So me and a friend are gonna rent a unit, we've applied and been accepted but its just the two of us there. We intend to have her boyfriend living there as well but he won't be on the lease. We're gonna get him on in a couple of weeks once some unpleasantness is cleared up with his current place.
Is this legal? Are we breaking any laws or anything?
What Spackbace said.
Best is to notify the REA of your intention. Most likely they don't care as any damage to the property is paid by you and your friend.
Really? What is the law against this - can you give me the exact legislation? I thought it's probably against the lease conditions, and by law you may need to advise the agent of the names of the occupants, but the occupants do not need to be on the lease do they?
The lease is a legal contract, so if you're in breach of that it would be illegal.
All occupants have to be listed. As said below, whether they care or not is up to them, but under the lease agreement they have to be named.
You are correct. It is not illegal. These are civil contracts. The landlord can of course end the contract (the lease), if they are not informed about it, however.
It is technically not legal but no one is gonna report you unless your house mate's boyfriend is running a drug business in the house. If it is not long term, the agent wont be too fuss. I used to rent the entire 2 bedroom apartment myself, but had my sister and partner stay with me over the years. The agent knew about it but they didnt care as long we kept the place neat, clean and paid on time. I never ran into any issues.
No it's not illegal, it is very common for not all of the people living in the house to be on the lease (often only one person is). However, you should have permission from the real estate agent/home owner to have three people living in the house.
However, if they say no they wont be able to tell the difference between the boyfriend living there full time and only visiting occasionally anyway.
Your lease probably has a clause about sub-leasing.
Whether anyone cares/knows is different.
This is stupid. You should want him on the lease for other, obvious reasons. Eg. What if he causes damage etc?
You don't put them on the lease you create a new formal subletting agreement with him. If they're on the lease and if he cause damage, everybody is equally liable. He could walk away and not care about being blacklisted and OP will have to take care of damages if they do.
Also, why wouldnt he want to be on the lease? Gives him a more extensive rental history…
Without being on the lease he can't really claim it..
Do not put them on the lease. Co-tenancy is a bitch if problems occur down the road (I learnt the hard way). In QLD a landlord cannot unreasonably refuse permission to sublet but you will still need to let the landlord know prior to them moving. Also get a bond from the person that's moving in too and submit it to the RTA. You will basically be their landlord so same laws apply to your relationship with this person as you and your landlord.
More info in the link but seriously just call RTA and have a chat with them - they're very helpful and while it's not legal advice it would still be a lot better than most of the advice here.
https://www.rta.qld.gov.au/Resources/Fact-sheets/General-ten…
Pretty sure the landlord can refuse to approve a sub letting arrangement if they deem the person unsuitable to reside within their home (ie refuse without providing a reason i.e. Any reason)
According to RTA which references the legislation.
The Act states that the lessor/agent must not unreasonably refuse permission to sub-let or transfer the agreement from one person to another. Tenants or occupants of a share home can apply to the RTA’s dispute resolution service if they believe the lessor/agent has acted unreasonably in refusing to sub-let or transfer the agreement.
I'm pretty sure in the real world it is fairly easy to "reasonably" decline any application as a landlord.
"We referenced checked the applicant and on that basis declined the application"
"We income checked the applicant and on that basis declined the application"
"We character checked the applicant an on that basis declined the application"
"We met the applicant and after that meeting determined further reference checks would be required, no further references could be provided and on that basis declined the application"
"We asked the applicant to provide at least 2 rental references, only one could be provided and that property manager declined to comment on the suitability of Mr X, as such the application was declined.
"The landlord of this property determined any application for more than 2 people residing within the home would be declined due to issues with - parking, body corporate, requests from other neighbours within the unit complex etc etc etc"
I think the questions is more: Does allowing an additional person who is not named on the lease to reside in the home contrary to the terms of the lease?
Possibly yes, read the lease.
Illegal - I doubt there are any specific laws preventing this, although if you are in breach of the lease covenants you have agreed to abide by you may be subject to the termination clauses outlined within that same lease (ie as those above have suggested - you may be asked to leave).
Personally if I was your landlord I would be annoyed if the property was leased to 2 people, then an additional person was added (or was harboured an additional person without consent) - Wear and tear up and you have prevented the property manager from accurately assessing the suitability of your application in full at the time of application (back ground checks of all applicants etc).
I don't want to sound skeptical but are you sure your friends boyfriend isn't on a black list or wouldn't pass a rental reference check and hence wants to remain in the shadows until the lease is signed?
Do you trust him enough to be personally liable for any damage he may cause as your undisclosed "permanent guest"?
While you are at work or school or on holidays (or anywhere) you are also responsible for his guests and any damage or theft they cause or effect.
If he decides not to pay his share of the rent - you are personally liable to pay it on his behalf.
The bond will be held in trust in the names of the lease holders - his actions will jeopardize your bond.
All up - bad idea. Even if the property manager or land lord turns a blind eye or gives the OK - why risk all of the above?
All those risks still stand if his name is on the lease, the only fact that changes is liability is shared but it doesn't just go away. Co-tenancy is not as simple as it sounds. If one person causes enough damage everybody can get blacklisted.
I should also mention if you put them on the lease and you want them out, they don't have to a go anywhere and can continue to live there until the end of the lease. If you sublet you can give them notice to leave and follow the proper avenues.
And OP if you don't want to inform the landlord just tell them he's her boyfriend i.e. a guest. Landlords can't limit your visitors. I doubt you would be caught as long as you don't admit they're living there.
On the paperwork I've filled out it said to list people to be on the lease and to list "dependents"…
Dependants are your kids…
But you're right, it said to list who's on the lease
Damnnit, I think your reply killed my edits :P
Yeah, I know he isn't a dependent.
He is actually a good friend of mine. He got wroughted at his last share house so the idea was that me and his missus apply cause his most recent realestate reference says that he caused damage to the place etc (not true).
I'm basically asking, "if I can fill out the the application without lying, Ie, no 'dependents' and just list myself and her on the lease and he moves in as well, have I done anything that could get my tenancy terminated?"
As previous commenters have stated, the agent might not care and it will all be a non-issue. There's also a chance they will care.
All will probably depend on how much he's there, how much stuff of his he brings etc.
Also, some property owners do drive-bys of their own properties. Seeing the same 3 cars in the drive every night would raise concerns.
There's no way of saying with any certainty that things will be fine if he's not on the lease, but living there.
Oh, and if he 'moves in' then you have lied on the lease. And a dependant is just a kid, that's all!
@Spackbace:
If I list myself and her as being on the lease, I know we take all responsibility for anything that he does. But as long as it doesn't say anything about listing other people living there (other than dependents) then in my mind I haven't lied.
I know the situation isn't ideal…
Sigh, going to bed… thanks for your thoughts everyone but as someone said above, I should just ask the RTA which I will in the morning.
say goodbye to your bond
Bond. Goodbye Bond.
"Living in a share house if you're not on the lease? (QLD)
So me and a friend are gonna rent a unit"
So what is it? A house or unit?
If a house you can do whatever you want.
If a unit it depends on how many bedrooms. In general 2 people for each bedroom excluding babies or toddlers. In Sydney overcrowding is not illegal yet but you can be evicted when caught with proofs and notice.
No
Yes. Not anything that could involve police, but could involve being evicted without notice and having a black mark on your names.