Poor Driving or Poor Road Design?

THL on 03/05/2023 - 22:45

Hi all,

Just want to do a poll on this intersection I drive pass everyday.

Context: the lane I'm in becomes a left turn only lane after traffic lights and the lanes adjacent are through lanes. I always move into this lane as early as possible and join the queue. It does queue quite far back during peak hours (maybe 200m).

Usually when others indicate I'll just let them in. However at this location, me and many others have done the right thing by choosing our lane early and slowly move forward to the front of the queue, only for others like this black van who cut in/force their way in from the adjacent lane, essentially jumping the queue. Hence in the video I wasn't keen to allow the van to merge in front of me, after waiting for my turn for 5 mins+.

Should I have just let them in? Or simply a result of poor road design?

Dash cam video here: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1yw-KG3ooCFDZIfzxF62pdnk6DWE…

Poll Options expired

  • 4
    Poor road design
  • 22
    Just let them in - no big deal
  • 71
    Stay close and don't let them in - they should've joined the back of queue like everyone else
Automotive

Comments

  • mskeggs on 03/05/2023 - 22:55
    +12

    When I have a terminal illness I will spend my final days standing next to that turn lane with a handgun, enforcing courteous merging.

  • Benoffie on 03/05/2023 - 23:09
    +10

    Like tossers who see road works merging a mile off, lanes of traffic moving and see the 'free lane' as Moses parting the Red Sea just for them.

    • ESEMCE on 04/05/2023 - 10:40
      +7

      No, the early mergers are the tossers.
      Merge at the merge point, not before.

      It means more efficient road use and faster throughput through the constriction.
      https://arstechnica.com/cars/2014/07/the-beauty-of-zipper-me…

      In this scenario, there is no merge point.
      So the merging driver is;
      1) aware of the road design but unwilling to wait so is being a dick trying to cut in
      2) unfamiliar with the road design.

      Arguably it's poor road design more than anything, but adding a merge point would worsen straight traffic efficiency so not really beneficial either.

      • boretentsu on 06/05/2023 - 22:18

        I used to think that late mergers were aholes but I now agree with this point of view. You are using all the available road which is actually a good thing. The issue becomes if you use a lane that has become a left/right turn as a runway ahead. In Sydney, citybound Westlink Balmain Rd left turn lane springs to mind.

  • AustriaBargain on 03/05/2023 - 23:11
    +2

    Nice try, you're not getting my Google account name by baiting me with delicious dash cam footage…

    • THL on 03/05/2023 - 23:24

      Should be good to view now without logging in

      • Stopback on 03/05/2023 - 23:32
        -2

        So this is brunsun in melb cbd?

        Okay your the idiot.

        The road design is bad that it's hard to tell. So you are the bad driver.

        • THL on 04/05/2023 - 11:59

          Thanks for your opinion - really adding value to this discussion.

          • Stopback on 04/05/2023 - 13:39

            @THL: I looked at Google maps and the street then formed my options. Then you also got my email.

            Some people just do see the work I do

        • ThithLord on 04/05/2023 - 15:27
          +1

          Okay your the idiot.

          You're.

  • ram4ram on 03/05/2023 - 23:13
    +1

    So far, 1 for Poor design, and 5 for "Don't let them in"

    Guess who voted Poor design - me. FYI I did not watch the video, jsut read the description.

    My reason:

    SOmetimes, noobs don't know that some roads are like left turn only lanes, and just go for the 'free' lanes, especially during peak traffic… Just go for the empty lane. Then they realise, "Oh sh it, it's a left turn only, I hope someone lets me in, I've made a mistake, I won't do it again".

    There's a similar road in Pacific Highway near Wahroonga NSW. During peak traffic, the 3 way lane becomes clogged, but one of the lanes get merged at the end. Why people don't use this lane, I have no idea. Just "courtesy" / just not wanting to merge at the end? Anyway, NOT using this free lane causes traffic to build up even longer. If you use it, you've 'skipped' the 'line' by 500 metres. But you really didn't 'skip' any 'line' - it's a merge lane that no one uses, which causes even more traffic. Hope that makes sense.

  • Stopback on 03/05/2023 - 23:20
    -3

    While you are in the right. Because cars drive slow there is normally space near the exit. Where you can turn into to beat the queue.

    Doesn't work for all exits but it's a nice trick.

    Use it for the westgate bridge to CBD.

    Works well when there are many traffic lights

    • Skyllian Blitz on 03/05/2023 - 23:33
      +5

      If someone can find the gap and safely merge then more power to them and I myself have no issue with that. It's idiots who slow down in adjacent lanes and shove their way in that are a menace. Like there's 3 car lengths of gap behind me that you could have slotted in, I'm not (profanity) letting you push in front.

  • pegaxs on 03/05/2023 - 23:35

    All I see is two idiots playing chicken with each other like morons trying to out do each other with their collective stupidity.

    And you let them in?? Only allowing them to reinforce their bad behaviour… should have rode it out to it’s inevitable conclusion, exchanging numbers on the side of the road with two scratched up cars all over both of your egos.

    Next time, just let them run into you to teach them a lesson and let insurance sort it out.

    • idonotknowwhy on 04/05/2023 - 07:54

      And you let them in??

      It looks like they pushed in eventually. How could you not let them in at that point without a collision?

      Anyway, no wonder the traffic is always (profanity) up around that area. Google Maps should just add an extra +5 minutes when you have to drive through there, rather than "heavier than usual traffic" every time.

      • pegaxs on 04/05/2023 - 09:45
        +1

        Sorry, I forgot the </s> tag.

  • Pelicannn on 03/05/2023 - 23:39

    Burn em'

    /s

  • Eeples on 04/05/2023 - 00:50
    -1

    Queue jumpers. I let them in and honk (legally to show my position) at the same time.

    Usually I get the finger. I love it.

  • altomic on 04/05/2023 - 00:54

    swan st + punt rd.

    has been a disaster ever since they tore down Tigers Used Cars showroom.

  • scrambledeggs on 04/05/2023 - 06:30
    -4

    Just let people get in your lane you absolute peanuts, are you really going to be upset about being 1 car length further away from home, OMG

    • idonotknowwhy on 04/05/2023 - 07:52
      +1

      Let them in before the intersection and you risk getting caught by the red light.
      Let them in (illegally) mid-intersection and you risk blocking it if the light goes red.

      • scrambledeggs on 04/05/2023 - 07:53

        Boohoo, I hit a red light and it took 2 minutes longer to drive somewhere

        • idonotknowwhy on 04/05/2023 - 10:36

          That's cool, then say "are you really going to be upset about it taking 2 minutes longer to drive somewhere" rather than "1 car length further away from home"

    • Almost Banned on 04/05/2023 - 11:25
      +2

      The pusher-inners are not just screwing you - they are screwing everyone else who is in the correct lane. And it encourages more people to do it too.
      Would you feel the same way letting people into a queue to order food or drinks at a big event when there's a clear line of people?
      So why is it different for cars?

      • scrambledeggs on 04/05/2023 - 13:02
        +1

        Straw man argument, not the same thing.

        Some people don't know the road, some people were in that lane because they merged into it from another on ramp, some people have tried 10 times to move across but 5x aholes haven't let them in yet and they're forced to make a move. It does not hurt you to just let them in.

        Using all available road space helps the flow of traffic.

  • doctordv8 on 04/05/2023 - 07:41
    +4

    Most drivers are just ignorant higher than thou scum and know their time is way more important than yours.

    Let them in to avoid the idiots that will touch paint or start Road Raging even they are in the wrong.

    Forgive these idiots for they know not what they do, some are just lost and do not know the road.

    Holding your road space can cause you to tailgate and cause a rear end collision.

    Keep off the horn. They know they are wrong, and yes, they can see you. This is not an Emergency Warning moment.

    The van driver was wrong to even try. Crossed a Solid Lane Divider line, change Lanes mid Intersection, and failed to complete Indicating during the lane change.

    Van driver…all drivers that do this….learn ALL the Road Rules, follow ALL the Road Rules, be Courteous and remember the No ! Rule - Do everything in your ability to avoid an incident or collision, regardless who is in the right or wrong.

    If all else fails, Deploy Tyre Spikes please.

  • kolorijo on 04/05/2023 - 08:16
    +1

    Let them in and move on with your life. It is better that way. You'll never know what type of psycho you encounter on the road so best to avoid them all. You have your whole life to live for.

  • tomleonhart on 04/05/2023 - 08:49
    +2

    All that and the van still gets in regardless. Just accept people are ahole and let the ahole in.

    • Stopback on 04/05/2023 - 08:54

      Get insurance on a beater

  • Euphemistic on 04/05/2023 - 09:06
    +1

    There a number of factors involved and in any one instance you just don’t know wether the other driver is incompetent or a jerk.

    Poor road design, but that’s exacerbated by heavy traffic volumes that no amount of road building will solve. (Only temporary until demand rises). No idea how to solve this issue.

    Poor driving. Failure to plan ahead and merge, or simply not being aware enough that they are in the wrong lane. Plenty of times I’ve been distracted and forgotten where I’m headed and need to change lanes at the last minute. There’s also drivers that are to scared to merge like a zipper and change lanes a doze car lengths back from the zip point which slows everyone down as well.

    Aggressive driving. Must get in front attitude that leads to ‘queue jumping’. This type of driver is smug in the attitude when they get ahead of just one car not realising that the gains are insignificant. imagine how good they feel when passing more!

    I regularly use the ‘spare lane’, but only if it’s an unbroken lane line, not a solid line you aren’t meant to cross. I do this especially if there’s a long queue of cars. I won’t force my way to the end, but pick a natural gap at some point near the zip. If someone gets snarky, I’ll pick another gap. On the other hand, if I’m in the queue and a car wants to merge I’ll let them in - except if they are forcing their way in and there’s a suitable gap behind me. Allowing a zipper merge (even if they are QuEuE JuMPinG) just allows traffic to flow better.

    Learning to breathe and let it go when a d-head pushes in somewhere just means the rest of us can get along with moving slowly in traffic instead of fuming and blocking and making life miserable.

  • melbourne guy on 04/05/2023 - 10:17
    +1

    One main issue with going from Punt into Brunton is from those who have come from south of the river, as they need to merge across into the lane after the freeway traffic has merged into Punt Road. It's part poor road design but yeah you need to leave a little less gap in front of you to discourage these types of drivers.

    • Stopback on 04/05/2023 - 10:52

      Its bad road design/ sinage - the signs before brunton make it seem like you can go to brunton av/ city by just going straight

    • THL on 04/05/2023 - 11:57
      +1

      That merge from freeway off ramp def makes it worse. Most people will still try to do the right thing to move into the left lane early but some decide to jump to the front of the queue.

  • trapper on 04/05/2023 - 12:23

    If he wants to change lane then it's on him to do so legally and safely. ie, Wait for a gap rather than wedging in.

    But if you're intentionally slowing down and speeding up to block another car from changing lane then you're also acting dangerously.

  • bobbified on 04/05/2023 - 13:03
    +2

    It's a shit design. Very shit design. There seems to be a few similar intersections like that around Melbourne.

    It's good to keep in mind that some people don't drive around the city very often and often don't realise which lane they need to be in until the last minute. I usually just let people in out of courtesy. No need to get annoyed at everything/everyone. Keeps my stress levels down.

    Besides, I'd rather not damage my car - regardless of who's fault it may be. haha

  • Chris Topher on 04/05/2023 - 13:32

    The 1 in 10 driver.

    9 out of every ten drivers can be, or are, total inconsiderate ignoramances. There was four more in front of you and four more behind you. Are those numbers correct?

  • sidesw1pe on 04/05/2023 - 13:42
    +1

    Should I have just let them in?

    Naturally there is no right or wrong here, everybody will have an opinion so just go with whatever feels OK for you.

    The way I look at is this.
    There are drivers who think that they are special and shouldn't have to wait in the queue like everybody else.
    They will bypass the queue by driving up in the adjacent lane, throw on their indicator, and expect the other drivers to let them in.
    From what I've observed, there is always somebody who will let them in. So they've learned that this behaviour is OK.
    So, when somebody tries to do this to me, I see it as an education session, where I teach them that when they try to cheat it doesn't always turn out the way they'd like.

  • garffi on 04/05/2023 - 17:45
    +2

    Omg I hate this road. On the odd occasion I decide to drive to the city, I always forget which lane to stay in and miss this exit because I didn't want to cut in.

  • hippieyippie on 06/05/2023 - 21:07

    The van is doing the right thing. Multiple youtube videos explaining why the van was right and you are wrong.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35byJxDIX88&ab_channel=Chedd…

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mmSTSj_OMpA&t=293s&ab_channe…

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wHP6CddYS18&ab_channel=Conqu…

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