Ideal Internet Speed

LanceVance on 07/05/2024 - 11:21
Last edited 07/05/2024 - 11:39 by 1 other user

G'day,

I'm currently on a 50/20 plan with Aussie Broadband using HFC and overall am pretty happy. I've been wondering however if there would be any tangible benefit from upping my speed. Use case is below:

  • Work from home just over half the week, pretty standard IT work. The only load I would say there is are video calls but I never have an issue with them.
  • Jump on for a COD/catch up session with mates about once a week using the Xbox, works perfectly fine. Every now and then the console or one of the games has to download an update which takes a while, but its an infrequent device for me so not an issue.
  • 4K/HD streaming through the TV, works perfectly fine with content loading quickly.
  • Otherwise usual use of casual laptop/phone/ipad connected to wifi, its only myself, my wife and my newborn in the house.

That being it the only thing I can think of that would change are the occasional updates the Xbox downloads which I don't care about. Would a higher internet speed produce a noticeable difference in day to day browsing? Noting that I'm perfectly happy with how fast this currently is.
I don't do any torrenting or regular downloading of large files.
Wondering if there is anything I'm missing and also why other people tend to go for much higher speed options.

Thanks!

Internet Broadband HFC nbn

Comments

  • geekcohen on 07/05/2024 - 11:32

    How many people are using the connection at the same time? That has only ever been a noticeable issue on my end. When I was on the NBN 100/40 during COVID, if my wife and I were both on video calls, then we would notice a speed drop / slow performance.

    But if all of what you are doing is just one at a time, then an upgrade might not be noticeable.

    • rumblytangara on 07/05/2024 - 12:57
      +2

      When I was on the NBN 100/40 during COVID, if my wife and I were both on video calls, then we would notice a speed drop / slow performance.

      Sounds like more than a problem with 100/40 though- no way should a real 40Mbps up be causing a quality loss with just 2 video calls.

      I've watched realtime throughput during the COVID years as people started Zoom calls- each call took iirc 5Mbps or less. I wasn't noticing any appreciable latency spikes either.

      • geekcohen on 07/05/2024 - 13:04

        It wouldn't be unuseable, it was just slower. Two video calls with Video. Google Meet and Teams most of the time.

        • rumblytangara on 07/05/2024 - 13:09
          +1

          That's frankly weird… I would be pretty pissed if my ISP was providing a 40Mbps up line that couldn't handle two simultaneous conference calls.

          • geekcohen on 07/05/2024 - 13:15
            +1

            @rumblytangara: It could handle them fine and the quality was good, but other web browsing etc was a little sluggish. As soon as one call ended, it was alright. It might have been due to hardware, not sure. I was using NetComm hardware and now running Ubiquiti.

            No longer on the NBN so I don't have that problem anymore. On a much faster and better solution giving me 400/400.

    • LanceVance on 07/05/2024 - 21:52

      My wife is no longer working so I don't think I'll notice anything. Thanks!

  • geekcohen on 07/05/2024 - 11:33
    +1

    Every now and then the console or one of the games has to download an update which takes a while

    Even upping your speed might not make the update any faster as it can be dependent on the download source/server/location.

    • LanceVance on 07/05/2024 - 21:53

      I think it would make it at least a bit faster, given when the updates do happen it's almost always sitting right on the 50Mbps limit, so its clearly got more in the tank.

      • geekcohen on 08/05/2024 - 05:56

        If thats the case, then a higher speed plan would be faster.

  • Twix on 07/05/2024 - 11:39
    +4

    50/20 is enough for two users. A faster plan won't make a difference in day to day browsing. You could get 100/20, 100/40 or 250/25 for the same price or less by swapping ISP every 6 months.

    • follow on 07/05/2024 - 17:29
      +2

      exactly. nbn made the 50/20 plan not worth it when you can get 100/20 for almost the same price

    • LanceVance on 07/05/2024 - 21:55

      I could get 100/20 for an extra $10 a month. But if it isn't going to make any difference, whats the point?

      • Twix on 07/05/2024 - 21:57

        Are you paying $85 for 50/20 with Aussie BB?

        • LanceVance on 07/05/2024 - 22:13

          Yes, bad deal? I'm also very happy with their service which I value highly.

          • Twix on 07/05/2024 - 22:17

            @LanceVance: Aussie BB service is good however they do charge a premium. Superloop 50/20 is $65/m for 6 months but the downside is they moved support overseas.

  • JMosk on 07/05/2024 - 11:43
    +6

    Why not upgrade for a month to see if there is any noticeable difference?
    Everyone has differing hardware, situation and requirements so you're really the only one that will be able to know if the extra cost is worth it for you

    • sumyungguy on 07/05/2024 - 12:41
      +2

      Alternatively, downgrade for a month; save some money?

      • LanceVance on 07/05/2024 - 21:55

        I don't think I can go any lower :D

  • Cheaplikethebird on 07/05/2024 - 12:43
    +1

    12% cost increase for 200% speed increase? No brainer for me but I guess it depends on how much an extra $120 a year means to you.

    • rumblytangara on 07/05/2024 - 13:00
      +2

      12% cost increase for 200% speed increase? No brainer for me but I guess it depends on how much an extra $120 a year means to you.

      If only the world were that simple.

      Anyone with half a clue about how tech worked would be running tests before changing anything. 2 adults who don't torrent/download? 50Mbps down is not going to be an issue at all- he's going to notice no difference in day to day usage. That's $120 a year that can be spent for something that will be noticed, like extra KFC burgers.

      I used to live overseas, and took the cheapest plan I could get (300/300). Gig was maybe another $10 a month, and it was a waste of money because even if I fully loaded my network with test machines just torrenting and running VC sessions, I couldn't get past 120Mbps.

      • Cheaplikethebird on 07/05/2024 - 13:04
        +1

        For me, personally, I'd pay $10 a month just to have the overhead.

        • rumblytangara on 07/05/2024 - 13:05
          -2

          That's fine, but have you ever tested whether you use that overhead? 'Cause I did a crapload of testing.

          I am in tech, most my friends are in tech. The friends who ran gig lines fully admitted they only paid the extra so they could get higher speedtest.net numbers- none of them ever used the overhead for anything practical.

          • Cheaplikethebird on 07/05/2024 - 13:06
            +1

            @rumblytangara: Not sure you're picking up what I'm putting down. I've worked in IT the last 12 years.

            • rumblytangara on 07/05/2024 - 13:07

              @Cheaplikethebird: You're happy to pay for overhead that you are not sure if you ever utilise?

              • Cheaplikethebird on 07/05/2024 - 13:17
                +1

                @rumblytangara: I just upgraded from 100Mbps to 1Gbps to go from downloading 20GB updates in 30mins to 5mins. Doing maybe 10-20 updates a week. For me it was worth it

                Old mate works in IT. For me if I had my partner watching watching 4K Netflix and I'm on a Teams call and I needed to have a file download running simultaneously I would appreciate that extra 50Mbps of bandwidth and just that, for me, would make it worth an extra $10/month especially when you consider it's only a 12% increase on the current fee.

                However, I agree, probably best to try it out for a month to see if they notice any real world benefits hence my upvote on JMosk's comment above. I'm just throwing in my 2c.

              • Cheaplikethebird on 07/05/2024 - 13:57
                +1

                @rumblytangara: BTW when you ran your tests were you checking bandwidth utilisation directly from the router or were you just eyeballing it from what was running on your PC?

                • rumblytangara on 07/05/2024 - 14:43
                  +1

                  @Cheaplikethebird: I was looking at the router, it was running OPNSense. For testing, I'd look at realtime figures. And I'd also look at historical figures iirc taken on 5 second intervals.

                  My testing was a mix of waiting for my kids to get onto their Zoom school sessions, then running a various 4K video streams (Youtube, which I assume are compressed) and kicking off a load of Linux ISO downloads. I was using something like 4 separate PCs for this, wired via ethernet cable. The zoom sessions never suffered from latency or quality problems. This was overseas, not using NBN.

                  The highest I ever managed to push downloads was something like 120Mbps, I can't remember what my highest uploads were (but obviously lower than 120).

                  iirc I did see higher figures when doing Steam updates, but I don't game much so it's not relevant to me. Whether a once a fortnight Steam update took 15 seconds or 45 seconds wasn't something I ever worried about.

                  With my current setup, because it's NBN and some asymmetric POS, I definitely hit upload limits, but these are for multi-hour backups which run by themselves, so it's not really a problem. I have come to peace with NBN being generally a bit crap <shrugs>.

                  The OP doesn't sound like he's pushing around lots of data for lots of people, so I really don't think that an upgrade is likely to be worthwhile.

                  • Cheaplikethebird on 07/05/2024 - 14:58
                    +1

                    @rumblytangara: Yeah I mostly agree. I don't agree that he would be incapable of seeing a difference, for two people the jump from 50 to 100 is a whole different kettle of fish compared to anything 100+. I think the difference would most likely be small and usually unnoticeable hence why I've said in my original comment it depends how much $120 a year is worth to you.

                    The comment I was originally going to write was that if OP doesn't notice it now then psychologically it would be easier to deny himself the upgrade by never trialling it in the first place so why bother.

      • Chaddy on 07/05/2024 - 16:27
        -3

        Depends how cheap and crappy your computer equipment is, if you run decent equipment you notice a huge difference between 50 and 100Mbps particularly when on things like Zoom and Teams calls and when using things like Voice Over IP or when watching TV and movies things are just so much quicker.

        • rumblytangara on 07/05/2024 - 16:45

          Depends how cheap and crappy your computer equipment is, if you run decent equipment you notice a huge difference between 50 and 100Mbps particularly when on things like Zoom and Teams calls and when using things like Voice Over IP or when watching TV and movies things are just so much quicker.

          Facepalm.

          Yeah, because running a simple videoconference requires a Xeon and a discrete GPU. Have you even every looked at the bandwith requirements for a VoIP call? It's literally in the Kbps range, voice was designed to be carried as low bandwidth signals over analogue lines.

          (Please, do not give anyone advice on computers or networking, that was just painful.)

          • Chaddy on 07/05/2024 - 18:23

            @rumblytangara: The reference was more aimed at video conferencing as the improved speed assists with that greatly. While you can get away with using a poor 3G or 4G connection for Voip you do notice a drop in voice quality.
            Though the quality of the headset you use can affect voip more then the speed of the connection the higher speed connection is still good to have if you can afford it.

            • rumblytangara on 07/05/2024 - 18:32
              +1

              @Chaddy: Zoom calls take less than 5Mbps: https://support.zoom.com/hc/en/article?id=zm_kb&sysparm_arti…

              While you can get away with using a poor 3G or 4G connection for Voip you do notice a drop in voice quality.

              What does this have anything to do with VoIP calls- when in this thread has anyone even mentioned cellular data speeds for voice? And because you bring this totally tangential issue up, you can get absolutely crystal clear voice over less than half a meg- any problems with VoIP over cellular connections are going to be down to highly variable latency, nothing to do with bandwidth.

              I suggest you up the meanings of latency and bandwidth.

              Then I suggest you look at your resource utilisation when running a VC or a voice call- even on low spec hardware, resource utilisation should be close to zero. These are incredibly simple tasks for a PC to perform.

              From what you have written so far, it appears that you are grabbing totally random, barely related tech tidbits off the internet and munging them into some kind of passage that frankly makes no sense. ChatGPT would do a better job of giving sensible advice here.

              • Chaddy on 07/05/2024 - 19:58

                @rumblytangara: Basically I was just saying that higher speed connectivity improves the overall browsing experience. Even NBN Co themselves are starting to push higher speed plans by increasing the cost of the lower speed plans while increasing the default speed of others.
                I wasn't saying that its a requirement to go for the higher speeds.
                Also you tend to get lower laytency on higher speed connections as well but that can vary depending on the type of connectivity as well, the voice example was just an example and I was thinking more of video conferencing rather then plain voice calls.
                Also before Zoom started using Cloudflare the call quality was a lot worse as the traffic went back to the US so it was affected a lot more by latency.
                I was just pointing out that you definitely notice the difference between 50 and 100Mbps download speeds as everything loads quicker on the higher speed connection.
                You especially notice it with video content.

                • knobbs on 08/05/2024 - 09:56

                  @Chaddy: The ONLY reason NBN are pushing higher speeds is to make more money…

                • rumblytangara on 08/05/2024 - 11:01

                  @Chaddy: Your posts are just wrong or misguided on so many levels that I am not going to bother with a serious response. It's like arguing with a taxi driver from El Salvadore about the intricacies of deep sea oil drilling.

        • LanceVance on 07/05/2024 - 22:07

          I mean I've said I'm working from home in IT…. so you can guess my equipment is pretty current. Everything loads very quickly so no I don't think Teams calls would load any quicker, have to agree with @rumblytangara, especially when in the office and using their gigabit internet it all feels about the same when launching a Teams call.

      • LanceVance on 07/05/2024 - 21:56
        +1

        I appreciate the perspective, KFC burgers are important and $120 extra bucks in the pocket is….. $120 extra bucks in the pocket.

  • blonky on 07/05/2024 - 13:11
    +1

    We're on 1000/50 (speedtest ~900mbps) and do a lot of 4K streaming. We find YT consumes the most bandwidth, often 350mbps+ on the 4K videos initially then around 80mbps. Netflix seems very compressed and doesn't need much more than 25mbps. Zoom calls less than 5mbps with 1080p video enabled
    Xbox game updates rarely get above 700mbps and tend to run around 300mbps on average but it is nice to have massive updates done in a couple of minutes

    Realistically day to day stuff won't change, maybe the odd excel file downloads a few seconds faster

  • mskeggs on 07/05/2024 - 13:23
    +3

    I have 100/40 fttn. Get about 85/34.
    Two simultaneous video calls, a kid downloading a steam game, and another watching streaming fills it up.

    This is mainly the uplink, I believe, with outbound video and TCP acknowledgements filling up the upstream.

    I don't want to have to think about it, and will upgrade to fibre as soon as it is offered. Just like I would if the power was sometimes blowing fuses or if the rubbish bin was always overflowing by bin day.
    I don't want to have to worry about utilities.

    • Chaddy on 07/05/2024 - 16:21

      If you have money to burn you can order NBN EE Enterprise Ethernet and get 1GBPS both up and down right now without waiting. But you need to be running a business for that as it requires an ABN or ACN number.
      But it is another option.
      Comes down to requirements.

      • Hector on 08/05/2024 - 09:00

        I first thought AWESOME

        Then 1Gbps / 1Gbps is $700/mo with Exetel.

        A bit much.

  • OldSchoolHarry on 07/05/2024 - 14:18
    +2

    50/20 is sufficient for your case. For added improvement in latency when multiple users are active, you can enable QoS (Quality of Service) on your router.

    • Chaddy on 07/05/2024 - 16:18

      Or they could just order a 1000/50 plan and download the entire internet.
      No need for messing around with modem settings in that case and you get the best speeds possible.

      • OldSchoolHarry on 07/05/2024 - 20:42

        There are somethings that can only be achieved by QoS, no matter how much speed you throw at your router.

    • LanceVance on 07/05/2024 - 22:08

      Cheers for that

    • Ramrunner on 08/05/2024 - 14:40

      This - reading your post, you've basically answered your own question I think.

      General web browsing will not be noticably faster, only things like downloads and simultaneous use/streaming. If you have Netflix premium for example and like in my family when we had it 2 x 4K TVs and a tablet streaming simultaneously you will see it.

  • Chaddy on 07/05/2024 - 16:14

    You notice the difference when going from a 50/20 Mbps connection to 100/40Mbps, its a lot snappier on the 100Mbps connection and the likes of teams calls work so much better.
    But you need to make sure your not on a conjested part of the HFC network that can get 100Mbps and above speeds.
    Your ISP can do a check on this for you and let you know the speed that the cable is capable of. Admittedly HFC is a lot better then FTTN with this stuff but can still run into issues.

    • Twix on 07/05/2024 - 17:44

      All of nbn HFC can do Gigabit. No need to ask your ISP.

      • Chaddy on 07/05/2024 - 18:17
        +1

        I think I was thinking of FTTN which can only do 100Mbps and can only do a max of 50Mbps in some areas.
        HFC is affected by power issues and wet weather issues from what I am aware of.
        More then speed.

    • LanceVance on 07/05/2024 - 22:12

      Commented above that Teams calls feel exactly as they do when working from the office using their gigabit connection, so I really don't know what you're basing that on. As does regular browsing for that matter.

      • Chaddy on 08/05/2024 - 17:13
        -1

        I was talking about when you switch from the lower speeds say 25Mbps to 100Mbps you notice a difference especially when viewing video etc.
        250Mbps and above you really wouldn't notice much difference with general web browsing but if you are downloading huge amounts of data say 100GB or more you would notice a huge difference as the files will download a lot quicker then on the slower speeds what would of taken days can be done in a few minutes or a couple of hours tops. I am thinking of things like transferring backups to cloud services that takes ages on slower connections but can be done quicker with faster speeds.

  • Hector on 08/05/2024 - 08:58

    I'm on Exetel for 250/25 - the reason being 2 WFH people always on video need the 25 Mbps up (Teams / Zoom ~ 6Mbps each)

    If I'm editing google photos online, I'll use a daily speed-pass to go to 1000/50 - while latency is the same, load time of photos / videos is much faster, accelerating workflow.

  • Chiyoko on 08/05/2024 - 09:28

    I'm just waiting for them to introduce a cheap 50/50 symmetric plan for streamers, until then I have to do with 100/40…

    • Chaddy on 08/05/2024 - 17:06

      Won't happen as NBN Co don't see the need for symmetrical speeds on home plans.
      They have reserved that for businesses and businesses they consider enterprise so ones that have money to burn. Government healthcare etc.
      NBNco are a bit backwards in their thinking sometimes.

  • Waltervp on 08/05/2024 - 17:31

    We have a household where two people might be streaming video content simultaneously, or having video calls, one on 4k tv, and we have a 6 camera Swann system on there, 2 ring devices, and multiple other cameras, lights, devices… i use an old TP Link M4 Deco (2 units) with the tpg supplied modem/router and have the tv and Swann system on Utp, rest is wireless and noone ever has trouble with the 20/5 TPG internet. So i wont be upgrading yet. I think the internet response times are very important and perhaps placings of the deco wireless points. Not sure… right now in Finland with 500MBps cable and cant really say anything works any better here for just the two of us.

  • HelpMeiCantSee on 08/05/2024 - 21:10

    I’m pretty heavily automated at home, with multiple cameras, local storage etc. streaking for kids etc. I was with iinet for yonks in a 100/40 plan which maxed out at 75 down- having it at the 50 plan was unpleasant with odd latencies and feeling throttled, even when browsing, despite relatively consistent latency under 20. The difference in going up to the 100 plan (and only getting 75) was noticeable. Fttn sucks nuts.

    I’ve since dropped it to a 50 plan again and use it as a redundant connection only, and I’ll soon ditch it completely (unless I find a suuuuuper cheap fttn plan), and have Starlink as my primary.

    I see 300/25 at least 20 hours a day, probably more. I’ve seen 350/40 even. It’s leagues beyond fttn. My feeling is that 250/50 is a reasonable bar to set. Uploads are a big issue, I see no reason for them to be below 50% of download speed. It would be rare for any user to be constantly maxing out a higher speed connection, but realistically, in the digital age being able to down (and up) load stuff quickly IS important.

    I dream of a Gb connection, though I doubt I’ll ever get it without forking out 14k.

    • Twix on 08/05/2024 - 21:19

      Check here if you are eligible for the $0 FTTN to FTTP.

      • HelpMeiCantSee on 08/05/2024 - 21:22

        Negative. Not on the list sadly

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