Migrating from Google Workspace to MS365 - Tips? Regrets? Shoulda Coulda Woulda?

• 

  melb-hunter on 14/04/2023 - 07:50

  +3

  I've just gone through this process.

  For the migration, we just followed Microsoft's instructions and that brought our mail and contacts over with no problems at all. No need to pay a third party to help with migration.

  The one "gotcha" I'll warn you about is that when you delete a user from Google Workspace, even though the account technically is there, you will lose access to some services that may be unexpected. For example, my account was removed from Workspace, and while I could still log in as a Google account, things like Recaptcha admin and even YouTube channel management was all lost. My Analytics account no longer exists at all so need to be re-created too. The warning when you remove a user makes it sound like just Workspace will be removed, but it impacts all services.

  Before deleting a user, make sure you go through all of your Google services to make sure that you have granted access to someone else who still can access things - you'll need this to get access back when you re-sign in.

  This last one has proven to be a real headache if I'm honest.

  Besides that, the switch to M365 shows how far behind the Workspace offering is for business use - with Microsoft, we can work more collaboratively within the organisation, and with those outside, improve the UX of sharing files with OneDrive, and also centralise email signatures (using CodeTwo's offering). No regrets at all switching - just that one warning above to be aware of.

  • 

    geekcohen on 14/04/2023 - 07:59

    For the migration, we just followed Microsoft's instructions and that brought our mail and contacts over with no problems at all. No need to pay a third party to help with migration.

    Do you have a link to those instructions? How long did it take? I have about 18 accounts to migrate.

    The one "gotcha" I'll warn you about is that when you delete a user from Google Workspace, even though the account technically is there, you will lose access to some services that may be unexpected. For example, my account was removed from Workspace, and while I could still log in as a Google account, things like Recaptcha admin and even YouTube channel management was all lost. My Analytics account no longer exists at all so need to be re-created too. The warning when you remove a user makes it sound like just Workspace will be removed, but it impacts all services.

    Before deleting a user, make sure you go through all of your Google services to make sure that you have granted access to someone else who still can access things - you'll need this to get access back when you re-sign in.

    This last one has proven to be a real headache if I'm honest.

    Thank you, that is something I definitely want to avoid. We are pretty good with access primarily through a shared GMAIL account, so we rarely have individual access. But definitely the Google Console is something I need to be aware of as we use that for some of the Google Maps API.

    The warning when you remove a user makes it sound like just Workspace will be removed, but it impacts all services.

    Such a flaw in Google then.

    Besides that, the switch to M365 shows how far behind the Workspace offering is for business use - with Microsoft, we can work more collaboratively within the organisation, and with those outside, improve the UX of sharing files with OneDrive, and also centralise email signatures (using CodeTwo's offering). No regrets at all switching - just that one warning above to be aware of.

    Thanks. I like the Centralisation of the Email Signatures, that is something in Google Workspace that is so frustrating and we have recently discontinued our Black Pearl Mail subscription which used to take care of that.

    • 

      melb-hunter on 14/04/2023 - 08:13

      Do you have a link to those instructions? How long did it take? I have about 18 accounts to migrate.

      The key thing is to read every bit of this document, and follow the "Important" link in the blue box to start. It reads really overwhelming, but when you set it all up, we had everything work nicely.

      Thank you, that is something I definitely want to avoid. We are pretty good with access primarily through a shared GMAIL account, so we rarely have individual access. But definitely the Google Console is something I need to be aware of as we use that for some of the Google Maps API.

      My advice is basically for every user, go through every service - YouTube, Analytics, Search Console, Cloud Console, Repcaptcha, everything - even Drive Docs that have been shared with you - because all of that disappeared for me and needed to be re-added by another user in the org.

      Thanks. I like the Centralisation of the Email Signatures, that is something in Google Workspace that is so frustrating and we have recently discontinued our Black Pearl Mail(blackpearlmail.com) subscription which used to take care of that.

      CodeTwo has some automated steps to set things up, but may need intervention from MS support due to MS trying to reduce spam and phishers signing up. But when it is set up, it's great. No matter the email client, signatures are injected in to emails. We have a "main" one for the first message in a thread, and a slimline one for subsequent replies to the thread. And the user information is pulled in from Azure AD, including headshots. This is great as some are using Outlook, some Apple Mail, and no more faffing about with markup approaches for different clients.

      Also means if new users come on, their signatures just work. And if you need to add a seasonal message or change the content, it is all in one place. Super dooper awesome.

      There's more behind the scenes with the Google situation I can't publicly disclose at this time but their recent changes have negatively impacted our business, and my only regret is not ditching Workspace sooner. We've been able to replace several services with M365 services, including Teams (instead of Slack) and Bookings (instead of Savvy Cal, which is nicer, but for our use case, not worth the expense). Centralising OneDrive is so much more user friendly than Google's offering.

      Also, there are different user plans to consider too - check out M365's pricing page. Shared mailboxes can be at no cost, which is good to know, and if a user doesn't need desktop apps, you could get away with a cheaper plan. One of our team doesn't need desktop apps for their role so we're saving money there, and for the very very rare times he needs to edit a Word doc, the web apps work beautifully for him.

      • 

        Chaddy on 18/04/2023 - 00:29

        +1

        Just on the shared signatures thing, if you buy the Enterprise licenses particularly E3 or E5 you can design a shared signature that goes organisation wide, so the individual can still have their own one but any disclaimers get inserted automatically org wide.
        https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/microsoft-365/admin/setup/…
        No need for third party tools.
        In fact it looks like you can do this on the Small Business licenses now M365 Premium.
        Been a while since I needed to look at this.

• 

  Kaz0551 on 14/04/2023 - 08:24

  +2

  How good would it be if you could migrate a workspace account to a standard Google account and keep all your associated services. Stupid Gsuite legacy.

  • 

    geekcohen on 14/04/2023 - 08:28

    Yep. As much as I love Google, some of their processes and updates are so stupid.

    All the changes with Analytics and Google Ads, just making things worse! Just to name a few things………

    • 

      scotty on 14/04/2023 - 11:08

      Yeah, talking about Analytics. Forced migration to GA4, as a website owner I still can't get it to do what UA has and it's now much harder to use.

      • 

        geekcohen on 18/04/2023 - 06:30

        Honestly, GA4, a nightmare. In the website space myself (with clients) and its going to be a headache soon. Trying to understand the new terminology and settings for things is becoming harder.

        Just to apply an exclude IP filter is a 10 click process!

• 

  Hellfire on 14/04/2023 - 08:49

  +1

  As a user I've gone from 365 to Google and back to 365 through changing jobs.

  From my perspective Google is just so much easier for the user, everything is generally user friendly and well integrated with key apps like Slack. Not as feature rich as 365 though. Some people may still need Office and you'll need 3rd party apps to make the most of it.

  365 is great that everything is included but its poorly integrated. Teams feels like a bolt on that is a poor imitation of Slack. Sharepoint/Teams should be really good for collaboration but too hard to use properly so nobody does. Great for power users but poor for everyone else.

  • 

    geekcohen on 14/04/2023 - 09:07

    +1

    From my perspective Google is just so much easier for the user, everything is generally user friendly and well integrated with key apps like Slack. Not as feature rich as 365 though. Some people may still need Office and you'll need 3rd party apps to make the most of it.

    I agree. We mainly use the Google Docs element, but no reason why we cannot use MS365 and the Online Apps moving forward.

    Whilst Google is a little more integrated and maybe a bit more user friendly, I don't see that being a huge issue for our team.

    365 is great that everything is included but its poorly integrated. Teams feels like a bolt on that is a poor imitation of Slack. Sharepoint/Teams should be really good for collaboration but too hard to use properly so nobody does. Great for power users but poor for everyone else.

    Being that I think a majority of MS365 users would be using Outlook for Emails, that is understandable that Teams appears as a bolt on. If Outlook + Teams were integrated, that would be awesome > similar to how Gmail integrates everything with Chat + Meet etc became all in one window. I don't like that, I separate it out.

    • 

      Chaddy on 18/04/2023 - 00:38

      Outlook and Teams are integrated certainly more so in Windows 11 then Windows 10 but I won't be upgrading to Windows 11 for a while due to Microsoft's silly hardware requirements I don't want to mess about with the registry and break anything on a production machine. Why MS didn't just write a script to enable the stuff it needed to for the upgrade is beyond me. And I am not installing third party copies of windows with stuff missing just to get the upgrade.
      I'll wait till I need to do a hardware upgrade.
      Then get a proper copy. Or i'll run a Windows 365 instance to kick the tires a bit.

• 

  AustriaBargain on 14/04/2023 - 10:43

  I'd even think about using both. Surely the per user fees are tiny compared to your business turnover per employee.

  • 

    geekcohen on 14/04/2023 - 10:49

    Using both? We would still have Google accounts, but just without Google Workspace features/attached.

    Paying Fees for both is not an option. May as well stay with Google Workspace.

    • 

      AustriaBargain on 14/04/2023 - 10:55

      -1

      Do you own the business?

      • 

        geekcohen on 14/04/2023 - 11:11

        No, but am the key decision-maker in the process. Just need to the final approval from the CEO and then will be good to go. If benefits are cost saving for the same thing, he would say it is a no-brainer, let's move.

        • 

          AustriaBargain on 14/04/2023 - 11:13

          -1

          @geekcohen: You've spent five hours talking about it here, and time on Whirlpool. Are you on the clock for all this time?

          • 

            geekcohen on 14/04/2023 - 11:17

            +1

            @AustriaBargain:

            time on Whirlpool

            I've had 0 responses from Whirlpool.

            Are you on the clock for all this time?

            Yes and no. Technically on the clock now. But at 6:30am this morning when I was researching and looking into this, I wasn't on the clock. My official hours are 8am to 4pm.

• 

  brandt on 14/04/2023 - 11:08

  +1

  What is the Cost of Google subscription as a % of revenue of the company. and what's the same % for M365? If there is a significant difference then maybe start having a think about it, but if its about the same % then don't bother.

  50% saving is not a justification for moving platform as with most companies with any scale your savings will be destroyed by transition costs, loss of productivity and disruption.

  • 

    AustriaBargain on 14/04/2023 - 11:14

    +1

    I know right. OP is a key decision maker for the company, how much is his time worth per hour?

  • 

    geekcohen on 14/04/2023 - 11:15

    What would you say is a worthwhile migration % of revenue?

    50% saving is not a justification for moving platform as with most companies with any scale your savings will be destroyed by transition costs, loss of productivity and disruption.

    While I agree to a certain point, I don't see the transition costs being too high, loss of productivity wouldn't be much and disruption I expect to be minimal if planned and executed correctly. I have done transitions of phone systems, hardware/OS changes, device transitions, office relation transitions and NAS transitions with minimal disruption to the business.

  • 

    Chaddy on 18/04/2023 - 00:53

    Yeah but if they are already heavily running on Windows and using Outlook for mail its a no brainer really.
    I am not just saying that as a Microsoft partner either, I have personally used both Google Workspace and M365 and M365 is miles ahead from a productivity stand point and just works without too much configuration. Google can't even produce correct reverse PTR records half the time.
    Also the web interface is rubbish.
    On the flip side the NCE New Commerce Experience for Microsoft partners like my business has been a poorly implermented joke and just confuses customers as if you opt for an annual plan you can't add or remove licenses during that annual plan till the next renewal date and you can't cancel a subscription either.
    Plus they restructured all the partner programs without much notice late last year which was annoying.
    So they no longer have Silver or Gold partnerships anymore you need to be a "Solutions partner and meet a lot more criteria which doesn't favor smaller providers as much.
    Rant over.
    The technology still works well though when its not offline, we've rolled out a fully redundant system for when Teams falls over so I can still get calls in the business.

    • 

      geekcohen on 18/04/2023 - 06:24

      Yeah but if they are already heavily running on Windows and using Outlook for mail its a no brainer really.

      We run Windows, yes. But Outlook only two people actually use, everyone else uses the Web Portal. However, I wouldn't have a problem moving to Outlook. Just haven't done as the Web Portal seems to be a bit better and other things don't 100% sync (rules etc)

      • 

        Chaddy on 22/04/2023 - 23:06

        I think based on the fact that most of you prefer the google interface that you would be better off just sticking with Workspace. Find a partner who can give you cheaper pricing www.ventraip.com.au as an example.
        I prefer M365 personally but use Google Meet and Webmaster tools and such a fare bit but have a free Google account.
        Also use MS Teams which does integrate with Outlook and Edge. The web versions of the MS tools aren't quite as good as the desktop ones its the Opposit to google. I just prefer the desktop environment day to day.

        • 

          geekcohen on 23/04/2023 - 06:42

          @Chaddy:

          I think based on the fact that most of you prefer the google interface that you would be better off just sticking with Workspace.

          I only use the Google interface because its better than using the Google Sync tool with outlook which I find a bit buggy and sluggish.

          Find a partner who can give you cheaper pricing www.ventraip.com.au as an example.

          I'd rather go with Microsoft directly. I've worked in the web hosting space and not keen on doing that. Plus, I had an issue with a client who went with a partner and it killed their email briefly after the transition.

          Also use MS Teams which does integrate with Outlook and Edge. The web versions of the MS tools aren't quite as good as the desktop ones its the Opposit to google. I just prefer the desktop environment day to day.

          Edge, yuck……. But thanks for the heads up.

          • 

            Chaddy on 23/04/2023 - 16:25

            @geekcohen: Newer version of Edge is built on Chromium anyway so it works identical to Chrome.
            Some orgs I know of prefer to use Google Workspace on a daily basis hence some of my comments.
            Wasn't sure if you were just looking at pricing rather then functionality. One thing I will say is the default spam filtering with Office365 isn't as good as Googles by a long shot. Unless you buy the Microsoft 365 Premium license which comes with Defender for Business.
            If your just using the Standard license you will either need to buy the Defender add on or use an alternative spam filter.
            This is why we charge slightly higher as we bundle in backups on a daily basis and spam filtering as well as Virus filtering as well which prevents a lot of issues.
            Microsoft 365 isn't backed up by default you need to setup retention policies or use a third party backup tool, or in the case of some of our clients do a bit of both.

• 

  Chaddy on 23/04/2023 - 00:53

  Its Microsoft we are talking about so you will get downtime, nothing ever goes smoothly.
  Also the support is based overseas in China for the most part Microsoft365 goes down at least once or twice a year for several hours without fail. I say this while my business is also a Microsoft partner.
  I mean if your business is fully integrated with Microsoft and Windows then all well and good, just have some redundancy for when it goes down unexpectedly.
  This depends what your doing and how critical the operation is as well, also you didn't mention the amount of users.
  If its a few hundred users I would stick with Google Workspace particularly if your business relies on it.
  Talk to a partner if pricing is an issue as partners can do cheaper rates for Google Workspac. Also if your a Google partner already talk to one of the Distributors such as Dicker Data as you get volume discounts through them.
  This would be far better then messing around with retail pricing.
  Plus you can then on sell it to customers.

  • 

    geekcohen on 23/04/2023 - 06:45

    Its Microsoft we are talking about so you will get downtime, nothing ever goes smoothly.

    It can, if you plan it.

    Also the support is based overseas in China for the most part Microsoft365 goes down at least once or twice a year for several hours without fail. I say this while my business is also a Microsoft partner.

    So their support is just as good as Google's then? Annoyingly bad?

    If its a few hundred users I would stick with Google Workspace particularly if your business relies on it.

    Nah, it is 10 users but we have 18 mailboxes

    Plus you can then on sell it to customers.

    Been there and done that, such an annoying process and supporting people is a nightmare. We tell people to go elsewhere, we can provide a recommendation but we don't want to deal with the headaches of billing, support etc.

    We did it in the past with Hosting and it was painful. It was started before I joined and then when I joined, we moved people away to reduce the support requirement. Plus, due to billing, it wasn't actually making money. The billing was being missed so some clients were getting free hosting.

    • 

      Chaddy on 23/04/2023 - 15:53

      That is fare enough, if works for us because we bundle M365 with the hosting and charge a premium for both as its a fully managed service. Its also why most migrations are scheduled late at night to try and avoid any downtime or disruption for clients services.
      The tricky part is ISPs that ignore the TTL that you set on DNS, such as Telstra instead of respecting the 5 minutes or less TTL some ISps won't change DNS for a number of hours which can lead to issues from time to time. Plus Microsoft themselves like to introduce random bugs with the system.
      Though all the major cloud providers have issues from time to time, this is where good planning does come in. Plus the use of hybrid systems can help as well, depending on the org.

• 

  Chaddy on 23/04/2023 - 16:02

  With M365 you can get Aliases for free, so [email protected] can just be an alias that points to [email protected] as an example.
  That way you only need to pay for 10 or 11 licenses instead of 18.