Bought gift overseas - Slapped with GST then got TRS refund denied.

LIndomietable on 18/01/2016 - 11:45

I bought an expensive watch for my brother's wedding gift which cost me $2000 AUD shipped from USA.
He live overseas, so I time my purchase to be 30 days before I fly out.

I couldn't get anything local below $2000 which is the maximum budget I can afford, so I resort to buy the watch overseas.
I ordered the watch and UPS withheld it because custom need to charge GST on it.

They use some weird calculation and I had to pay $250 GST on it. I paid straight away as I was confidence that I can get it back on TRS.
I visited TRS booth on the way out and they declined my application on the grounds that the company I purchased my watch does not have ABN registered.

They told me to contact customs to fix this issue and they said that I should get my refund. It took 60 days for customs to get back to me and they declined my claim
with the following reason :

The invoice you have supplied does not show that GST has been paid, or that the retailer has an ABN, or that the goods were sold in Australia.
Goods that are imported into Australia to which DIBP apply GST on importation are not eligible for a refund of GST under the TRS.

Has anyone been in my position ? Any advice on how I can get the GST back ?

Travel

Related Stores

customs.gov.au
customs.gov.au

Comments

  • retiredfeline on 18/01/2016 - 11:48
    +45

    I think you're out of luck, it's not covered by the TRS scheme, which is supposed to refund GST on goods bought from Australian sellers.

    • cloudy on 18/01/2016 - 11:55
      +4

      Spot on.

      So the fact is u have paid GST, but u paid straight to the government not via a retailer. And because the TRS scheme is in place to support overseas shoppers to buy in australia whilst holidaying here, the scheme requires receipt with all the stuff mentioned. ABN, GST stated, etc…

      So ur out of luck.

      • Indomietable on 18/01/2016 - 14:15
        +3

        Yes .. I'm out of luck .. I guess I will need to be more carefull next time.

        • [Deactivated] on 18/01/2016 - 14:34
          +1

          Even with paying GST, did you save money by getting it overseas?

        • Indomietable on 18/01/2016 - 14:44
          -1

          @Drew22:
          Yes :D

          After shipping + extra warranty I saved about $1000.

          I just hoped that TRS do better job in informing visitors.
          On TRS site ( http://www.border.gov.au/Trav/Ente/Tour/Are-you-a-traveller) under "What purchases are eligible for a refund?" there are no mention of imported good shipped from overseas and I met all the eligibility requirements.

        • RockyRaccoon on 18/01/2016 - 15:16
          +10

          @pig: They have, but like all things you need to read things carefully.

          On the page you linked to

          A tax invoice has the word ‘tax invoice’ on it and shows the business name and Australian Business Number (ABN) of the retailer, the purchase price including the GST and/or WET paid, a description of the goods and the date you purchased the goods

          Bought overseas goods from an overseas retailer will NOT have an invoice with an ABN on it.

          You are interpreting "bought In" as meaning

          While you are in Australia

          rather than

          Goods from an Australian retailer.

          However this is covered by the terms above requiring an ABN which means GST being paid by the retailer.

          When you bought from overseas the RETAILER never paid GST, which is the requirement as covered in the TRS site. (which I quoted above)

          While I understand that you need to be fully aware of this and maybe it could have been clearer. It wasnt wrong. So we are trying to tell you that there is nothing you can do.

        • Settero on 18/01/2016 - 15:36

          @pig:
          "The Tourist Refund Scheme (TRS) lets you claim a refund of the Goods and Services Tax (GST) and Wine Equalisation Tax (WET) that you pay on certain goods you buy in Australia and then take out of Australia with you or in your checked luggage or carry-on bags."

        • retiredfeline on 18/01/2016 - 16:24
          +20

          @pig:

          I met all the eligibility requirements I did not read all the conditions.

          There, fixed that for you.

        • [Deactivated] on 18/01/2016 - 20:29
          +2

          @pig:
          Visitors generally wouldn't be buying stuff online anyway, so its not relevant

        • [Deactivated] on 18/01/2016 - 20:33
          +1

          @Settero:
          Was just about to say that too

        • ommitedspider on 18/01/2016 - 21:34

          @Settero: I don't think it can apply to items in checked in luggage, as they need to see the item at TRS counter.

        • Indomietable on 19/01/2016 - 09:40
          -2

          @RockyRaccoon:

          See : https://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/121427?page=1#comment-1665…

          I think its not where the purchase was made … as long as the retailer has ABN and paid GST for the item you can claim it.

          In my case, government applied the GST and Government do not have ABN, so i'm out of luck.

        • retiredfeline on 19/01/2016 - 10:26

          @pig: Even if you had the government's ABN, that's no good, because it's the retailer that needs to have an ABN.

        • Indomietable on 19/01/2016 - 10:27

          @greenpossum:
          Yep!

        • retiredfeline on 19/01/2016 - 10:36
          +1

          @pig: However, if you had got a friend with a business and an ABN to import it for you, pay the GST, take your money and give you an invoice, then you would be clear to proceed as you hoped. Assuming that your friend's business could plausibly want to import such a thing.

          All in all you should have had it sent direct to your brother's country. But maybe that might have attracted more import duty that end.

        • Peck on 19/01/2016 - 10:41
          +2

          @greenpossum: HEHE! You ARE cruel! :)) Anyway, thanks to 'pig' for sharing his experience. I learn something new every day on OzB.

        • ronnknee on 19/01/2016 - 11:14

          @pig:

          I just hoped that TRS do better job in informing visitors.

          They have made it very clear that an ABN is required (and the pre-requisite of having an ABN is being located in Australia).

        • ankor on 20/01/2016 - 20:14

          @greenpossum:

          Who'd have thought that on ozbargain, a pig gets slapped down by a possum and a raccoon?

    • Stoz on 19/01/2016 - 13:03
      +5

      Just for fun, "TRS scheme" = "Tourist Refund Scheme scheme" :-)

      • retiredfeline on 19/01/2016 - 14:12
        +3

        Sharp of you. I realised that after posting but someone had replied so I couldn't edit it. Still, not as bad as Automatic ATM machine.

        • strangeloops66 on 21/01/2016 - 00:41

          I need my PIN number for the ATM machine.

        • retiredfeline on 21/01/2016 - 12:15
          +1

          @strangeloops66: Sure you wouldn't prefer a Personal PIN Number?

        • strangeloops66 on 21/01/2016 - 13:21

          @greenpossum:

          I can identify with that.

        • spaij on 21/01/2016 - 18:11

          I'm sure if you said, "I need to get cash from the automatic T machine", people would either look at you blankly or ask about this mystical "T machine" that you can get cash from…

          Probably the same of you refer to it as an AT machine…

        • retiredfeline on 21/01/2016 - 18:22
          +1

          @spaij: It's right next to the automatic coffee machine.

      • surethang on 21/01/2016 - 02:49

        "TRS scheme" - close cousin of the widely used "PIN number"

  • RockyRaccoon on 18/01/2016 - 12:02
    +12

    They said it to you in plain english

    Goods that are imported into Australia to which DIBP apply GST on importation are not eligible for a refund of GST under the TRS.

    What more do you need to know.

    • Indomietable on 18/01/2016 - 14:08
      -5

      What more do you need to know.

      I said it in plain english that I want to know if there is anything I can do to get the GST back.

      • Shonky on 18/01/2016 - 14:10
        +23

        And in plain English it clearly says you cannot.

        Simpler English: NO.

      • ronnknee on 19/01/2016 - 11:23
        +2

        I just hoped that TRS do better job in informing visitors.

        No, you're blaming them for not being informative when in reality, you had difficulty understanding.

  • humdingaling on 18/01/2016 - 12:25
    +4

    the extra 50 bucks is probably import processing charge which is applied for goods over the value of 1000 AUD

    • JimmyF on 18/01/2016 - 22:46
      -3

      correct….. BY THE FREIGHT COMPANY.

      Tell them to screw it, you'll pay the GST not there handling free.

      • Kenb0 on 19/01/2016 - 14:32
        +2

        Yeah….I don't see where you have any leverage here…don't pay the handling fee, you don't get your item. Its not like they're going to be falling over themselves to make the delivery to you.

        • JimmyF on 19/01/2016 - 14:41
          -5

          Thanks for the neg Ken….

          Well $50 handling fee is outrageous to collect GST on a item. They are already being PAID to transport the item.

          A fair handling fee is acceptable, but not $50.

        • Kenb0 on 19/01/2016 - 14:46
          +1

          @Level380:

          Wasn't me that negged you first. Didn't think I did neg you, and just went to try and see if I could neg you and now I can't withdraw the second neg I hit you with :P

          EDIT: managed to find the option to withdraw my neg.

        • JimmyF on 19/01/2016 - 16:25

          @Kenb0: No worries! :)

          Anyhow, what do you think a acceptable handling fee to collect GST would be? $50 on sub $2k items is a crazy handling fee. Yes on goods worth $10k being imported, fair enough. but for the average joe blogs importing say a $1k camera, getting hit with a $100 GST bill and a $50 handling fee isn't right. That handling fee is equal to 5%!? Not fair!

        • Kenb0 on 19/01/2016 - 17:25

          @Level380:

          Personally, I reckon $20 is enough but then again I don't know how much effort they have to put in to collect that GST charge, remit it to government with proper paperwork, etc.. I've bought quite a few items over that $1k mark over the past few years, and even with the $50 processing fee on top of the GST, I've managed to save quite a few bucks from aussie prices, so in the end, I've just coped with it.

    • Thaal Sinestro on 19/01/2016 - 03:53
      +1

      Soon we shall all have to pay a 15% GST on personal imports from overseas + a $50 processing fee, even for a $1 item from Commie. Man, I hate Libtards, but the ALP are no beter: voted in they would retain the changes.

  • ynot1985 on 18/01/2016 - 12:33
    +7

    "They use some weird calculation and I had to pay $250 GST on it"

    If i'm not mistaken, you have to pay GST on the freight cost as well if it's over $1000

    • ESEMCE on 18/01/2016 - 12:40
      +1

      ^THIS and any Insurance/third party warranty you might have paid for..

      I learned this the hard way back in the bad old days when anything over $500 copped GST.
      I added an International Warranty and shipping Insurance to my purchase and that pushed my item over the threshold.
      NOT HAPPY JAN!

    • Kenb0 on 19/01/2016 - 14:33

      Pretty sure if the watch was around $2k, the gst is 10% of that, which is $200. Add on the import processing charge for any item over $1k, which is around $50-$60, thats how it comes to around $250.

  • cDNA on 18/01/2016 - 12:41
    +5

    The TRS scheme is here to benefit overseas travellers not tax dodging Australians. There is no Australian GST from overseas sellers, so why are you trying to claim 10% back?

    Even if you buy a product here and claim the GST back from the TRS counter, don't be surprised if you are forced to pay back the GST refund when you arrive back in Australia.

    • Shonky on 18/01/2016 - 13:02
      +5

      His point was that he did end up paying GST when it was imported, however GST in that case is not eligible for the TRS.

      • cDNA on 18/01/2016 - 14:00
        +2

        I understand his situation, but the OP really needs to understand what the TRS is for.

        "The Tourist Refund Scheme (TRS) lets you claim a refund of the Goods and Services Tax (GST) and Wine Equalisation Tax (WET) that you pay on certain goods you buy in Australia and then take out of Australia with you or in your checked luggage or carry-on bags."

        • Shonky on 18/01/2016 - 14:04

          You asked why he's trying to claim it back and yes he's not entitled to. He did pay GST, just not to the overseas seller.

          You don't pay back the GST if the item is less than the $900 limit otherwise the system would be pointless for Australian residents.

    • cloudy on 18/01/2016 - 13:51

      When he returns back from overseas, and he is carrying his receipt (or whatever paperwork) showing he has paid GST once, he should be fine.

      GST is only payable once:)

      • cDNA on 18/01/2016 - 14:04

        That is correct, but if you receive the refund prior to departing Australia, you can be forced to hand that money back when you arrive back in Australia. The people who get away with it are lucky bastards. This sometimes happens to people with goods over $900 and people who declare these items. Please read this:

        "I claimed a TRS refund for some goods that I now want to bring back into Australia. What do I need to know?
        If you are aged 18 years or over, you can bring in up to A$900 worth of general goods into Australia duty-free, or A$450 if you are younger than 18. Families travelling together can pool this allowance (so a couple with a child can bring in a total of A$900 + $900 + A$450 = A$2250 worth of general goods into Australia without paying duty or tax). This is called your Passenger Concession.
        General goods include gifts, souvenirs, cameras, electronic equipment, leather goods, perfume concentrates, jewellery, watches and sporting equipment.
        If the total value of the goods you are bringing in is greater than your Passenger Concession, including goods for which you have previously claimed a tax refund under TRS:
        you must declare all of these goods
        for goods where you have previously claimed a tax refund under TRS, you will need to pay that refund back
        duty and tax will apply to all items of this type, not just goods over the limit of your passenger concession."
        Penalties may apply if you don’t declare that you have goods in excess of your concession.

        • cloudy on 18/01/2016 - 14:20

          Yea that is absolutely right. If u claim, and bring it back, u can be forced to pay back the GST. But just to be extra technical, ur only supposed to pay back the current value of the goods, so technically speaking if u were away on holiday for 1 month, u can depreciate the value of the goods for 1 month and then GST on the market value.

          I believe this to be true, but I cbf finding the source, so u don't have to believe me on that. :)

        • [Deactivated] on 18/01/2016 - 14:27

          I did it once. I claimed gst when I went overseas on a watch I bought here but when I returned I declared it just in case so I ended up paying the gst back. Funny thing is when I went to pay the officer was wearing a Tag Heuger and I said to him it's a nice watch but he told me it's a fake, his dad bought it in Thailand. A customs officer wearing a counterfeit watch!

        • JohnHowardsEyebrows on 20/01/2016 - 13:02

          I just got back the past fortnight, after having claimed the GST on a $1500 laptop. When returning, I went to the declare channel, and the customs officer wasn't interested, just telling me to head for the exit.

          If it's quite busy (as it often is), you'll often get away with it. Even if you don't, apparenlty they'll mark down the item for depreciation, so you'll get back at least 20% of the GST when all's said and done.

        • [Deactivated] on 20/01/2016 - 13:37

          @JohnHowardsEyebrows:

          Same. My father declared something once and the guy just said 'thank you for being honest. Please go to the exit.'

          I have smuggled or whatever term you want to use things back EVERY time i have travelled and never ever been caught. I don't fly on an Australian passport so that may be why.
          I have heard of people in the abstract being caught but no one I actually know.

          Does anyone know anyone who specifically had to pay it back rather than the abstract - i heard about someone?

        • McFly on 21/01/2016 - 13:12

          @JohnHowardsEyebrows: Ditto. I was the only one in the declare lane too. He asked how much it was (~$1400) and waved me through.

    • Indomietable on 18/01/2016 - 14:04
      -3

      There is no Australian GST from overseas sellers

      There is! Its very clear on the invoice that what I am paying is GST.

      • cDNA on 18/01/2016 - 14:06

        That's dodgy. So that store has no ABN, but is still charging GST.
        I misunderstood. I thought you purchased from an overseas store that offers international shipping.

        • Shonky on 18/01/2016 - 14:08
          +3

          No, the invoice is from customs/shipping company to say he's paying the GST on the import. He did buy it from an overseas store.

  • oscargamer on 18/01/2016 - 13:24
    +3

    nice try - but you should have read the rules before you bought

  • spackbace on 18/01/2016 - 14:16
    +7

    Lol this forum has been interesting to say the least over the last week!

    First, we see someone hit a pole - thread doesn't go the way the OP hoped
    Second, someone trying to get a refund from Telstra over charges they incurred from Vaya, by calling Telstra - thread doesn't go the way the OP hoped
    And now this one, thread clearly not going the way the OP hoped ("Any advice on how I can get the GST back ?")

    Ah fun fun!

  • swiggity swag on 18/01/2016 - 14:51
    -3

    You live in this country, you pay tax. Simple.

  • bobbified on 18/01/2016 - 15:10
    +4

    bit harsh, some of you.. lol.

    I personally don't think it's unreasonable to expect a refund on the GST that was paid during the import of the watch that is then taken out of the country…

    but they've already got a specific rule against it, so can't argue with that.

    • RockyRaccoon on 18/01/2016 - 15:31

      As for harsh, he's never going to win the argument, so people are just trying to say, yep its maybe a little vague, depending on your ability to understand the exact requirements, the key being the lack of ABN as required. So do we just say, yes you poor sod, go argue with the bureaucrats who wont be able to change the law, or maybe we say write to his parliamentary member and start a social network campaign? I think that would be harsher.

      As for your persoanl view on the rule, a maybe "unreasonable", but then you could then argue, its unfair if its bought 61 days ago rather than 59, its only 2 extra days, but in that case it wouldn't qualify. Plus why should the government go thru all the paperwork for collection and then refund, when the buyer could have just had it shipped directly to his brother or another relative overseas to hold for him.

      My guess is that the country where his brother was, might have had a higher duty to be paid on the watch

      • bobbified on 18/01/2016 - 16:21
        +2

        I agree that he's never going to win the argument because there is a specific rule against being able to claim the GST back on his item.

        What I meant was that the OP's initial expectations of getting a refund was not unreasonable because it would seem quite logical to have the GST refunded.

        But he now knows.. so can't argue with the rule.

  • Max Power on 18/01/2016 - 15:20

    Some relevant reading for you:
    https://www.ato.gov.au/Business/GST/In-detail/Rules-for-spec…

    There's currently a $1000 GST-free threshold, but that may be reduced or eliminated completely from 1st July 2017.

  • whooah1979 on 18/01/2016 - 15:29

    I bought an expensive watch for my brother's wedding gift which cost me $2000 AUD shipped from USA.

    i don't get it. wasn't the item a gift? did you give it to your brother and did he keep it, or did you actually take the item with you when you left oz in hope of getting a gst refund?

    • RockyRaccoon on 18/01/2016 - 15:31

      The brother is living overseas

      • whooah1979 on 18/01/2016 - 15:32

        ohh.

        • oscargamer on 18/01/2016 - 17:38
          +1

          so……..he bought an item from overseas, then took it overseas, and somehow customs have to refund him the GST…….something not right there….even to the most stupid amongst us

        • Indomietable on 18/01/2016 - 17:43

          @oscargamer:

          This is how Duty Free shops works.

        • oscargamer on 18/01/2016 - 18:47

          @pig:

          didn't read….but i reckon i know how they work

    • captobvious on 18/01/2016 - 23:04
      +1

      Gifts sent to you
      There is no longer a concession for goods sent as a gift. Goods that are gifted, donated, loaned or supplied free of charge are still subject to assessment for duty and other taxes and charges if they have a value of more than AUD1000 or if the goods are tobacco and/or alcohol products.
      If you are unable to provide evidence of the value of the goods, the legislation (the Customs Act 1901) provides other ways of determining value.

  • antzz on 18/01/2016 - 22:57
    +1

    Are you sure the watch is real? I collect fine watches and never find such big price difference. Even in Europe the price is not much different than elsewhere maybe not by more than 10pc. Careful as there are lots of fake watches out there

    • Indomietable on 19/01/2016 - 07:03

      The watch is real and I think Australian retailers are taking high profit margin.

      I saw a watch went on sale just under $2000 but I didn't buy it because it was months away from my flight. After the sale period ended, the lowest price I can get for the watch is $3500. I tried half a dozen shops and still can't get it under $2000. The average asking price is close to $5000. They laughed when I asked them to do price match. If one retailer can sell it for 2k imagine the profit margin for retailer that sells them em for 5k.

      As for replica or fake watches, generally the seller will be upfront about it.

      If you buy from reputable online seller that has brick and mortar shop then chances are you are getting the real deal.

      • theStinge on 19/01/2016 - 12:41

        Why the downvotes? Fair comment I thought.

  • Dabbler68 on 19/01/2016 - 00:52

    While the TRS rules make it clear the purchase does not qualify in this instance, it still seems a little unfair. Whether he bought from a legitimate Australian retailer or imported it and then had to pay GST on arrival, the government received that tax.

    So in either case, it would seem fair that bona fide travellers should be entitled to a refund, regardless of how the GST was paid. But I agree that he would be unlikely to succeed in any such claim.

    • KaTst3R on 19/01/2016 - 02:32
      +1

      You are totally right. It is arguable that if GST was paid before flying, he should be entitled to the refund at the airport. The rules do clearly state that the receipt needs to show the ABN to be eligible for refund. However, he paid the GST to the government, who does not have (or do not show) an ABN !!!! It is a hole in the policy !!!

    • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 20/01/2016 - 08:19
      +2

      The entire point of the TRS is to encourage buying from Australian retailers.

  • Randxyz123 on 19/01/2016 - 01:04
    +2

    Sorry OP but you should have double checked about whether you could do this.

    TRS is really only for purchases made in Australia

  • [Deactivated] on 19/01/2016 - 02:24
    +1

    Shouldn't UPS had issued a Tax Invoice given that they collected the GST?

    Should have direct shipped to the destination country if that was cheaper.

    But at the end of the day, despite your massive saving already by getting gray imported even with the GST+Fee levied, $2k is a hell of an amount to spend on a watch/wedding gift. Just be thankful that you are in a position to spend such a large amount of money on something like this. $250 is nothing compared to spending $2k on a watch as a wedding gift.

    • Indomietable on 19/01/2016 - 09:14

      Thanks , I definitely feel grateful and my brother is very happy with the gift. I told him not to get married again :)

      The invoice was issued by UPS, but UPS is not the retailer.
      If I have known this I would have directly shipped to the destination country.

  • JimB on 19/01/2016 - 09:55
    +2

    What watch was it and what country does your brother live in?

    • theStinge on 19/01/2016 - 12:43

      ^This. I think we all deserve to know now. :)

      • JimB on 19/01/2016 - 12:44
        +1

        I wouldn't say I deserve it, but I love watches and am curious! lol

        • nx1nx1 on 19/01/2016 - 14:17

          me too. Especially since there's such a big price difference.

  • Lancerx on 19/01/2016 - 15:55

    deleted

  • O15 on 19/01/2016 - 18:23

    What was the watch?…

    • KaTst3R on 19/01/2016 - 20:19

      The other question is which website?…

    • spackbace on 19/01/2016 - 22:41

      Which watch?

  • Indomietable on 20/01/2016 - 00:13
    +2

    Watch is Raymond Weil Freelancer. I bought it from Jomashop.

    • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 20/01/2016 - 08:23
      -3

      Seriously why are we discussing $2000 watches on OzBargain? Start a website called OzWatch.com….

      • algy on 20/01/2016 - 16:14

        Nothing wrong with saving your cash in other ways to buy a watch. Have you never had a hobby?

    • xsacha on 20/01/2016 - 15:14

      Seems to be different types of Freelancer, like the Chronograph.

      Did you get this one? https://www.grahamsjewellers.com.au/raymond-weil-2730-sp5-65…

      • Indomietable on 20/01/2016 - 18:10

        I bought Freelancer 7730-st-2004

        See : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i-Nj4ebYoeg

        • xsacha on 21/01/2016 - 10:50

          Looks like it is cheaper to buy in Australia.
          http://www.bodying.com.au/raymond-weil-watches-7730-st-20041…

          This was first link for that model on Google.

          $2169 and you would have been able to claim back 10% making it under $2k.

        • Indomietable on 21/01/2016 - 12:18

          @xsacha:

          • Bodying ships from overseas
          • it cost > $2000.
          • I was able to get it just under $2000 delivered from Jomashop.
        • xsacha on 21/01/2016 - 19:38
          +1

          @pig: What I mean is:
          Bodying includes GST (it has to because it is an AU website)
          Bodying is Australian and has an ABN, hence you can claim TRS on it.
          — You can decrease $200 from the price
          — Ends up under $2k

          Jomashop price didn't include GST
          Jomashop isn't Australian and doesn't have an ABN, so you can't claim TRS on it.
          — You have to add $200
          — You have to add $50 because GST wasn't paid.
          — Ends up over $2k

          Ergo, bodying ends up cheaper.

    • nx1nx1 on 20/01/2016 - 15:51

      I reckon you can probably get that price here. you can generally get 30% or so off retail here. and then considering the TRS/GST difference. Might have been cheaper here. but wouldn't be much difference. Jomashop prices were much more attractive when the dollar was at parity.

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