Aussie Farmers Direct -> Threatening Black Mark for $74

Moots on 14/07/2014 - 18:22
Last edited 14/07/2014 - 18:22

Received an e-mail from Aussie Farmers Direct. I originally signed up for a University Special to try out AFD. $13 instead of $26 for a box of fruit/veg. Apparently I was told it was a WEEKLY delivery; I don't remember signing up to a weekly agreement at full price. After the 2nd box was delivered I e-mailed them saying I didn't want the deal anymore as I wasn't aware of the weekly instalment.

I was charged 3x $20 for my bank declining their transaction as I called them to stop. I did not sign any contract; nor did I even remember agreeing to any weekly instalment!

I told them I'd be happy to pay the $25 for the box I received, but I am not paying any fee's on top.

I received this e-mail:

Thank you for your email & for letting us know.

Please be aware we have sent you a email of the voice recording that you had agreed to a weekly delivery on the 2nd of May.

We have investigated and listened to the call made on the 2nd of April with the sales agent you spoke to. The agent confirmed with you the order was placed as a weekly order & you had agreed to this & if you are not happy with the reoccurring orders you will make the changes online to what was suitable for you before the cut off time. Unfortunately you will be liable for the orders you have received. If payment in full is not received by the due date, you leave us no alternative but to send your account to a debt recovery agency, which may result in you incurring further costs. Credit default listings stay on your consumer file for 5 years, and may inhibit your ability to obtain credit in the future. The current balance on your account is $74.00.

What are my rights, can they really refer the amount owing onwards or is it a scare tactic?

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Aussie Farmers Direct

Comments

  • Mikaela on 14/07/2014 - 18:25

    So does this voicemail actually exist where you agree to weekly delivery? Because it sounds like an imperative part of their claim against you

    • Moots on 14/07/2014 - 18:27
      +3

      I e-mailed them requesting a copy of that recording about 20 minutes ago. I am awaiting to see what they e-mail back.

      • Mikaela on 14/07/2014 - 18:30

        Good idea. I was going to say the exact same thing; that you should try to get a audio copy of the voicemail so that way you can listen to it and ascertain whether or not you did in fact agree to weekly installments. I am interested to see what happens next

      • StewBalls on 14/07/2014 - 20:20
        +2

        You'll never hear it Moots, they'll quietly fade away now that you've called their bluff.

        A family member had a credit union pull this kind of thing on her once, as soon as she effectively said put up or shut up they basically went to water! AFAIK, the whole voice recording for quality assurance purposes thing is a very grey area as far as binding you to a verbal contract, so it seems that not many people are willing to test it.

  • inasero on 14/07/2014 - 18:38
    +1

    Also for privacy reasons they can't just go recording conversations without your consent, they could land themselves in big trouble if that's the case…

    However it is true that defaults on payments can end up on your credit rating, which can be a real bummer. If ever it does get to that stage I would suggest getting in touch with VCAT (or the equivalent in your state) to state your case.

    • Moots on 14/07/2014 - 18:46

      I understand what your saying but seriously are they able to take it that far through a phone agreement? Just say I didn't agree. I did not sign a contract, I didn't sign anything saying if the debit was denied they would charge me $20 each time.

      Also; their terms and conditions clearly state "An administration fee will be charged on all declined payments. We may also ask you to nominate a new credit/debit card account." There is no actual charge notice, so they could literally say $100.00 per attempt.

      Either way I did not click any "I agree/I accept" these terms.

      • nexus4 on 14/07/2014 - 22:43
        +4

        A contract doesn't have to be signed or even on paper to be valid, so that argument isnt going to work.

        If they did make it clear that you were signing up to an ongoing arrangement there's not much you can do.

        However if the nature of the offer was misleading visit your local community legal center and maybe file a statement of claim with your civil and administrative tribunal (eg VCAT in Victoria). Once they see that they're being sued they'll most likely drop it as the cost will exceed what they want to recover.

        That is if you have the time and patience. It also may be worth calling and asking to speak to a supervisor and just calmly explaining the situation. You may be able to reach an agreement this way.

    • nexus4 on 14/07/2014 - 22:36

      I think you'll find that most businesses advise that the call is being recorded before you're connected to an agent.

    • kwaker on 21/07/2014 - 13:23

      they did not tell me at any point that the call was being recorded

  • ozhunter on 14/07/2014 - 18:59

    I originally signed up for a University Special to try out AFD. $13 instead of $26 for a box of fruit/veg.

    Did you sign up online through that link? It does have a pdf file of their terms and conditions.

    Call Recordings:
    All phone conversations to and from AFD are recorded for quality assurance purposes. We can retrieve and listen to
    recorded conversations upon request to confirm interactions and agreements.
    Under certain circumstances, Aussie Farmers will allow or offer customers to listen to recorded conversations

    • Moots on 14/07/2014 - 19:02
      -1

      That 'Terms and Agreement' is a general footer that's located on most pages, I didn't accept or agree with any terms once submitting.

      • ozhunter on 14/07/2014 - 19:13

        I guess it's just better to listen to the recording first. They may have said something like, "By placing your order, you agree with the t&c on our website".

        I can't think of any websites now, but I have seen sites that have a recurring payment ticked by default when you make a payment. From the sounds of your post though, it seems you read the email then called them to place an order.

  • StewBalls on 14/07/2014 - 19:56

    This is why I never sign up to any of these type of 'deals'…usually ends up in a shitfight.

    I told them I'd be happy to pay the $25 for the box I received, but I am not paying any fee's on top.

    Sounds fair enough to me…at least you're willing to meet them halfway. I'd put this to them & tell them it's the best offer they're gonna get.

    What are my rights, can they really refer the amount owing onwards or is it a scare tactic?

    It's a scare tactic, nobody is going to be able to engage the services of an actual debt collector for $74…you'd be unlucky if they even did it for $740…shit, I had trouble getting one that would chase up a debt of $1200 a few years back!!! Sure, they might purchase some dodgy letterhead that makes it appear that they have (a lot of organisations do this) & post out a threat letter or two, but for that small sum where they probably know they're in the wrong anyway, unless they can bluff you then they don't really have much hope!

  • [Deactivated] on 14/07/2014 - 20:19
    +2

    Damn. Looking at that site, I might've assumed it was a one-off delivery too. Nothing on there clearly suggests anything about signing up for a weekly delivery.

    Tiny Terms and Conditions link is tiny… o_O

    Keen to hear whether you get a copy of the telephone conversation and what was actually said!

  • spychiatrist on 14/07/2014 - 21:06

    I order from Aussie farmers from time to timne. Make sure you tick one-off for each order you make, or you'll end up like OP. There was a time we ended up with 2 eskies, got a phone call after a couple of months but no issues.

  • [Deactivated] on 14/07/2014 - 23:10
    +4

    My friend runs an independent fruit and vegi delivery business.

    In their industry AFD is a very nasty business driven company who are not farmer friendly as they are promoted to be. They do more damage to industry and other business owners and consumers at the end. I'll never order from them for the main reason they kick other businesses out, lock customers in contracts and aren't really Aussies farmers direct, very misleading names.

  • [Deactivated] on 15/07/2014 - 08:34
    +1

    They're taking the pi$$ trying to charge you three dishonour fees - I had a DD setup on my credit card and got a call from the merchant straight away on the first rejection (I had cancelled it due to fraudulent activity), gave them the new number and that was that not even a dishonour fee.

    It was a credit card not an EFT, but the point is the same - they should've seen the first direct debit fail, and that's their cue to contact you not to try another couple times for kicks.

    The amount is also excessive as you stated above; in your shoes I'd call them up and offer $25 for the box plus $10 for the first dishonour only because you stopped it at the bank before trying to work it out with the merchant, and that's your best and final offer. They'd be stupid to refer the remaining dishonour fees to an agency - the amount outstanding well exceeds the fee per case that most agencies charge (we use a couple different ones at work depending on the amount and we'd never bother for that low), and even tiny agencies that try to add their fee as a percent of the amount collected will ask what the amount relates to, and if the answer is a couple over inflated dishonour fees they probably won't take it up because they won't have a leg to stand on.

  • spersephone on 15/07/2014 - 09:06

    Normally I'd have said suck it up, you didn't pay attention. But there is nothing in your original link to suggest that this is an ongoing delivery situation, just that you can try it out at a one off discount.

    I'd be requesting that audio before I agreed to anything. If it is clear from the recording that you were told it was ongoing, the charges involved, and you agreed, then you don't have any real options. If it's not, then you do.

  • Peace Maker on 15/07/2014 - 09:54

    Unfortunately you will be liable for the orders you have received.

    So they are asking you just to pay for the food you got? Why not just do that? It doesn't sound like there are any penalty fees from your description.

    I understand you are against the method they used, but you did get the food didn't you? Chalk it up to experience and move on. There doesn't seem to be any real penalty here other than having some extra fruit and veg around the house or am I reading this wrong?

  • samfisher5986 on 15/07/2014 - 11:26
    -1

    Something doesn't seem right.

    I've done the exact same thing, had to call up for a special deal, they never mentioned it would be a weekly delivery etc.

    I called up, they listened to the recording and while they acted like it was my fault because they hinted at it they still cancelled the order and I didn't have to pay for the second incorrect delivery and got to keep it. They knew I wasn't obligated to pay for it.

    It sounds like you should be threatening legal action.

    Also just so you guys and Google can hear this.

    Aussie Farmers direct is a scam and they are full of dodgy salesman. Every single time I have dealt with them they have attempted to trick me. This doesn't even include their dodgy door to door salesman or the fact that they are very overpriced.

    For example telling me I have a $20 off voucher, I nearly finish my order and reconfirm everything, turns out it was only $20 off fruit/veg not anything else from their store.

  • Commonwealth Pig on 15/07/2014 - 17:42
    +5

    They cannot list a default on your credit file for an amount less than $150.

    Source: moneysmart.gov.au

    A credit provider may only report your debt if:

    • The default amount is $150 or more

    Source 2: Veda (a leading credit reporting agency)

    • …The minimum amount for a default is now $150…

    With that in mind I wouldn't worry too much about their threat.

    • Moots on 15/07/2014 - 20:16
      +1

      Cheers, sent them a very lovely e-mail.

      • GafferFish on 15/07/2014 - 21:47
        +1

        It's illegal for companies to mislead you about what they are going to do about about a debt.

        The ACCC has information on their website at http://www.accc.gov.au/consumers/debt-debt-collection/dealin… including a link to complain about their behaviour.

        Although, they didn't actually say in their email that they were going to put a default on your credit file, only information about how long a default sticks around.

  • assetcollector on 15/07/2014 - 17:45

    I signed up with AFD over a year ago after a backpacker knocked on my door.
    I initially ordered a fruit and vege box, but I now select items.
    I get a minimum delivery every fortnight.
    It is a franchise operation and my local deliverers seem nice people.
    I get a weekly email with my order which I then modify.
    If I am going away on holiday, I logon and set a holiday period.
    Not cheap, but it is delivered, and has introduced me to new fruits and vegetables.

  • grasstown on 15/07/2014 - 20:45
    +1

    Personally I would send an email back saying I'll pay you but I am Forwarding this email to fair trading and making a complaint settibg out my version of events and showing them the demanding content of this email - please advise if you will clear the amount I owe or would still like me to pay. Something like that.

  • kwaker on 18/07/2014 - 10:42
    +2

    I ordered the trial, after agreeing taking my credit card details and completing he said its a weekly delivery. I said no I haven't agreed to a weekly delivery and he said its a weekly delivery but your lucky because its no contract so you can change any time ill email your account details so you can access your account and change it anytime you like. I said no, I only want the one, if I want one next week ill log in an order it, he said ok ill change it for you.

    so they sign you up without telling you then its up to you to opt out. sneaky.

    • spersephone on 18/07/2014 - 10:47
      +2

      That's not really allowed, so I'd be complaining about that. If you're not listening properly, you may not realise what you've agreed to.

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