Someone Used My Credit Card to Pay Pass but The Card Is in My Wallet

Major Packer on 14/04/2018 - 12:50
Last edited 20/04/2018 - 14:05

Last Saturday, I found that my CBA credit card detail was compromised and someone been using my card to buy stuff. Immediately, I cancelled my card and dispute the transactions.

A few days later, CBA got back to me saying that 1 of the dispute was declined, the reason is that it is a PayPass transaction and because I didn't lose the card so they cannot approve the dispute. They believe it's impossible to PayPass without the card.

So I looked at the transaction again and I am 100% certain it's not me because:
- Transaction detail shows Coles Bulleen, I have never shopped there
- Purchase time shows 12.00AM, Coles Bulleen closed at 11PM
- I was at home sleep at the time (but I live alone and no one can prove this)
- I have my card with me all the time, I have never lend it to anyone

I went down to the branch and the branch helped lodging another dispute and said there is a chance I won't recover the money.

Any suggestions on what I should do next? Report to the police? Thanks

Update 1:
- I spoke to the bank today and they said this transaction can only be done via card, can't be the Android or Apple pay.
- They also told me that the purchase time is the time they received the transaction and therefore the transaction could occur offline then later being sent to the bank.
- I've reported it to the police.

Update 2:
- A customer resolution manager from the bank called today and after hearing my store he decided to refund all the money. He called because I opened too many transaction disputes and that grabbed their attention.

Financial Credit Card

Comments

  • follow on 14/04/2018 - 13:00
    +2

    report to the police. ask for footage at coles if you want to go further. they may say no

  • kerfuffle on 14/04/2018 - 13:03
    +4

    You can PayPass without the card. By adding it to Google Pay and using your phone to PayPass.

    • Major Packer on 14/04/2018 - 14:08

      This is very likely what happened. Once or twice I left my wallet on my office desk overnight. The theft may have scanned my card there. But why doesn't he/she just take the whole wallet?

      • kerfuffle on 14/04/2018 - 14:11
        +4

        Too obvious if they took your entire wallet. With Google Pay, the bank should be able to tell you what card number they used for the PayPass transaction or whether it was paid for with Google Pay or the CBA app or something

    • whooah1979 on 15/04/2018 - 09:25
      +1

      Google Pay

      google pay requires cvv. the user either gave the cvv to someone or failed to keep it secure.

      • kerfuffle on 15/04/2018 - 09:38

        True, but maybe they managed to extract that detail somehow? I was a victim of credit card fraud myself a few tears ago; someone went and spent $1299 on Officeworks online even though I physically had the card in my possession (and hadn't shared my credit card details with anyone)

        • Major Packer on 16/04/2018 - 20:45

          Did you recover the money?

        • kerfuffle on 16/04/2018 - 20:47

          @jsuen: Yep. It was something like $2K in purchases including Foodora and Vodafone as well

    • Major Packer on 16/04/2018 - 19:09
      +1

      Update:
      I spoke to the bank today and they said the transaction is a card contactless transaction and it can't be done using a smart phone

  • loulou1 on 14/04/2018 - 13:20

    Bulleen would have been on AEDST, so closing at 11PM is actually 12AM AEST i think.

    • JIMB0 on 14/04/2018 - 13:42

      Daylight savings has ended.

      • loulou1 on 14/04/2018 - 14:11

        ah ok

  • mbck on 14/04/2018 - 13:21
    +3

    was your other cards linked to google pay compromised? I wonder if it's your google account…

    • Major Packer on 14/04/2018 - 13:48

      I have never linked this card to Google Pay. I switched to iPhone back in Oct 2016 and the card was issued May 2017. I don't know if you can install Google Pay on an iPhone but I didn't.

      This card is not linked to Apple Pay either.

  • chumlee on 14/04/2018 - 13:35
    +1

    Do you sleep walk?

    • Major Packer on 14/04/2018 - 13:52

      Not that I know of.

      • [Deactivated] on 14/04/2018 - 14:02
        +8

        You do according to the CBA

        • MathNerd on 14/04/2018 - 17:28
          +1

          CommBank: "Yes, we CAN… Accuse you of using your card to PayPass at a Coles while asleep in bed. That's our motto for you."

  • No Username on 14/04/2018 - 14:02

    Has anyone bumped into you recently? Someone was probably using an NFC sniffer to get your code and clone it to an NFC card or transfer to a phone. To make transactions.

    • Major Packer on 14/04/2018 - 14:17
      +1

      No. But the NFC sniffer is quite possible

    • JIMB0 on 14/04/2018 - 16:46
      +2

      I don't think it works like that. These cards would be encrypted.

      • kerfuffle on 14/04/2018 - 16:47

        Then why do they sell those RFID blocking sleeves for cards and passports? ;)

        • JIMB0 on 14/04/2018 - 16:52
          +11

          Same reason why they have rocks that keep tigers away.

      • No Username on 14/04/2018 - 18:19

        It's possible and has happened before. With the right gear, you can successfully clone the necessary blocks and sectors. Another approach is by buying a used POS system on eBay and modifying the firmware and NFC antenna so that as long as your in the range you can capture the card.

  • kiwijunglist on 15/04/2018 - 09:00

    This is interesting. In NZ they advertise a lot about how your insured against this kind of thing.

    Is it worth sending the bank a link to this thread, to pass a long to their PR team.

    • [Deactivated] on 15/04/2018 - 11:13

      Pretty sure op is in Australia

    • Major Packer on 16/04/2018 - 20:58

      The bank keeps telling me that because I didn't lose the card so I might not be able to recover the money. It sounded to me like if I reported card lost, I would have got the money back already.

      • kerfuffle on 16/04/2018 - 21:06

        That’s bs. Your credit card details were somehow fraduently obtained.

        • Major Packer on 16/04/2018 - 21:15

          4 CBA stuff and 1 police officer I spoke to, they all believe it's impossible to duplicate a credit card and use it for contactless (PayPass) transaction. I wanted to believe it too but I just can't think of any reasonable explanation. Other than the crazy ones like sleepwalking, memory loss or someone stole my wallet and bring it back after doing shopping.
          And thanks for your input :)

  • Claudia89 on 15/04/2018 - 12:18
    +3

    If CBA rejects your dispute, I would also try talking with Coles Bulleen, Mastercard/Visa and if all else fails, the Financial Ombudsman Service.

    If you have any kind of location tracking apps, you may be able to pull your location at the time. I use Life360, which would show that I was at home asleep at that time. If you don't have any apps, you could try asking your mobile service provider for cell tower records, but no idea how much luck you'll have getting them to give you those.

    If you can get some kind of proof of your location, you could try asking Coles to explain and/or refund the money. There might have been something dodgy on their end or they might be sympathetic and return or credit the money to you out of goodwill.

    Mastercard/Visa both have zero liability policies: https://www.mastercard.com.au/en-au/about-mastercard/what-we… and https://www.visa.com.au/pay-with-visa/security/zero-liabilit…

    I'm not sure they'll cover you if you've left your wallet lying around for card details to be stolen, as that might not be "using reasonable care in protecting your card from loss or theft" but talk to the applicable company and see what they say.

    Otherwise, try FOS: https://www.fos.org.au/resolving-disputes/before-you-lodge-a…

    • whooah1979 on 15/04/2018 - 13:31

      I use Life360, which would show that I was at home asleep at that time.

      How can an app show that you were asleep at home?

      • kerfuffle on 15/04/2018 - 15:00
        +2

        Google Maps timeline can do the same thing if you have it enabled

      • Claudia89 on 15/04/2018 - 18:46

        There are apps which can monitor your sleep cycles, which I suppose combined with Life360 could show I was asleep and at home. But I don't think that was a genuine question :P

    • Major Packer on 15/04/2018 - 14:40

      Thank you, very good information

  • outlander on 15/04/2018 - 15:11
    +3

    Is coles bulleen far away from you? Might be worth taking a trip down there, and asking them to pull up the receipt. Then you can see what was purchased, which might give you a clue as to who it was

    If they reject your request because of something stupid like 'privacy reasons', don't make a scene just leave. Then, on another day say you want to return something and you lost the receipt, but you paid by credit card. They should be able to retrieve the transaction, and then you ask them to reprint the receipt. If they ask why, say something vague like 'tax purposes'

    • Major Packer on 16/04/2018 - 09:29

      Yeah, good idea. I am only 9km away from Bulleen.

    • Major Packer on 16/04/2018 - 19:13

      I called Coles Bulleen today and they said they have millions of transactions per day and it's impossible to find that transaction. And they told me to speak to the bank, let the bank speak to them.

      I have reported to the police..may consider going for your option 2 if nothing happens with the police.

      • outlander on 16/04/2018 - 19:16
        +1

        Yeah, thats usually the response you get from the lazy drones, but they definitely have the record, and they can definitely retrieve it. A million transactions means nothing. Do the second part. Go in person, claiming you want to return something but lost the receipt. They will be able to understand that

      • kerfuffle on 16/04/2018 - 20:42

        Your bank should be able to tell you what time the transaction took place. Armed with that, your credit card number and the date of said transaction, they ought to be able to look it up.

      • GeneralZod on 20/04/2018 - 21:15

        That is bullshit. It literally takes like a minute of their time, if they have the card number.
        Some people don’t have any compassion, hey!

      • realfancyman on 21/04/2018 - 20:31
        +1

        They have the option to search through those transactions using your card number, so it will be easy for them to see who used your card if you haven't destroyed your old card yet.

        • Major Packer on 23/04/2018 - 13:47

          Thanks for that, it's good to know and I still have my old card. Now since the bank has refunded my money and the police is investigating, so I will just leave it to them to deal with :)

  • paulinspace on 16/04/2018 - 11:34
    +1

    If you sign a stat dec then the bank will wear the liability. I have never heard the bank charging you back for fraud. Been then only time I have had to dispute is for online transactions where fraudsters can work out card numbers through trial and error.

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