Best Cities to Live in The USA

ty99234 on 26/08/2023 - 15:50
Last edited 29/08/2023 - 13:35

Hey guys,

I work in the Tech industry and I'm considering taking advantage of the E3 visa and move to the US with my partner (no kids yet) to work and live for a few years.
I would like to focus on applying for jobs in five cities/regions and sincerely hope to land a job in any of them.

Currently, based on the number of job listings I found on LinkedIn; I picked a few cities that I like and have reasonable amount of job openings.

City/Region 24 hours 7 days
California (entire state) 1002 4365
Dallas 509 1979
Boston 441 1721
Atlanta 424 1716
Seattle 412 1634
Chicago 447 1561
Denver 361 1449
Austin 366 1443
RTP (North Carolina) 337 1297
Charlotte 315 1275

I personally lean towards the following cities/regions:

California:
Pros: After all, it's home to Silicon Valley, a place I've always aspired to be. The climate is decent and somewhat similar to Sydney; Highest income.
Cons: High taxes, high cost of living, possibly high crime rate.

Seattle:
Pros: Close to Vancouver and Portland (tax-free), lower taxes than California; Highest income.
Cons: High cost of living, gloomy in winter, less sunshine, possibly high crime rate.

Dallas/Austin:
Pros: Lower taxes, lower cost of living; Dallas has a major AA hub, making travel convenient.
Cons: Possibly lots of bugs? Hot and humid summers, and very sunny; Slightly lower income

RTP (North Carolina) and Charlotte:
Pros: Great climate, said to be therapeutic; low cost of living, good public safety.
Cons: High state taxes, lower income, possibly lots of bugs due to many trees?

Based on the fact that US topics are quite popular here, I'd like to kindly ask almighty Ozbarginers for their opinions on the above table and the cities I'm leaning towards. Are there any pros and cons I haven't considered, or any other cities I should think about?

I understand the current job market and US's gun control & crime rate is bad, terribly bad. But I do have to move away from my family due to some "issues".

Travel North America United States

Comments

            • morse on 28/08/2023 - 20:04

              @trapper: The population of the US is about 13 times higher than Australia. I suspect it’s that homeless people with substance issues tend to concentrate in certain areas in the US. So if you avoid those areas you’ll most likely be fine. I’ve asked my brother who lives in the states about this (I was like “hey, it’s all looking a bit dysutopian over there”) and he says there's a big media push to amplify issues of crime, drugs and homelessness to make the Biden administration look bad. He was surprised it was making Australian media. It’s not that there aren’t issues, but it’s easy to make things look significantly worse than they are. We also have a lot of people living in tents in Australia, but it’s in caravan parks, under bridges etc all over the place. We’re also fortunate fentanyl hasn’t become an issue, but alcohol, amphetamines and opioids are a really problem in Australia.

              • trapper on 28/08/2023 - 22:33
                +2

                @morse:

                The population of the US is about 13 times higher than Australia.

                Read carefully, my comment was regarding only a single state, not the whole country.

                There are 15x more people living on the streets in the state of California than in the entire nation of Australia.

                This is not 'around the same' as Australia, it is astronomically worse.

                • morse on 29/08/2023 - 04:51

                  @trapper: The data doesn’t support this. The official homelessness rate is lower, adjust for counting (i.e doubling) roughly the same as Australia. Sure there’s condensed pockets in the US, but same in Australia, it’s just less visible due to our smaller population and cultural differences.

                  Anyway, my point is that OP has plenty of places to choose to live in the US where they are unlikely to step out into human faeces as per 7ekn00’s comment that I was responding to. I’ve encountered human faeces on the street in Sydney too. The entirety of the US isn’t the hell hole the media makes out - absolutely there’s issues, but there is in Australia too, like teenagers car jacking people and taking a machete to a security guard in suburban shopping malls. I’m just grateful we don’t have the gun culture and accessibility they do in the US.

          • nigel deborah on 28/08/2023 - 16:33
            +2

            @morse: That's due to differences in who is considered homeless and how they are counted. In big cities, the real homelessness rate (people living on the street) is an order of magnitude higher, and this is obvious to anyone visiting major US cities (some worse than others of course).

  • dBagDealer on 26/08/2023 - 23:25
    +1

    I am thinking of doing the same, OP. Have you had much luck garnering the interest of a potential sponsor through linkedin yet?

    • ty99234 on 27/08/2023 - 00:30

      Not yet, as mentioned in the post “I would like to focus on applying for jobs in five cities/regions”, so I’m still in the cities choosing phase:p

      • Kangal on 28/08/2023 - 20:53
        +4

        I was in your shoes back in 2019.
        The standouts for me was North Carolina, in particular Raleigh as it's a No-Tax-State meaning you could save money quickly. The weather is pleasant. And you are well situated to take roadtrips drive towards Pitts, DC, Philly, New York. Or if you're missing the beach there's Nag Heads, Virginia Beach, and Ocean City.

        The other alternative was Washington State, in particular Vancouver, again as it is a No-Tax-State. The weather is not-bad, it's kind of like Hot California if you removed the Hot. It's a short drive to Portland, Oregon which is a big hub major city. And from Vancouver you can drive to mountains for hiking and mountain biking, you get some nice Christmas Snow, and it is only a 1-2hr drive from the beach. By the beach I mean the Pacific Ocean, however, all the photos look grey that's because it is. You get the nice Surfers Paradise beach but it's overcast, not too-windy, but definitely not-hot-beach.

        There's a lot of crime in both cities, but less than the USA average. But it's still orders of magnitude much higher than Australia. That was the reasoning I didn't go. I was in your exact situation.

        At the time, I calculated that cost of living there was actually lower (rent, drinks, food, electricity, fuel, car, insurance, healthcare). However people have been saying it is now the opposite way, with USA being on-parity (or even higher) than Aus for everything except Rent. I also calculated that homeownership is much easier. Where it is around x30 your annual salary here, over there it is around x10 your annual salary. Plus there's a lot of cheating you can do with the tax system there.

        My advice is that you should do as much research as possible. You've got a lot of useful hints in this comment and others here. After you've done all of that, you should go on a 5-week vacation there, and suss it out in person. You may realise it's not for you. Or you may narrow your options from 5 or 2 cities down to just 1 city for example. You can also try networking while you are there. It is a big move, so you need to vacuum as much information as you can while you visit. Hope it all works out for you : )

        • ty99234 on 28/08/2023 - 21:22

          Thanks a lot. Great insights!

        • AlienC on 28/08/2023 - 21:43

          Wow this was really helpful great read.

          Yeah it seems saving for a house and overall income potential is higher in the states compared to here but the obvious drawback is higher crime and being exposed to American events.

  • Seaword on 27/08/2023 - 04:07
    +8

    I would look at Denver, and Boulder if you can swing it. Colorado gets snowy winters but still plenty of sun. Heaps to do outdoors and its a pretty relaxed part of America. United has a big hub there so it would be an east hop to LAX or SFO if you were coming out to Aus. Probably more money elsewhere but as someone who has travelled a lot in the states this is the only place I would live. (Would live in NY if I had mega bucks.)

  • jjjaar on 27/08/2023 - 06:10
    +10

    If you’re a woman or identify as LGBTQIA+, or planning to go with someone that is, I would strongly suggest avoiding the southern states where your access to safe medical care is compromised.

  • Lunarboogie on 27/08/2023 - 08:07
    +2

    Good on you OP for having the courage to explore the world and get out of your comfort zone. We only live once so live it to the full if you can.

    I reckon all those places will have their own pros and cons. But for me, I'd err on the smaller sized cities of up to 3 million to avoid congestion and all the bad things about living in a metropolis, while still enjoying good amenities. I was watching the SBS food channel the other day and they aired a program on the rejuvenation of the food scene in Pittsburgh. Looked incredible and had me thinking I needed to visit. Cincinatti, Milwaukee, Boston and others are in that ilk. Good luck.

  • Sinnerator on 27/08/2023 - 08:46
    +2

    I think you have an AWESOME opportunity.
    Do it.
    Just research what areas you would want to live in first, because as everyone else has pointed out they have a problem with crime, guns and drugs.
    If you live a very Middle Class lifestyle over there then you are 'mostly' safe and will have a great experience.

  • 2esc on 27/08/2023 - 09:15
    +1

    Never even considered visiting America but if i had to the 2 on your list that jump out as the best options are Dallas and Seattle.

    • CurlCurl on 27/08/2023 - 12:00

      More people live in CA 39,000,000 than in Australia 26,000,000.

      It is not the place to live.

    • Protractor on 30/08/2023 - 09:30

      Going by stats around 'safety' I'd skip Dallas.

  • LFO on 27/08/2023 - 12:08
    +2

    Sorry but sounds a bit unrealistic, in particular for the USA.

    Workers are supposed to WORK, lots and LOTS of hours.
    The more you get paid the more it will be expected from you.
    Remember the motto from the founders of Cisco: show commitment working at least 100 hours a week.

    So, the place might be spectacular but chances are only a few are able to enjoy that 'spectacularity'.
    New York City is THE place to live … if you are a billionaire with servants and bodyguards. And not many principles, few or non human values.

    I have good friends in San Francisco and Los Angeles and none of them rejoice in living there. They are passionate about the utterly demanding work they do, how rewarding it is and how much more they achieve WORKING there … but NOT about living the lifestyle of the place.

    As an experience? A resounding YES but don't fiddle too much about where it will be. It will only be for a short time.

    Happy adventure!!

    • ty99234 on 27/08/2023 - 13:31

      Thanks for your input. I'm aware of the workplace culture, and I admit that moving to the US is a significant gamble. It's very possible that our lifestyle may not improve. That's why we're considering working/living in the US for only a few years and then coming back to raise our kids.

      • od1n on 29/08/2023 - 09:41
        +1

        I also would really like to have that much confidence you have regarding your job prospects. Dog days are over and tech jobs with good offers are pretty scarce these days. You will be competing with people who already have a lot of experience and are not "immigrants" (even though it sounds like you are an immigrant from the relevant culture).
        Some people already mentioned waves of lay-offs in big tech, and I kid you not, they are not even over. Worse than that, in the states you are going to have at-will employment, which means that you can be fired any moment (unfortunately happened to a lot of my overseas pals in big 4 regardless of their importance/experience). Also many companies started pushing people to return to office (or even return to the team hub) so bigtech companies may simply ignore you until you are located in Cali or or Seattle.

        Absolutely not telling you off, but very likely you won't have that much flexibility as you expect.

        • ty99234 on 29/08/2023 - 10:12

          Thanks for your insights. I'm totally aware of how tough the job market is at the moment. Securing a decent offer might take me several months or even years unless there's an unexpected economic turnaround (which seems unlikely). But I'll give it a shot.

  • martywins on 27/08/2023 - 14:10
    +9

    I would recommend Boulder, CO. It’s a short drive outside of Denver. Locals refer to the Boulder Bubble because it’s a small enclave of wealth and a leftist town in a mostly rural, right state.

    It is a mini Silicon Valley with everything needed for a thriving tech ecosystem. Most of the big players (Google, Twitter/X, Meta) have offices there. There are plenty of startups and VCs.

    It’s close enough to Denver that you can enjoy American Baseball, Football, Ice Hockey and American Football.

    Boulder is a University town, with great foodie/restaurant scene and incredible craft breweries. At the foothills of the Rocky Mountains you will get hiking, climbing, skiing, etc. unlike anything in Australia.

    300 days of sun a year, so it snows but then will be sunny for days or weeks afterwards.

    • bulletbill88 on 29/08/2023 - 07:27

      Boulder is awesome. Definitely my pick of USA spots.

  • aik on 27/08/2023 - 21:21
    +1

    I've checked Austin/TX (everything they do indoor is good/great, they just do not get out), Seattle/Redmond/WA (wonderful very green nature, good coffee) and LosAltos/SFBA/CA (lovely Sydney-like climate, decent infrastructure), stayed for a week or two at friends places just to see it from the inside (well, weeks is not much but still). The SFBA is alright and even Seattle is if you are keen to snow (I am not).
    Have not moved there as I could not get 500k$ job offer :-) And 250k$ is not worth it considering the cost of living and lack of swimmable beached in driving distance, and aforementioned guncontrol.

    • morse on 28/08/2023 - 01:39
      +1

      Would the exchange rate not be enticing at the moment? If OP currently earns $250k AUD, if they got an offer of $250k USD, that’s $390k AUD. Cost of living is high but not especially more so than in Aus. So whatever OP saved would be worth more. I can imagine this would be really useful for paying off mortgages on any investment properties in Aus. Or just for buying more investments of any kind.

      • localhost on 29/08/2023 - 11:43

        Linkedin is full with $250k jobs :) AUD or USD. It's more like $80-100k

  • truebunny on 27/08/2023 - 22:40
    +3

    depends what you want, do look at zillow to see avg rents and house process in each of the cooties and how much you will be commuting each day. I would say RTP area if your focus is family, if your focus is growth then SF/Seattle

  • od810 on 27/08/2023 - 23:08
    +1

    It really depends on how much you get. I know my company has different salary bands in for different locations. The consensus is to live in medium cost of living cities, so excluding SF NY LA. Ideally live in the states without income tax (maybe Austin). I know CA has stupidly high tax.

    You will get massive boost in total package, but depending on where you live, expense could be very high too. The US folks in my company (CA) gets double what we get here in australia for the same level. And by australian standard, we are one of the top tier employers in term of compensation.

    EDIT: oh i forgot… You might have to do in office jobs, so that really limit your choice to probably SF, Seattle and NY in term of compensation and jobs availability. I would pick Seattle. Maybe try to see if you can apply to one of those fully remote jobs. I know my company does it in the US

  • johndoe789 on 28/08/2023 - 00:49

    I have only visited the US twice, if I was still in my youth I would probably spend a couple of years in New York city, the energy there is just insane (also close to Europe!)

  • shaybisc on 28/08/2023 - 08:28

    Charlotte's climate doesn't look great to me.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlotte%2C_North_Carolina

  • AlienC on 28/08/2023 - 08:29
    +1

    I have a good friend in North Carolina near Chapel Hill and he says that his area is very nice to live in albeit more expensive than other areas.

    Always says good things about his area.

    I think your summaries and pros and cons are pretty spot on when thinking back to conversations with many Americans from those areas.

  • morebunnings on 28/08/2023 - 08:29

    I'd hit up Denver if you're into Nature and Skiing. Easy to live a healthy & fulfilling lifestyle there. Was not too much homelessness when I was there (pre-covid).

    I'd be weary of Seattle. Quite a lot of drug and homeless issues.

  • samyall on 28/08/2023 - 08:33

    If you are from Sydney then I would suggest Boston/NYC. They are very different to Sydney climate-wise which makes it more interesting for a short-ish stay and will make you very happy to come home.

    Both cities are amazing to live in (but not cheap) so you will get the most out of your time there.

    • ty99234 on 28/08/2023 - 09:13

      Very true, I did some research on Boston's rental price and it looks insane. Boston's winter is much colder than Sydney's though.

      • samyall on 28/08/2023 - 10:55
        +2

        I did 6 months in Boston and while it is dark and cold in winter, their houses are insulated and its very cosy. People from cold places complain that they have never been as cold as they were in a Sydney winter because we live in tents.

        I highly recommend giving proper seasons a try - its a very interesting experience.

        Plus Boston is very safe (for the US) and Mass is a progressive state so it is nicer to live in than many other states.

  • shaybisc on 28/08/2023 - 08:42
    +2

    In fact it is remarkable how bad the climate is in most American cities compared to Sydney or even Melbourne. They are either freezing cold or boiling hot or both. Austin, for example, which looks like a great place to live … apart from the climate.

  • ruddiger7 on 28/08/2023 - 09:01
    +1

    One of my friends who I used to work with (in tech) worked and lived in America for a while. I believe he said he worked in Chicago, San Fran, LA , Vegas and Salt Lake City. Surprisingly he said Salt Lake was the best place to live.

    • shaybisc on 28/08/2023 - 09:10

      Salt Lake City, hot and cold but at least it is very low humidity heat which is good. Then there is this:

      "Severe drought and water diversions have shrunk the Great Salt Lake by two-thirds and reduced it to its lowest recorded levels,[102] resulting in hundreds of square miles of dry lake bed and exposing millions of people living in the fast-growing metropolitan region to dust storms laced with arsenic and other toxic chemicals."

      Hmm

      • perfectlydark on 28/08/2023 - 09:59

        lol i remember driving past and thinking 'wheres the lake?'

  • perfectlydark on 28/08/2023 - 09:58
    +2

    Colorado was probably the only 'major' state I've been in that felt pretty safe, that said it was very expensive.

    I'd avoid the south eastern part of the country outright, and pretty much every major city. parts of the midwest can be OK with generally nicer people, but you of course have a lot of 'patriots' there, usually not quite as rabid as those in the south are though. States I would personally consider would be (in no real order)

    Utah
    Colorado
    Arizona
    Milwaulkee
    Nebraska

    I dont really want to move there at all though with kids, and my american wife really wants to (and seems to think the gun violence is 'exaggerated') but some parts would be ok to live in closer to retirement perhaps, assuming you set yourself up beforehand

  • caboose on 28/08/2023 - 10:04
    +1

    We lived in the Bay Area for 5 years which was extremely enjoyable and would recommend doing it. Lived in San Jose, Cupertino, and Mountain View - I worked in Palo Alto and wife worked in Menlo Park.

    No need to stay in San Francisco itself unless you're looking for city life, especially if work is in the peninsula. It is noticeably colder in SF, the rent is higher, and I would say there's a lot more 'flavour' in the city. Mountain View in particular feels very safe.

    Weather is actually much drier than in Sydney, much less humidity and while we were there we probably had less than 7 rainy days in a whole year.

    In terms of pay we found that it scales pretty well when comparing to Sydney costs, and were able to save a good amount while we were there. Food is probably actually cheaper, with the caveat of tip culture being an annoying money sink.

    National parks are also amazing in the west. Some of the most beautiful places in the world.

    • try2bhelpful on 28/08/2023 - 10:42

      Great post.

      Mark Twain once asserted "The coldest winter I ever spent was a summer in San Francisco."

      We took my mum to San Francisco and went into a restaurant. We decided to delay taking a shot of the Golden Gate Bridge until we got out. Not so much after the fog rolled in. We drove out from San Francisco, stayed at Yosemite a couple of days then down through the Sierra Nevada’s, Death Valley and then to Vegas. A trip well worth doing.

      The coast road from San Francisco to LA is worth the drive as well.

    • ty99234 on 28/08/2023 - 10:44

      Thanks for your input. What do you think of the safety in the Bay Area? I've heard it is generally not too bad if SF downtown and some particular bad suburbs are avoided.

      • shaybisc on 28/08/2023 - 11:37

        Few, if any, American cities or metro areas are grappling with the large scale of homelessness seen in the San Francisco Bay Area. Locally, the issue is front and center, too: 70 percent of San Francisco residents cite homelessness among the top three problems in the city.1 And while California is on track to become the fourth-largest economy in the world,2 it also hosts half of the unsheltered homeless population in the United States,3 with a significant share of the population concentrated in the Bay Area. On any given night, 38,000 individuals in the Bay Area are homeless, an increase of 35 percent since 2019.4

        https://www.mckinsey.com/industries/public-sector/our-insigh…

        • ty99234 on 28/08/2023 - 11:55

          I understand, that's why I mentioned to avoid SF downtown (metro area)

          • try2bhelpful on 28/08/2023 - 12:11
            +1

            @ty99234: It is unlikely you will live in downtown San Francisco. You won’t be able to afford it. With most big US cities you are better off a little but further out in the ‘burbs. The centres do seem to have issues with homeless people. When living in Atlanta we rarely travelled into the city centre. San Francisco does have a pretty good public transport system.

          • caboose on 28/08/2023 - 13:44
            +1

            @ty99234: I never felt that unsafe anywhere in the Bay Area, in the sense that I wasn't concerned that someone was going to pull a gun on me, but there are definitely areas which were rougher than others - Tenderloin, the north edge of the Mission district (there are tent cities in this area), and downtown Oakland come to mind, but generally I would say that I'd be comfortable living in city outside of those small pockets (not that I could ever justify the cost and extra commute - would have been great for going to Giants games though).

            I've had a few friends and colleagues who lived in SF proper - in Mission district, Dogpatch, Potero Hill, and the Marina district - and they've all enjoyed it (and they've had nice apartments), but long term they've mostly moved down to the Peninsula or out of state (partly due to the pandemic).

        • try2bhelpful on 28/08/2023 - 12:18

          Just wondering when the last time you stayed in San Francisco. Admittedly we were last there about ten years ago but most of the homeless people we saw just had signs asking for money. Market Street could be a tad interesting and you stayed away from certain parts of Golden Gate park but we didn’t see any violence. Would be interested in a first band update.

  • shaybisc on 28/08/2023 - 12:23
    +1

    Google employees have been known to live in the parking lot, sometimes for years. I don't know if they can still get away with it.

    https://www.businessinsider.com/why-google-employees-live-in…

  • TRAVELO on 28/08/2023 - 13:28

    Regarding your choice of cities, it seems like you've done some thorough research and have assessed the pros and cons quite effectively. Let's break it down:

    California: As the home of Silicon Valley, it holds immense potential for career growth in the tech industry. The climate is appealing and somewhat similar to Sydney, which could help with adjustment. However, the high taxes and cost of living are definitely factors to consider, as well as the potential for a high crime rate.

    Seattle: Proximity to Vancouver and Portland is a definite advantage, and the lower taxes compared to California is a plus. However, the higher cost of living and gloomy winters with less sunshine could be factors to keep in mind. Crime rates can also be a concern, so it's worth looking into specific neighborhoods in the city.

    Dallas/Austin: The lower taxes and cost of living in these cities are definite bonuses. Dallas's major AA hub could make travel more convenient for you. However, the hot and humid summers, along with lots of bugs, might not be as appealing. Personality-wise, Dallas and Austin offer contrasting experiences, so it's worth looking into which city aligns best with your preferences.

    RTP (North Carolina) and Charlotte: Great climate and a reputation for therapeutic conditions sound promising. The low cost of living and good public safety are definite advantages. However, the high state taxes and lower income compared to other cities might be a trade-off. As for the bugs, it's always good to research the specific areas you're considering.

    In terms of additional cities, you might want to explore other tech hubs like San Francisco, Boston, or New York City. Each has its own unique advantages and disadvantages, so it's worth widening your scope to consider them as well.

  • huwcar on 28/08/2023 - 15:44

    San Diego

  • rumblytangara on 28/08/2023 - 16:25

    C'mon, what is this? A blatant troll post or a serious question?

    If it's a serious question you've given zero information for anyone to answer with.

    For starters, what do you look for in a city, and are you moving with a family?

    Makes a huge difference to the potential answers.

    Anything else is going to generate wild guesses, personal bias on politics and arguments about random violence.

  • somebody123 on 28/08/2023 - 16:29

    How easy is it to get e3 visa once you have a job offer?

    • ty99234 on 28/08/2023 - 19:52

      If the company agreed on sponership when giving out the job offer, it's generally pretty easy to get e3 and the company will cover the legal costs.

  • gromit on 28/08/2023 - 18:17
    +4

    Be careful comparing job numbers that way. You need to take into account population, e.g. Dallas has a pop of about 1.3m while California has a pop of nearly 40 million or about 30 times the population. So California double the vacancies but 30 times the number of people competing for those jobs (both have similar rates of unemployment).

    • Protractor on 30/08/2023 - 09:53

      Isn't that comparing a state to a city?

      • gromit on 30/08/2023 - 17:42

        yes it is, but that is exactly what he is doing. the warning is you can't look at raw numbers and compare without taking the population into account as 1000 vacancies but 1000000 applicants is very different to 1000 vacancies and 2000 applicants. If you divorce the population from the numbers you have no basis for comparison.

        • Protractor on 30/08/2023 - 17:43

          I hope he's better at his job than he is at data ,then

    • Soothsayer on 31/08/2023 - 14:24

      1.3M is only counting the city of Dallas itself, most thinking of "Dallas" in terms of population would think of the DFW metroplex which is closer to 8M people, and many of those jobs are distributed outside of Dallas city itself in outer counties like Richardson, Plano, Arlington, Allen and Fort Worth.

      Dallas is a huge metropolitan sprawl, much bigger than any Australian metro area.

  • try2bhelpful on 28/08/2023 - 23:13
    +1

    The reality is if you move overseas then, if your parents are controlling, they will come and visit and expect to stay with you. Given the long distance they are likely to want to stay for a couple of weeks. Particularly if you do have kids. I would still consider interstate rather than overseas. They are likely to stay for a shorter visit.

  • wizzlesticks on 29/08/2023 - 04:08

    What I've found about living in the US is that specific location matters. For example, St Louis is considered by many to be unsafe, but greater St Louis (I stayed in Brentwood) I found to be more safe than a lot of cities in Australia. People so polite, cars that stop in the middle of a busy street to let you cross, very friendly and welcoming neighbours etc. Same goes for California, you have some very affluent and ritzy areas, but don't dare step foot into down town (e.g. LA or San Francisco) because they are absolute hell holes.

  • titewod on 29/08/2023 - 07:07
    +1

    Have you considered just moving to another city within Australia? We're desperately short of qualified Tech workers here in Oz and could use your skills!

  • serpserpserp on 29/08/2023 - 08:01
    +1

    Sounds like you're young without kids. If I were you I'd try moving to California and see how far up the food chain you get.

    I would also live in Seattle if you love the great outdoors and all types of weather. Yes it is gloomy, but the houses are built better and warmer and really like living in a small Melbourne but without the scorching summers.

    Personally at my age now with kids it would be North Carolina then Dallas. I'm really personally interested in living in the borderlands regions like El Paso etc.

    I probably wouldn't move there (USA) today because of gun control, wild political motivation, and extreme events (earthquakes, wild weather etc. Possible terrorist attacks). My work has a lot of jobs open in California and Nevada so I could move tomorrow really and still wouldn't go.

    If in my 20s and had the opportunity. Absolutely.

  • xdigger on 29/08/2023 - 12:12
    +2

    You can't access abortion legally in half of the US states. For those who lament the state of private healthcare in US, I expect Australia would be moving towards the expensive US model of private healthcare given we spend more on AUKUS ($368 billions before the typical Defence budget blowout) than Medicare and aged care combined, not to mention other social spendings. The ABC last week reported a whole town in Tasmania lost their last doctor due to poor healthcare fundings.

    https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-08-19/st-marys-gp-cyril-lat…

  • psycho-chicken on 29/08/2023 - 12:35

    My opinion, based on lots of USA travel, is:

    Chicago - bigger than Boston, smaller than NYC, cleaner than both. Love Chicago.
    Denver / Boulder
    Austin - blue city in a red state.
    Charlotte - beautiful southern city.
    Seattle - heaps of tech jobs, shit weather, great nature around tho.
    Boston
    California
    Atlanta
    Dallas

  • WarCreation on 29/08/2023 - 13:13
    +2

    This is a REALLY tough one to answer. I know having a good paying job is important but I'd recommend to look at what kind of lifestyle you want to have and what type of people you want to associate with; and that really depends on your own set of personal morals. I've lived in the US for a number of years and living in CA compared to TX compared to East coast are all going to be VERY different.

    If you don't have kids yet, give it a shot and live life a little. If you have kids, maybe look at staying in AUS as my personal suggestion.

    There will most definitely be a culture shock but the US is a great place for opportunity but there is also greater risk and minimal safety net in place if something goes wrong. I would also make sure you educate yourself and family heavily about the region you move into. If you have a strong Aussie accent most Americans will be very forgiving of any cultural slights. Good medical insurance is a must! Make sure you do your research before making any decisions. You are likely to be best off taking a job with slightly less money but better benefits. (As an example I had a friend's son have a rattlesnake bite and the medical bill was circa $1m!, thankfully insurance covered)

    Best of luck

  • TightAl on 29/08/2023 - 14:51
    +4

    It's amazing people on OzB are trying to justify the US as being not that bad. US rivals absolutely sh*t countries on having the worst statistics, gun deaths, drugs, deaths in a first world country from bad healthcare.

    Why people put USA on the pedestal is astonishing, apart from some huge tech companies, the govt has done nothing productive for their people in the last 15-20 years.

    All they've done is bring freedom to Muslim countries (Lmao and how well of a job they did at that). Don't believe me? Go take a ride on their rat fested subway system, wait you'll experience their third world country level airports well before then.

    • callum9999 on 30/08/2023 - 12:00
      +1

      The US is a great place to live if you're wealthy/find a high paying job and don't care about the poor. Most people don't hugely care in Australia either, but generally at least want the poor to have a basic level of dignity not present in the US. Developed cancer? Tough, you should have worked harder and got better insurance - enjoy your new home on the street.

      I find a lot of the immigrants it attracts have the same mentality (even if they're poor now, soon they're gonna be the rich guys). Not the OP necessarily of course.

  • cubestreamer on 29/08/2023 - 15:00
    +1

    Hey OP, I'm thinking about to do the same (probably next year ish)

    My reason is because I can't see any further career progression (as a software developer) in Australia. Compared to US the rate here is nothing. Even with higher hours/week, I'm happy to work harder for a few years & then can paid off my own house, instead of working 9 to 5 but has to do that for the next 30 years.

    I'm thinking either Seattle vs San Francisco in terms of the city (looking for a young family friendly places).

    Have you done much research on how are you going to look for a job? I'll probably start applying into FANG but as you probably know the interview process is very time consuming & need to be prepared a lot.

    • localhost on 29/08/2023 - 15:42
      -2

      If you are good developer $150k should be easy to get here. Unless you want to buy a $10M house I think should be good for average home in Sydney.

      • fefris on 29/08/2023 - 17:44

        be interested to understand what average home a single income 150K salary gets you currently.

        Median house price in Sydney is ~1.5 million.

        You are not getting a bank to lend you even 80% of that on a 150K salary, total boomer thinking that you even imagine this is possible

        • localhost on 29/08/2023 - 17:49

          Don't expect just after 2 months working you will enter the bank and get a home loan. Same in USA and don't think prices are cheaper there.
          But it's your call.
          Also everyone lives in house in Sydney :)

      • cubestreamer on 30/08/2023 - 08:27
        +2

        150k exclude super = 8,864/month after tax

        Assuming the house is 1 million with 20% deposit:
        800k mortgage with 6% interest & 30 years = 4806 monthly

        You only have surplus 4k per month, with food, car, council, bill, ozbargain expenses, there will be nothing left to pay off the mortgage faster & you might have to work forever.

        Meanwhile in the US:
        https://www.levels.fyi/t/software-engineer/locations/greater…

        Also the fact that AUD keeps dropping does not help. :)

        • localhost on 30/08/2023 - 09:40
          -1

          This site is based on what everyone put as a salary, not a real advertised jobs. Like everyone in WP forums is on $300k.

          See real job offers - https://www.indeed.com/jobs?q=software+engineer&l=Seattle%2C…

          More like $100-130k USD. Also I am not familiar with taxes and can't comment on that. Just don't be fooled by some sites, you might get a different offer.
          Also don't forget all those companies made redundant thousands of people in the last few months and now they would like to hire top of the top for half of the money :)

  • Marcsie on 29/08/2023 - 16:33

    Best ?
    None !

  • fefris on 29/08/2023 - 17:38

    Dallas, at least you can conceal carry and be one of the gun owners, given its the wild west, might as well dress the part

  • ass3ts on 29/08/2023 - 19:30

    Aspen in winter :)

  • ContinuousCustomer on 29/08/2023 - 20:00

    I’d like to do the same but I have 3 kids. If I were you, I’d definitely go.

  • jatbinks on 29/08/2023 - 20:13

    Why in the world would you want to move to the US.

    1. High crime rate, out of control police brutality and excessive racism
    2. Tech is great, but so is the turnover rate. You will be fired without a second thought. Everything is very mechanical.
    3. Tech is great, but so is the burnout. No work life balance.
    4. Tech salaries are good, but match the cost of living. San Fran is a hub for homeless for a reason.
    5. You can basically apply for the same FAANG job in Australia. Look for SE roles in Google, Amazon etc.
    • MrThing on 30/08/2023 - 09:08

      Shit medical care
      Disfunctional government
      Social unrest
      Massive inequality

      • Protractor on 30/08/2023 - 09:56

        He did make it great again!

        • MrThing on 30/08/2023 - 10:00

          Couldnt make it great in 4years, so better give him another 4years

          • Protractor on 30/08/2023 - 10:06

            @MrThing: Turn off the streaming,grab a wheelbarrow full of popcorn, and watch it implode.
            Pretty soon we'll be fishing American refugees out of the water.
            This time they better stop the boats properly. No excuse. We a have mixed AUKUS Armada in Darwin.
            Torpedos and all.
            Maybe we can resettle them in GITMO?

            • MrThing on 30/08/2023 - 12:38

              @Protractor: Nar send em to mexico

              So mexico can build a wall and do make mexico great again to keep the americans out

              • Protractor on 30/08/2023 - 12:46

                @MrThing: Build a wall out of US refugees, to keep other US refugees out??
                Like 'value adding'?

  • hopper on 29/08/2023 - 20:33

    North Carolina

  • ke14jl on 29/08/2023 - 20:52
    +1

    We lived in RTP for four years and work in tech too. Its a great place, lots of tech companies from small to large companies.

    The area can be quiet, no massive shopping malls. Great "balanced" weather. All four seasons equally have 3 months.

    It may be too far from Australia though if you need to fly back for vacation.

  • Eeples on 29/08/2023 - 22:33
    +1

    I recommend San Diego.

    Very much reminds me Australian Cities.

    An apartment around Little Italy would be nice.

    Balboa Park is great and the zoo reminds me of Taronga.

    Nice light rail. Even to the border to walk to Mexico for a day trip.

    Gaslamp area for a big night out.

    Coronado Island is lovely.

  • shaybisc on 30/08/2023 - 08:28

    I've got an American cousin employed by some company based in San Diego. She lives 90% of the time in a gated gringo community in Cancun.

  • MrThing on 30/08/2023 - 09:07
    +3

    None….America is a steaming pile of turd, no Australian with our quality of life should ever want to live there (unless you are very wealthy and wana step on some scummy poor people)

    • Protractor on 30/08/2023 - 09:36

      ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

      Given the current US military takeover of the top end, that's the place get top USD salaried tech jobs.

  • Protractor on 30/08/2023 - 09:27
    +1

    Go where the least guns are.
    Which I guess is a low 1.8 weapons per head.
    Put 'safety' on top of your list of wants

  • aussiekid on 30/08/2023 - 09:38
    +1

    Seattle:
    Pros: Close to Vancouver and Portland (tax-free), lower taxes than California; Highest income.
    Cons: High cost of living, gloomy in winter, less sunshine, possibly high crime rate.

    Petrol is one of the highest in the country, filled up between $4.99-5.20/gallon.
    Best places to live is on the east (Bellevue/Kirkland).
    If your really into the outdoors, Washington has some of the best Hiking and outdoor activities. Yeah winters can be rough but the summers are pretty good.
    Another thing to consider is Washington state is an AT WILL STATE in terms of employment.

  • callum9999 on 30/08/2023 - 11:53
    +1

    There's some great advice here but you should absolutely NOT be basing this move on some kind of pro/con list - you should be visiting these places first.

    I love the US and have been over a dozen times as a tourist, but no matter how good a city might seem on paper, there's no way in hell I'd ever consider living there. While it may seem superficially similar, the cultural differences are pretty staggering and I personally think it's a hellish place to live. It's really something you need to see for yourself to see if you can tolerate it.

  • MrThing on 30/08/2023 - 12:40
    +1

    Remember OP money is not everything if you have to make substantial quality of life sacrificies that money cant buy

  • cnrmlj on 30/08/2023 - 14:14

    San Diego

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