Who Is at Fault? Car Accident in QLD with Dashcam Footage

User210686 on 01/12/2019 - 10:06
Last edited 01/12/2019 - 13:14 by 1 other user

Last night I had a very minor car accident in Brisbane. A vehicle in front of me pulled to the side to parallel park on the road and I was trying to overtake him.
However, I immediately realized that he was not giving way and only paying attention to his left-hand side, so I stopped but it was too late.

In retrospect I should've waited for him to complete his manoeuvre but I guess I was a little impatient. There was just enough room for me to overtake and I hoped that he would see me. I remember reading similar discussions on OzB, I was under the impression that a reversing vehicle was usually at fault.

The fender on my vehicle got very minor scratches (pics attached). Couldn't really see anything on his because his car was dark. Also, he didn't seem to care about his vehicle much.

It was such a pain in the a** to get him (a rideshare driver) to produce his driver's licence as he kept saying "Why you come for me, why do you do that? Why you come for me?" insisting that I was at fault and demanding to see my license but not showing me his, etc. On top of that he refused to give me his phone number and insurance details. When I said I was going to call the police, he said he would go to them the following day. I was on my way to pick up my partner so decided to report to the police the next day as well since I already got his license. Besides I couldn't stand listening to him anymore; I didn't understand most of what he was saying.

I have a comprehensive car insurance and assume he does too since he's a rideshare driver.

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Comments

  • drprox on 01/12/2019 - 19:01
    +6

    I love how this kicks off with a classic "who is at fault?" query and then becomes a "the ride share guy was difficult so please side with me" rant.

    • pegaxs on 01/12/2019 - 19:56
      +2

      And a dash of racism to spice it up :D

      • smartazz104 on 01/12/2019 - 21:46

        Not sure why OP is trying to highlight that the other driver is foreign when he refers to a "fender".

  • mezje on 01/12/2019 - 19:02
    +5

    Each one of these posts I lose less and less faith in the countries driving ability.

    Just imagine what the Police think when they review this, hope they throw the book at you.

  • CocaKoala on 01/12/2019 - 19:22
    +2

    Did you get your drivers license from the back of a cereal box? This could all have been avoided with a little bit of common sense. The fact that you don't even know who is at fault means that you must take some driving lessons and read the road rules.

    • snackerjoe on 01/12/2019 - 21:00
      +2

      Common sense not so common these days, same with courtesy sadly.

  • cloudy on 01/12/2019 - 21:07
    +5

    Last threadI read everyone was saying reversing vehicle alwaysin the wrong, end thread.

    This thread seems provide no support to prior thread. Shrugs, I think op should have waited though.

    • youknow on 03/12/2019 - 23:50

      That fairness, that thread is a completely different scenario.

      • cloudy on 04/12/2019 - 12:08
        +1

        yea, I most accidents are different, my only point was, that, in that thread people pointed that reversing car is always wrong. (which I don't happen to agree on, I like to look at the facts)

  • Jtin on 01/12/2019 - 21:52

    Someone needs to go back and learn their basics…

    You can only overtake to the left of a vehicle if it is safe to do so and:

    • you are driving on a multi-lane road and the vehicle can be overtaken in a marked lane to the left of the vehicle
    • the vehicle is turning right or making a U-turn from the centre of the road and is indicating right
    • the vehicle is stationary
    • you are lane filtering on a motorcycle.

    This is from Queensland Government's Road rules website.

    • Pantagonist on 02/12/2019 - 00:17
      +7

      Someone needs to go back and learn their basics…

      Like the difference between left and right?

      • Jugganautx on 02/12/2019 - 10:38

        'Murica

      • Jtin on 02/12/2019 - 13:22

        You can only overtake to the left of a vehicle if it is safe to do so…

        Not sure if you're taking a stab at me or OP… but if it's at me, someone else also needs to go back and learn their basics

        • Pantagonist on 02/12/2019 - 15:13
          +1

          Does OP's video show them attempting to overtake the parking car on the left or the right?

          Given your answer, how does what you posted apply to OP's error?

  • wiipantz on 01/12/2019 - 22:27
    +1

    Geeze, I hope this gets taken further by other driver or police. Drivers and people like OP with the entitled attitude are becoming all too frequent and lucky no one was hurt but imagine if someone was. Say a kid appeared behind the reversing car, the road rules clearly show you need to wait until it's safe, this is a blood rule like most road rules are. This selfish "who is at fault' attitude is just the worst. I hope your insurance is permanently wrecked also, maybe subsidise others who know some basic road rules and common sense.

  • bulletNOVA on 01/12/2019 - 22:31
    +1

    So OP, have you decided to make a police report or no?

  • MITM on 01/12/2019 - 22:33
    +1

    JHC!!!
    No further comment from the ignoramous driver.
    Hey, but has comprehensive insurance which covers stupidity.
    Hopefully the uber driver can use the dash cam for his claim.
    Appropriate music playing on the radio.

  • CheapskateQueen on 01/12/2019 - 22:59
    +7

    feel sorry for the other guy. ppl like you piss me off, flying past a parallel park making it super dangerous. granted in your case you were going slow, but that's not the point.

  • Kamsi on 01/12/2019 - 23:10
    +1

    OP what where you thinking? Seriously, a few min wait for the guy to park his car won't ruin your day. Fck me.

    • Vote for Pedro on 02/12/2019 - 00:08
      +2

      More like 20 seconds. These days people are so selfish.

    • Drewbo on 02/12/2019 - 00:18
      +2

      A few minutes? A few seconds.

  • moo on 02/12/2019 - 00:08
    +1

    At the end of the day, no one gives a F what OzBargain thinks as to who is at fault. Whilst this thread might excite some of our inner keyboard warriors to let out some steam, it has minimal real world value. Let the insurance company decide. End of thread.

    • Vote for Pedro on 02/12/2019 - 00:10

      /End of OzBargain Forums

      You need a hug?

      • moo on 02/12/2019 - 00:12
        +1

        Yes please. 😍

    • Kamsi on 02/12/2019 - 14:03
      +2

      Ozbargain mod should ban all this type of nuisance questions.

    • [Deactivated] on 03/12/2019 - 11:27
      +1

      This kind of thread adds lots of value actually, every time this comes up you get about 5-10% of people trying to argue the incorrect side saying the person who did the wrong thing was right. Those 5-10% of people will hopefully learn the rules a bit better and improve their driving.

      • moo on 03/12/2019 - 11:51

        I'd agree with your sentiments in general. However due to the elements of subjectivity and personal interpretation, it is probably safe to assume that no one here knows 100% who is or isn't at fault.

        • [Deactivated] on 03/12/2019 - 12:01

          True, but it still gets discussions going about some specific road rules and situations, even if it's very difficult to determine exactly who is at fault. We state our assumptions about the situation and how the road rules apply to that, assumptions may be wrong but at least there is then a situation laid out that people can read and argue against or learn from.

  • [Deactivated] on 02/12/2019 - 00:13
    +2

    You're at fault.

    By the way, as a woman, I find your username quite offensive. Was this the intent? Or was it a result of an over-inflated ego, coupled with poor judgment?

    W

    • gimme on 02/12/2019 - 04:29

      Nah OP is an empowered woman who is comfortable in her own skin and invidualism #somethingsomethingme2perperpetuallyoutraged

      • [Deactivated] on 02/12/2019 - 17:36

        Assuming OP is a woman ( or identifies as one) , how is calling herself a "beautiful sl&t" empowering?🤨

        Now if OP is not a woman…

        • ozhunter on 02/12/2019 - 19:26

          Same way as baddest b**ch is empowering.

          Now if OP is not a woman…

          He could just identify as one 😏

        • gimme on 02/12/2019 - 19:41
          +3

          I was just being facetious. Just tired of the perpetually offended brigade. And yes OP is female.. unless she just likes dressing up in women's clothing… queue some outrage from the crossdressers association.

  • El cheepo on 02/12/2019 - 00:18

    Unless the rideshare guy could hear your music and hit you to make it stop I’d say the same as the other 99% here.
    Your bad.

    • tryagain on 02/12/2019 - 01:50
      +1

      https://youtu.be/6p-lDYPR2P8?t=60

      • El cheepo on 03/12/2019 - 01:08
        +1

        Make it stop! Make it stop!

        Now i have this on YouTube play history…
        I’m sure on a list of embarrassing things in peoples search view history this would rank up with things like:
        is a smelly rash normal?
        how do seagulls mate?

        The shame!

  • belongsinforums on 02/12/2019 - 00:28

    Is this south bank? You're probably going to be found at fault since it would be unreasonable for the parking vehicle to expect you to not give way here.

  • gimme on 02/12/2019 - 05:19

    I'm not sure if you're 100% at fault but dick move. This is normal in my neighborhood where noone will ever stop to let you park even if the traffic is at a standstill in front. I on the other hand a almost always give way much to the annoyance of cars behind me. That's my passive aggressive move

  • HeWhoKnows on 02/12/2019 - 07:44
    +1

    Both at fault

    Rule 1: Take care when overtaking
    Rule 2: Take care when reversing/parking

  • ol mate on 02/12/2019 - 08:52
    +1

    50/50:

    OP overtook in the same lane
    Rideshare guy reversed without due care.

    At the end of the day, it sounds like it won't be pretty so many a claim on your insurance (assuming you have comprehensive) and let them sort it out.

    • akyeeeahdude on 04/12/2019 - 14:09

      Completely accurate - careful though, my comment suggesting this got downvoted 12 times XD

  • Soldier on 02/12/2019 - 09:22

    OP for listening to material girl

  • OzHunterNSW on 02/12/2019 - 10:02
    +1

    Within the first line of text….. you are at fault.
    You can not overtake a vehicle attempting to park.
    Maybe re-do your driver's test.

  • [Deactivated] on 02/12/2019 - 10:26

    I'd say you're at fault and should own up to it and pay the excess. Though if you want to fight it, you might have a case per this OZB comment about reversing. https://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/495418#comment-7947416

  • gstfree on 02/12/2019 - 10:36

    From legal's perspective, OP had right of way. The reversing vehicle should give way.

    From socials perspective, I believe OP should stop and let the other vehicle complete reversing.

    • pegaxs on 02/12/2019 - 21:42
      -1

      OP had right of way.

      Oh, so OP was crossing and easement on a property?

  • lint on 02/12/2019 - 10:40
    +1

    Single lane road, you shouldn't have tried to overtake. Why not just wait for them to park?

  • payless69 on 02/12/2019 - 10:47
    -4

    To be quite frank: If you would demand to see my license without showing yours I would lodge a police complaint against you for assault! You would be far more sorry about that then the scratches! Paying for the commercial vehicles consequential loss you wanna think twice about your patience!

    • crashloaded on 02/12/2019 - 12:59

      And then you'd probably be in trouble for filing a false police report since you're on camera you bellend.

  • Peck on 02/12/2019 - 10:51

    Lack of road courtesy has created bad karma. Hopefully those who don't use their indicators when turning left at roundabouts also get a slice of the 'bad karma cake' one day too.

  • westzod on 02/12/2019 - 10:52

    One lane road… the other car clearly indicated that they're going to park. If OP was a little more patient instead to trying to save a few seconds of trip time they wouldn't have this headache.

  • kylarstern on 02/12/2019 - 11:45
    +4

    I am sorry for saying this but you're obviously, blatantly at fault and posting this online including the actual dashcam footage just makes you look more like a moron and gives the other party more cause. Rule of thumb: If car in front of you stops for whatever reason and there's not enough room, dont try to overtake. Plus you had more than enough time to brake: his reverse light was on for at least 2-3 seconds and you were still driving like a moth to a flame.

    • cloudy on 02/12/2019 - 21:56

      Plus you had more than enough time to brake: his reverse light was on for at least 2-3 seconds and you were still driving like a moth to a flame.

      Haha yea, this I could not understand. Seriously funny way to put it though

  • Hellfire on 02/12/2019 - 12:29
    +1

    Liability doesn't fall on the person who broke the law (although in this case they both did). Everyone has a duty to avoid a collision.

    If this went all the way to court it would end up with them both paying a portion of the costs because ultimately they both caused the accident. If it only goes to the insurance companies then it really could go any way.

    Hopefully the OP learns a valuable lesson and will not try to overtake a parking car on a single lane road again.

    • SJDR on 02/12/2019 - 15:41
      +3

      Correct,
      I can't watch the video right now but…

      Whilst it could have been avoided if he'd waited for the other driver to park, the fact he was stopped and the other driver reversed into him could very well be enough for him to win the insurance claim. Insurance companies care very little about common sense and how an accident could have been avoided and rely on generic rules and statements.

      I had a discussion with my insurance company regarding who was at fault when changing lanes - they categorically told me that even if you begin changing lanes when there are no other cars in sight and another vehicle comes around a blind bend at 200kph and hits you, it is still your fault because road rules say you must give way when merging. The only circumstance they would consider a different outcome is if the Police charged the other driver with an offence.

      I wouldn't be surprised if their was a similar insurance/road rule regarding reversing vehicles. Actual common sense is not what insurance companies look at in these situations.

      • OzzyOzbourne on 02/12/2019 - 17:37
        +1

        Hence if you need some repairs to your car, simply ram any poor sucker who is reversing. A sad state of affairs indeed.

  • BhanuL on 02/12/2019 - 12:33
    +3

    Definately the Queenslander was in the wrong…

  • esty on 02/12/2019 - 12:47
    +2

    OP's gone silent. im guessing s/he thought s/he would've had OzB on their side.

    • Munki on 02/12/2019 - 13:22
      +2

      I'm so glad OzB has a lot of sensible people to tell them otherwise.

  • Yummy on 02/12/2019 - 18:00

    Common sense and courtesy, OP. Your fault.

  • [Deactivated] on 02/12/2019 - 20:29

    People please watch the video carefully and don’t make assumptions what is going to happen (as reversing)
    The vehicle ahead is stationary with its brake lights on and at no time shows intent to reverse by having its indicator on or reversing lights on.
    The driver with the dash cam proceeds to move around what he though is a stationary vehicle.
    The driver or the vehicle in front decides to reverse at no stage should we make assumption he is parking (no indicator), He then reverses into the vehicle passing him.
    If the vehicle in front was going to reverse, he must indicate in an appropriate time occupy his lane (not the adjacent lane or bike lane) make sure that the space behind him is clear and safe to do so and then reverse. And then he is responsible for all damages he incurs while reversing unless he stops and another party runs into him.
    At no stage did the vehicle in front stop while reversing so he is at fault.
    By law the vehicle in front will be treated as double parked vehicle.
    The lane on the side is most likely a bike lane which he is also breaking the law by parking over it.
    I have been in this circumstance many times and the driver with the dash cam is not at fault.
    And in most states, you do not need to present a driver’s license all you have to do is provide contact details.

    • SBOB on 02/12/2019 - 20:51

      hard to see, but pretty confident indicator is on though, as the left side is brighter slightly before the reverse lights come on (doesnt help the op started it without showing any of the lead up)

    • ankor on 02/12/2019 - 23:53

      jesus mate, you should be a lawyer! :/

    • [Deactivated] on 03/12/2019 - 11:36

      Are you kidding? The reversing lights turn on less than 1 second into the video. OP's car is completely behind the parked space when the reversing lights turn on and the parking car is obviously positioned to begin parking. They had the time to assess the situation and 1 second AFTER the reversing lights turned on they chose to accelerate around instead of brake. It's too difficult to determine if the indicator is on or not due to the quality of the video and there is no evidence to say that he was parked there either as there is no lead up to the incident in the video.

  • [Deactivated] on 02/12/2019 - 21:21

    SBOB I downloaded the video and went frame by frame and the only thing I seen is the driver having brakes on the reverse lights come on which makes the video cam iris adjust the light level and that makes it look like a flash but you see this once, If the flashes were on you would see the iris adjusting continuously. Also, by ADR the light output is defined so lamp wattages are also equivalent =brakes 21w reverse lights 16w, indicator 21w. So, indicator lights have to be designed equivalent brightness to stop lights and not brighter then reverse lights.

    • SBOB on 02/12/2019 - 21:44
      +2

      crappy screenshot but right at the start you can see the left hand set of lights go brighter than the right, before the reverse lights kick in
      and a crappy dash cam is already washed out by those lights hence the more difficult to see indicator

      https://ibb.co/qJ1s3sX vs https://ibb.co/r2sPzXG

      can also see a change in indicator light area at ~2 secs but its off angle so harder to see

      either way, OP was impatient, couldn't wait 5 seconds, and now here we are
      less drivers like this on the road would be an improvement for everyone

      • pegaxs on 02/12/2019 - 21:47
        +1

        Just came here to say the same thing. The indicator is definitely on. At the last frame before the car obscures the rear lights, you can see the indicator illuminated right above the reverse light.

        Photo showing indicator was used. It can even be seen reflecting in the black SUV parked next to the blue car.

        100%, indicator was in use at time other car was reversing.

        And please, what-da, post the relevant ADR where it mentions “wattage” of these lights… Keen to update my ADR knowledge.

  • The Almighty Dollar on 02/12/2019 - 21:45
    +1

    I’m glad drivers like this have dash cam.

  • Eeples on 02/12/2019 - 22:34

    It might help us (not the OP) if you posted more of the video (earlier).

    I think its 50-50 too.

    Showing your licence does not mean handing over your licence nor letting someone take a picture of it.

  • phaol7ta on 03/12/2019 - 05:50

    op where re you?

    • Munki on 03/12/2019 - 09:42
      +1

      OP is dying from shame, maybe.

  • Kobe08 on 03/12/2019 - 07:19

    The reversing car still owns the lane space since they are still occupying it when reversing.
    Op decided to pull an a-hole move by trying to pass when it was unsafe to do so.
    Just because Op decided to stop and back out of his overtake does not mean he is absolved of fault. He entered the safe space not allowing the reversing vehicle to make the manoeuvre.
    Same situation as if you were walking and someone decides to cut across right in front of you and stops. You would walk straight in to them if there isn't sufficient time to stop.
    Very clear who is at fault.

  • Cave Fire on 03/12/2019 - 10:42

    The rule is the reversing vehicle has to let the other vehicles past AFAIK. Then reverse when it is clear. The street being so narrow complicates things.

    • moo on 03/12/2019 - 11:53

      Rules are black and white. Can you please point us to your reference point?

      • Cave Fire on 03/12/2019 - 12:16

        Someone posted the r.u.m rule above.

  • User210686 on 03/12/2019 - 11:53
    -1

    Update: I've spoken to someone who works in claims department of another insurance company. He's seen cases like this all the time and his guess is that the other driver will likely be found at fault. However, I won't make a claim through my insurer unless a small repair job ends up requiring a lot of $$$. I was able to remove scuff marks and can hardly see any damage with the naked eye.

    • moo on 03/12/2019 - 11:57

      Interesting outcome. Rightly or wrongly, it would seem that 90% of the responses here (our own armchair lawyers) seem to think that you're at fault. Im going to channel my inner Marc Randolph (Netflix co-founder) and say 'No one knows anything'. Well worth attending one of his talks or get his book.

      • syousef on 03/12/2019 - 13:02

        I'm too late to the party. The video has been made private.

      • gimme on 03/12/2019 - 13:35

        Don't need Marc to tell me 90%+ of Ozbers don't know their arses from their elbows lol. But I'm going to check out this Marc person anyway.

      • happirt on 03/12/2019 - 15:46

        "his guess" and "other driver will likely be found fault" is not an outcome.

    • Koolness on 03/12/2019 - 14:36

      Did you show that person the video? Or only describe what you think happened?

    • akyeeeahdude on 03/12/2019 - 22:19
      +1

      Whilst this comment has been downvoted, there is some truth. With claims, it's not always black and white which often results in liability splits between the insurers being agreed upon (eg 60%/40% of loss) or simply the insurer covering the damages of their insured customer.

  • Jugganautx on 03/12/2019 - 15:01
    +1

    Regardless of outcome, OP deserved what they got for being so blatantly careless.

  • Okayy on 03/12/2019 - 20:05
    +1

    OP posted thinking everyone will be on his side.

  • starburstyellow on 03/12/2019 - 21:44

    Missed out on the video, now says private. Damn.

  • CVonC on 04/12/2019 - 01:21

    Come on someone must've mirrored the video somewhere??

  • OneIdiot on 04/12/2019 - 06:29

    OP has hidden the video now that its his own fault and the rideshare driver might not have a dashcam to prove. Seems like OP is going to challenge the incident.

  • akyeeeahdude on 23/01/2020 - 21:10

    So how did the insurance company settle this? Did you have to pay your excess?

    • User210686 on 24/01/2020 - 08:40
      +1

      The other driver was found at fault and I didn’t have to pay my excess!

      • akyeeeahdude on 24/01/2020 - 11:51

        Well…I got down voted many times and shut down saying I was incorrect by saying the other driver was at fault. What a classic "I told you so…" moment for me #humblebrag

        • User210686 on 25/01/2020 - 07:42
          +1

          Haha I know. As I spend more time on OzB, it has become more apparent that advice offered on here tend to be biased/misinformed compared to other online forums. OzB is great for finding bargains though.

          • akyeeeahdude on 25/01/2020 - 11:07

            @User210686: Haha good point. For example - look at the poll results. It seems like the majority don't know basic road rules which is a bit of a worry…

  • HeWhoKnows on 26/01/2020 - 12:42

    Whatever the insurance company says

    Nothing else matters

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