Should The Ute Pay for The Crash if There Was Evidence?

hasher22 on 12/03/2022 - 14:36
Last edited 12/03/2022 - 15:27 by 1 other user

Hey guys,

First time ever I had a car crash behind me. Just got me wondering…..

Busy road, forgot which road, but a ute wanted to turn right on unbroken lines and I knew he couldn't do this but he was backing up traffic. The car in front went into the left lane straight away and I slowed down, everyone slowed down behind me and I decided to wait cause I get traffic merge paranoia.

The car behind me decided to merge to the left but he crashed into the back-right of a van. It was a loud bang and I shat myself, but my car is ok. I do understand it's the car's fault for merging and not the vans.

The ute in front of me noticed what happened and he did a runner and decided not to merge and go straight.

To my understanding, you cannot cross unbroken lines unless you're entering or exiting a property such as a home or petrol station. Therefore, the ute cannot turn right into a road.

My question is:

I don't have a dashcam or anything, but if there was evidence of the ute trying to turn right on unbroken lines, made traffic which caused drivers to merge, would the ute have been at fault and made to pay whatever bills, such as insurance or other?

Diagram

Poll Options

  • 83
    Car is at fault
  • 1
    Ute is at fault if there was evidence
  • 6
    Both drivers are idiots
Automotive

Comments

  • Quantumcat on 12/03/2022 - 14:49
    +7

    You're responsible for what you do with your own car. Car driver could have merged safely if possible, or waited like you did if this wasn't possible. It isn't the ute's fault the car driver decided to do something dangerous instead of the safe thing. Car driver at fault.

    • hasher22 on 12/03/2022 - 18:50
      +1

      Ya I agree, since the ute drove off when the crash happened, I thought he knew something that I may not know about the road rules cause first thing I thought "why is he driving away so fast? is he liable?"

  • apsilon on 12/03/2022 - 14:50
    +1

    No, car driver is responsible for safely changing lanes regardless of cause.

  • ULT on 12/03/2022 - 14:54
    +2

    To solve this issue, If i was the Car driver I would've just held the horn until the ute realised he shouldnt be trying to turn right there and to move on. Unfortunate this occurred and could have been avoided easily, but the fault has to fall on the car driver, the ute didnt force the car to turn dangerously.

    • jrvb42 on 13/03/2022 - 10:34

      In this day and age, sadly, you honking no stop may well cause the ute driver to get out and do who knows what to you. people don't like being told, much less admit, they were wrong.

      • ULT on 13/03/2022 - 10:46

        Fair point, but Id like to naively believe that most people would get a clue and do the sensible thing without the need to hold on the horn, but maybe im asking for too much

  • codenamesharp on 12/03/2022 - 14:59
    +1

    Even though it wasn't - if you think of the Ute being broken down it makes it clearer too. Anyone behind is responsible for how they change lanes.

    • Quantumcat on 12/03/2022 - 15:07

      Yes exactly or the driver started having an epileptic fit and had to stop wherever they were or there is a small motorbike stopped in front that you can't see or a whole host of reasons that it could be stopped legitimately. You have to take responsibility to drive your best no matter what everyone else is doing.

      • Muzeeb on 12/03/2022 - 15:22

        driver started having an epileptic fit

        Oddly specific

        • Quantumcat on 12/03/2022 - 15:23

          Or migraine, or heart attack, or…

          Anything that means they can't safely drive very suddenly and don't have time to find somewhere to pull over

          • Muzeeb on 12/03/2022 - 15:24

            @Quantumcat: To be fair if they were free of seizures for more than a year they are entitled to a driver's licence

  • elgrande on 12/03/2022 - 15:32

    Nope, needs causation.

  • Muzeeb on 12/03/2022 - 15:37

    I decided to wait cause I get traffic merge paranoia.

    Paranoia or phobia?

    • hasher22 on 12/03/2022 - 18:52

      sorry phobia is a good word, lol. I was an aggressive driver when I started driving, thinking I'm invincible, merging crazy and being cocky. But now I am more defensive and look at very open spaces to merge.

  • Huck on 12/03/2022 - 15:42
    +7

    https://www.nsw.gov.au/topics/roads-safety-and-rules/road-la…
    "You can cross double unbroken lines to enter or leave the road by the shortest route."

    https://www.mynrma.com.au/cars-and-driving/driver-training-a…
    "A surprising number of motorists are under the impression that it's illegal to cross a continuous double or single line when driving off or onto a road"

    • pegaxs on 12/03/2022 - 16:32
      +10

      Came here to say the same thing. Ute can cross unbroken lines to enter and exit a road or property/road related area by the shortest possible route. (NSW Road Rule: 134 subrule 3-1 (may vary in other states))

      Even if the ute couldn't turn there (ie: No Right Turn sign) they are still not responsible for some moron car driver merging without giving way to the cars in the lane beside them.

      Car driver 100% at fault for their own stupidity.

      • Euphemistic on 12/03/2022 - 17:49
        +2

        It does seem odd that the lines were unbroken at an intersection. Normally they leave a gap so there is no confusion.

        I’d like to see the actual location.

        • Grunntt on 13/03/2022 - 11:24
          +1

          I have to agree that diagram does look like nothing I have seen in practice.
          Are you sure they were turning into another street or was it into a driveway?
          Can you give a link to a streetview location?

    • silo on 13/03/2022 - 08:04
      +1

      Yeh way too many people don't understand this rule… I had a another guy rage against me one time because I was the one turning. They should really do a marketing campaign around this rule lol

  • AustriaBargain on 12/03/2022 - 17:34
    +1

    If everyone slowed down and stopped then the ute was in no way a sudden obstruction. Crash was caused by a bad merge rather than trying to avoid the ute who stopped for no good reason.

  • Pharos5 on 12/03/2022 - 17:44
    +1

    Thank you for the diagram.

  • Euphemistic on 12/03/2022 - 17:50
    +1

    If you are too scared to merge and can’t remember where you were during a significant incident such as this you should really consider if you are aware and competent enough to be driving

    • Muzeeb on 12/03/2022 - 17:53
      +2

      Lack of situational awareness amongst licensed drivers blows my mind.

      • Euphemistic on 12/03/2022 - 17:54

        Usually blows other drivers airbags too.

        • Muzeeb on 12/03/2022 - 17:55
          +1

          That's the problem with airbags - these drivers get to do it all over again.

          At least it was natural selection before the advent of such devices.

          • pegaxs on 12/03/2022 - 19:05
            +2

            @Muzeeb: The problem here is, the idiots are seldom the ones that die in accidents, it is mostly the case that some innocent party are the ones to pay the ultimate price that they had no choice in.

            Natural selection doesn't work here because car accidents are based on random influences. We take out the air bags and more innocent people start getting killed and the moron drivers walk away with their life and a renewed sense of being invincible.

            It's a bit of a harsh call to say that a family driving to their weekend away and being run into is "Natural selection" because some drunk arsehole lost control of their vehicle.

    • hasher22 on 12/03/2022 - 18:36
      +1

      Quick to judge huh…..

      I couldn't see in front of the large car in front of me that the ute was turning right, hence when the vehicle merged left all of a sudden, I saw the ute trying to turn right and then I slowed down.

      Also, it was pretty heavy traffic but cars still flowing up each other, I was fully aware that me slowing down plus cars on my left not slowing down, I will cause an accident like the car behind me did. Also, I wouldn't have time or space to merge. So I waited….. I am not impatient like the car behind me. The car in front of me merged quickly to avoid the ute turning right.

      And no, I don't need to remember where the accident was, it happened behind me, I was delivering a package in a new area, why should I remember the road? I wasn't the one in the accident, I drove off like the ute did….. I remember it was 2 unbroken lines and the ute wanted to turn right onto another street.

      Oh, and by the way, I have not had any at-fault incidents with another car / person EVER in my 10+ years driving……. A car hit me from behind and he admitted he wasn't paying attention, I accidentally hit a pillar in a driveway…

      So maybe, just maybe, when you want to judge someone on their driving abilities cause I don't like to merge in high traffic areas, maybe consider the full story first.

      Don't be so quick to judge, I am sure there are things in driving that you don't like doing. No one is perfect on the road.

      • Euphemistic on 12/03/2022 - 19:29

        You offered that you get paranoid at merging. That can’t be a good thing. Maybe it sounds harsh, but many drivers should be told they are incompetent and should leave driving to others. Yes, I was quick to judge but it made you think about it didn’t it.

        Our licensing and testing system is a joke. Might as well hand out licences with the cornflakes.

        • hasher22 on 15/03/2022 - 19:03

          There's a difference between paranoid at merging and paranoid when merging in traffic.

          I don't like merging in traffic unless there's an obvious gap I can easily get into. If it's bumper to bumper then I wouldnt force merge myself to change lanes for the sake of it unless I really need to.

          Again, you're not perfect on the road, stop making it out you are. Reality is, you're not. Please get off your high horse.

          • Euphemistic on 15/03/2022 - 20:17

            @hasher22: You’re the one that mentioned paranoia and driving. If you’d said ‘I chose not to merge’ there is no quarrel, you made a decision based on the conditions. Quite often people who are to timid to pull into a gap can cause issues for other motorists increasing frustration and encouraging stupid acts.

            Never said I was perfect. I am however, confident to drive in all conditions and certainly am not paranoid about merging.

            I hope that someone pulls me up when my faculties fade and tells me to quit before I injure someone.

  • rektrading on 12/03/2022 - 18:31
    +1

    https://ibb.co/mqPhNT8

    Bad Friday for the car. 😭

    One of the perks with WFH is not having to deal with traffic. 😁

    • pegaxs on 12/03/2022 - 19:09

      I think you meant "Bad Friday for the van", the car driver got what they deserved.

  • nomoneynoproblems on 12/03/2022 - 20:13

    OP not sure if you're aware but when asking for vehicle accident advice on ozbargain, you're supposed to be at fault. No matter what. I would close this thread before you get banned.

    • Euphemistic on 12/03/2022 - 22:08

      It’s also preferable that you don’t have insurance.

    • silo on 13/03/2022 - 08:07

      OP didn't even post an mspaint diagram either… How are we supposed to follow the story!

  • WreckTangle on 13/03/2022 - 09:18
    +2

    Why can’t the ute cross unbroken lines to turn?

  • OzHunterNSW on 15/03/2022 - 16:25

    The van

  • [Deactivated] on 16/03/2022 - 13:09
    -1

    Always the cyclists' fault

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