain about a purchase ask if there is a return/exchange policy prior to purchasing it (especially a mattress as everybody is different and this mattress may not suit you). If there was a fault different matter altogether.

          Reason why: you could have f***** on the first night and she would have to take your word on it.

          Just my 2 cents though: the next bed you get that you plan to use for a few years…. I'd recommend trying out a few mattresses and worry about the price after as you spend like at least 5-8 hours of everyday on it. (30% of your daily life on?)

          Don't want to have a bad back in the future do we :)

          Btw @Thirft
          @Thrift:
          http://www.ikea.com/ms/en_AA/customer_service/return_policy/…

          I suppose my wording should have been unwrapped :)

          Just a tip for everyone (I used to work in electronic retail for a few years)
          - If an item you receive is physically broken where the store could accuse that you done it. Seriously don't be lazy and deal with it the next day or at least CONTACT the store if you can't make it ASAP.
          - They will only doubt you if you come a week later saying that something is broken (snapped off, mobile phone screen crack, iPad screen cracked)

          p.s. yes I have replaced customer's cracked iPads cause they came back within 3 hours and I did a physical inspection of the edges and impacts on the screen. Does not take a apple genius to tell if you dropped an ipad.

        • [Deactivated] on 10/04/2015 - 02:45

          @sunarde: The return policy you linked is for the Adelaide and Perth stores, which are franchises owned by Cebas Pty Ltd.

          The east coast stores, owned and operated by IKEA Pty Ltd, have slightly different wording for the mattress policy - there's no exclusion of JOMNA mattresses or "unwrapped mattresses".

  • High on 08/04/2015 - 01:32
    +1

    Thanks for the comments everyone I have learned a lot :)

  • p1 ama on 08/04/2015 - 16:38
    -3

    This is stupid and nitpicky. I get the fact that you're throwing a tantrum because you can't return your mattress, but really, just grow up. Their return policy is as clear as day and night. The Australian Consumer Law on refunds is as clear as day and night. You have no legal right to force anyone to refund you for change of mind, which is what this is.

    As for slogans, why don't you go and have a fit over Hungry Jacks when the burgers from XYZ is better than theirs?

    • gimme on 08/04/2015 - 22:41

      Hmmm … Clear as day and night you say? Have you even read it? You must be living in a twilight zone

      • p1 ama on 09/04/2015 - 12:16
        -1

        http://www.consumerlaw.gov.au/content/acl_resources/download…

        There's no ambiguity - no requirement for refund based on change of mind.

        • gimme on 09/04/2015 - 12:37

          It's IKEA's OWN POLICY. We're not talking about consumer law and minimum protections.

          Here's something you may grasp - I'm tossing up between buying something from Ikea or a competitor. I see Ikea's own policy which states I can return it even if I change my mind and think GREAT I'll make my purchase from Ikea rather than competitor X who simply provides the minimum legally mandated return policy. End result - Ikea's gained a competitive advantage due to their 'nice' policy and are bound by it.

          This is no different than, say a real estate transaction where there are minimum legally mandated clauses in contracts and there's 'special conditions' that both parties may agree to in the contract. The conditions are legally enforceable. Get it?

  • ncmx5 on 09/04/2015 - 01:54
    +3

    This may help. I bought my mattress knowing I had this exchange as backup - Within 90 days of purchase, you can bring back the mattress and exchange it and pay the difference. They told me that you can only do ONE exchange though.

    http://www.ikea.com/ms/en_AU/customer_service/policies_and_t…

    • gimme on 09/04/2015 - 12:40

      Yes exactly, that policy has already been pasted above. Sadly some people are incapable of reading before shooting from the hip

  • chaosmaster on 09/04/2015 - 14:04
    +2

    "Is it really illegal to record a conversation? FYI this is Queensland and I couldn't find any evidence recording itself is illegal, though use of the recording may be limited."

    Don't know, but if that is how you interact with people to find a solution you may want to rethink your strategy. I understand stores can be frustrating at times but don't sink to someone elses level, neither effective or fun.

  • pookie on 11/08/2017 - 13:52

    I believe the word you are looking for is "Puffery".
    It refers to an exaggeration or statement that no reasonable person would take as factual.
    It often occurs in the context of advertsing and promotional testimonials.
    Puffery may be used as a defence to a warranty or fraud claim, to assert that the plaintiff shouldn't have relied on the statements in issue.
    Puffery generally is defined as “exaggerated, vague, or loosely optimistic statements about a company that are deemed so immaterial and unworthy of reliance that they cannot serve as the basis for liability.
    The difference between a statement of fact and mere puffery rests in the specificity or generality of the claim.

    There is a fine line in Australia between misleading advertising and puffery.
    There is a very broad provision in the Australian Consumer Law that prohibits conduct by a corporation that is misleading or deceptive, or would be likely to mislead or deceive you.
    It makes no difference whether the business intended to mislead or deceive you—it is how the conduct of the business affected your thoughts and beliefs that matters.
    If the overall impression left by an advertisement, promotion, quotation, statement or other representation made by a business creates a misleading impression in your mind—such as to the price, value or the quality of any goods and services—then the conduct is likely to breach the law.
    False claims
    As well as the broad provision of the Australian Consumer Law that prohibits misleading and deceptive conduct in general (see above), there are also some specific provisions.
    For example, the law also says businesses must not make false claims about:
    -the quality, style, model or history of a good or service
    -whether the goods are new
    -the sponsorship, performance characteristics, accessories, benefits and uses of goods and services
    -the availability of repair facilities or spare parts
    -the place of origin of a good (for example, where it was made or assembled)
    -a buyer’s need for the goods or services
    -any exclusions on the goods and services.

    If a business makes a false or misleading claim or representation about one of the issues on the above list, then the conduct is likely to breach the law.

    Puffery, on the other hand is not so clear.
    As I said above, puffery is a term used to describe wildly exaggerated, fanciful or vague claims for a product or service that nobody could possibly treat seriously, and that nobody could reasonably be misled by.

    Examples of puffery include ‘best food in town’ or ‘freshest taste ever’.

    Puffery in advertising is a practice that is generally not prohibited by the Australian Consumer Law.

    So that's why they can get away with wild exaggeration, it seems that the crazier and more unlikely the statement is to be true, the more likely the company can get away with asserting it.

    Have to love the law :)

    Pookie

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