Effective as of 18 November, 2014, the claim window for item not received or SNAD will be extended from the current 45 days to 180 days for US accounts, not AU accounts at this stage. It will not be retroactive, ie will only apply to purchases made from that date.
https://www.paypal.com/us/webapps/mpp/ua/upcoming-policies-f…
Agree, I recently bought a LG G2 tempered glass protector from ebay and the seller keep on pleading with me not to open a dispute resolution and tell me that she has sent the items twice, until the 45 days have passed. Now, I can't do anything, not even giving a negative feedback.
had the same issue here, the shipping date was past the 45 days, 3 months later and still nothing… :(
I just tell them to refund me and I pay them back if I receive it later.
If they don't refund you, just open the case anyway.
Absolutely agree. After being burnt a couple of times trying to give sellers the benefit of the doubt, it's 44 days and then lodge the dispute. And since Paypal have been so happy to ignore complaints about this for years, the new change is way too late to change my behaviour now.
For me, from November 18, it'll still be 44 days then dispute.
44 days is way too long. I generally file as a few days after Paypal will let me (15+ days?).
@Boshait:
But thats point, some things take 30+ days to get here from mainland china. Reporting willy nilly is abusing the system making it worse for everyone, inundating paypal with claims and more sincere claims suffer.
@thedude23: bull, the initial dispute process is completely automated (as is probably the whole system unless theres other circumstances). paypal themselves (the actual humans) would know nothing about it until at best a claim is made.
i put mine in around 30 days then wait till just after that to escalate it in case i forget to by the 45th day. gives me the option to escalate or cancel the claim if i end up getting the item
Double protection - use paypal, and a credit card (CC is usually 90 days).
If Paypal screws with you, give them the chargeback, they still charge it back onto the seller.
That's the problem right there.
You obviously have learnt to open that dispute instead of the fake pleas from the seller.
Bought some seriously dangerous melting LED spotlights from BiC on eBay. Without realising it, I opened my dispute on the last remaining hours of the 45th day. Thankfully that is what I did, or I would have never gotten my money back. For items which take that long to arrive, you just need more time.
Thanks for the info
Sure raise not received to 60 days or so but you sell something and 5 months later they say it is SNAD, that is bad.
180 days is a joke, I can send items strapped to a tortoise faster than that.
Based on what your implying I decided to crunch some numbers. The average turtle can walk 2 km/h. Now they can only travel ~1km before over heating, needing to rest. Rest times are around 2 hours. Tortoise require rehydration, food and sleep for 20 hours a day. Turtles have exception night vision so dont be worried about the night shift. For the purpose of this we will assume the turtle is going Forrest Gump on the delivery, none stop. So that will allow 2 stints a day @ 2 km per day. 180 days the turtle would have travelled 360 km. Provided you items fall within a 360km, I'm happy to call this plausible.
I think a determined turtle would break up the 20 hours sleep into multiple sessions so could conceivably do 8 x 1km sessions in their 4 hours of waking, expanding the distance to 1440km, which is enough to cover east coast inter-capital deliveries as the crow flies, er, turtle crawls.
The Turtles Please courier company is one step closer.
But turtles swim a hell of a lot faster than they walk and undoubtedly most of the trip would be in the water, so I think your numbers are way off.
@OZB Al: Calculations will need to be verified empirically, but discussion clearly refers to local sellers.
Extended dispute window WILL allow overseas sellers to consider leatherbacks and loggerheads as alternatives to airmail (medium-sized packages), along with seasnakes for delivering usb cables and various species of even very small fishies for Meritline tweezer-deals. None of the concerns regarding current airmailing of lithium batteries. Only risk is of an occasional fried seafood platter.
Tortoises/turtles with proper feet instead of flippers, will still be needed for the land-leg component of deliveries, obviously.
Hey, PayPal 'Public Relations' - who doubtless receive 'Google Alerts'.
Kindly gimme my $5, you mongrel bastards.
@OZB Al: you have hit the nail on the head my friend
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1HY_nwi29Ik
this footage shows clearly documented evidence they will be taking full advantage of the super fast EAC for there deliveries. walking speeds have very little to do with delivery time.
But what if said turtle was in his teens and his previous occupation was a Ninja? It'd get a lot of ground covered in a single day.
Of course, that's provided that it doesn't take any meal breaks at Dominos or Pizza Hut.
I'm subscribing to this thread purely to have an easy link back to these excellent tortoise posts.
Brilliant.
i'm imagining dick smith sending out a 2000+ strong group of turtles with ps4s strapped to their shells.
cypher67: you got negged by the lone resident hare, evidently.
This is assuming we're talking about your average turtle/tortise. I think you'd find that, even with breaks for pizza and ass-kicking, owing to their bipedal nature, the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles would provide quite an expedited service.
EDIT: Damnit! Should learn to read the whole thread. Beaten to the joke by scrimshaw.
I kinda agree with this.
While I always thought the 45 days was too short, 180 days is a MASSIVE jump. I can't see any reason why 90 days would not have been sufficient.
Good for buyers, and pragmatic from Paypal.
Most credit cards do chargebacks up to 180 days, so disputes where the funding came from a card would be costing Paypal charge back fees anyway, even after the 45 day cut off.
It's interesting that the stock market views the new Apple payments tech in iOS8 as a serious competitor to Paypal, so they might be inclined to be a little more generous to both their buyers and sellers. FWIW I don't think the Apple payments will be that big a thing.
iOS market share is not that big, I agree with you.
Oh here comes the neg wagon… People need to read a bit to understand what market share means - http://core0.staticworld.net/images/article/2014/08/idc-2014…
You need a bigger chunk of the smartphone market to threat paypal, which is available in all platforms.
Definitely agree on the Global Marketshare, however in the US (where this policy change is happening) it's quite different;
http://www.infocium.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/US-smartp…
The bigger issue for Paypal isn't just iPhone 6 users (Apple payments needs the new NFC chip I believe), it's that now that the Visa/Mastercard have signed up with Apple, they probably will with Google/Android manufacturers too - essentially every Android phone has NFC.
I bought some stuff at banggood.com and it took 10 weeks to turn up. I bought an item from an eBay seller and it had tracking. It went back and forwards between the seller and China Post several times before actually departing China. It took about 55 days to get here. I suspect that PayPal were getting a lot of non delivery claims at 44 days that eventually turn up. This change may save them a bit of dispute work because I the free postage from China is becoming slower.
If I buy something from banggood like a torch or what ever. I totally forget I bought it it takes that long and it's a surprise when it turns up. Only a few dollars is how I look at it.
It took about 55 days to get here
I find that hard to believe. No shipping takes that long from China. I can more easily believe the seller was very slow to ship and fooled you into thinking he had earlier than he did. False tracking numbers is an old, easy scam.
end result is the same, you'll forget about your orders after more than 2 months and be happily surprised when they arrive
180 days is excellent news for buyers but could be detrimental for sellers of 2nd hand goods etc. I think sellers will have to be very careful what terms and conditions they put in there listings.
Not good if tracking info doesnt stay up that long. This means ppl will game the system.
Once again sellers come off second best to eBay/PayPal. Now sellers need to worry about people claimining chargebacks six months after they sold an item, leaving many opportunities for buyers to scam the seller or buyers charging back on second hand goods with a short lifespan. 45 days was indeed a short time but 180 days is definitly too much.
Good point, for example, smart phone, will rapidly reduce in price, buyer can claim money back and buy another smart phone, cheap way to upgrade your phone every 3 months!
Far out, unscrupulous buyers (and competitors) now have half a whole year to make a false claim and cause damage :(
PayPal got even worse. May as well increase their fees while they're at it…
May as well increase their fees while they're at it…
That's a great idea. I will forward your suggestion to the next meeting. Expect an increase to 11.9 percent to final evaluation fees next year.
Regards
John McCabe
Senior Vice President
Customer Service and Operations
how much tax do they pay in Australia?
Yes. I don't see how this is some massive win for normal buyers. Indeed it implies they should be waiting up to 180 days for delivery, which is ridiculous. Anyone with a clue buying on eBay files long before the 45 days. For sellers it opens up more opportunities for getting scammed. It means they have to keep all their proof of shipping for at least 180 days.
. Indeed it implies they should be waiting up to 180 days for delivery,
I think it's more like providing 180 days of 'money back guarantee'.
Hi Boshait, remember me from 179 days ago? Yeah I'm raising a dispute coz the phone you sent me has a scratch. Refund the monies plzzzzzz.
Worried about slower deliveries… As of now, sellers in say HK and China need to ship the item out within 3 days to ensure it gets here before the 45 days.
The new problem I see is sellers saying we could wait longer now that we're covered for longer. ie: we wouldn't use a dispute claim until much later and they can stall longer…
Although I am glad we have a bigger window especially since purchases from the US usually take a month and a half to two months.
This policy encourages people to lodge a dispute.
Horrible news for sellers. :(
FFS - WE LIVE IN AUSTRALIA, not America
Therefore, THIS POLICY REVISION DOES NOT APPLY.
Please people - if you are going to post about things like thks then AT LEAST make some attempt to be accurate.
Australian Policy updates page = https://www.paypal.com/au/webapps/mpp/ua/upcoming-policies-f…
There is NO CHANGE planned (at this stage) for Australian Paypal accounts.
Thank god. PayPal are already bad enough.
It's only a matter of time before the policy shifts once they see an increase in buyer traffic. The same happened with the +10% fees. The thing that rubs salt into your wounds is when they send out 'feedback' Emails or try to call about your sellers account, yet they never listen.
That the change was so unquestionably plausible does seem to reveal something about how cynical people are about eBay/PayPal nowadays.
It applies for the UK as well. I'll bet any day now the change will come.
I use a US paypal account.
FFS - WE LIVE IN AUSTRALIA, not America
Therefore, THIS POLICY REVISION DOES NOT APPLY.
Please people - if you are going to post about things like thks then AT LEAST make some attempt to be accurate.
Australian Policy updates page = https://www.paypal.com/au/webapps/mpp/ua/upcoming-policies-f…
There is NO CHANGE planned (at this stage) for Australian Paypal accounts.
COUGH Pardon?
COUGH Pardon?
come on lets be honest, at the time it was only a US thing and you didnt/should have said that at some point in your OP. unless you had inside info you didnt actually know it would happen here a month later and you were just guessing at best.
you cant look back in hindsight and claim you called it when you really didnt. llama still had a point at the time
edit: as a matter of fact they called it better than you did…
Please people - if you are going to post about things like thks then AT LEAST make some attempt to be accurate.
There is NO CHANGE planned (at this stage) for Australian Paypal accounts.
Yep, I've scaled back from power selling on Ebay, to light selling. Now this ensures I'll never sell on Ebay again.
Too easy.
Would've thought a bit less would've been a better balance, but maybe this is to really include those from Asia that take a while to arrive and then stuff up after a month or two of use…
Yet sellers have to show item is delivered within 7 Days of a dispute being opened
Otherwise you will lose out even if the goods are sent
Fark feebay and paypal. I hate them with a passion
Paypal dispute didn't work for me
Bought an item for 127 dollars. + 55 postage.
Only half of it arrived.
Paypal dispute raised.
Outcome Refund the 127 after item is shipped back to seller.
Cost of postage $55 to me + $50 back to seller.
Total spent $190
Total refund from Paypal $85 Total loss for entire adventure $105
[Assuming it is rolled out to AUS] What would this mean for CashRewards 2% cash back? If eBay policies follow suit (they are currently aligned at 45 days) then your cash back would take 6 months to be available for withdrawal. Not ideal.
I think 180 days is too much. Something like 90 days would be more than sufficient and practical
Buy new iphone 6+ around december 2014, then make a claim after 165 days, got a full refund. and wait for view more months for new iphone model again. stupid 180days, bad bad for seller!!!
under what grounds could you possibly claim a refund under these conditions?
SNAD resolution by Paypal is always to return the item for a full refund so buyers will just claim SNAD 179 days later and will send back a used and possibly out-dated item.
surely if you can prove via tracking numbers that they received it and were happy with it for a week/month they couldnt call snad?
i just find that almsst impossible to believe because ebay/PP fees will also get refunded to the seller meaning they are also out of pocket.
@nosdan: Well good people wont't do that but there are low-lives who will suddenly discover that it was missing something 5 months later. As for fees, ebay and paypal care about making BUYERS happy.
@nosdan:
if remember correctly i was charged additional 50 cent fee for issuing partial refund (without dispute),
Just received an email from PayPal stating that this will also apply in Australia from 18 November.
https://www.paypal.com/au/webapps/mpp/ua/upcoming-policies-f…
Yep. I received the same email. As a non-eBay seller apparently it gives me "Greater business opportunity".
About time I recode the website to ditch PayPal and move to Stripe.
So how might this affect people's buying habits? I mean, for me, a big part of the decision to replace my old camera, upgrade to a bigger hard disk, etc., or even just try a product out, has been the efficiency of selling ever since the advent of eBay.
With the choice soon to be between providing a six month 'warranty' period for my used goods, reverting to old school classifieds, or the Quicksales wasteland, I'll be less keen on the process of trading up. With the recent eBay fee hikes and existing bias toward protecting buyers, the costs and risks of selling had already been more front and centre in my mind when deciding whether to buy certain things.
thanks for letting us know, 45 days is way to short when ordering items from china/HK