Payment Fees for Rent

Bubbleshark on 16/05/2019 - 11:57
Last edited 22/05/2019 - 17:47 by 1 other user

Hi.

I live in Brisbane and lately my renting agent is asking me to pay through Bpay or simple pay. I am currently paying (for the last 2 years) through a direct bank transfer to one of their trustee account that they will close soon. Basically I am asking if anyone knows how to dodge the fee? The "best value" option is $1.65 per week … an extra $86 per year out of my pocket for the benefit of nothing!

I found some regulation in NSW but couldn't put my hands on anything in QLD.

I sent an email (they have yet to respond) saying that if they close the account and I'm unable to pay, I will keep the rent in an account and give them a payout once we find a viable option … the thing is I don't know if what I'm doing is legal.

Thanks for reading and helping!

EDIT:

Luckily for me the agent backed down and gave me a trustee account I could tranfer my rent into. By reading my renewal contract, I saw that they stuffed me when the clause 10.1 changed indicating "as per agent options" rather than "bank transfer, simple pay or money transfer". I unfortunately signed it without thinking much of it. If they were to be fussy, I don't think I could win and would have taken the monthly rent payment to limit the damages.

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Comments

  • Some Human on 16/05/2019 - 12:04
    +4

    Yeah I guess you could do that if you want to get kicked out and blacklisted.

    • Bubbleshark on 16/05/2019 - 12:37

      I asked the RTA and I think I won't use that move. Nonetheless I just don't feel like just paying and be racketed every time some (profanity) want to get some extra money.

  • spackbace on 16/05/2019 - 12:06
    +4

    How is there a charge for bpay?

    • Bubbleshark on 16/05/2019 - 12:09

      My bad Bpay wasn't an option:

      IMPORTANT: Effective 6th March 2019, our RENT payment system has changed. This will ultimately affect all tenants and eventually invoice payments will also transition to this new payment system.

      1. Bank Account Direct Debit $1.65 per transaction (best value)

      2. Recurring Visa/MasterCard Payments 1.98% (great way to earn Frequent Flyer points)

      3. Bank Cheque/Money Order

      PLEASE NOTE: The current payments options of “bank transfer, cash, EFT” will soon, NO LONGER be available as tenants transition to the new system.

      • spackbace on 16/05/2019 - 12:11
        +23

        Direct debit shouldn't have a charge that's crap

      • salmon123 on 16/05/2019 - 14:47
        +1

        Bank Cheque/Money Order

        It really annoys me when people ask for "Bank Cheque" for no apparent reason. If you're going to default on your rent, you simply wont bother sending a cheque, instead of trying to buy yourself a few extra days by bouncing a personal cheque.

      • [Deactivated] on 16/05/2019 - 21:31

        You can always pay in cash. There shouldn't be any fees with cash payments. It all depends on how much you value your time and how spiteful you're feeling.

        Edit: Looks like its been resolved.

    • brad1-8tsi on 16/05/2019 - 12:40

      That's what I was wondering.

  • mbck on 16/05/2019 - 12:22

    Wtf

  • toniyellow on 16/05/2019 - 12:25
    +1

    QLD is here https://www.legislation.qld.gov.au/view/pdf/inforce/current/… page 65, 66

    It says they have to offer 3 methods, and tell you what the costs associated with each are. It does not say there has to be a free way

    You could confirm with Tenants QLD https://tenantsqld.org.au/

    • Bubbleshark on 16/05/2019 - 12:33
      +1

      I just called the RTA and you are right, in QLD it doesn't state that there should be a free way as in NSW. I resigned my lease and I got stuffed as the agent mentioned "payment as agency options" and I thought nothing of it … then they hit me with this extra fee. I mean all in all, it's more about the way it's done than the actual amount to pay.

  • Quantumcat on 16/05/2019 - 12:31
    +6

    They're effectively increasing your rent, can't believe that's allowed

  • Bubbleshark on 16/05/2019 - 12:46
    +7
    That's what I wrote to my agent when she asked me to change my payment:

    As for now we were paying through a weekly transfer to the trustee account incurring no fees and would like to keep it this way. All the propositions previously presented to us were all surcharging our current rent (unless I failed to see a feeless option then please correct me). I think a previous email mentioned the “best value” equaling a surcharge of $1.65 per week, which will cost me a total of $85.80 per year for the extra benefit of nothing. For that amount, we can pay a 2 year VPN subscription, more than 8 months of Netflix or 15 Mc Chicken.

    We realize that it is not your doing so please escalate to the person in charge or we will meet you halfway, we will pay our rent amount of 350-1.65= $348.35 per week and then use the best value transfer option to pay.

    If the trustee account closes, I will retain the amount due of $350 in an account and cumulate it until a viable option is found and pay it all out once an agreement is reached. I agreed for my rent to be $350 and not $350+. Once again, we never missed a payment and paid our rent on time, We have no intention to make things difficult and would prefer an amiable resolution.

    Regards,

    The RTA is now telling me to get some legal advice … I'm torn between getting deeper in that nonsense or just pay it. I don't want to pay as I'm not some cow they can milk when they want some extra cash … but goddamn it sounds like I'll be up for long fight

    • Quantumcat on 16/05/2019 - 13:14
      +4

      Exciting stuff, can't wait to hear how they respond. This could be a good precedent for others who are facing the same issue

      • Bubbleshark on 16/05/2019 - 15:35
        +11
        That's the answer I got:

        Good Afternoon,

        Hope all is well.

        My accounts team have advised I am okay to give out the trust account details please find details below;

        I found this piece of article:
        https://www.rta.qld.gov.au/Forms-and-publications/Fact-sheet…

        A lessor/agent may request a change to the method of rent payment during an existing tenancy, but the tenant has to agree in writing to the change. If they don’t agree, the current payment method will continue.

        I suppose they didn't find it worth fighting! (and I'm glad they didn't)

    • ThithLord on 16/05/2019 - 14:45

      Good luck - stick it to 'em, mate. I am so sure I read that there has to be a method of payment with no additional cost (for QLD) - so I hope someone can locate this bit of law.

  • jjjaar on 16/05/2019 - 14:05
    +8

    If nothing else works, demand to move to monthly payments so you will only have 12 payment fees a year, not 52…

  • bobbified on 16/05/2019 - 14:07
    +4

    Bank Account Direct Debit $1.65 per transaction

    Is it normal to pay rent weekly? If you can pay rent monthly (I always thought that was the default frequency), it doesn't completely eliminate the fee, but you'll be paying it 12 times instead of 52 times.

    • ThithLord on 16/05/2019 - 14:45

      Every lease I've seen you can choose from weekly, fortnightly or monthly.

      • salmon123 on 16/05/2019 - 14:54

        Note that rent is always paid in advance, so changing the frequency of your payments can affect your cash flow.

      • bobbified on 16/05/2019 - 15:39

        Could it be a state thing?

        Every lease I've seen (Vic) has required 4-6 weeks bond and the first month's rent at the time of picking up the keys.

        • salmon123 on 16/05/2019 - 15:48
          -1

          Could it be a state thing?

          Yes - In NSW, the maximum bond is 4 weeks. The rent payment frequency can be negotiated (weekly/fortnightly/monthly).

          • gyrex on 17/05/2019 - 08:22
            -1

            @salmon123: The maximum 4 week bond clause only applies to residential leases and doesn't apply for commercial leases. For instance, we require a 6 month security bond for our commercial tenants/leases.

            • salmon123 on 17/05/2019 - 08:32

              @gyrex: Thanks Sherlock. I think it's safe to assume we're discussing residential leases here and not commercial, agricultural, leasehold land or any other type of lease.

  • zathras on 16/05/2019 - 14:18
    +4

    Ask them for the bank account details of their new account that they have setup for the direct debit option, so you can authorise the new transaction with your bank.
    Then just setup your own recurring direct credit transaction to their new account from your account.

    They will get the money, and you won't have to pay the fee. Don't give them your bank details and pay their fees.

    • salmon123 on 16/05/2019 - 14:51

      Then just setup your own recurring direct credit transaction to their new account from your account.

      I'm guessing this will cause problems with their accounting system and matching payments to properties/accounts. Further, the direct debit is probably managed by a 3rd party, so they agent might not have those details.

  • kolorijo on 16/05/2019 - 14:32
    +3

    I learn something new everyday. New way to f us up.

  • salmon123 on 16/05/2019 - 14:56

    Another approach would be to ask for the landlords' account details and pay directly into that. The agent can then direct debit the landlords account for their fees and 1.65 fee!

    It's pretty unlikely they'll go for it, but in a declining property market, you might rattle the owner enough to make them cover the fee.

  • Bubbleshark on 16/05/2019 - 15:41
    +11

    End of the story:

    They gave me a new trustee account I could transfer into. I didn't nothing else toward them else than sending the email being sarcastic about the 15 Mc Chicken. I tried to cover my bases in case of a negative answer but it all worked out. Thank you for everyone helping out!

    If anyone has the same issue, I would suggest to engage the RTA first (https://www.rta.qld.gov.au/Contact) and get some community legal service to help out (apparently free).

    Here some piece to read:
    https://www.rta.qld.gov.au/Forms-and-publications/Fact-sheet…
    https://www.legislation.nsw.gov.au/#/view/act/2010/42/part3/…

  • Almost Banned on 16/05/2019 - 15:45
    +2

    Doesn't this raise a component pricing issue?
    If there is no way to avoid the fee - then it should be disclosed in the price - in this case rent.

    • Bubbleshark on 16/05/2019 - 15:54
      +3

      Funny thing is that when I signed the entry lease in 2016, the clause for the payment was different but was still with fees and an option for cash payment (they took out cash payment in my renewal). I told them that I refused to pay a fee so they gave me a trustee account, in a clause of my contract I had the choice of paying by cash … I told them straight I'd go every week if necessary to pay my rent and make it difficult for them to process. 3 years later the agency got absorbed by another entity and tried again on squeezing me out …

      If this is the norm, imagine the ridiculous amount of money they would sit on without lifting a single finger.

    • salmon123 on 16/05/2019 - 16:04

      Doesn't this raise a component pricing issue?

      When's the last time the ACCC prosecuted anyone for component pricing? ACCC is usless.

      There's also an interesting quirk in the component pricing rules - basically a vendor can get away with component pricing, when a fee applies to an entire order (instead of an individual item in an order), making it difficult to know how much the total will come to when they display a price. This is how ticketek/ticketmaster get around it.

      I'm guessing that the real-estate agent could make a similar argument, because the $1.65 is flat fee and they wouldn't know the total until you negotiate a payment frequency.

      • Quantumcat on 16/05/2019 - 16:37

        When's the last time the ACCC prosecuted anyone for component pricing? ACCC is usless.

        Webjet?

        I'm guessing that the real-estate agent could make a similar argument, because the $1.65 is flat fee and they wouldn't know the total until you negotiate a payment frequency.

        That's true —- hopefully the ACCC could tell them they just have to give a discount for paying more in advance, like insurance give you a discount for paying for the whole year instead of monthly.

        • salmon123 on 16/05/2019 - 17:20

          Webjet?

          Link?

          I can see a couple of references to jetstar/virgin being fined relating to offenses in 2013/2014, but nothing concrete about webjet. The fines that jetstar/virgin paid are so pantry that it seems like component pricing fines are just a cost doing business for them.

          • Quantumcat on 16/05/2019 - 18:27
            +1

            @salmon123: Oops, I thought it was Webjet but maybe it was the individual airlines as you said

  • JimB on 16/05/2019 - 17:04

    Bank Account Direct Debit $1.65 per transaction

    If you pay monthly it's less than $20 p.a.

    • Bubbleshark on 16/05/2019 - 17:13

      That's what I would have done if I had exhausted all the possible solution. My problem is mainly that I had to pay for a service that would only benefit the renting agency, giving me zero benefice, paying to make someone's else life easier …

    • salmon123 on 16/05/2019 - 17:44

      If you pay monthly it's less than $20 p.a.

      Say your rent is $400/week and you can get 2.8% interest in your savings account. Paying weekly-in-advance vs paying monthly-in-advance is going to cost you ~$6/month in interest.

      You should ask for a discount if you're paying monthly in advance.

  • gork on 22/05/2019 - 12:12

    I would ask them to reduce the weekly rent by $1.65/week.

  • sunnyc on 22/05/2019 - 17:27

    I won't use that software as a home owner, lots of software like this to rip off tenant. They need more than 1 method of paying.

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