Petrol V's Electric Vehicle Cost Comparison Spreadsheet

pegaxs on 28/09/2019 - 16:35
Last edited 28/09/2019 - 22:19

Been working on updating my ICE vs EV cost spreadsheet that I used a while ago. It was super messy and kinda broken but worked for what I wanted it to do for me at the time.

With another thread on here that was asking and contemplating spending 3x their budget on an EV version of what they were after, it got me to working on cleaning up my spreadsheet. It is by no means accurate, as it does not allow for a lot of variables, but it should give a rough estimate on how long it would take for the EV to at least break even in terms of more expensive purchase price vs cheaper running costs.

Here is an example of the Hyundai Kona Elite v's Kona Elite Electric

Spreadsheet is on Dropbox if you wanted to enter your own vehicle details yourself. Petrol Vs Electric Cost Comparison.xlsx

EDIT: (28/9 @ 22:20) Have played with the sheet and added depreciation into the mix. Links have been revised above.

This sheet will still work, even if you want to do a comparison between two EV's or two ICE vehicles.

I am by no means an expert Excel spreadsheet master, so any comments or suggestions (that are constructive) or features anyone would like to see added, let me know. (Or if anyone knows how I could turn it into a web page and host it somewhere, that would be super cool!) And yes, I know, it's probably full of spelling errors…

Fields that can be edited:
Make
Model
Price
Consumption (l/100 and/or kWh/100)
Average yearly km
Average fuel price (petrol/diesel/electricity)
Servicing costs (Yes, EV's still need servicing)

Automotive Fuel

Comments

  • oscargamer on 28/09/2019 - 18:11
    -8

    Very nice effort, BUT (and this is a very big BUT - think J Lo or similar) you haven't included depreciation (as you say) but this is the single biggest cost of ownership of a car.

    9.5/10 for effort.
    0.5/10 for actual usability.

    • brendanm on 28/09/2019 - 18:27
      +4

      Depreciation should be similar for both, percentage wise.

      • oscargamer on 28/09/2019 - 19:15
        +13

        Agreed. But 50% depreciation of $60k car vs. 50% of $35k car is a significant difference and isn't reflected in the spreadsheet.

        To me, $12500 (in the above example) is a lot of money and if you are trying to compare apples with apples, then a guestimate of depreciation should be in the calcs.

        Keep negging people. Can't see why though.

        • brendanm on 28/09/2019 - 19:56
          +4

          I didn't neg you mate.

          • Kangal on 29/09/2019 - 07:56
            -5

            @brendanm: …said the negger.

            In all fairness, depreciation shouldn't rely on a Percentage. And even if there was a shared percentage drop in value, they would be similar among ICE, and EV, but not together. Anytime they happen together would be a coincidence. Why?

            Just think about EV's. They will have the largest depreciation because after a decent time, say 5-10 years (or more) the battery pack will begin to wear-down and fail. And that will result in three things: decreased performance, decreased range, and expensive rebuild. That's in contrast to ICE. These have much smaller drops in performance, and little drop in range after many years. And while a big service will be required, it won't mean an expensive swap.

            So in general, EV's should depreciate much quicker. The only reason I can see affecting these is cheaper electricity, government assistance, and external "cool factor". But I feel like EVs would be built with luxury options anyway, so depreciation would increase, combating these other factors.

            • MrBear on 29/09/2019 - 11:20
              +2

              @Kangal:

              depreciation shouldn't rely on a Percentage

              It doesn't. It depreciates based on what the market will pay for it 2nd hand.

              the battery pack will begin to wear-down and fail

              You mean engines, transmissions, etc don't begin to wear down and fail? What you haven't taken into consideration is that petrol/diesel engines have many more (moving) parts than an electric vehicle, all of which need servicing or replacing more regularly, which in turn increases the cost over the long term.

              • Kangal on 29/09/2019 - 11:30
                +1

                @MrBear: That neg wasn't nice, since the first sentence was clearly a joke. But who cares.

                The wear down on engine, transmission, parts is going to be less than the wear on the battery. I mean this as a financial perspective.

                Most used cars are still "good" but might have decreased slightly in performance, efficiency, and range. The same is not true for EVs at least not for the next decade.

                When battery technology evolves and we have much denser packs AND at lower prices, could the depreciation come in-line with ICE cars. It would require a lot more advancement in battery technology for Used EVs to become better than Used ICE cars, when it comes to utility and price.

                • MrBear on 30/09/2019 - 08:57
                  -1

                  @Kangal: I didn't neg you. Not everyone who replies to you, negs you. Maybe they should?

                  And you're opinion is incorrect. Here is some documentation: https://avt.inl.gov/sites/default/files/pdf/fsev/compare.pdf

                  • Kangal on 30/09/2019 - 22:15
                    -1

                    @MrBear: You disproved my "facts" with a documentation.
                    I read the whole link. It doesn't actually disprove that EVs depreciate worse than ICEs. It's only about driving cost, which is duh, electricity versus gasoline. So its not really helping your stance. On top of that, it doesn't provide any source to scrutinise the data. So we can't be sure anything from that is trustable (peer-review?). And the cherry on top, is that this "report" isn't really a report and is written by an Advocacy Group for EVs, so there's a conflict of interest.

                    The point still stands, that EVs depreciate much more than ICE vehicles. One of the reasons for this is because they require a higher upfront cost, and that generally causes larger drops in vehicle depreciation. The other reason is that Lithium Batteries degrade over time, which affects performance, efficiency, and range… and to service/exchange this single part is the most expensive part of the vehicle. An analogy of this for ICE cars, would be a used car getting sold with a blown engine, and its not actually legal in Australia (no roadworthy) unless you buy it for parts. So we're not even in the same ballpark when comparing old/used EVs and ICEs. And even in such comparison, most used ICEs will be in decent mechanical condition (ie Not Blown Engine) but almost all used EVs after a certain period will have a degraded battery. Of course, this is all in its infancy since there's really only one car in the Used EV market (Tesla Model S) and its actually more confined to one market: Mainland USA (excl. Alaska, Hawaii, Puerto Rico, etc etc). After 1-2 decades we will get a clearer idea on the topic, but I have a hunch that battery technology will not improve that much, that soon, and get that much cheaper, thus proving my prediction.

                    PS: That's alright, I don't care much for the votes.
                    Sometimes I say something which might not be entirely factual, so I welcome the negs or criticism (it's how I improve). Other times I stick to the culture here, and make some Dad Jokes, naturally, some people don't like it and neg or respond to it with disdain.

        • gimme on 29/09/2019 - 11:12
          +2

          Didn't neg but fyi you could have said add depreciation rather than making a lame 'but' joke and putting the OP down with your equally lame and unnecessary score.

          • oscargamer on 29/09/2019 - 11:39
            -2

            @gimme: Everyone is so precious these days.

            Snowflakes.

            OP didn't seem that bothered.

            • gimme on 29/09/2019 - 12:33
              +1

              @oscargamer: On the flipside the internet brings out the kboard warriors. If you behave the same way in real life, things would generally get very unpleasant very quickly.

              • oscargamer on 29/09/2019 - 12:34

                @gimme: I'm an ex-pommie. A northerner. We tend to call a spade a spade. If someone doesn't like that, then they don't like that.

                • gimme on 29/09/2019 - 12:38

                  @oscargamer: Also I disagree with your 0.5 assessment if the only thing missing is depreciation, so you clearly intended to be a dick to make a passive aggressive point.
                  You're really calling a spade a tractor.
                  Anyway I didn't neg you just pointing out why you may have been. I'm sure you experience it in real life assuming you behave the same way

                  • oscargamer on 29/09/2019 - 12:42
                    -2

                    @gimme: That's nice. But when the biggest cost of a car is the depreciation, and that's missing from a cost of ownership analysis, then it's a very significant omission.

                    I wouldn't have given a 0.5 if depreciation was included but servicing costs were excluded.

                    Who cares what I think? I'm just one bloke, that's expressing their opinion. If you don't like my opinion, ignore it, but don't get all offended when I point out that there is a significant gap in the piece of work, that if left unchallenged, some other poor schmuck might take as gospel.

            • MrBear on 30/09/2019 - 08:58

              @oscargamer:

              Everyone is so precious these days.

              And you are complaining about people negging you? Snowflake.

              • oscargamer on 30/09/2019 - 09:19
                +1

                @MrBear: Where am I complaining? You're getting your posters mixed up…..

                I actually invited more negs…..

                • MrBear on 02/10/2019 - 09:12

                  @oscargamer: With a passive aggressive "Keep negging people.", keep telling yourself that…

        • burningrage on 01/10/2019 - 11:05

          I don't know why you are being neg-ged so I'll attempt to neutralize.

    • pegaxs on 28/09/2019 - 18:34
      +3

      It's almost impossible, because every car is an unknown. It could be super popular and have great resale, or be a complete shitbox and be worth nothing.

      The only way I could do it is to add in an "average" depreciation value (otherwise it gets too confusing)

      But I agree. If, say after 5 years, A vehicle is worth 60% of its original value, then "vehicle A" at a cost of $30,000 has lost $12,000 in value, where as the same applied to "vehicle B" at $60,000 would see its value down by $24,000 in that same time…

      The reason it wasn't added here was because a: it's not that easy to compensate for it. b: I'm a mechanic, not a finance expert. c: I cant find any definitive "average" depreciation for cars in Australia. Every site I search has different ideas on what it should be.

      But I am trying to get something like that added.

      Maybe I could add a "how many years you think you will own it" and work out how much it will have paid for itself in that time.

      • oscargamer on 28/09/2019 - 19:18
        -1

        I agree. You have put in a disclaimer saying depreciation isn't included, so why not put in a disclaimer / assumption of depreciation of say …
        year 1 - 25%
        year 2 - 40%
        year 3 - 50%
        year 4 - 60%
        etc…etc…

        • pegaxs on 28/09/2019 - 19:35

          assumption of depreciation

          Because, that's all it is. An assumption.

          I didn't want to get too bogged down in depreciation because I wanted the calc to show how long you would have to own one vehicle or the other to pay for its difference in price if you were going to own it until it was worth $0 (ie: forever)

          Once the price comes down on EV's to about the same as an ICE equivalent, depreciation is going to level out. Once the price is a only in the low thousands, depreciation becomes neglible and not worth the programming required to make it work. But I'll work on something. Even if it's for nothing more than fluffing about in Excel.

          Most sites I have researched about vehicle depreciation in Australia come in at about 13~15%/year for the first 3 years and 8~10% per year there after.

          • spackbace on 28/09/2019 - 19:37

            @pegaxs: Toyota has future values on the website, though those are trade-in figures, not retail

            Hard to gauge EV resale values as they haven't been on the market long enough. If they have a sharper curve it could throw everything else off.

            If we considered them to have equal depreciation, then they don't affect the calculations to determine which is better

            • oscargamer on 28/09/2019 - 19:43
              -5

              @spackbace: You probably want to go back and redo year 10 maths.

              Depreciation (as stated above) is suggested to be a percentage of cost, not an actual amount per year.

              • spackbace on 28/09/2019 - 19:47
                +1

                @oscargamer: Which will be a number completely plucked out of thin air without any proof.

                I dunno about you but I prefer actual real world data to use to compute statements, not meaningless bullshit.

                Oh… Wait you're stealership guy. Ok you prefer random bullshit 😉

                • oscargamer on 28/09/2019 - 19:48

                  @spackbace: Time to go to sleep bloke. That beer is taking it's toll on you.

                  oscargamer on 28/09/2019 - 19:48 (Collapsed - Offtopic. Show)
                  • spackbace on 28/09/2019 - 19:49

                    @oscargamer: Umm… Right. It's 6pm here and I'm sober as a judge.

                    Dunno wtf you're on though!

                    spackbace on 28/09/2019 - 19:49 (Collapsed - Offtopic. Show)
        • spackbace on 28/09/2019 - 19:39

          You'd have to be damn unlucky to have 50% resale in 3 years.

          Or have really bad taste in cars 😂

          • oscargamer on 28/09/2019 - 19:41

            @spackbace: Or have a stealership that runs true to form….. ;o)

            Know any ?

            oscargamer on 28/09/2019 - 19:41 (Collapsed - Offtopic. Show)
            • spackbace on 28/09/2019 - 19:45
              +4

              @oscargamer: I hear most Jeeps suffer resale like that

              • oscargamer on 28/09/2019 - 19:47
                -2

                @spackbace: What's funny, is that if you actually read the post you are referring to, I was happy with both my purchase and trade in values on that POS. Wife loved the car and that's all that mattered at that time. Had a great VW turbo diesel engine (yes that 2L TDi) and manual gearbox.

                • spackbace on 28/09/2019 - 19:48
                  +2

                  @oscargamer: Naive people are normally the happiest. It's ok, I've seen it often, I used to sell Captivas and Cruzes too. Some people are happy in their own ignorance

                  • oscargamer on 28/09/2019 - 19:49
                    -3

                    @spackbace: I am truly bored of you. You are a salesman, nothing more. Boring boring boring.

                    • spackbace on 28/09/2019 - 19:50
                      +6

                      @oscargamer: sigh

                      Sometimes arguing/debating can be fun when done with someone who can match your wit and intellect, other times its with oscargamer

    • HardlyCharly on 30/09/2019 - 01:31
      -2

      Depreciation doesn't matter, and it isn't a cost as you aren't paying for it, you are paying for the vehicle in it's current condition and value at the time of purchase. That money has absolutely nothing to do with you ever selling it or what you sell it for.

    • burningrage on 01/10/2019 - 11:22

      I own a Plug In Hybrid vehicle and Kangal is telling the truth as that is my experience. EV/Hybrid PHEV cars do depreciate quicker.

      As a side topic, you have a good chance of recovering your cost premium (eg the extra cost of an Outlander PHEV vs ordinary Outlander which is about $15k as an example) would be somewhere between 3 (vs V6-V8 cars) to 5-7 years (for V4 or lower).

      But if you get an Outlander PHEV now which can be had for about $30k or less, then the whole car could pay itself after 6 - 7 years (vs V6-V8 cars) or up to 10 years (for V4 of lower).

      Done the calc long before buying my plug in hybrid.

  • Ivegottadog on 28/09/2019 - 19:00

    This is great, have been looking for something similar.

    I’ll change electricity cost to reflect my feed in tariff.

    If looking for improvement opportunity, I’d include the annual cash flows so can discount with inflation/interest rate to calculate net present value (sum of discounted cash flows).

    Thanks for putting this up

  • Bid Sniper on 28/09/2019 - 19:18
    +4

    You forgot the most important running cost - Insurance!

    People here for Model 3 are getting $5Kpa quotes. More expensive the car the higher the insurance premium. Any saving on petrol is wiped out by insurance and then some.

    • pegaxs on 28/09/2019 - 19:22

      You can always add that to the "service" costs for now. But it's a good idea to add a line for "other costs" to incorporate things like the difference in insurance or to make allowance for something that is particular to those types of vehicles.

      • Bid Sniper on 28/09/2019 - 19:37
        +6

        I think need a line for insurance, its pretty important and a significant cost no one talks about when it comes to ownership of EV.

        People love WRX but the insurance costs are a deal breaker so they buy other cars. I run a daily beater just to keep my premium down.

        People sign up for Teslas, a $100K car then apply for insurance, the get a rude shock when its $6K premium unlike their junker Camry. Any savings for petrol and serving is out the window.

        Also the interest on a loan for a significantly more expensive car.

        Then % depreciation of a more expensive car, 40% loss in 4 years is reasonable.

        This not just a EV thing, its a more expensive car thing, regardless if ICE or EV.

        • pegaxs on 28/09/2019 - 19:45
          +1

          I'm really trying to keep it as simple as I can. I don't want it to become a defacto budget, (but that is giving me ideas for V2.0, where that's exactly what it could end up being.) but more of a quick/dirty reference for economy vs price.

          Or, maybe I could rejig this sheet as a budget for new car consideration between any two cars. Then people could add all the info about the cars they are looking at, Rego, CTP, insurance, fuel economy, servicing costs and whatever else we can think of that people want to compare "spend wise" on new cars and it will give a rough overview on ownership for what they want to compare.

          • Bid Sniper on 28/09/2019 - 19:54

            @pegaxs: yeah leave it for 2.0

            I think the other figure is same regardless of car of additional losses so that can be crossed out. so 40% loss of price ($X) + Interest on ($X) loan that simply scales with price.

            Insurance will be variable but would like to see what people pay. my STI I'm paying under $1.5K, thats through Shannons with 65% NCB, clean record, stored in a garage, value of $50K. So a car thats twice that and more expensive to repair would be bit more.

            I think Tesla will be starting their own insurance program to counter some of the insane premiums some owners in US are getting.

        • LukeOliver on 29/09/2019 - 07:58
          +7

          Model 3P owner here.
          Good driving record.
          AAMI ~$1,250pa, vs ~$1,100 for the $7K junker BMW it replaced.

        • Itburns on 29/09/2019 - 08:11
          +6

          This is simply not true. Current quotes for a Model 3 are in the range 1 - 1.5$K pa I paid $1.3K for mine with 2 yrs full replacement & unlimited hire car.

          I don't know of anyone paying anywhere near $6K - some insurance companies are quoting high bcoz they don't know the car but that is not the situation for most.

          • Bid Sniper on 29/09/2019 - 09:07
            +2

            @Itburns: Stand corrected !

            Im really suprised people here getting that low premium on such a expensive car.

            Theoretically it should be low due to advanced safety features.

    • [Deactivated] on 28/09/2019 - 19:44
      +3

      People on TMC are paying ~ $1500 on Model 3s.

      • Bid Sniper on 28/09/2019 - 19:55

        in Sydney or OS? Daily driver?

        • [Deactivated] on 28/09/2019 - 20:57

          Yes, many.

      • Architectonic on 29/09/2019 - 17:05

        It's not just about the insurance premium though, but the runaround you get when you actually need your car repaired. Teslas are a PITA for anything more than just a bit of paint.

  • [Deactivated] on 28/09/2019 - 19:46

    Interesting comparisons:

    Tesla Model 3 SR+ Vs BMW 330i

    Tesla Model S LR Vs Mercedes E43

    Tesla Model S Performance Vs Mercedes E63S

    • spackbace on 28/09/2019 - 19:52

      Elaborate…? 🙂

      • [Deactivated] on 28/09/2019 - 20:58

        These are the cars people will cross shop. The EV will (I assume) be a lot cheaper to run. No one actually cross shops a Kona and an EV Kona.

        • pegaxs on 28/09/2019 - 21:12

          But in the $65k~$70k bracket, no one cross shops a Kona Electric with a BMW 2 series either… For my example in the post, it's more likely that someone considering a small SUV may compare other small SUV's. At least this way, the sheet shows you that it just isnt worth it to go that extra $30k for the electric.

          Now, in the future when Kona ICE is $35k and electric is $39k, it may be worth a second look… (the ROI there is about 3.5 years…)

          • [Deactivated] on 28/09/2019 - 21:47

            @pegaxs: That’s why I gave those more apt examples above, which are cars people actually cross shop. I’d suggest you run the numbers.

    • brad1-8tsi on 30/09/2019 - 09:41

      I know 3x recent Tesla purchasers.

      A mate just bought a model 3 it replaced a BMW 335

      Also has a 2014 Mazda CX5 and a 2018 Golf (can't remember which drivetrain) in the garage. Golf was bought last year as an interim car after the BMW lease ran out. BMW had been "problematic".

      My neighbour just got a Model X. It replaced a 2015 Ford Focus. They just had their first child so needed a "family car" /rolls eyes…

      Another mate got a Model 3. I think he also had a Focus and races a road registered Clio. (Haven't seen him for ages, just saw the photo on FB).

      • [Deactivated] on 30/09/2019 - 09:48
        +3

        Cool story bro

        • brad1-8tsi on 30/09/2019 - 09:51

          It shows what people are replacing or cross-shopping

          • [Deactivated] on 30/09/2019 - 10:34
            +1

            @brad1-8tsi: Cross shopping is not the same as replacing. Cross shopping is based on the budget for the new car, not the piece of shit you used to drive.

  • t_c on 29/09/2019 - 07:31

    I got a bad feeling $2 a litre is 4 years away

    https://tradingeconomics.com/australia/gasoline-prices

    • trongy on 30/09/2019 - 08:48

      The great thing about a spreadsheet is that you can enter your assumed petrol price in and see what difference it makes to the bottom line. What are your feelings about future electricity prices? Often when the price of one commodity rises, market forces tend to increase the price of alternative commodities, but not always to the same extent.

      Note that the site you linked is predicting lower prices in the future:

      In the long-term, the Australia Gasoline Prices is projected to trend around 0.84 USD/Liter in 2020, according to our econometric models

    • maxwellian on 18/11/2021 - 00:06

      Reading this 2 years later and fuel is $2 a litre!

  • buderim11 on 29/09/2019 - 08:03
    +3

    I think at this stage Hybrids make a lot more sense than EV , a plug in Hybrid with 60km electric range would be a good solution for a lot of owners.

    • pegaxs on 29/09/2019 - 08:38

      At this point, I think you are spot on. A plug-in Hybrid makes way more sense. Most people use their car as a work commuter and shopping trolly, so a battery that does this part of the job regularly and a dinosaur oil burning engine for when they have to go anywhere outside their usual work/shop round trip.

      • dealsucker on 29/09/2019 - 10:19
        +2

        The problem with plug in hybrids is that they arent as efficient as a pure electric vehicle and neither a pure gasoline vehicle. The other extremely important metric is the battery degradation which since they are not designed as a pure EV is always a factor. I was in the market for a Outlander PHEV but there are far too many battery degradation stories which scared me off.

        • burningrage on 01/10/2019 - 11:25
          +1

          The battery does degrade quicker and at one point Mitsubishi had a guarantee of 80% charge within 5 years and they failed that. I got a new battery and now 9 months down the track, it has lost 10% (at 90%).

          This is why from now on when I buy a new EV or PHEV, I ask them to give battery guarantee in writing and only Tesla was willing to do that (90% within 5 years)

    • [Deactivated] on 29/09/2019 - 18:50

      If you’re talking about a budget car, for sure, but a pure premium EV is a much better car than a petrol car that is price equivalent. The Model 3 is much better than a 3 series, the Model S is much better than a CLS or E class.

    • burningrage on 01/10/2019 - 11:23

      Agree. In 2021-2022, the next gen Outlander PHEV will come with 100km range.

  • dealsucker on 29/09/2019 - 10:25
    +1

    I think the comparison is not as easy as it seems. I will take the example of a Tesla Model 3, which even in its cheapest form does a 0-100 sprint in around 5.6 seconds. The Model 3 Performance in comparison does the same sprint in a scant 3.4 seconds. If you are in the market for a sedan with the same kind of performance, you are looking at much higher fuel costs, maintenance/service costs and much higher depreciation. For someone like me who does not use his car everyday, I can charge my car during the weekdays off the solar (with a feed in tariff of around 12 cents per kwh) and basically spend nothing on fuel while I drive during the weekend.

    • spackbace on 29/09/2019 - 10:44
      +1

      How often can you do 0-100 in record times tho? Let's be honest, it's a nice figure to say but doesn't mean much unless you're gonna take the car down the 1/4 or round a track.

      • dealsucker on 29/09/2019 - 10:55

        Agreed but you cannot ignore it either. Kona electric costs almost the same the base Model 3 but neither has the performance or the technology or the supercharger network. For someone who is in the market for a performance sedan, the Model 3 Performance is an absolute bargain just on purchase price alone. Factor in the costs of running which is less than what you would spend running a Corolla and literally no maintenance, its hard not to be impressed. I am saving for a Model 3 Performance.

        • whooah1979 on 29/09/2019 - 11:34
          +3

          A model 3 is predicted to cost $66k. A 2019 Corolla hybrid is around $33k. The savings from buying a Corolla hybrid may used to run it for 15 to 20 years.

          • dealsucker on 29/09/2019 - 11:41

            @whooah1979: And how is a Corolla comparable to a Model 3? How about a Honda Civic Type R which has almost the same performance but is smaller.

            • whooah1979 on 29/09/2019 - 11:47
              +1

              @dealsucker: They don’t compare. One is the new kid on the block and the other one have decades of proven reliability.

              • dealsucker on 29/09/2019 - 12:13

                @whooah1979: Toyota is not even the new kid on the block. They do not sell a Pure EV yet. Their decades of "proven reliability" does not matter. An ICE engine running on petrol with engine oil, filters of all kinds vs an electric motor, I will bet on electric motor anywhich day.

                • spackbace on 29/09/2019 - 12:15

                  @dealsucker: Toyota have already been building pure EV, as well as hydrogen powered etc. The difference is that pure EV isn't financially viable right now. Just look at the Kona pricing differences as a reflection of that.

                  Hybrid is for now and is mainstream now, but even they acknowledge its not for the future, but it's a step in the right direction.

                  Good on the early adopters for EV to make it more mainstream, but there's no doubt that the technology they use will be old hat in the near future. Resale of the first EVs will plummet as a result.

                • whooah1979 on 29/09/2019 - 12:44

                  @dealsucker: Reliability takes time to perfect which is something the Corolla have had plenty of.

                  The Tesla have to work on their model 3 reliability seeing that their ratings have started to drop.
                  https://www.cnbc.com/2019/02/21/tesla-tanks-subaru-soars-in-…

          • Stimps on 29/09/2019 - 11:53
            +2

            @whooah1979: A Corolla hybrid is $33k. A Mitsubishi Mirage is $15k. The savings from buying the Mitsubishi Mirage may be used to run it for 15 to 20 years.

            • whooah1979 on 29/09/2019 - 11:59
              -1

              @Stimps: Of course. The TCO of an ICE in Australia will always be cheaper than an EV.

          • [Deactivated] on 29/09/2019 - 18:53

            @whooah1979: Hey a Porsche 918 Hybrid costs $2m second hand, and a Prius C costs $20k. It will take you 2000 years to make up the difference.

          • [Deactivated] on 30/09/2019 - 09:48

            @whooah1979: What do you mean predicted? It’s been on sale for months, deliveries started here a few weeks ago. And your comparison is ridiculous. No one cross shops a corolla and a Model 3.

            • whooah1979 on 30/09/2019 - 22:05

              @[Deactivated]: There are only a handful of EV in Australia. The Model 3 is Tesla's cheapest passenger vehicle.

              • [Deactivated] on 30/09/2019 - 23:30
                +1

                @whooah1979: People cross shop Model 3 with BMW 3 series and Mercedes C class. That is the market.

                • whooah1979 on 01/10/2019 - 06:20
                  -1

                  @[Deactivated]: Fuel conscious drivers compare fuel efficient vehicles. It is not unreasonable for them to compare EV with hybrids.

                  • dealsucker on 01/10/2019 - 10:59

                    @whooah1979: Thats the thing with EV's. You can have all the performance and have it fuel efficient too.

      • OzzyOzbourne on 29/09/2019 - 14:07

        Nearly every on ramp in west Melbourne has 3-4 lanes going into 1 with traffic lights, useful for when the tard-in-a-ute next to you decides to nail it just as you are merging

    • whooah1979 on 29/09/2019 - 11:25
      -3

      Only hoons care about 0-100 sprints.

      • dealsucker on 29/09/2019 - 11:28
        +4

        Only hoons think that people who care about performance are hoons.

  • hadronox on 29/09/2019 - 12:32
    +1

    This is really good thanks OP. Very helpful

  • Gaz1 on 29/09/2019 - 15:09
    +1

    Great effort in creating this spreadsheet.
    Whilst there are obviously lots of variables & differences in some peoples expenses it gives a really interesting comparison.

  • Architectonic on 29/09/2019 - 17:07
    +5

    The most cost effective option is to sell your car and ride a bicycle for your commute (works especially well if you currently have a 2+ car household). Next best option is to simply keep your current car and ride a bike. If you need to ride long distance, just get an ebike!

  • Hirolol on 29/09/2019 - 19:23

    Can someone do some calculations and throw some up?
    I would like to see what people are doing

  • lothus777 on 30/09/2019 - 08:21
    -1

    $500 yr servicing? wth

  • knackers on 30/09/2019 - 13:43

    It's important to note that most EVs possess a regenerative motor which goes a long way in preserving brake pads and tyres. The simplified drive train of the EV is hugely beneficial with respect to ongoing maintenance. The degradation in EVs is mainly associated with load capacity of the battery in relation to charging cycles.

  • ChatCPT on 30/09/2019 - 14:07
    +2

    Analysis is dated 28/10/19
    This guy knows what hes talking about, he's from the future

  • OzHoneyBadger on 30/09/2019 - 16:04
    +1

    Nice spreadsheet pegaxs!
    I've spotted a few things to add (and its hard to know if you have already with the protected cells):

    Charging efficiency ~85% - https://www.veic.org/documents/default-source/resources/repo…

    Home charging installation cost - https://evse.com.au/blog/evchargercost/

    I think you sheet assumes always charging at home, might be worth adding an area to estimate public charging and at what cost?

    • pegaxs on 30/09/2019 - 17:34

      Cheers.

      As for efficiency and installation costs for chargers, these values can be manipulated in the "average electric price" and "purchase price". If you charge 20% at home and 80% for free, just adjust the prices. Hell, put in $0 if you get all your electricity from a free EV charge point.

      I just want to keep the sheet as simple as possible. It gives a dirty output, but is only supposed to give people an "idea" of where EV prices are up to at the moment. It's not ever going to be anywhere near accurate due to everyone's individual experience with vehicles and how they own/service/fuel/drive them.

      I may make a more comprehensive sheet later as more ideas roll in where people can change a lot of the values. But at the moment, the less people have to fill out, the easier it is to read and get information from. No one wants to take 20 mins to fill in a huge sheet to get an output they already guessed at.

  • whooah1979 on 30/09/2019 - 22:41

    Tesla Model 3 to the 2020 Toyota Prius AWD-e. That was a surprise.
    https://youtu.be/dbi8xvqTzlI?t=1430

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