Rental Repairs - How Much Compensation Is Reasonable?

brooksnk on 19/09/2023 - 08:39
Last edited 21/09/2023 - 10:58 by 1 other user

Hi everyone, I rent a 2 bed 2 bath apartment with a balcony to myself.

Recently, the balcony had to be totally retiled and re-waterproofed due to leaking issues. This required 16 days of interference to complete those works. The apartment is a typical modern open-plan design - a balcony connected to a lounge room with a kitchen (and then the 2 bedrooms and bathrooms).

My lounge room became unusable and had to shift all my furniture to one end to make room for the tradesman to store the tools and equipment. Not all of those 16 days was work actively happening, but when there was, there was obviously a lot of noise and no privacy during those days (I typically work from home part-time). There was a lot of dust everywhere in the lounge and kitchen during the entire period, presumably from the tiles and the use of their machinery.

Just wondering what a fair amount of compensation from the landlord is for the loss of right to quiet enjoyment and space contracted for?

I pay $500 a week in rent.

Thanks.

UPDATE: for those curious: I ended up putting forward an offer of 50% rent value * 16 days and LL came back with an offer of $500 being 1 week worths of rent (so 50% * 14days) and agreed to that.

Home & Garden

Comments

    • brooksnk on 19/09/2023 - 10:19
      +2

      Fair enough. In my case, it's the entire living space, leaving only bedrooms habitable. I understand the practicalities of maintaining a good realtionship. The landlord offered to compensate in the first place because we have a good relationship. So in good faith on all parties, I was seeking other peoples opinions on what is a fair amount.

      • jv on 19/09/2023 - 10:28
        -3

        I was seeking other peoples opinions

        But start crying when the opinions are offered.

      • Lichen6420 on 19/09/2023 - 13:22
        -2

        It is my opinion that in good faith you should not claim compensation, yes it was annoying but sometimes that's life. It was a repair that was needed to maintain the property in good working order.

        It's already cost the landlord money and contrary to popular opinion not everyone has piles of cash laying around.

        • brooksnk on 19/09/2023 - 18:51

          It's his decision to repair the leak. The leak affects the neighbour below, not me. I couldn't care less. If an owner wants to rent out their property, but during that time, chooses to make intrusive repairs, that's on them is it not? If they choose to rent out the premises for a set amount of money, then the expectation is that they provide that premises as offered. I value my cash and pay the asked amount for this space because that's what I require. If I am not receiving the benefits of my consideration, then compensation for that is standard protocol in any contract.

          • Lichen6420 on 19/09/2023 - 19:23
            +3

            @brooksnk: It sounds like your mind is well and truely made up and your not really here to gauge the opinion of others. Your here to vent your frustrations of how hard done by your are and how much you don’t give a shit about the downstairs neighbours.

            So the answer to your question of how much to attempt to claim in compensation is yours alone to answer.

            However don’t be surprised when your not offered a lease renewal or your rent is increased.

            • brooksnk on 19/09/2023 - 19:36

              @Lichen6420: Some people here are suggesting that the repairs were done for me - no, they weren't, and that's why I say I couldn't care less. I am happy for them to be done at the will of the neighbours and LL - and made every effort to have them done when and how they wished. I came here to gauge not whether people think compensation should be had at all - I came here to gauge, in a transactional way, what amount is reasonable that is commensurate with the interruption. As I said in another comment, some people here are mature enough (including my own LL) to treat this relationship as a transactional one. Other people are emotionally invested for some reason (even more curiously given they aren't involved) and take it very personally, which is their prerogative, albeit an immature one.

              • bp2000 on 20/09/2023 - 08:55
                +1

                @brooksnk: Wouldn't a leaking balcony be a structural risk for collapse? I don't really disagree with your compensation claim, but from the sounds of it I think the repairs were important. Fair it isn't the LL renovating the kitchen for you, but still.

    • Assburg on 20/09/2023 - 09:06

      Honestly man, don't let anyone do this to you ever again. You paid for something you couldn't use for an 9 months, worth probably about $100 a week.

      Not worth maintaining the relationship if they want to screw you over like that, and hindsight is 20/20 but they literally moved you out as soon as they could anyway.

      • djsweet on 20/09/2023 - 09:30

        Obviously didn’t know they were going to kick us out. But yeah, was trying to work with them not against them, and they did upgrade our aircon just before and they had been trying to help out with another issue with the fence. But if I had have known they weren’t going to return the good will then I would have gone harder.

        • Assburg on 20/09/2023 - 10:36

          Yeah, you're a good person for sure and that's more important than money, just hurts to see good people get done over by those with no sense of goodwill.

  • Drakesy on 19/09/2023 - 10:26
    +3

    I'd say how much of your space/time was taken up by the repairs?

    if it rendered XX% of the house unusable then expect a XX% reduction.

    So say 20% of the house was unusable, then you'd want a 20% reduction.

    • jv on 19/09/2023 - 10:28
      -1

      That's funny…

      • Drakesy on 19/09/2023 - 10:29

        Que?

        • Protractor on 19/09/2023 - 10:31

          Good to see you didn't put all your X in one basket

  • redforever on 19/09/2023 - 10:41

    I would see if they can put plastic sheets as a barrier to reduce the amount of dust and ask for the affected areas to be cleaned after the work.

    • brooksnk on 19/09/2023 - 10:43

      It's all done now. Plastic sheets weren't really possible given the layout. They did sweep the area after. I just had to do a fair bit of vacuuming and dusting, but I have no issues with that and was happy to clean myself.

  • ttt888 on 19/09/2023 - 10:43
    -5

    Probably LL should not have repair anything and let you complain and then only he repair and then you don't get anything because you ask for it.

    Put it this way if you own your own property you will have to pay compensation to yourself :)

    Its part of life properties need repairs and all as time passes.

    So I don't reckon this is something tenant deserve a compensation.

    • jv on 19/09/2023 - 10:45

      Put it this way if you own your own property you will have to pay compensation to yourself :)

      exactly…

    • freefall101 on 19/09/2023 - 12:05
      +1

      Except they don't own the property, the landlord does. That's kind of the key difference here.

      If you rented a car and it broke down due to no fault of your own, would you accept continuing to pay for renting it while they repaired it?

      • ttt888 on 19/09/2023 - 13:48

        Sure if you want to use that comparison.
        Then LL should have the right to ask the tenant to leave on the spot. if house need repairs whenever since unfair to ask tenant to continue to live there and paying rent.

        • freefall101 on 19/09/2023 - 15:00
          +1

          So you're saying if your car broke down and the car rental place refused to give you another car you'd be fine with that as well? That's even worse. But what do you think happens if a house is unlivable? The landlord tells the tenant to leave (not on the spot, because tenancy laws forbid it) and then it gets fixed.

          The point you're missing is that this has has nothing to do with landlord rights, it's about landlord obligations. They signed a contract too, to provide a good/service for a price. Coming to a reasonable understanding when part of that good/service is unusable is what OP is doing here, they stayed in the house, there was a verbal agreement on a discount on the rent while part of the house was unlivable, OP wants to know how much would be reasonable.

          Because that's what reasonable people do.

          • ttt888 on 19/09/2023 - 15:15

            @freefall101: I'm questioning the logic of your car rental example. Its flawed and not worth comparison.
            As you put it, car rental has as fleet of cars in many states. Landlord doesn't have another fleet of house just to give to tenant where ever he is.

            • freefall101 on 19/09/2023 - 17:04

              @ttt888: Except your argument was "Put it this way if you own your own property you will have to pay compensation to yourself. Its part of life properties need repairs and all as time passes."

              It's part of the life of owning a car too. It's a stupid premise to decide what should be done in the case of repairing a house.

        • Motek Benzona on 21/09/2023 - 07:28
          -1

          @ttt888 People like you should be stuck in a forced labour camp. You are talking absolutely 100% total and utter rubbish

  • Lord Fart Bucket on 19/09/2023 - 10:52

    Ask what you want. Go to the REA and say that since it's the balcony, it's strata, so the owner can claim it from strata?

    • Weezle on 20/09/2023 - 17:29

      Why is it strata, its not common property….

      • Extreme on 21/09/2023 - 07:25

        Balconies may/may not be common property. In my experience, in most cases they are. But it would all depend on the strata plan.

  • deme on 19/09/2023 - 11:00

    100% discount

  • tsunamisurfer on 19/09/2023 - 11:10
    +1

    The OP is allowed to ask the question at the least.

    OP, do your own calculation of how much utility you have lost during the 16 days and then approach the REA.

    No one here knows what level of peace and enjoyment you feel you have lost.

    Lets say you think 50%, so simply ask for 50% off for the next 16 days.

  • newjerseydamo on 19/09/2023 - 11:35

    The fact that you've stated they only swept however you had to do heavy cleaning, I would expect compensation to the effect of the cost of a professional cleaner, plus considering it's major construction works to the property, I would additionally ask for (500/7) * 16.

    Now, that is the utmost maximum which they will counteroffer, thus begin negotiations to get the highest amount possible.

  • JimB on 19/09/2023 - 12:31
    +4

    Landlord here.

    Landlord seems like a decent person trying to do the right thing.

    I wouldn't be asking for compensation but I'd ask for them to pay for a cleaner to clean up the mess.

    You work part time from home.. big deal. Go to the office for those two weeks.

    It's 2-3 weeks. Shit happens.

    I fixed a leaking shower in my rental and they had to re-tile part of the shower. Took about a week.

    The tenant showered at the gym.

    Was he inconvenience? Yes.
    Did I fix it (and other issues)? Yes
    Did he ask for compo? No.
    Did I raise the rent while he was there? No.

    • Lichen6420 on 19/09/2023 - 13:25
      +7

      Be careful… your a landlord so you must be evil and your opinion doesn't count.

      • JimB on 19/09/2023 - 13:36

        So evil, I'm not sure how I live with myself.

        Imagine letting a single mother with 2 kids rent my house and keeping the rent below market rate! Oh, the shame!

        • Lichen6420 on 19/09/2023 - 13:47

          Yeah you can be a real dick sometimes

          • JimB on 19/09/2023 - 14:06

            @Lichen6420: As a landlord, I'll wear that badge with pride.

    • brooksnk on 19/09/2023 - 19:02
      +2

      Seem to be projecting your experience onto what you assert therefore must be reasonable for everyone else in this world?

      Thats great for you. My LL iniated a suggestion of compensation, which is the right thing to do. There is nothing wrong with me accepting that offer (in fact, I do expect it given that my entire living space was appropriated alongside other disruption), and there is nothing wrong with me coming to OzB in good faith to ask people what they would consider fair compensation as commensurate with the disruption.

      Both me and the LL seem to be treating the relationship as a transactional one in good faith. In any transactional relationship, compensation should be offered and accepted. The only question left is what does fair compensation look like. That's what I came here to ask and a bunch of the audience decided to squeal and complain for some odd reason.

      People here take the LL/tenant relationships very personally. Not everyone is so immature.

    • trapper on 19/09/2023 - 19:59
      +1

      Landlord seems like a decent person trying to do the right thing.

      It's not fair or reasonable for a leak 'repair' to take 16 days though, or to treat the lounge like a workshop. I am a landlord too and would never do this to a tenant.

      • Extreme on 21/09/2023 - 07:30
        +2

        Absolutely garbage.

        A leaking waterproof membrane would require demolition, reapplying water proofing, waiting for it to dry, applying a new sand/cement screed, waiting for it to dry, retiling, waiting for glue to dry, then grouting.

        16 days to do the job properly would be about right, once you factor in aligning trades and their prior commitments.

    • Motek Benzona on 21/09/2023 - 07:33
      -2

      You would be paying me pal…wtf are you on about?
      You pay for a house or unit in a particular condition and if you can't use any of those premises you should be entitled to a reduction in the rent comparative to the thing you cannot use

      Honestly.

      Noone renting gives a toss what you have to repair these days with the rent gouging happening

      Just fix the house, compensate and be quiet would be my words to this owner

      • Extreme on 21/09/2023 - 07:57
        +1

        My words to the owner would be to factor in any compensation when it comes time to do your next rent review also.

        Instead of leaving rent as is/or potentially below market rates, increase to what your agent determines as market rent for the property.

        That aside tho, sometimes a bit of give & take from both sides results in a far better outcome for all.

        • Motek Benzona on 21/09/2023 - 11:13

          The "give" is I give my money to them for certain things
          The "take" is they take it under an agreement, a legal one where certain things can happen.

          Obviously if a workman had to come in for a few hrs or maybe even overnight its not anything major but, long term.. PAY UP.

      • JimB on 21/09/2023 - 18:07

        Sure, that’s fine.

        I’ll pay up but you’ll be paying it back multiple times over in perpetual rent increases in-line with market rent (note I rarely increase my rent for long term tenants).

        • Motek Benzona on 21/09/2023 - 21:40
          -2

          Then you should be stripped of your assets and worked in a camp until you pass on.

          Scum like you think renting is all one way…You would soon bleat if a tenant scratched a wall….disgusting

          • JimB on 21/09/2023 - 23:42

            @Motek Benzona: Lucky I don’t live in a socialist country then.

            All one way? Lol Haven’t you read anything I posted?

            Good luck in life.

            • Motek Benzona on 25/09/2023 - 08:31
              -2

              @JimB: I dont care, you said you would raise rents if a tenant asked for compensation they are possibly entitled to under an agreement YOU or your agent signed and you also said you would do it for years.

              You do not deserve oxygen on this planet.. Its that simple

              • Extreme on 25/09/2023 - 09:45

                @Motek Benzona: A tenant may be entitled to compensation, but a landlord is also entitled to increase rents in-line with market prices(subject to appropriate state tenancy laws).

              • JimB on 25/09/2023 - 13:48

                @Motek Benzona: Give and take mate.

                You take, that's fine. I'll also take.

                Fortunately I have very reasonable long term tenants. Fortunately for my tenants, they are paying below market rent. If they caused me hassles, they'll be paying market rent.

                It is what it is.

  • brokenglish on 19/09/2023 - 13:04

    Different state different rules. If you don’t say it, we can’t direct you to the right resources.

    This is for VIC https://tenantsvic.org.au/advice/common-problems/compensatio…

    Generally, if the cause of repair is not due to the negligence of rental provider, the rental provider is only obligated to arrange repair (unless you can prove otherwise).

    You are free to claim any loss you have experienced to VCAT if you cant reach an agreement with the rental provider. The claim has to be reasonable. VCAT will decide.

    Our fair amount =/= your fair amount =/= your landlord fair amount

    You decide.

  • AustriaBargain on 19/09/2023 - 15:44

    $500 for a two bedroom, where is that?

    • brooksnk on 19/09/2023 - 18:56

      inner south east Melb. It is being raised to 570 soon which is fair market currently.

  • samyall on 19/09/2023 - 17:17
    +3

    I went through almost the same thing, asking a similar question here on OzBargain. The community wasn't the most helpful but we ended up getting an okay resolution. See here for my update.

  • trapper on 19/09/2023 - 18:21
    +2

    The apartment would have been unrentable in the state you describe. It's not unreasonable to expect compensation for the entire time

    Set that expectation by reminding the LL that this disruption lasted for 16 days, and ask what kind of figure they had in mind to compensate for this time.

    Negotiate from there, but I would try and keep in in terms of 'days' compensation.

  • Webber000 on 19/09/2023 - 19:05

    I'd ask them to give you a free week (and word it as a free week rather than $500). That seems fair to me given it took over 2 weeks and you had to clean up yourself afterwards.
    Or ask them to waive / cancel /postpone or half the rent increase if your not too late to negotiate that.
    But as others are saying $200 is closer to reality, then if you think you didn't have to clean much and you like the place and have a good landlord and want to stay there then maybe even consider letting it slide and building some goodwill with the landlord if you are on speaking terms with them and might want to use it in future to stay or get any repairs yourself or not get another rent increase next year (as frankly $200 is not much per day when you consider the noise, dust, having to move your stuff and not be able to work from home for over 2 weeks and you probably ended up changing your plans because of it).

  • jason101 on 20/09/2023 - 07:13

    So now you have a beautifully re-tiled balcony - the rent should probably go up to reflect the improved state of the property, be careful what you push for - $250 compensation once off may cost you $20 per week for the rest of your occupancy.

    • smartazz104 on 20/09/2023 - 08:03
      +1

      Or maybe the repair quality has brought it up to the expected level given the current rent.

      • jason101 on 20/09/2023 - 08:21
        +1

        Unlikely, if the rental was previously too high relative to the market the property would be vacant, if it is occupied by the OP this reflects the current rental was correct for the state of the property pre-repairs. I'm not debating the quantum of the rent and if this is fair or justified, just the fact the property is occupied demonstrates the rent is competitively priced (hence occupied). Now the property is at an improved state, rent would/should be higher. Understand this isn't a popular view - but the position is factual.

        • brooksnk on 20/09/2023 - 10:44

          The property itself is no more improved for me (or any other occupier) after the repair. The balcony was not worn down and is exactly the same as before. The only effective difference is the waterproofing is supposedly fixed so as to not cause a leak to the neighbors below

  • Champ888 on 20/09/2023 - 08:23

    If I were a land lord, and someone chased “compensation” for this i’d put them firmly in the pain in the ass category and for sure kick them out at lease expiry.

    • trapper on 20/09/2023 - 09:18
      -1

      Acting out of spite is not wise in business, will only cost you money.

    • SpicyStew on 20/09/2023 - 19:49
      +1

      if

  • mickrb30 on 20/09/2023 - 08:49
    +2

    its absolutely the wrong climate to risk getting on the wrong side of the landlord
    1/- he does not need you, he can easily get a new tenant paying much more than you
    2/- he will most likely increase you rent if you come across unreasonable
    a increase of 60 is over 3k a year, then be proud of yourself, you got a couple of hundred compo
    3/- what does it cost to move, the work, the many expenses involved ? ?
    if i were you, i would not seek any compo, If LL offers you something themselves, i take it
    otherwise if you get on the wrong side of LL it will cost you into the thousands over a year.

  • jrvb42 on 20/09/2023 - 08:59

    If the issue was to repair a leaking tap, nil compensation right?
    But obviously this was a major repair, and stopped you enjoying a proportion of the property (guessing 25% tops?) for about 2 weeks (and only during working hours).
    The repair had to be done, for your benefit, and wasn't a deliberate act of the landlord - nobody was trying to annoy you.

    Seems to me half the day for 25% of the livable area for two weeks rent (0.5 x 25% x $500 x 2 weeks) $125 would be fair.

    As a reasonable person, you'd probably thank the landlord for dealing with the issue promptly and say not to worry about clean-up.
    A lot of landlords would drag their feet or avoid the issue, so there is some gratitude to be shown for having a decent person who is actually willing to talk compensation as well!

    You weren't prevented from using the dwelling, just inconvenienced for a necessary repair to part of the usable area.

    • trapper on 20/09/2023 - 09:17
      +3

      and stopped you enjoying a proportion of the property

      I don't think I would still be enjoying any part of the property if my lounge was turned into a building site.

      • jrvb42 on 24/09/2023 - 08:04

        Maybe if you'd experienced living on the street (rent free!), the enjoyment of the (paid) property would improve to the point where you'd appreciate the non-building site areas and a roof over your head.
        Everyone is different I guess. I wouldn't have any prob with it - you clearly would. Different levels of gratitude for our comforts I guess.

  • eek on 20/09/2023 - 09:49
    +2

    Even if you successfully negotiate a discount for the inconvenience caused, no stopping the landlord making your rent $650 when it comes to renewal time, or kicking you out and renting to someone else for $650 per week :|

    • mickrb30 on 20/09/2023 - 23:28

      agreed
      at 150 increase, thats 7,800 extra a year
      wow wow you got compo for half of 500, 0r full week 500
      but paid over 7000 in one year, or over 14k over 2 years rent increases
      its the landlords demanding high rents and getting them
      many landlords a increasing rents as high as they can
      you dont want to come across difficult, unfare, otherwise your out, or pay dearly
      good luck

    • trapper on 21/09/2023 - 09:07

      no stopping the landlord making your rent $650

      This is silly. Landlords can't just pick any random number and assume 'someone' will pay, why not make it $1000 lol

      The market determines what they can charge, and the market rate for this place is apparently $500.

      • eek on 21/09/2023 - 09:26

        Demand is high and supply is low for renters unfortunately, so the is with the landlords. In QLD at least rent increases are now limited to once per 12 months. What's to say landlords won't be jacking up rent more than usual to account for interest rate increases, increases to insurance, rates, cost of repairs etc? Market rate might be $650 next year ;)

        • trapper on 21/09/2023 - 09:40

          What's to say landlords won't be jacking up rent more than usual to account for …

          Landlords don't determine the market rate, the market does, that's why it's called the market rate. It doesn't matter at all what the landlords expenses are.

          If you kick out your tenant and double the rent you're not going to magically get $1000pw - you're going to get $0 pw.

  • apple2016 on 20/09/2023 - 10:23

    you should have asked for replacement lodging while they are caring out the works.

  • Ciderfizz44 on 20/09/2023 - 10:27
    +1

    You should be paying your LL 50% more for getting it fixed!

    Jks, I think 50% over the 16 days - rounded to $500 or basically 1 week rent free for the next month. GL

  • JC1186 on 20/09/2023 - 11:50

    They owe you approx $400-$600 in steam vouchers imo

  • Odin on 20/09/2023 - 13:11
    -1

    2 weeks put out

    $500 X 2 = $1,000

  • MrFunSocks on 20/09/2023 - 13:18

    Did you lose any money because of the renovations? No? Then why would you need compensation? You've now got a new balcony that's not dangerous.

  • IM-Cheap on 20/09/2023 - 15:29

    If he asked I think 50%+ cleaning costs would be fair given you still had the bedrooms and bathrooms which is the most important part.

  • SpicyStew on 20/09/2023 - 17:51

    50.1%

  • [Deactivated] on 20/09/2023 - 20:06
    +1

    OP simply wants to argue as to his perceived rights.

    There is no magic formula to a figure, if any. Ask whats on offer as owner suggested it and agree or simply ask for a little more and move on.

    If you start being difficult you'll get a nice rent increase/termination notice. You can always go tribunal if you feel even more victimised.

    • Extreme on 21/09/2023 - 08:06
      +1

      Spot on.

      Working with the landlord and coming to a mutual agreement is likely to be the best option for the OP.

      Throwing around your rights & entitlements is a good way to get your landlord off side. This could even lead to a no grounds eviction notice if he’s unlucky.

      I’ve recently issued a tenant a no grounds eviction notice because their shitbox car was leaking oil all over the driveway on an 18month old house. I’m talking large amounts of oil (puddles over 50cm in size). I requested the tenant to park on the street until they had their car fixed. They refused and said they can use the house how they see fit and the oil stains are just fair wear & tear.

      • JimB on 22/09/2023 - 08:36

        Imaging the entitlement of these people thinking a huge oil stain on the driveway is acceptable.

  • fullmetal on 20/09/2023 - 20:10
    +2

    If it is all acted on good faith, it is best not to expect anything. Just take whatever your LL offer.

  • Mrgreenz on 21/09/2023 - 08:56
    +1

    Propose an offer that you feel is fair.

    Was there much consultation from the landlord about the works?

    The landlord ahould have consulted with you prior to the undertaking, and if the works were non-urgent the fair thing the landlord could have done is scheduled between tennants.

    It sounds like there was a fair bit of inconvenience caused and the works were not urgent, both which work in your favour. But yea get on excel and create a fair breakdown of a %reduction in utility across the days of impact and present it to REA / LL

    Example :

    Days 1-16 : no access to balcony 20% utility lost
    Days 1-6 : living room full of tools 20% utility lost

    Daily rent = $71.4
    Days utility lost = 160.2 + 60.2 = 4.8 days
    Compensation seeked = $343

    I did a similar thing and anded up going to VCAT and being successful, although tennancy had ended and impacts were greater, same concept

  • Bar-Gains on 21/09/2023 - 08:57

    My Thoughts. $500 per week Rent (Calculate the floor area of total Unit, Calculate the Area of Unusable space due to reno's). Divide Unusable area by Total Floor Area = Percentage of Rent Reduction. EG. 10m2 Unusable 40m2 Unit = 25% Rent Reduction for 2.28 Weeks ($1140 Rent x 25% = $285).

  • brooksnk on 21/09/2023 - 10:58
    +5

    Update for those curious: I ended up putting forward an offer of 50% rent value * 16 days and LL came back with an offer of $500 being 1 week worths of rent (so 50% * 14days) and agreed to that.

  • justwii on 21/09/2023 - 20:43

    Why make both the landlord and tenant suffer while the tradie wins them all?
    Their incompetent to drag a simple retiling job to 16 days, worked only minimal hours per day and unnecessarily occupied space to store their tools?

    If I were the LL, I will blame whoever hired that tradie and have them compensate my lost.

    • JimB on 22/09/2023 - 08:34

      Waterproofing isn’t a quick retiling job

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