Using a buyers' agent in China

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  JimmyF on 20/03/2018 - 22:46

  So you're going ahead with the buy…..

  The value of the goods is around $2000

  So thats $4kAUD to buy here? Including delivery?

  And does that $2k from China factor in GST, import duty and freight?

  It might also help if you list what brand/model you're buying.

  • 

    DeepDreamer on 20/03/2018 - 23:13

    So you're going ahead with the buy…..

    Mebee. Still thinking it through.

    So thats $4kAUD to buy here? Including delivery?

    Nope, A$2k to buy. About $3k landed, including duties and taxes, and then local delivery will be extra

    • 

      JimmyF on 20/03/2018 - 23:18

      Thought it might have been closer to that. Personally, its not worth your time/risk to import directly using a 3rd buyer agent. They'll want a cut/fee, so say goodbye to another $200-500 and if something falls apart along the way and blows out, you might be paying $4k or more!

      At the end of the day, you're looking at only saving $500-1000 by importing directly, but you forgo any local warranty and if you have upset the Australian distributor by importing around them, don't expect too much love from them when it stops working and you need troubleshooting advice and/or parts. As they'll know they didn't sell this unit in Australia to you.

      It might not be this year or the year after, but one year it'll play up

      • 

        DeepDreamer on 20/03/2018 - 23:51

        +1

        At the end of the day, you're looking at only saving $500-1000 by importing directly

        More like $3500, actually

      • 

        JimmyF on 20/03/2018 - 23:56

        +1

        @DeepDreamer:

        You're providing dirty statements then.

        You said it costs $2k and it'll cost you half of what you can get it in Australia.

        But really you meant it'll cost you $3.5k and it'll cost $7k in Australia to buy.

        Be clear and don't try to muddy the waters with your cryptic posts.

      • 

        spackbace on 21/03/2018 - 00:09

        +2

        @DeepDreamer:

        $3500-$7000 on something that just heats? Seriously?

        Lol I'd put that sorta coin into a decorative and functional fireplace. At least that adds value to your property and a talking point when people are around.

      • 

        mskeggs on 21/03/2018 - 09:48

        +1

        @Spackbace:
        The crazy part is the cost of operating these in Australia is sky high. So paying above the odds for the stove, and then a mill stone to fuel it.

        If OP wants the ambience of a fireplace, they should buy a cheap fuel stove and light it when they want pretty flames, but heat the house with RC aircon (with solar PV on the roof).

      • 

        JimmyF on 21/03/2018 - 09:59

        @mskeggs: See the thread the OP linked to in the first post, they started it a few days back. They think operating costs will be cheap as chips and use under 1000kgs a year for heating in ACT.

        I looked into these a few years ago when the folks pulled out the slow combustion heater as gathering wood was getting too much for them. But loading pellets into a heater would be fine. But the costs of pellets are eye-watering when its $1/kg + delivery.

        I do think pellet heaters have a place, just not for everyday heating in the burbs!

        A holiday house would be fine, but then so would RC AC.

      • 

        DeepDreamer on 21/03/2018 - 10:07

        @JimmyF:

        You said it costs $2k and it'll cost you half of what you can get it in Australia.

        Dude! Nope, never. I said the value of it is that. In China. That's relevant context when considering a buying agent. My own cost of shipping and importing is irrelevant to this context.

        But really you meant it'll cost you $3.5k and it'll cost $7k in Australia to buy.

        Dude! Nope. I said the savings would be around $3.5k. But you're near enough

        Be clear and don't try to muddy the waters with your cryptic posts.

        I'm muddying the water?

      • 

        DeepDreamer on 21/03/2018 - 10:08

        @Spackbace:

        The premium units go for >$12k, which is crazy.

        Some of these boilers are functional fireplaces, though arguably not as pretty as a wood burning one.

        To put it in context, this is a relatively powerful unit that will heat a decent living area by radiant heat, and also heat and pump water through the house to radiators to keep the rooms warm.

      • 

        DeepDreamer on 21/03/2018 - 10:11

        @mskeggs:

        I considered this, but:
        * RC heating is less effective below the dew point (around 4deg C). Our mornings get below that for 5-6 months of the year. People I've spoken to with RC heating confirm it's just not as effective when it's really cold outside.
        * PV won't help me heat early in the morning and late in the afternoon

        Effectiveness aside, even without the solar PVs, RC would be the cheapest running cost, maybe by a factor of 2x-3x. However I've got seven rooms I need to heat plus a living area. The cost of installing RC over that range is not going to be cheap (no firm quotes though).

        Plus warm air blowing on your face just isn't as nice as radiant warmth.

        So I put RC further down my list.

      • 

        JimmyF on 21/03/2018 - 10:17

        @DeepDreamer:

        I'm muddying the water?

        Yes, remember saying

        but will sell it to me, at more than twice the price I can get it if I import it myself.

        The value of the goods is around $2000

        Anyhow, enjoy your pellet heater.

      • 

        mskeggs on 21/03/2018 - 11:49

        +2

        @DeepDreamer:
        I understand radiant heat is nice. I have had fireplace, gas hydronic, forced air and RC AC for heating and the hydronic was nicest for whole house heating (but costly). Consider though, RC AC unit/s in some rooms that get turned on only when needed with a wood burner and AC in the living area, versus running the whole pellet thing whenever you need heat.
        If you need the heat for a short time, like in the morning on weekdays, whole house systems are not ideal.
        I live in a colder place with gas forced air heating and I will be switching to AC for the running cost savings. In Canberra where it gets hot too I can't fathom why you wouldn't use AC. You could easily spend $2k p.a. more on running costs with the pellet stove.

        It seems like your mind is made up, but financially this isn't a good decision. I think you will be stunned at how much fuel you end up using. I see in the other thread you are thinking 4 hours per day running, but I would suggest 12 -16 hours per day is more likely in winter. Because of the thermal mass involved, it takes 30mins to get much of a result after it is turned on, so you need a timer or a thermostat.

        Just to give a comparison, my gas bill charges about 2.1c per MJ. Wood pellets supply about 18Mj/kg, or about 5.5c per MJ. An electric radiator is about 6.9c per Mj (at 25c kWh), and a RC AC with Coefficient of Power of 5x will be 1.4c. Consider I used 55000MJ in the 3 months of winter bill, with a thermostat set at 18 and heating usually off during the day and after 11pm to 6am.

      • 

        JimmyF on 21/03/2018 - 11:53

        @mskeggs:

        I think you will be stunned at how much fuel you end up using

        Agreed, they think 4hrs day usage in ACT over winter…. and will use under 1ton of fuel a year. Clearly is a dreamer for sure!

      • 

        DeepDreamer on 21/03/2018 - 21:39

        @mskeggs:

        Thanks, that's a great response. I'll rethink the whole RC thing. My show stopper for that was reports that they are just not effective for heating below about 4 degrees. But perhaps more research is required.

        I didn't think the coefficient of power was 5x, though - I thought it was about 3x.

      • 

        mskeggs on 21/03/2018 - 21:44

        @DeepDreamer:
        Some of the Daikin models reach a COP of 7! But 5 is pretty good. I think it is worse than that at lower temps as you suggest.
        The forum at http://www.ata.org.au/forums/ would have all the details!

• 

  KaTst3R on 20/03/2018 - 23:08

  How is the distributor blocking the deal? Are they asking the Chinese company to not sell you the item directly?

  Im actually surprised they will do this for individual purchases. It is not as though you are intending to bring in a large amount for reselling.

  • 

    DeepDreamer on 20/03/2018 - 23:14

    How is the distributor blocking the deal? Are they asking the Chinese company to not sell you the item directly?

    So it would appear. The product is for sale through Alibaba and listed on other China marketplaces. Nothing there about any restrictions.

  • 

    JimmyF on 20/03/2018 - 23:14

    I'm guessing they are not blocking it directly by saying they can't sell to this person, but its been blocked by a blanket agreement, that the agent is the only ones allowed to sell directly to people in Australia if people contact the OEM directly.

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  Oofy Doofy on 20/03/2018 - 23:22

  I did a search for 'Wood Pellet Boilers Australia' and a heap of places in Australia seem to be selling them. I learned something new though.

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  mskeggs on 21/03/2018 - 09:51

  +2

  In the USA they started selling these, and they were cheap to fuel as the pellets were made from wood waste. As more people start using them, all the waste is accounted for, and they need to make the pellets out of wood they need to buy, and the cost of fuel increases…

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  stirlo on 21/03/2018 - 14:50

  I think the issue will be getting the radiators and and spares once you've imported it. Obviously the distributor was annoyed enough to block the sale to you. Do you think they'll be happy to service it once you sneak it past them?

  • 

    DeepDreamer on 21/03/2018 - 21:40

    It's a good point, but I can buy a complete set of spares from the manufacturer as part of the same deal. There's still a risk though, granted.

• 

  stirlo on 21/03/2018 - 15:01

  +1

  Also with regards to importing products, be very careful with the costs to land it. Once somethings in a container FOB you can still expect $100's or $1000's of dutys, fumigation fees, unloading costs and customs charges. The whole system is setup to make it very unaffordable to ship just 1 item.

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  LlamaOfDoom on 04/05/2018 - 20:31

  You can fire them on wheat also, which can be significantly cheaper, as well as cheaper stuff again such as triticale, etc.
  It DOES require some fiddling to get them started however!