Wi-Fi Mesh or Extender/ Repeater? if Mesh, Which One

Mr Frodo on 25/03/2022 - 08:40
Last edited 25/03/2022 - 08:41

In the OzB braintrust I have full confidence. Hoping you will provide your views.

Before anyone bags me out, I have tried to do a little bit of research on this already but can't really find anyone sharing similar situation as myself.

Background:

  • I live in a unit block - every wall is a brick wall. Roughly 90 sqm unit.

  • My neighbour (1person household) and I (two persons household) both think that paying over $70 per month EACH (FTTB) is a little excessive for small households like ours. Both of us have the similar size units, we share a common wall where the router is kept.

  • So we decided to share the internet, so even if we up the speed to the highest one we think we require, we'd still be paying less than what we're paying now

  • Obviously having brick walls mean one of us (likely the modem will be in her unit) will get less signal that the other

  • After watching a few videos online, I think extenders might be a good solution, as I just need to make sure the wifi signal gets to all my rooms- ideally the 5Ghz one which is the faster band I think (?)

  • Also appreciate that Mesh are always a better solution, but trying to keep the cost at a minimum. See question #2 below.

Questions:

  • Firstly, can anyone think of any cons of having the modem in her place and sharing the internet like this? First one that comes to mind is if I need to reset the modem for whatever reason and she's not home, that might be an issue. Anything else?

  • So many videos say that Mesh is a better solution than extender. Would it be true in my case also? Note that I don't need to switch between the networks as long as the extender's signal reaches all room. I can disable the "connect automatically" for her direct modem network and only connect to mine.

  • Will the extenders have an 5Ghz band? If yes, does the extender need to be wired to get the 5Ghz? I feel like the 2.4Ghz will be too slow for streaming etc.

  • Some videos also said that with extenders, you can't really download and upload at the same time. Isn't this a huge problem, as I may be watching netflix in one room, but my partner may be in a video meeting in another at the same time, requiring download and upload at the same times?

  • If extenders, which one would you recommend? Similarly if Mesh is the way to go for my situation, which one would you recommend?

I'd really appreciate your input. I am a total noob when it comes to these things, but think I can understand if you explain it, especially after watching a few videos.

Many thanks in advance guys

Internet Wireless Range Extender Wireless Router

Comments

  • donbot on 25/03/2022 - 09:29
    +1

    Is it feasible to run an ethernet cable into your unit from hers (eg - via the roof?). I'd be inclined to do that direct from the modem, and then connect your router to the ethernet cable.

    Overcomes the brick issue, and probably gives you the best speed possible and control over your own wifi network. Then you could network into the modem if it ever needed a reboot.

    Note: I'm assuming you could run two different routers from the one modem. Someone smarter than me will confirm this, but makes sense to me.

  • 7ekn00 on 25/03/2022 - 09:30
    +1

    ASUS WiFi router with Mesh - it can be connected via Ethernet cord for superfast sharing … so modem in her place, main ASUS router with WiFi in her place connected via Ethernet cable to another ASUS Wifi Mesh router in your place (can even connect them via WiFi if you don't want to run a cable from her place to yours - just reduces the available WiFi to devices a little - but would work fine back to back between one brick wall) …
    Can buy two of the same router, or two different ones if needs are different in each area, review of ASUS routers here:
    https://www.techradar.com/au/news/best-asus-router
    I can vouch for 3 x Asus RT-AC86U working perfectly fine in a double story brick house 6 x bedrooms and many devices!

    • peetah on 25/03/2022 - 10:31

      just reduces the available WiFi to devices a little - but would work fine back to back between one brick wall) …

      Alternatively get tri band models and the 2nd 5Ghz band can be used as a dedicated backhaul though the triband models are more expensive.
      I've got the main router in the lounge and a mesh node in the office over the 2nd 5ghz band. Double brick apartment with the door closed and the office is able to achieve 432 down 272 up available for devices connected to the node according to the Asus UI at the moment.

      Modem in the neighbour's unit and play around with the placement of the 2nd one in your place.

  • AndyC1 on 25/03/2022 - 09:41
    +1

    Your research has IMHO clouded/mixed two different issues, being:
    1) How to link two apartments with a brick wall between the two.
    2) How to get wireless coverage in a single apartment with brick walls.

    I will start with the easy issue first, which is #2:
    This is where mesh is best, but may not be necessary and could be an overkill with regards to cost. But saying that if you have plans to move or do not want cables then mesh will work out better in the long run.

    The hard issue is #1:
    Both mesh and an extender between two points are equivalent.
    The problem is that getting a decent signal and therefore speed through the wall(s) (probably a double brick wall). I would head over to https://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum/9 and ask there as you will get allot better answer there.
    5Ghz signals do not like brick walls, so the 2.4Ghz will be better. But you are correct in that 2.4GHz may be too slow…
    Is there a possibility to run an Ethernet cable out one window along the brickwork and back in another window? Paint the cat5 cable to match the brick mortar is one way of hiding it.
    Have you checked to see if there are any cavities between the two apartments where you could run a cat5 cable between the apartments? To find if there is any check where pipes go along the common wall.

    Good luck.
    Good luck.

  • RockyRaccoon on 25/03/2022 - 09:47
    +2

    As above, or just move in and you can save on accommodation as well (3somes could be fun 😀)

  • netjock on 25/03/2022 - 09:59

    Maybe have neighbor test the reception and speed is acceptable before going all out.

  • LuffyTuffyFluffy on 25/03/2022 - 10:01

    Back in the cable days, we use to run an ethernet cable across the fence so see if you can do that via your balcony/window or even potentially drill a hole in the common wall.

    If that's not possible, go with a mesh/router option (more seamless and provides large coverage). I currently have the 2 x TP-link M9 plus (there are newer versions) for a 4 bed tri-plex house (one in the lounge room and one in the study upstairs) and it's been working flawlessly in every room including the bathrooms. Everything is controlled via the app (if needed) and easy trouble-shooting guides. There's been no hiccups in terms of speed (streaming up to 6-10 devices simultaneously) on wifi. Placement of the mesh is important to optimise the coverage, so you may need 2 per household, depending on the layout.

    The only drawback would be access to the modem by the other party when there's a NBN disruption/hardware failure, you'll need to wait until the other party is available to diagnose.

  • 87percent on 25/03/2022 - 10:44

    What’s going to happen if one of you download something you shouldn’t, and you get a letter in the mail??

    • dust on 25/03/2022 - 10:50

      What?

      • AndyC1 on 25/03/2022 - 10:52

        Poly want a cracker?

      • 87percent on 25/03/2022 - 11:04

        Let’s say you decide you want to watch that new Batman movie. So you download it from a site.. next thing you know the owner of the service gets a letter from their ISP asking for a “please explain”

        • RockyRaccoon on 25/03/2022 - 11:09

          Simple you tell your neighbour not to do it again.

          If they persist, you cancel the sharing deal.

        • dust on 25/03/2022 - 11:18

          Is that particularly common?

    • Mr Frodo on 25/03/2022 - 11:20

      valid point. I did think of this. I think there's mutual trust on both sides. Both are professionals with too much to lose. You never know though. A risk that we're willing to take.

      • scrimshaw on 25/03/2022 - 12:41
        +1

        If both of you share the same ISP, you'd both have the same IP address, which is a huge advantage for account sharing

        This makes it possible to share a Netflix Standard plan between the both of you without getting banhammered by netflix. https://help.netflix.com/en/node/24926

        Amazon prime also lets you watch up to 3 streams at once using a single account.

        To answer your question about mesh versus range extenders: Mesh networks are much more efficient than range extenders. A mesh router can use a 2.4GHz channel to communicate with the client and then use their 5GHz channel to relay data to the other mesh access points on the network. Tri-band mesh routers can use a third channel that acts as a backhaul, which further improves the efficiency of the mesh network.

        A range extender doesn't do this — it picks up a signal from your neighbours router and re-transmits it. Then, it has to pick up your signals and then transmit it back to your neighbour. Because everything is transmitted twice, an extender has half the maximum data rate of the router. There are more packets in the WiFi channel, so packet collisions are increased.

  • Morien on 25/03/2022 - 13:13
    -1

    What ISP?

    Not all options will work on all ISPs, so ISP and type of technology is important to know.

    • HelpMeiCantSee on 26/03/2022 - 13:25

      Not true at all. Extenders, mesh and hardwire cable work regardless of ISP.

      • Morien on 27/03/2022 - 14:36

        You sure? TPG (for example) need you to be able to set some settings (PPPoE, VLAN ID 2, and maybe some more) on their NBN services that come with a netphone (even if you aren't making use of the netphone).

        I've heard of people having no problems with the TP-Link Deco mesh, but being unable to get the Google Mesh to work.

  • dtc on 25/03/2022 - 15:13
    +2

    I wonder whether you are all on the same electrical circuit, in which case potentially you could use an 'ethernet over power' set up (if the CAT cable idea doesnt pan out - that is a better option if feasible)

  • Rocah11 on 25/03/2022 - 15:54

    Mesh would allow you both to have access to the mobile app which allows you to do tasks such as reboot the device for troubleshooting.
    If you aren't worried about the neighbour kicking your device off the network, messing around with settings that they shouldn't, this would work well for you.
    I use the TP-Link Deco M5 which overall has been good.

    Mesh can be worth trying but if you play games online, I wouldn't recommend this solution due to the brick wall which will lead to a frustrating experience.

  • omguleh on 25/03/2022 - 19:02

    Best mesh system I have used is the Amplifi system.

  • HamBoi69 on 26/03/2022 - 08:31

    We were recently using a wifi extender and after multiple drop outs and slow speeds, we decided to move to a mesh network. We are currently using the google nest wifi system, and it is absolutely worth the money. I'd would 100% recommend it, oh and a bonus is that it comes with a built-in google assistant!

  • Brendoo on 26/03/2022 - 09:55
    +1

    A mesh, like Google Nest, is not meant to be an extender. It replaces the primary router, not extends it. You will need to set the mesh system in bridge mode to extend your neighbour's router, but doing that will probably lose features. e.g. I'm pretty sure on Google Mesh this then only allows one access point so the 'mesh' cannot work. You also need to check that the system you choose even supports bridge mode and does it support wireless bridge (or you will need to run a cable to your neighbour's router).

    Your neighbour could set their router into bridge mode, but then it wont function as a router for them anymore, so probably not a good idea.

    One other thing to keep in mind - security. Depending on the setup you choose, yours and your neighbour's computers could be on the same local network and fully accessible to each other. This will happen if you both hang off the same wi-fi router. or you are bridging to their router. You then need to ensure the security is tight on all of your computers. Any hack or viruses on your neighbour's computers would leave you fully open to attack unless you provide extra strong protection on your computers. Of course your neighbour could do this to you as well, depends how much you feel you trust your neighbour.

    To be honest, for a saving of $20 - $30 a month or so, I would not bother. Unless you are strapped for cash and couldn't afford decent internet otherwise.

    • dtc on 26/03/2022 - 12:15
      +1

      You don’t bridge the router, you bridge the modem. Then you plug the mesh primary unit (eg the Nest) into the modem and it’s now the router. What OP will then do is pair a satellite mesh unit to the primary unit, and that becomes the OPs router and access point

      The proposal is no different to having a mesh system for a far flung bedroom. Modem/internet connection point in one room, mesh to assist with connectivity in another room. The only issue is the wall and how that affects the mesh - and, knowing apartments and living in a house with concrete walls which uses a mesh system, I can’t image it’s going to be that much of an issue

  • Waltervp on 26/03/2022 - 12:39
    +1

    I think a simple mesh solution would work with one mesh unit on either side of the wall you should be fine. Get it from an actual store and return within 24hrs if it doesn't work. I'm sure there will be no trouble with a mesh unit on either side, virtually under a metre apart.

  • cicada001 on 26/03/2022 - 12:51
    +1

    I did it for years in my previous house - we had hebel bricks between us and it was never an issue.

  • kranix on 27/03/2022 - 10:57
    +1

    In the OzB braintrust I have full confidence.

    Holy cow, that's a huge mistake. Everyone's got an opinion, that doesn't mean that it's a good one. Much less a good one for you. Check their credibility and do your own research to check whether it's right for you. In my own defence, I'm a trained network engineer and Linux sysadmin. Back when I had more time, I used to compile my whole OS myself (Gentoo).

    Put simply, extenders reduce your overall throughput. But they are cheap and you may not notice the difference. The bottleneck is usually with the Internet connection, unless you're doing a lot over the local network

    I avoid Chinese/Russian gear for core networking or security. Recent news is a great demonstration why. Yes everybody probably spies on you, but the impact and likelihood are far greater with products from those countries. That does narrow the playing field significantly, but it's still navigable.

    From experience, I'd avoid Netgear. Their software and support is pathetic. I have an Orbi mesh setup, which I was able to stabilise through loading the third-party Voxel firmware. But it's Russian so I'm going to have to consider a replacement.

    If you have Amazon Prime, it's a snap to buy something, test it out and return if it doesn't work for you. You could even buy the Amazon mesh product, which is pretty decent.

    You'll want the signal to go through a weak spot between your units… maybe at the front doors or across the balconies. You could even consider stringing a cable between them. If it's outdoors, get a cable rated for that.

    Also consider whether the cost is worth the effort of sharing the connection. Would you be OK if your neighbour is using all the bandwidth when you want it? Do you trust them with your data going over the wire? At a minimum, get an unlimited data account to avoid bill shock.

    • askbargain on 27/03/2022 - 18:33
      -1

      I avoid Chinese/Russian gear for core networking or security.

      What if their neighbour is Chinese/Russian?

  • Sterio on 27/03/2022 - 15:00
    +1

    If you share a common wall, single or double brick, why not drill through the wall and run a cable that way? Aesthetically pleasing too with a wall plate rather than running cable outside the building, through balconies etc.

  • jean claude reuille on 14/04/2022 - 12:00

    I have good result with Ubiquiti. POE UniFi AP-AC-Mesh and a cloud key to manage from outside the local network. Quite cheap solution.

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