T-Way Fine Dilemma

Offence: Drive in T-Way lane when not authorised - Camera recorded - Individual

My mother asked my father to drive her to her cousin's house to pick up a parcel and meet her other cousin who was visiting Sydney from overseas.
My father is in his 70s and is a bit slow when it comes to making decisions. My mother told my father to drive over Bennelong Bridge at Wentworth Point (the mini Asian city with high rises in Sydney's west) to get to Rhodes instead of going the way he normally goes which is down Parramatta Rd to Concord and then to Rhodes. Basically, my mother has an annoying and pushy voice and kept telling him to drive over the bridge while he was reluctant to do so. He said he wanted to turn back but there was no way to make a U-Turn. Reversing was the only other option. Neither knew that this bridge is a T-way, which prohibits private vehicles from using it.
Today we got the fine, and naturally, they are both arguing about who should pay the fine. The fine comes with 1 demerit point too so my father is pissed off.

I believe my father should pay the fine because he is a dumbo for listening to my mum instead of looking at the "No Entry" and "T-Way" signs everywhere.
My mother has a driver's licence and has been driving for 30+ years.

Please settle this for them!

Poll Options expired

  • 78
    Dad should pay the fine
  • 20
    Mum should pay the fine
  • 8
    Request a review from Revenue NSW and ask for leniency
  • 200
    Both should pay the fine

Comments

  • +19

    My mother told my father to drive over Bennelong Bridge at Wentworth Point

    I'm sorry but I sure hope you fall far far from that genetic tree. Because that bridge is positively festooned with signs and warnings and labels that it's a T-way non-public access bridge.

    • +13

      LOL… Even the Google Maps Streetview doesn't even go there. It goes down the bicycle/pedestrian part of the bridge.

      PS: And a little kek for the fans :D

      • +2

        I don't believe that's Street view. I think that's just a guy with a camera who added imagery to google

  • +16

    Right or wrong the driver is supposed to be in control of the car and is therefore responsible for any infringements while sitting behind the steering wheel.

    He shouldn't have listened to your mum in the first place (Easy for me to say)

    • +5

      He shouldn't have listened to your mum in the first place

      Lol that's probably what the mum said to the dad when they got the fine.

      • He shouldn't have listened to your mum in the first place

        Sometimes (probably all the time) its much easier to pay fine then argue with the wife :)

  • +16

    Do your mother and father have separate bank accounts?
    If not, this post is irrelevant.

    • There's also the demerit point as well (which should go to the driver).

      • +1

        Yes, agreed. But the poll only makes mention of paying the fine.

    • Do your mother and father have separate bank accounts?

      Yes.

      • +4

        Ok.
        Then the driver (father) should pay.

    • +1

      I don't understand father and mother arguing for who should pay the fine?, Does it really matter except who will lose the demerit point?.

      • +1

        you don't lose demerit points you gain them

  • +2

    The driver is responsible. Dad should pay the fine.

  • +44

    My father is in his 70s and is a bit slow when it comes to making decisions.

    Then take him off the road FFS.

      • +20

        "Most of the time" is hardly good enough. It only takes one lapse for something tragic to happen.

        • He's a good driver. I'm not worried about his driving skills. He has been driving for 50+ years. It's more his don't drive on a T-way skills in unfamiliar suburbs skills.

          • @Numlock: Lol fair enough.

          • +9

            @Numlock:

            It's more his don't drive on a T-way skills in unfamiliar suburbs skills.

            How is his stop signs skill?

          • +1

            @Numlock: Next time he will go to a one-way street from the opposite direction because he couldn't read a no entry sign. In that case, was it because he is lacking unfamiliar suburbs skills or reading skills?

      • +1

        He tends to stick to roads he knows.

        Ok that explains the 'Parramatta rd to Concord rd' part of this story… You know you can just hook around Bennelong Parkway, join Homebush Bay Dr and come off at the next junction for Rhodes. That would shave about 15 minutes off your dad's route.

        Edit: Dad's normal route.

  • +8

    I believe my father should pay the fine

    I think you should pay the fine for taking a side.
    if it was me I would have paid the fine and taken the point. what is the point of arguing over something so trivial, you guys a family or what. shouldn't have even been an argument to settle in the first place

    • -3

      I think you should pay the fine for taking a side.

      Stuff that. The fine is $350.

      • +7

        if you think $350 is a lot of money I assure you your 70 year old dad thinks $350 is a hell of more money than you do.

          • +1

            @pegaxs: No.. by OP standards everyone should pay their part in the loses including your kids. Hahaha

          • +4

            @pegaxs: Travel insurance should cover you. You did buy it straight after your flight yeah…

            • +1

              @lainey13: Nope. Even when I was offered it while I was buying tickets, I hesitated, contemplated, and decided against it. Never again. Expensive lesson learned. It’s like taking a hire car and not paying the $30 excess waiver, driving out the driveway and straight into the arse of a parked truck.

              I think of all the times I have travelled and never bought travel insurance and how much I have saved by not buying it, and it doesn’t even cover half of what I experienced today.

              Apparently what happened was, the plane arrived today, the pilot and crew got off and walked off the job and there was nobody to replace them. While I am all for workers rights and industrial action, my solidarity has worn a little thin today.

              • @pegaxs: Damn, you're SOL.
                My FIL booked a trip to come to my destination wedding and had a heart attack a week before flight time. The last thing he had to do was buy travel insurance….

                Oh well. At least he's ok now.

                • @lainey13: I hope he got a refund or at least credit for the flight to use later. The airline should have a policy that if you can't fly due to a medical condition, just get a letter from a doctor and you can rebook for free or get a refund. With my grandfather's condition it was unknown how long before he'd be able to fly so I pushed for a refund and got it. It may even be worth looking into whether hotels and anywhere else he lost money has such policies.

                  If whoever paid for it wants a refund, let them know it was for a wedding, which he missed, and now has no reason to travel.

          • @pegaxs: Sucks for people who took the day off for nothing- that's a real shame. Everything else should be covered by your travel insurance. You do have travel insurance, right?

            • +1

              @[Deactivated]: That's what I am most dirty about. I dont care about the money, it was the feeling of letting friends down who had to make other arangements or take their annual leave to spend time with us.

              You do have travel insurance, right?

              :(

  • Maybe go halves?

  • +3

    Does he have 10 year Clear driving record? If so, submit a review.

    • Does he have 10 year Clear driving record?

      Nope. A couple of minor speeding fines and parking fines in the last 10 years.

      • -3

        What about your mum's driving record? Say that she was driving if it is clean and apply for a review then.

        • +1

          There are images of the car at the time of the offence. Can clearly see my mum's hair at the back.

          • -5

            @Numlock: The government are not going to check if your mum has long or short hair. If it’s a photo from the front and it’s clear that it’s a man driving, maybe not so much.

            But from the back, it was mum and “her long haired” friend in the car.

  • +11

    Dad pays the fine, takes the points as he was driving…BUT tells your mother that when he is driving, he chooses how the route he is driving, or she pays fines for directing him if he incurs fines from following her instructions.

  • +6

    Your poor father 🙁 No-one likes a 'backstreet driver'

    Does your father have dashcam audio recording of your mother's backstreet driving? If so, then perhaps use it for leniency 😉

    • +16

      Just FYI, it's backseat driver haha
      .

      • lol - of course! D'oh!

        • +22

          Backstreet's back, alright!

          • +2

            @[Deactivated]: Didn't they have a song called I want it that way ? Backstreet Boys should cope the fine and the demerit points then.

            I mean , if we're going to disregard the law and rort the demerit point system , might as well get the BBoys to cope it , right?

            Falsely nominating another driver is a serious criminal offence and offenders can be charged with wilfully misleading police or false statutory declarations that can incur potential penalties ranging from $1600 to two years imprisonment and up to a $24,000 fine.

            Edit: OP, is the poll only about the fine, or the fine AND the demerit point?

            • +1

              @[Deactivated]: Sorry my twitch just kicked in - it's cop not cope :)

              Verb
              cop (third-person singular simple present cops, present participle copping, simple past and past participle copped)

              (transitive, formerly dialect, now informal) To obtain, to purchase (as in drugs), to get hold of, to take.
              (transitive) To (be forced to) take; to receive; to shoulder; to bear, especially blame or punishment for a particular instance of wrongdoing.
              When caught, he would often cop a vicious blow from his father

              I know, grammar nazi and all that happy to live with the hate.

              • @Ramrunner: Autocorrect changed it. I only noticed the typo after the edit window had closed :(

    • Eh, I think you mean backseat driver. Or maybe OP dad is the main roads driver and OP mum the back street but this point is moot. Also, I am sure that the court is not going to take evidence of a hen pecked husband as reasoning for dimissing the fine.

      • +1

        Yes, I know - acknowledged above.

        jk re: leniancy claim hence the emoji!

    • Does your father have dashcam audio recording of your mother's backstreet driving?

      Yes he does but the incident was 7 days ago and I think it may have been overwritten.

  • +6

    Don’t let 70 y/os listen to Backstreet boys while driving . Alright !!

  • -1

    If your mum told your dad to drive off a bridge would he do it? If so then they would both be dead so they should both pay the fine

  • +6

    So for those outside of the state, this is the street

    Holy crap that's a lot of warning signs (and leading up to it also). And that includes "no entry" signs

  • +8

    What is a T-Way?

    • +3

      Transitway. For buses

    • +2

      They have 2 types of bus lane in NSW:

      • The first is bus-only lanes (T-ways) that are exclusively for buses. Those lanes are heavily signposted and marked as bus only.A continuous white line generally separates a bus-only lane from a general traffic lane.

      • The second type is a generic bus lane like we have in Vic. They are primarily for buses but can also be used by other road users, under some circumstances, for up to a 100m.

      Happy to be corrected if I'm wrong.

      • +1

        They are primarily for buses but can also be used by other road users, under some circumstances, for up to a 100m.

        Can be used by road users outside of peak times usually and if you need to turn left or right at an upcoming side street.

        • …and also when you are entering or leaving a property adjacent to the bus lane, or if you have to pass another vehicle that has stopped to turn right or to avoid an obstruction.

          These bus lanes typically operate from 6am to 10am and from 3pm to 8pm from Monday to Friday, however some, especially in Sydney, run 24 hours :)

        • -1

          also taxi's are allowed to use them, i think?

  • +1

    dad is the driver, therefore responsible

    if mum asked him to drive off a bridge, would he do it?

    also, they likely have a joint account, so it doesnt matter anyway

  • +3

    my mother has an annoying and pushy voice and kept telling him to drive over the bridge while he was reluctant to do so

    I sympathise with your father. I have one person like that in the family so whenever I drive that person around, I have to make sure that I'm in a good state of mind, otherwise I would drive the car off a cliff somewhere.

    Going back to your question, I think they should both pay for the fine as your mother, being an annoying passenger, should bear the consequence of her behaviour.

  • Rock scissors paper?

  • +7

    YOU should pay.

    Shame on you for making your elderly father drive your whinging mother to her cousins house. This was your duty and you failed.

  • +2

    I think you should slowly back away and get the hell away from this argument.

    Let them work it out (or fight and divorce).

  • Just split the fine, sound like they're both equally to blame.

    • Indeed.

      OP: Teach dad how to record using his mobile phone, so he can record every time mum is in the car with him. The next time something this chaotic occurs (because it will), the situation can be reviewed with more than just the police photo. And the outcome could be good, in that mum would learn she needs to control her tongue a little better, and dad would feel better about paying the fine as she may opt to shoulder some of the responsibility

      Cars full of people talking make it much easier for a driver to make a mistake. The more passengers the easier it gets. If one is being boisterous, insistent, loud… all this makes it a bigger problem

      Add to that the fact that older drivers are more susceptible to confusion, poor decision making and subsequent mistakes…

  • +3

    I hate to say it, but Dad should pay for the fine as he was the one driving.

    But with that said, the payment of $350 is actually worth it… Now, whenever your mum wants dad to driver her anywhere, he can bring up this incident and say no. :) it's essentially a get out of jail free card!

    • -7

      Now, whenever your mum wants dad to driver her anywhere, he can bring up this incident and say no.

      You don't have a marriage as long as my parent's one by saying no or using the past as an excuse.

  • There's signs all over the approaches to that bridge. Must have been very distracted. Driver pays the fine.

  • +3

    The weirdness of ozbargain auto threads continues to impress.

    1. The driver is responsible
    2. Why are your parents accounts so separate it is an issue who pays? Surely they are just splitting up their combined income anyway.
    • -8

      Why are your parents accounts so separate it is an issue who pays? Surely they are just splitting up their combined income anyway.

      Mate, my parents are retired pensioners who have their own money. They're not young mums and dads with a mortgage and an investment property. They are long past the stage of joint bank accounts and budgeting. The money is not an issue. It's about who was in the wrong and who should pay.

      • +3

        They are a married couple. Over the decades the money has been jointly acquired so it doesn’t matter who ‘pays’ it is communal funds.

        The DRIVER is responsible.

        • -3

          Over the decades the money has been jointly acquired so it doesn’t matter who ‘pays’ it is communal funds.

          It doesn't matter to you. It does to them.

      • +1

        Not even a question. Driver is always reputable responsible. Even if they lack the balls

  • +2

    Please settle this for them!

    You should go to family court…

  • +1

    Dad is either a competent driver and so fully responsible for fine.

    Or an incompetent driver - who should not be on the roads!

  • +1

    I think your Mums Cousin should pay the fine ..then your Dad should file for divorce.

  • +1

    It is your fathers fault. He is the one who broke the law. Just because someone told me to break the law doesn’t make it not my fault. You do the crime you do the time!

  • +1

    I've misclicked but dad should have to pay the fine as he committed the offence.

    Strangely enough I had a similar thing happen in my family (but with an aunt and her son). Aunt is from an older generation of a migrant background and has the belief that she's always right and can't be challenged. Son had to cop a parking fine. He was really unhappy so as a family we decided to speak to her. In the end she couldn't argue with all of us and finally caved in. Losing face was incredibly embarrassing for her but I think she's a better person for it now.

  • +1

    what was in the $350 package?

  • +1

    some sort of error? no option for 'OP should pay the fine'

    • +2

      Option for… Who gives a…

  • If I were your father, I would tell his wife: if you sure about the road, then please take the wheel.

    I don't like when I focus on driving and follow road sides, but someone sit on the passenger tell me "have to do this and that", except for some safety concerns.

    Anyway the red paint on the road is a big signal for driver.

  • -1

    Can OP assume responsibility for the fine, elect to go to court a few months down the track, and plead guilty to the magistrate?

    Many cases I’ve heard of doing this all get off the fine, including myself, a mate, and a case here on OzB.

    • +4

      Whilst incredibly tempting, please don't endorse dishonest acts. Same as paying strangers on social media to "cop your demerits". Many people do it, but it doesn't make the roads any better. You're bailing people out, usually those who never learn or own up to their hooligan ways.

      The father should realise that he is ultimately responsible as he is the driver. He should stick the fine receipt on the dashboard in front of wherever the mother prefers to sit, as a constant reminder for her to shut up or drive the car herself.

  • one to pay the fine and the other to take the point

  • -1

    My father is in his 70s

    I would not worry about demerit point if I was at that age.

  • Someone told someone else to do something illegal and they did…. Who is responsible?

  • Sheesh, aren't you old enough to have learned that when your parents - or indeed any longtime married couple - argue you should stay right out of it? ANYTHING you say or do can only prolong the argument and also risks them ganging up on the interferer.

    Privately, yes, the driver is solely responsible. But keep that opinion private.

  • Driver is responsible for operating the vehicle. Driver is responsible for the fine. Why do you care anyway. Butt out. Let the grown ups decide for themselves

  • +2

    I think it's sad that your parents have separate money

    • Why? Works for them.

      • +1

        Yeah, clearly.

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