Getting the most out of my FF points

LMaxTravels on 17/07/2013 - 14:43

I'm looking to travel next year to Europe for myself + partner from Brisbane (preferable but other cities are ok, we need to travel to a capital city anyway).

I'm a qantas FF gold (one world sapphire) and I will have approx 100,000 points by the time I'm ready to book. I enjoy taking advantage of the lounges between flights so I'm keen to use a one world airline, though I would give this up for he right price :)

Looking to use my points towards a Europe trip for 2, either to a hub city like Paris, or to our preferred destinations of Greece or turkey.

100,000 points gives me approx $700 off qantas flights using points-plus-pay.

Qantas flights to Europe are way too expensive (currently $4800 for 2 return tickets in march 2014). I'm thinking about flying to Hong Kong or singapore using points-plus-pay with qantas, then connecting to another one world airline to continue to Europe. Don't mind staying over in my Asian hub overnight or longer as a stop over.

I'm flying this year with Finnair to Europe and have signed up to their mailing list. Thinking I could use Cathay pacific from Hong Kong, or finnair from singapore.

Just wondering if anyone has suggestions on one world airlines that I should be monitoring for sales. Anybody else gone down this route?

Travel

Comments

  • evol on 17/07/2013 - 15:28
    +5

    Fly via HKG with Cathay Pacific onward to Europe. Definitely the better option than Finnair. CX's "Wing" lounges in HKG are fantastic, and their on board product and service is great too. HKG is also a great place to stop over and do a bit of sightseeing/shopping.

    Points + pay is a really bad waste of points, value wise. 100k points for $700 is rubbish. For comparisons sake, I recently redeemed an Emirates flight in First class for 90k QFF points from SIN->MEL + only $50 in taxes/surcharges. Pretty sure the rack price for that EK ticket is a lot more than $700 ;)

    Best use of points is for upgrades - buy yourself the cheapest economy tickets that are upgradeable, then burn points so you and your partner can fly in Business. You'll enjoy the flight a lot more, especially since it's long haul!

    Also, with lounge access, don't forget that you can access all OneWorld lounges even if you're not flying on the respective airline. E.g. if you're flying on Qantas, you could go to the QF lounge, then hop over to the CX lounge, then to the MH lounge…etc ;)

    Lastly, my recommendation for best value option is via KUL with Malaysian Airlines. MH have very cheap sale fares to Europe and back, and recently joined OneWorld too so you can have fun in their lounges. As an added bonus, all their Europe routes (KUL<->LHR, KUL<->CDG), are serviced by their new A380's.

    • xmod on 17/07/2013 - 18:00

      Hi Evol

      What is the process to obtain that kind of deal from SIN to MEL do you go through the emirates site or qantasff?

      This with classic award or the regular.

      Sorry im all new to this stuff.

      Thanks

      • evol on 17/07/2013 - 19:50

        It was a classic award booked via the QF site. Just login and search for a one way redemption and it should come up in the results. QF recently revamped their search engine for flights and made it somewhat easier to use.

  • MaxTravels on 17/07/2013 - 22:53

    Aren't the taxes and fees on the classic awards terrible? I had been reading the Australian frequent flier forum and there are so many complaints.

    I can get a return trip from Brisbane to singapore or Hong Kong with classic awards air 60,000 per person, but can't see the fees as I don't have 120000 points yet.

    • evol on 18/07/2013 - 00:04

      QF redemptions exiting Australia have massive fees - you get ripped off by excessive fuel surcharges, Australian airport taxes/fees/levies etc. Likely the fees for your BNE-HKG/SIN return trip will be something ridiculous like $350pp. Just do the search for 1 person and then multiply the surcharges/fees by 2.

      The Emirates classic award didn't have any charges when I redeemed it - all I had to pay was SIN airport fees which amounted to AUD$48. Could've been a glitch in Qantas's new system, but I think it's correct as the flight was departing out of SIN where they don't have ridiculous fees.

  • Foxtail on 18/07/2013 - 07:18

    Go to Asia in Y from OZ and pick up J flight out of there.

    Check out CX flights out of Taipei

    Good place to find flights is…

    http://www.bestflights.com.au

    For expert advise go here…

    http://www.australianfrequentflyer.com.au/community/qantas-f…

    • MaxTravels on 18/07/2013 - 09:19

      thanks for the advice, i'm a frequent reader of the AFF site and get the newsletters from bestflights (and every other major travel company that i have come across) :)

  • Foxtail on 18/07/2013 - 09:20

    Good to see your well connected then.

  • MaxTravels on 18/07/2013 - 09:46

    I appreciate all of the input so far. The thing I am trying to achieve is to fly for the least amount of money out of my pocket. I am definitely going to look at the classic awards from Qantas, and hope the fees are not too high.

    While I am sure I would love flying premium economy or business, I just want to 'get' there, and i can tolerate 24+ hours of discomfort to do that and am worried that flying in a higher class will spoil me for all future travel. I try to travel internationally each 12-18 months, and have learnt to just grit my teeth and bear it.

    Out of interest, it seams that the cost for 2 return tickets using classic awards flying qantas will be 120000 points and $800 in taxes. If i booked the same flights (now on sale though not a great sale) are $2110 (for 2 pax). that saves $1200 but using 120000 points off this paid fare (points+pay)would reduce this cost by a further $900.

    then I still need to get to Europe.

    The way I see this, is that I would be spending $400 more to use point-plus-pay but I have the advantages that I can book a trip directly to my European destination(rather than one classic awards flight and then another separate flight) and I earn status credits and points during the trip.

    have I figured this out wrong or missed something obvious?

    apart from waiting for sales (which i am doing), what else could I do to get this trip at a bargain price?

    • evol on 18/07/2013 - 12:46

      If you want to go the least money out of pocket route, I'd advise you just save your QF points up for another day (where you can get more value from them or spoil yourself/partner in Business) and just fly to Europe with Malaysian Airlines:

      http://www.malaysiaairlines.com/au/en/deals/deals-of-the-day…

      Example fares from that link:
      BNE-LHR return: $1947pp (A380 aircraft for KUL<->LHR)
      BNE-CDG return: $1665pp (A380 for KUL<->CDG)
      BNE-AMS return: $1633pp
      BNE-HKG return: $917pp (A380 for KUL<->HKG)

      I believe this will work out most cost effective, rather than buying in 2 separate legs and wasting a bunch of QF points in the process.

      You can even earn some QF status credits and points on MH, albeit at a crappy earn rate.

      Malaysia Airlines have a pretty good service and on board product and the lounge at KUL is quite spacious.

      Qantas fares are way too overpriced, even on sale, for what they're worth. It's easy to see why the company is bleeding money - why pay for a QF flight on their old planes, with mediocre in flight entertainment and average lounges, when for the same price (or sometimes even cheaper) you can fly on a much better airline like Emirates or Cathay Pacific?

      Also, if you haven't already tried it, the best site to search for fares is: http://matrix.itasoftware.com/

      • MaxTravels on 18/07/2013 - 13:11

        Good point, well made!

        I'll keep an eye out for the Malaysian airline specials (looking for next year) and just go via KL, which I enjoy staying at.

        I'm flying finnair in a few weeks and am happy (so far) with the benefits extended to one world saphire. I can select my seats and have chosen exit aisle seats for the overnight leg (which I cannot do on qantas), get to use the lounges, and earn status credits and points. The planes might be old, but i got it at a good price so I can't complain.

        I can always use my points to get classic awards from my domestic airport to the international.

        Appreciate the advice!!!

  • Foxtail on 18/07/2013 - 10:17

    If you call Qantas on a special No. see the AFF posts to book a YASA at Classic price then you'll accrue QFF points too.

    http://www.australianfrequentflyer.com.au/community/qantas-f…

    Its a bit of ht and miss but you might get lucky.

    I usually pay for flights and use CC for everything to get points until such time I have a enough FFP for us to go internationally in J (spoilt).

  • RockyRaccoon on 18/07/2013 - 14:57
    +1

    Do some sums.

    eg 100000 pts gives you just over $700 in BigW gift cards which can also be redeemed at Woolies. (3,500 points for a $25 BIG W Gift Card )

    then use the savings for a flight.

    So if your redemption of 100000 points gives you a $800 savings over the lowest fare you can buy (with Qantas or partner or even another airline), then use the points for the gift cards

    You will need to factor in any points you will also earn by paying for a flight.

    Eg an award flight Syd - LAX = 96000 points return, which is $675 worth of gift cards.

    If the flight is $1250 then this will net cost you $575 out of your money. If the taxes/surcharges they charge you are greater than $575, then you know what to do.

    Plus a US trip = enough points for $100 more gift cards so the net cost of a $1250 ticket would be $475 as using a FF ticket doesnt earn any extra points.

    Now if the ticket is $1650 then the cost of buying would be $875 and if this is more than the surcharges. then you would go the points purchase.

    An extra advantage of the gift card/buy is that you would have more flexibility with your bookings

    • MaxTravels on 19/07/2013 - 09:35

      thanks for the tip RockyRaccoon! I had considered gift cards as an option but hadn't done the maths.

      I'm particularly if I can get cheaper flight with another one world airline. I'm flying this year with Finnair because i was able to book the flights for about $500 cheaper per person than qantas. If i take the gift card option, then that would make the difference even greater.

    • kabigon on 19/07/2013 - 09:48
      +1

      Just on the Big W gift cards, you use 140pts per dollar for the $25 card, and 135 for all the other cards (next highest is $50).

  • saintza on 18/07/2013 - 19:22

    I'm in almost exactly the same boat as you. Looking at flights from Brisbane to Europe late Feb / early March next year. Judging by the sales over the past month or so it looks like sale fares for Feb/March will start coming out sometime in the next few months.

    Agree that the Qantas sales of late have been really crap, which is a pity. Those Malaysian airline deals evol linked look pretty good, I'll be checking them out!

    • MaxTravels on 19/07/2013 - 09:42
      +2

      and keep an eye out for sales with Finnair. They are a one world airline and seam to value my one world status greater than qantas does.

      i booked through bestflights (couldnt get them online at the time) and gave them my FF number. When the details came through i was flying a codeshare with qantas from australia to singapore. through the qantas FF web site i can see the flight details and select my seats, but am limited to non-exit aisle seats. i am unable to select seats on the finnair flights here.

      logging in to the Finnair web site, i can book the rest of my seat allocations, but this time i can book exit aisles. I managed to secure exit aisle seating for all 4 people in my party on every flight. As my husband is 6"4', i know this will make the journey more comfortable (marginally).

      i dont know what they are like to fly with, but I'll know after September.

  • baxter on 22/07/2013 - 14:45

    Hi MaxTravels,

    I don't know if this will help you in particular since you're possibly only looking for a single flight to Europe, and by the look of it have already booked, but we've had FF points for the last 10+ years and have always used them for RTW (round-the-world) fare redemptions.

    There's plenty of information out there on how to maximise earning your FF points (personally we have a Commonwealth Bank Diamond account with dual AMEX/MC cards on it and put everything on there, use the AMEX whereever possible because of the higher earning rate, do our shopping at Woolworths as so get double points - your Everyday Rewards card earns FF points too), but maximising your redemption is important too. And from everything I've read and worked out, RTW flights are the best dollar for dollar redemption.

    As an example, it currently costs 142,500 points for a RTW trip which includes up to 5 stopovers. You can do overland travel between cities (but the miles between the 2 count), and there are heaps of conditions, but you can make it work. Our most recent trip was for 2 months in Sep-Nov last year and we went:

     Canberra to Tokyo (via Sydney) - Stopover 1
 Tokyo to London - Stopover 2 (travelled around the UK before ending up back in London)
 London to Venice - Stopover 3 (travelled from Venice to Paris via a 2 week car trip, and
    then Paris to Brussels on the train)
 Brussels to NY - Stopover 4 (travelled by train to Washington)
 Washington to Hawaii - Stopover 5
 Home :  Hawaii to Canberra (via Sydney).

    This complied with all the rules, and would have cost over $3,500 otherwise (or $4,500 if we'd bought a standard RTW trip - but obviously that would have had more flight segments available). So for 142,500 points, this is terrific value. You still have to pay taxes, levies, etc. and our were just over $1000.

    Just some food for thought, especially if you didn't end up using your points with Finair and so have a good start towards 142,500, and might consider having a longer holiday at some stage, including a few more places on your travels.

    Happy to answer any questions if I can.

    Cheers,
    Baxter.

    Some links:

    T&C's for Qantas Oneworld Classic Award - http://www.qantas.com.au/fflyer/dyn/program/terms#jump13
    Points requried (see the bottom table) - http://www.qantas.com.au/fflyer/dyn/program/usingPoints/poin…

  • Foxtail on 22/07/2013 - 15:00

    There's 800 threads on the QFF RTW subject here.

    http://www.australianfrequentflyer.com.au/community/qantas-f…

  • MaxTravels on 22/07/2013 - 16:05

    Thanks Baxter and foxtail. I have spent the weekend reading the enormous volume of posts of the Aus FF forum about RTW on points. There is certainly some great info there and I'm considering just keeping my points and using them for that in 2015-16.

    The only problem i will have is trying to afford the trip in 2014 for my 10th wedding anniversary following one in this year :), but I'm watching out for sales and with flexible dates, I hope to grab a good sale OneWorld fare.

    Thanks again! Appreciate the pointers.

  • Foxtail on 22/07/2013 - 16:12

    Great.

    Some real smart travel guys over at AFF, got me to Plat. recently.

    I've been on there for years and learnt so much, I still ask questions there though.

  • baxter on 22/07/2013 - 16:49

    If you want to book for 2014, you probably want to do so about 6 months out. You can book up to 1 year out, but airlines might not have released all available seats that early. 6 months gives you good flexibility to change routes around, minimise taxes, work in with other people you might be visiting etc. You should have plenty of points by then - we earn about 5,000/month just from our credit card alone, plus whatever extra points we get for flights, special offers etc. I'm not sure how often the Oneworld fares come on special (I notice they have 10% off atm), but the fixed fare of 142,500 probably won't change (unless it goes up that is!). The first time we used it in 2005 I think it was only around 120,000 points! Don't forget that if you have any family members (pretty wide definition too) that have FF points they can always transfer some to you (but only 1 transfer per year or something like that). You've probably read a lot of these tips anyway with all that weekend reading on the AFF site.

  • Foxtail on 22/07/2013 - 17:00
    +1

    I would say book major airline flights when they are released usually its 335 days out, if you have status then 9/10 months out. They go fast.

  • baxter on 22/07/2013 - 19:30
    +1

    Quite true Foxtail - it's always a good rule of thumb to book as early as you can. If you have enough points a year out and the flights are there - take them! For our last trip we booked on 31 May for a 12 Sep departure and still managed to get all the flights we wanted. Luckily we had some flexibility in terms of travel dates etc. as flights were not available on all days (or all flights on each day). Depends of course where you are travelling, and which cities you want to transfer through - some cities/transfers make your taxes hundreds of dollars more expensive. Direct flights are always best (ie. our Brussels direct to NY), and avoid London Heathrow if possible.

  • MaxTravels on 22/07/2013 - 20:31

    Thanks guys, you rock.

    Won't have enough for ATW in 2014 (for 2) but might plan for 2015 :)

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