[VIC] Does The Long Surgery Waitlist Worry You

Trying2SaveABuck on 13/01/2023 - 21:02
Last edited 13/01/2023 - 21:03

The AMA’s analysis shows Victoria makes up the largest percentage of the backlog (134,950 patients, or 44 per cent of the backlog) together with New South Wales (77,845 patients, or 25 per cent of the backlog).

Queensland and Western Australia account for around 10 per cent of the backlog each.

https://www.ama.com.au/media/urgent-funding-and-reform-neede…

it is quite clear that the public system cannot handle the COVID backlog how do we best tackle the situation when we have such under funded and poorly staff hospitals…..this is the longest it has ever been and the list seems to be growing….

Poll Options

  • 30
    yes im concerned - i do not have private health insurance
  • 15
    im not concerned - i do not have private health insurance
  • 13
    yes im concerned - i do have private health insurance
  • 26
    im not concerned - i do have private health insurance
  • 7
    poor people dont deserve proper health care
Health & Beauty

Comments

  • AustriaBargain on 13/01/2023 - 21:10
    +1

    Not if you've lived a life without regret.

  • Falkner on 13/01/2023 - 21:25
    -6

    Why would it be a big deal? The people of Victoria were clearly okay with the struggling health system and the government at the helm.

    Stop complaining or move somewhere else then if it worries you.

    • Nugs on 13/01/2023 - 21:35
      +2

      "move somewhere else".
      No, keep them all in Vic
      .

  • elgrande on 13/01/2023 - 21:32
    +1

    Thanks for sharing, did not realise that the backlog was that bad. It will be great when Melton hospital opens.

    • Trying2SaveABuck on 13/01/2023 - 21:51

      As someone who resides in the City of Melton i agree. Wish it would be quicker then 2029 though

  • JimmyF on 13/01/2023 - 22:23
    -4

    LOL sounds like the AMA trying to drum up some extra funding to pad their pockets…. 'estimated backlog', so lets look at the real figures, not some guesstimate.

    The 'worst' state being VIC has a CURRENT backlog of 135k people, for a population of 6.71 million people or about 2% of the population waiting for something.

    Depending on what they are categorised at, it is normal to wait up to 12 months. So you need to look if this number is growing or not. If it is always sitting at ~135k then the system is keeping up.

    I know someone who was a cat 1 in VIC, so to be done within 30 days, they got done in 14 days. The system is far from failing for life saving issues as some might want you to think.

    • meowsers on 14/01/2023 - 11:34
      +1

      Cat 1 is not a place you want to be. You get their by either being sick, or potentially becoming sick or dying quicker if you dont get the surgery. Stop minimising this. It's a disaster out there.

      • JimmyF on 14/01/2023 - 13:26
        -1

        Cat 1 is not a place you want to be

        It's not a place you want to be for sure, but if you are, you get treatment pretty fast. Which was my point. My friend went from not knowing they had anything wrong to finding out they needed surgery classed as cat 1, and 14 days later having it done. So the system is 'working'.

        It's a disaster out there

        Its far from a disaster, are the numbers growing or holding steady? If steady then people are getting treated. Boohoo if you have to wait 6 months in the public system for treatment that isn't life and death. That is why they are categorised.

        • meowsers on 14/01/2023 - 13:44

          Not really if you got unlucky and had a delayed cat 3 (colonoscopy) which then turns into a cat 1 due to a delayed diagnosis of bowel cancer. This happens multiple times a month if not more.

          You can't categorise someone if you don't have the information.

          Don't act like you know it all.

          • JimmyF on 14/01/2023 - 22:08

            @meowsers:

            You can't categorise someone if you don't have the information.
            Don't act like you know it all.

            LOL, well 'doctors' categorise people not me.

            I've never heard of anyone waiting for a long time for a colonoscopy. Are you trying to say people are waiting years for a colonoscopy now?

    • brendanm on 14/01/2023 - 16:09

      135k people, for a population of 6.71 million people or about 2% of the population waiting for something

      Lol, what a weird way to put it. The entire population doesn't need surgery.

    • brendanm on 14/01/2023 - 19:06

      Also, aren't you meant to be changing your username?

  • jv on 13/01/2023 - 22:34
    +7

    How long has Dan Andrews had to fix this?

    • Trying2SaveABuck on 13/01/2023 - 23:34
      -2

      it has been growing problem under the Andrews and previous Napthine government for a while now

      • jv on 13/01/2023 - 23:39
        +5

        Napthine was in government 1.5 years.
        Dan has been there for over 8 years and done nothing.

        • Trying2SaveABuck on 13/01/2023 - 23:53

          i agree but it has been an issue for a while - it is also partly the fault of the federal government more money needs to go into medicare which would take pressure off the hospital system and more money needs to go into preventative medicine

          things like Knee replacements due to a life time of obesity could be prevented but it is all too common

          • jv on 13/01/2023 - 23:58

            @Trying2SaveABuck:

            it is also partly the fault of the federal government

            health is the responsibility of the states.

            why don't other states have this problem?

            why are Vic ambulances in such a mess too?

            • Trying2SaveABuck on 14/01/2023 - 08:31

              @jv:

              health is the responsibility of the states.
              why don't other states have this problem?
              why are Vic ambulances in such a mess too?

              this is incorrect the 'hospital' system is what the states are responsible most community health funding, most pubic health and Medicare funding is federally funded - i worked in community health for almost a decade 70 percent if our funding what commonwealth 30 percent was state. - thus why most GPs dont bulk bill [lack of indexation of the GP bulk billing] - id blame Tony Abbott for freezing the rebate GPs in 2013 but it is another ALP playing politics as Fed libs tried to introduce a co-payment which would of seen people pay like 5-6 bucks and make medicare more sustainable unfortunately it became a political football and the co-payment didnt happen due to fear of getting 'rid of medicare' -

              however id largely blame us the Australian people we dont want to change to make our great system sustainable instead we milk it till it breaks….

              but i take your point about 'why doesnt the other states have an issue' you are 100 percent correct and well that is were the Dan Andrews government comes into a massive question - the poorly handled COVID situation and the playing politics with the previous federal government didnt help…also inadequate planning and forced Vax etc

              Dan is trying to upgrade hospitals and improve the situation ill note the Opposition did promise similar changes to improve the backlog but i personally think more needs to be done - to come extent i would rip up the entire management team of all the major metro hospitals and start of scratch as the management running the hospitals are mostly incompetent

        • kanmen on 14/01/2023 - 01:38
          +1

          Sorry but saying Dan has done nothing is just quite grossly incorrect. You can have a look at the long list of upgrades and redevelopments to existing hospitals if you managed to stop making general falsehoods and bothered to actually googled it? A lot of existing infrastructure desperately needed upgrading to better suit the needs of the area which I'm sure you'd agree is actually kind of important if you want to have a functioning health system and address things like longer waitlists.

          The main hospital near me had a whole building created in the last 4 years, and there's plans for a community hospital (one of like 20) in my municipality that was an election promise from 2018, and yes 4 years has gone and work hasn't started but it's not really like things like hospitals can be built in a day or two (unless you're in China.) It does take years of planning, community consultation and public tender processes to find the right location and the right plans to suit the needs of the community, which in my area has actually been quite difficult.

          Not to mention paying for people to get nursing degrees which most people are actually quite excited about.

          This government gets accused over everything under the sun but generally even the most uneducated, unhinged people who are anti-Labor can acknowledge that 'doing nothing' is a dumb accusation. But yeah, I guess if you're still bitter over November it might be easier to continue to live in denial or something, I don't know. Better yet, continue to complain but don't bother offering any viable or logical solution!

          • jv on 14/01/2023 - 02:23
            +1

            @kanmen:

            Dan has done nothing is just quite grossly incorrect.

            Have you seen the state of the Alfred hospital lately?

            https://www.9news.com.au/national/alfred-hospital-western-di…

            "Our staff have to move mountains to provide care in third-world conditions in what are completely inadequate conditions."

            • freefall101 on 14/01/2023 - 10:56
              +1

              @jv: You didn't even read that article properly, the quote doesn't apply to the Alfred

              Fitzgerald's comments come just days after Western District Health Service (WDHS), which oversees Hamilton Base Hospital in western Victoria, posted a video on Facebook taking aim at the state government.

              The Hamilton Base had been trotting out the "third-world" line a lot last year, although has seemingly gone quiet now the election is over and they're not trying to milk the election for funding promises. Almost like it was a purposeful exaggeration to grab headlines.

              But hey, don't let the obvious get in the way of your anti-Dan rageathon you seem to have going on.

              • jv on 14/01/2023 - 11:27

                @freefall101:

                Acting Chief Executive Professor Mark Fitzgerald labelled the conditions at the hospital "inadequate" and dangerous.

                He also criticised the lack of action and communication about funding for the Alfred from the Andrews government in a radio interview.

          • jv on 14/01/2023 - 02:28
            +1

            @kanmen:

            I guess if you're still bitter over November

            This is about 8 years of incompetence, not about November.

            By the way, 63% of voters did not vote for him in the last election.

            • Trying2SaveABuck on 14/01/2023 - 08:43

              @jv:

              By the way, 63% of voters did not vote for him in the last election.

              this is true but both state and federally the 'seat of Melbourne' is voted for Greens which are the most incompetent useless party we have so - to your point about the Alfred hospital they kind of get what you 'vote for'

    • Sinnerator on 14/01/2023 - 08:10

      About as long as he has had to fix all the crazy people stabbing up trains.

    • JimmyF on 14/01/2023 - 13:27

      Looks like JV is a news corp reader…..

      • jv on 14/01/2023 - 13:31

        I read it on OzBargain

        • JimmyF on 14/01/2023 - 13:36

          Now owned by news corpse? You also are linking to the cough cough theage, the paper owned by news corp that hates Melbourne.

      • cloudy on 14/01/2023 - 20:10

        @JimmyF Hey, you gonna honour your bets or you gonna just pretend it didn't happen like a fraud :P

  • Clear on 13/01/2023 - 23:42
    +4

    Last year I was categorised as urgent Category 1 in Victoria where the typical waiting time is 30 days and I received a date for my surgery within 28 days. Even after a double booking stuff up. Meanwhile in Tas the same urgent Category 1 waiting list for this type of surgery is typically 155 to 322 days and the facilities are no where near as good as what Victoria offer and that makes survival less likely.

    So Victoria have it pretty good in comparison.

    • jv on 14/01/2023 - 00:00
      -3

      So Victoria have it pretty good in comparison.

      Not for many people waiting for surgery to relieve pain but not deemed critical.

      • Clear on 14/01/2023 - 00:07
        +1

        At least they'll be seen sooner.

        • jv on 14/01/2023 - 00:19

          At least they'll be seen sooner.

          yeah, maybe in a year or two…

          https://theage.com.au/national/victoria/mind-boggling-wait-t…

          • Clear on 14/01/2023 - 00:20

            @jv: Liberal or Labor there will always be issues.

            • jv on 14/01/2023 - 00:20

              @Clear: read the article.

              • JimmyF on 14/01/2023 - 13:38
                -1

                @jv:

                Sarah Hindson has been waiting to see an ear, nose and throat specialist for eight years.

                Clearly it can't be too bad if she has put up with it for 8 years while waiting….

                • cookie2 on 14/01/2023 - 21:56
                  -1

                  @JimmyF: Not true at all. I'd say you've never been there. We just give up because nothing changes or helps.

                  • JimmyF on 14/01/2023 - 22:06

                    @cookie2: It is true I haven't had the need to see a ear, nose and throat specialist myself, but I certainly wouldn't be waiting 8 years for a 'free' one if I really needed to see one.

                    My point was, if you have been waiting 8 years to see one, was it really that bad to start with?

    • JIMB0 on 14/01/2023 - 08:33
      +7

      This thread is meant to be about how you had to wait longer than 30 days because of Dan. No one here wants to hear about the system working.

      • Clear on 14/01/2023 - 08:39
        +2

        Dan this Dan that. I swear Victorians never stop sooking about Dan and they blame him for things completely unrelated.

        • Sleeqb7 on 14/01/2023 - 11:06
          +2

          Weather is a bit shit in Brisbane today.

          How could Dan do this?!

          • Clear on 14/01/2023 - 11:21

            @Sleeqb7: It's because Dan won't declare a climate emergency and resulting in high temperatures across the country. Dan strikes again.

    • Clear on 14/01/2023 - 10:41
      +1

      Oh and it's about 2-4 years for category 3 I should mention. Unfortunately it's a big issue everywhere.

      • JimmyF on 14/01/2023 - 13:27
        +1

        everywhere? Surely you just mean VIC…… As all the other states are perfect based on the replies here ;)

  • ECE on 14/01/2023 - 00:46

    No, i am healthy 💪🏿

    • meowsers on 14/01/2023 - 11:37
      -1

      Until you get a dog bite, or a cat scratch and need a washout by plastics.

      Enjoy the 30 hour wait in ED, and the 48 hour wait for surgery. Meanwhile the guy next to you with private insurance will be out of hospital the next day when ED rings the surgeon direct, gets you a bed in private in a few hours time and gets you to surgery that night.

  • Hardlyworkin on 14/01/2023 - 07:50

    ^ Healthy people injure stuff too!

    I found it's the wait to see a specialist and get on the wait list which is the most frustrating part as it often isn't mentioned. For example it took me over a year to see a specialist for a knee injury before I could even get in the waitlist. I was gullible and thought from time of injury it would be 18 months as that's what the data said - it took more than a year over that due to waiting to see a specialist or gives the obvious tick if approval for the surgery.

    Now I have private cover, hoping I don't need to use it.

  • JuanLove on 14/01/2023 - 08:14
    +4

    A couple of people have mentioned their cat 1 wait times. This isn't where the problem is. It's cat 3. At RMH they stopped doing cat 3 surgery again during the covid wave at the end of winter. One speciality I know of has a 2-3 year wait for cat 3 (as of yesterday).

    It's a complex problem. Lot's of people quit post covid when they were overworked. In early covid, execs sat at home telling all of us we have to work harder. At first we didn't need n95s. Then we needed them but only if we have a confirmed covid case but reuse it all week. Eventually we now have to wear them all the time in hospital, even outside of clinical spaces, replace every 4hrs as they lose effectiveness. It's now clear the earlier advice was a lie based on stock levels and our safety was too expensive. People felt undervalued and have quit. Less staff, fewer theatres, same amount of work + the covid backlog.

    You can't just throw money at this problem. It takes years to replace most healthcare workers. Most jobs need a degree + a few years experience before you can work without supervision. There's no good answer other than open theatres for longer, asking those who haven't quit to work longer shifts. But that disregard of staff welfare and burnout is why we are here.

    Honestly, if you're on a cat 3 waitlist in Vic, get private health cover now and wait for the 12 month cooldown on pre-existing conditions. It will be quicker.

    • JimmyF on 14/01/2023 - 13:36

      A couple of people have mentioned their cat 1 wait times. This isn't where the problem is. It's cat 3. At RMH they stopped doing cat 3 surgery again during the covid wave at the end of winter.

      So what you are saying is it is not the gov or health system that is the problem, but covid waves causing a backlog as the health system pivots trying to deal with a flood of other incoming cases.

      One speciality I know of has a 2-3 year wait for cat 3 (as of yesterday).

      So Category 3 as in Non-urgent. Causes minimal or no pain, dysfunction or disability. Unlikely to deteriorate quickly. Does not have the potential to become an emergency.

      While 2-3 year is crap, its also not directly linked to the time a Category 1 case is being treated which is under 30 days, or Category 2 being treated which is under 90 days. So if you do have emergency or life threatening issues, you will be treated promptly.

      Honestly, if you're on a cat 3 waitlist in Vic, get private health cover now and wait for the 12 month cooldown on pre-existing conditions. It will be quicker.

      Its been this way for decades, wanted a hip or knee done for 'free' via the public system you had to wait for years on the list.

      • Trying2SaveABuck on 14/01/2023 - 18:34
        +2

        Causes minimal or no pain

        come on man you dont really believe that….if you need an op for a knee or hip it is due to severe OA pain it probably hurts and causes a fair amount of disfunction

        Its been this way for decades, wanted a hip or knee done for 'free' via the public system you had to wait for years on the list

        i dont disagree with this part - but people pay the there taxes to a system they are entitled to use it - otherwise get rid of Medicare and have a US system which i personally think if much worse it is not unreasonable for tax payers to expects a better run system….

        we have lost our way in this country we have means tested and minority pandered everything whilst the people who work and fund the system are left out no wonder why so many people want to pay less tax they feel the system doesnt benefit them for what they are paying.

        While 2-3 year is crap

        i work in health care i know people who have been waiting for herinia repairs for over 3 years….it is non-urgent but it is painful according to them esp when doing moderate exercise ie walking up stairs etc

        knee and hip replacement it is not uncommon for over 24mo obviously non of these issues of life threating but they do cause some disability and they do cost the system as many people stop working or have increase absenteeism due to these Cat 3 issues

        • JimmyF on 14/01/2023 - 22:17

          come on man you dont really believe that….if you need an op for a knee or hip it is due to severe OA pain it probably hurts and causes a fair amount of disfunction

          That is how the medical system defines a Category 3 is it not? I did a copy/paste.

          i dont disagree with this part - but people pay the there taxes to a system they are entitled to use it

          I agree its crap, but to claim the system has recently fallen apart really true? People waiting for a knee/hip replacement for years has been common for decades.

          The problem is, we all want to pay 'less' taxes, so that means less money, hence more of a user pays system to plug the gap.

    • parisienne on 14/01/2023 - 21:00

      Amen to that.Those reasons ( amongst others) where why I left the industry after decades of service…and I know of dozens more ( just in my hospital) who have done the same thing.Simply "hoping" more staff are trained isn't going to solve any issues either….many,many educators who deal with the students that come in have said that many of the students ( apparently over 70% )either don't finish the training at all,OR leave within the first 12 months post completion due to seeing the realities of life in the field and the level of pay.I would be worried about a lot more than wait times right now.

  • [Deactivated] on 14/01/2023 - 09:34

    The only time COVID overwhelmed the system was when they artificially restricted it. Now the backlog happens all at once.

  • brendanm on 14/01/2023 - 16:07
    +1

    Probably shouldn't have pissed off everyone in the health system, and made their lives as hard as possible over the last few years. Who would have thought people would get sick of it?

  • Empharand on 14/01/2023 - 18:43
    +1

    I'm still waiting to hear back regarding a meniscus surgery (Knee surgery) from an injury end of 2020 hahaha. Fortunately meniscus injuries can somewhat heal to a point that it doesn't hurt so it hasn't been too bad and the pain doesn't really cause too many dramas; I just can't do anything strenuous with my knee which has been a little limiting so it would be nice to get it done sooner or later.

    I did both knees at the same time, the first one (the worst one) was about 6-8 months from point of injury to surgery.
    Last time I called them they said that they were backlogged and would send a letter when it's my turn.

    I understand that there are a lot more pressing surgeries and in the grand scheme mine isn't life threatening or dire by any means.

    Edit: Referring to public sector. I'm 32.

  • cloudy on 14/01/2023 - 20:06
    +2

    Old man had a heart attack in October last year, and after finding 3 of his main arteries are 70-90% blocked he is recommended to have urgent triple bypass. According to the info we've received he really should have had it within 30 days but due to everything that's well reported, he still hasn't had it yet, but luckily got the call the other day to have it this coming week. But clearly well outside the recommended time frame. Whilst he has been fine waiting, for others who may suffer another heart attack in the meantime it could be fatal.

    • Empharand on 15/01/2023 - 18:56
      +1

      That's really worrying, one would imagine that such a surgery should have been attended to more promptly due to the nature of the issue? Wondering if there's a lack of cardiovascular surgeons in the public healthcare sector (Assuming you went through the public sector)

      I'd hate to imagine the statistics for those that succumb waiting their turn.

      I hope your old man has a speedy recovery :)

    • Trying2SaveABuck on 29/01/2023 - 15:35

      no staff in fairness it isn't like you can just put an ad on seek for a oncology surgeon and you will have 50 applicants

      • meowsers on 29/01/2023 - 15:42
        +1

        Trust me this has nothing to do with surgeons and more to do with epic failures from the victorian government, hospital exec and the department of health in general.

        Plenty of surgeons ready and waiting to do these procedures. The real issue is that nurses are being driven away in hoardes to work fewer hours and work at other hospitals.

        This will be the same when they open up all these "new" hospitals including in the western suburbs etc. Staff just spread out between hospitals, there aren't that many to staff new hospitals. The government is disingenous because staffing hospitals isn't sexy. New buildings are.

        The good news is many people are happy just working at private hospitals, and working public like 0.2FTE. The government will eventually have to pay for them to come back. You can't just train experience like you said.

        • Trying2SaveABuck on 29/01/2023 - 19:27
          +1

          fair enough - it is clear the Victorian state government is clueless but the Victorian voters love the incompetence so you get what you vote for i guess

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