not bad for an X13, IMO.
Processor: AMD Ryzen™ 5 PRO 6650U Processor (2.90 GHz up to 4.50 GHz)
Operating System: Windows 11 Pro 64
Graphics: Integrated Graphics
Memory: 16 GB LPDDR5-6400MHz (Soldered)
Storage: 256 GB SSD M.2 2280 PCIe Gen4 TLC Opal
Display: 13.3" WUXGA (1920 x 1200), IPS, Anti-Glare, Non-touch, 72%NTSC, 300 nits
Thinkpad kb > mac kb :)
I'm not a mac user but m1 easily trounces this in other fields. Better battery life, performance and far better screen. Only downside is storage isn't upgradeable (ram isn't upgradeable by the user in either case).
That's what I'm thinking as well. I've a Windows PC and a Mac laptop currently, so I'm somewhat agnostic about environment - most activity takes place in the browser.
So it comes down to screen being probably the most important thing in a laptop for me, but I think the trackpad and keyboard are also important. Battery is a bonus on the M1 although I've had my 2014 macbook running from the adapter for years after the battery died.
I'm not too fussed with the lack of ram and storage upgradability. My laptop is still performing solidly after 8 years. We seem to have reached a plateau in performance for everyday tasks.
I have a M1 MBA which I'm more than happy with. I use mine a bit like a tablet - just leave it all the time and it's ready to go instantly.
Prior to that I had various cheap windows laptops and just used remote desktop to my desktop.
I don't know if I could go back to a cheaper laptop based on the improved trackpad, speakers(not just an after thought like on many windows machines), sleep, and screen. I'd also be curious to see a Windows laptop that competes with the MBA.
Actually the M1 doesn't outperform the Ryzen 6650U. If you look at Passmark
https://www.cpubenchmark.net/compare/4827vs4104/AMD-Ryzen-5-…
The M1 scores 14436
The Ryzen 6650U scores 16651
Whilst the M1 has better single core performance. The 6650u has better multicore performance.
The M1 will have its advantages in Mac OS, whilst the Ryzen 6650u will have advantage in Windows and Linux. The Ryzen 6650u does well considering AMD doesn't have complete control of the ecosystem like Apple.
Battery life has also significantly improved and is within 11% of the M2 when battery sizes are similar despite Apple being on a smaller mode.
Yep, understand. Although actual performance, at least for my use case, is a relatively low consideration.
28w vs 15w. Being fanless or rarely having to run the fan is amazing.
Apple silicons performance also doesn't change based on being plugged in.
@ihfree: AMD Ryzen 6000U series cTDP is 10w to 28w, hence you see the 6650u CPU's cousin the 6600u/6800u in gaming handhelds, because gaming performance doesn't significantly drop at lower TDPs. Ryzen and RDNA2 is very scalable from a handheld through to the world's most powerful supercomputer.
An example of performance scalability in the GPD Winmax 2 Handheld
https://cdn.videocardz.com/1/2022/07/RYZEN-7-6800U-VS-CORE-I…
It's really hard to beat Apple's macbooks atm. There's simply no comparison in terms of performance, battery life, screen, trackpad and speakers
But Thinkpads are still great (the best in my opinion) if you care about linux compatibility, upgradability (some models), price (if you buy second hand), repairability, and port selection. And of course if you simply prefer Windows/Linux over macOS
No comparison in terms of power efficiency, I will agree. Everything else though - it's debatable, and you can definitely get more powerful processors in x86 laptops (the i7-12700h is particularly impressive).
I personally will pick the Thinkpad every time as I find the keyboard to be better, and Windows is a lot more flexible than macOS for my productivity workflow. I also like the extra ports which I use a lot. They're also a lot easier and cheaper to fix in most situations.
No it's not really debatable. Only thing I will clarify is it's unmatched in performance to power ratio, not just sheer performance.
Battery life, screen, trackpad and speakers are just objectively better and it's not even close.
Good summary. I do care about ports, but the other factors not so much.
Actually the one thing that holds me back about the m1 macbook air is reports of screen fragility. Understand there is a bit of selection bias ( you only hear from those with cracked screens) but it does make me a bit apprehensive. Have had a good run with my macbook pro. Would actually have less hesitation if they made the macbook air with the same performance, but just a less slim and potentially more robust enclosure.
The software that I do run outside of the browser is mostly open source so I'm relatively OS agnostic. Would be a potential recruit for linux but just don't care enough (at the moment). Although you've just reminded me to create a partition on my PC and install ubuntu to give it another try. Every now and then I install it to see how it's going but then don't end up using it after something critical ends up breaking!
The Framework laptop is rapidly gaining mind share for folks who care about Linux compatibility and/or upgradability over a ThinkPad.
Having been out of hardware game for a while, how well will this handle something like AutoCAD or Solidworks and modelling ? Looking at something to replace my current ageing first gen HP x360
This is about as good as you get in a 13-inch frame.
Just note that with this generation of Ryzen mobile chips you get a big performance boost when plugged into power vs running on battery.
This is available with 32gb RAM and a 500 nits screen in the USA, not sure why you can't order that at Lenovo Australia.
I asked customer support and they acted like that model didn't exist. I don't see why such a powerful CPU should be hamstrung by 16GB RAM, with the 8 core CPU upgrade it would be an excellent long term purchase
The Lenovo Australia team is very weird and they pull that sort of shit all the time. For their gen 3 T series, you can't even get a proper screen (that doesn't have terrible colours / brightness) in Australia, but is readily available overseas. That's the 45% NTSC 300 nit screen (the one they usually slap on).
It doesn't even make sense since all the laptops come from their overseas factory, including anything built to order.
Yea..I had to get a 2.2K screen off AliExpress and the WQHD LCD internal cable for the Gen 3 at the end
Which thinkpad do you have? Is the bezel glued or screwed on?
It's an infuriating practice, I really don't understand it. It makes their laptops a very hard sell in a corporate environment, when you have a clearly subpar feature compared to a similar priced competitor model. The justification of "Lenovo Aus gonna Lenovo Aus" doesn't sway the beancounters, even when these laptops are far better than those of e.g. Dell when actually used.
Cutting themselves out of the market…
Yep, I got sick of this garbage and waiting for decent specs to become available for order so instead just ordered a Framework laptop.
How are you finding it?
Still setting it up and working through teething issue that I think are related to Intel 12th gen graphics driver bugs under Linux (seems to be an issue affecting ThinkPad and Dell users too).
The hardware seems very nice so far though. Keyboard has a surprisingly good feel, though taking a bit of time to get used to different layout. Screen looks beautiful, though PPI makes scaling a bit awkward and not sure how annoying the gloss will be yet (my first glossy screen laptop).
It's a decent price and pretty awesome that the embedded controller code is open and that there are some level of mainboard schematics. The community is really awesome too.
Still feels like a beta product though, so I don't feel I could recommend it to a general audience yet.
@AnotherHuman: Thanks. Your post was the first time I heard of this fascinating project. Sounds like waiting a bit longer for issues to be ironed out might be a wise idea.
FYI, same specs in Lenovo Edu Store is $1509.55
never AMD on laptop again… Lenovo hasn't properly addressed the sleep issue on win11.
I think the sleep issue is a windows one.
I've had nothing but issues with a recent intel dell laptop and that active standby thing. Take it out of my bag and it's hot like lava, and the battery is flat. stupist thing ever.
Yeah it's Windows. I've run both Intel and AMD laptops on Linux and never have issues, while the same systems on their stock Windows install will not stay asleep.
Would using hibernate instead of sleep work? I know it's not as convenient but a laptop in hibernation is off, you can even disconnect the battery and your session is saved
That's basically what I do.
Most of the time i close my laptop lid and pop it back in my bag, when I take it out (with modern / active standby) it would be hot and flat and full fans on.
Honestly It's dangerous but I don't know who to complain to. So I just use hibernate instead.
I think Mac has this process down pat, it's honestly embarrassing how Windows manages it.
@thedean: I will avoid AMD based on your feedback for now, that is pretty poor
(my 6 year old thinkpad is still working just fine, has 32gb RAM too…)
I expect you have already looked into this, for anyone else with the issue you can disable active standby and bring back standby and hibernate as options with a registry mod. Then you will be able to set hibernate when you close the lid.
@greatlamp: This has nothing to do with AMD.
My experience with this is with an Intel laptop.
The issue is Windows, not the processor.
hmm. very interesting. I did point it to Lenovo unable to address it with bios and driver updates.
I do also have Intel based Dell which is now kinda behaving… but now reassuring the issue is not isolated to amd.
Just a hassle downgrading to win10 and reinstalling all apps and moving data.
Sleep worked under windows 10?
it worked before I did the Stoooopid win11 update. unless something has borked it too
Anyone know of any store that displays thinkpads? They seem to be sold online only.
Currently considering shifting to a thinkpad once my macbook (2014) dies. Briefly had a thinkpad back in 2002(!), but haven't tried one since. For someone like me who just uses the computer for email, wacthing movies, internet, light coding, the biggest consideration is screen quality, keyboard and touchpad, weight and of course OS.
But it's hard to decide between the ergonomics and feel of thinkpads v macs, when you can't do a comparison.