Advice on getting a job

LRizzy on 26/04/2014 - 17:12
Last edited 29/04/2014 - 12:55

Hi Ladies and Gents,

EDIT: Thanks OzBargainers for your time and help. I appreciate it a lot. Hopefully I can secure a job very soon with the corrections, advice and tips you all have given me.

Thanks again everyone.

Original Post -
I need some help finding a job in the Civil Engineering/Structural/Construction Industry. I worked so hard for 4 years to finish my Civil Engineering degree. I finished mid 2013. I have applied to over 200 jobs and I have had only 5 interviews. My cover letter and resume have been checked by job seeking recruiting agencies and they say it is fine. I have cold called 20+ companies asking if there are any positions with no luck. I also have mailed out cover letters and resumes to companies. I have applied to Perth, Adelaide, Sydney, Brisbane, Mackay and all over VIC (I live in VIC). I am happy to relocate or work FIFO. I prefer to work anywhere in VIC, NSW and QLD.

Does anyone have any advice or any contacts that I could send my resume and cover letter too?

I'd appreciate any help.

Thanks.

EDIT: Thanks OzBargainers for your time and help. I appreciate it a lot. Hopefully I can secure a job very soon with the corrections, advice and tips you all have given me.

Thanks again everyone.

Education & Work

Comments

  • Luminary on 26/04/2014 - 17:50

    You might get some insight in this forum. http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum/136 Also people are usually happy to give suggestions if you upload your CV/Cover letter (with all your personal details removed of course).

    • Rizzy on 26/04/2014 - 18:12

      Thanks for your reply Taniiah. I am pretty new to this. I have managed to upload files onto my account. Not sure if this will work. I have two CVs. CV1 is free flowing and CV2 is boxed.

      Cover Letter - http://files.ozbargain.com.au/upload/124936/22423/cover_lett…

      CV1 - http://files.ozbargain.com.au/upload/124936/22424/curriculum…

      CV2 - http://files.ozbargain.com.au/upload/124936/22425/curriculum…

      • Luminary on 26/04/2014 - 18:43

        No problem. I don't think I'm the best person to critique your documents because I'm more in the commerce side. But just looking over your CV I think you need to put more emphasis on profession experience (if any) and extracurricular activities. I go to Melbourne Uni as well. Did you get this checked at uni or an external agent? I don't mean to offend, but it just seems a little weak and I would think the university would have made more comments about the structure. But then, maybe Engineering is different to Commerce.

        Definitely post on Whirlpool. You should get decent feedback but they can be a bit blunt on there. :)

        • Rizzy on 26/04/2014 - 19:32

          I have had it checked by Melb Uni and external companies. The problem is everyone has their own opinion on how a cover letter/CV should look like. Some people say sound cocky and sell yourself while others say be neutral. I finished Uni last year and then went on a family holiday for a few months. I have 0 professional experience. I have been applying for graduate intake positions as well as entry level jobs. I will have to talk more about my extracurricular activities.

          I can take constructive criticism, however I don't have to for people being rude or attempting to troll.

          Thanks Taniiah with your replies and help. Very much appreciated.

        • kelea on 27/04/2014 - 22:09
          +4

          Rizzy, don't you need to do 12 weeks work experience in engineering to graduate? Industry related experience such as vacation work placements are highly regarded, so I would 'sell' that where possible.

        • cwongtech on 28/04/2014 - 01:22
          +1

          I know UNSW needs 60 days placement, not sure about some other unis though

        • Rizzy on 28/04/2014 - 15:05

          Hi Kelea,

          No not for Melbourne Uni.

      • scrimshaw on 26/04/2014 - 18:50
        +6

        You might want to talk about what sort of projects you did at university. As an engineering student you may have taken part in some real world projects, right? Might want to mention those as well as any notable accomplishments you have done at university, e.g. Merit certs, high distinctions.

        A resume guide can be found, usually, from your university's website and they should also have Job Seeking workshops that you SHOULD attend since they're usually free.

        A copy of your academic transcript will also be helpful, but be aware work experience trumps grades. If your grades are only average, then best to exclude them altogether, however employers will be interested to know what you studied.

        For your cover letter, you may wish to get rid of the bolded "I am an outstanding applicant for this position" and instead focus on your work experience / responsibilities rather than using overly glowing adjectives describing your personality — anyone can make this up! Talk about what you did at your previous jobs and talk about your transferrable skills.

        Make sure you do plenty of research about the firm and know about them inside and out. It also helps massively if you know someone inside the organisation.

        Check out this doc and follow the guidelines.

        • Rizzy on 26/04/2014 - 19:36

          Hi Scrimshaw,

          Thanks for your response. I have 0 professional experience (No real world projects). I have been applying for graduate intake positions as well as entry level jobs. I will add project highlights and talk more about my extracurricular activities.

          Your input will be noted and I will make corrections to my Cover Letter/CV.

          Thanks Scrimshaw. Very much appreciated.

        • scrimshaw on 26/04/2014 - 21:13

          Here's some extra resources to help you tweak your cover letter and resume.

          Sample Cover letters
          http://www.monash.edu.au/careers/students-grads/apply-for-a-…

          Transferable skills
          http://www.careers.qut.edu.au/student/resource/transferable.…

          How to address selection criteria, plus a lot of other general info on Resumes and interviews
          http://www.jobaccess.gov.au/content/how-write-selection-crit…

          Addressing selection criteria, with a more detailed explanation
          http://www.careers.qut.edu.au/student/resource/Selection_Cri…

          The addressing selection criteria part IMO is perhaps the biggest obstacle you will encounter in a formal job application — you will probably be sick and tired of hearing about the "STAR" method everytime you apply online. Nobody writes a perfect resume / cover letter on the first go, so don't get be dissapointed if your first fifty or so resumes get rejected.

        • Rizzy on 26/04/2014 - 21:24

          Thanks Scrimshaw.

        • ge on 28/04/2014 - 09:25
          +4

          HI Rizzy, if you don't have any professional experience, you have three options:
          1) DRESS THE TRUTH: Make some uni projects look like professional experience.
          2) VOLUNTEER: Offer your services to a prospective employer for free for a couple of weeks so that they can test you.
          3) LIE: Make up work experience but make sure you have someone as a referee.

          For better or worse we live in a world in which experience is everything, and while some people don't like to hear this, academic qualifications are less and less important.

          Volunteering is a great thing, I did it for 4 weeks, then I got a job offer. Once you volunteer, not only you massively improve your chances of getting a job offer from your current "employer", but you also get that real-life experience most uni grads don't have.

          Stay positive and good luck.

        • tyler.durden on 28/04/2014 - 13:42
          +3

          or create blue meth and start your own drug empire

          http://s1.ibtimes.com/sites/www.ibtimes.com/files/styles/v2_…

        • Rizzy on 28/04/2014 - 15:05
          +1

          Thanks for your post Gestaba.

      • redraoh on 27/04/2014 - 02:43

        I'm no expert, but I would remove or at least reduce your extra-curricular stuff. One line is enough. But personally, I don't include it.

        You should go into more detail about your work experience, even if it isn't relevant to what you're looking for (as you have nothing else to go on). List responsibilities, projects, achievements, etc.

        I'm surprised the recruitment agencies thought a one line description of each job was adequate.

      • Tnetennba on 27/04/2014 - 15:16

        You might want to remove the email and phone right at the bottom, as you've already put that information in the header. Generally, you don't need to put it twice.

      • [Deactivated] on 28/04/2014 - 08:36
        +3

        From a purely psychological standpoint, I would move Microsoft word & excel to the bottom of your skills summary and put the most technical / engineering specific at the top of the list. Or list them alphabetically.

        From your skills list as it is, it looks like MS Word is your #1 technical skill.

        Good luck :-)

        • Rizzy on 28/04/2014 - 15:06

          Thanks for your post Snowblindnz.

        • Marty131 on 29/04/2014 - 07:40

          If you have advanced skills with excel, list that - specifically VBA etc. I spend 95% of my time at work using excel & vba. But as snowblindnz suggested, I wouldn't put this at the top, but I would put it separate and above Microsoft word.

      • orrinxu on 28/04/2014 - 14:01
        +1

        In your CV, put in the "projects" you've completed through uni. In my mechanical degree I had numerous projects done for uni like FYP, FEA, CFD projects for the various subjects. Then list the skills involved in each one i.e.

        • Synthesis of Data using MATLAB
        • FEA calculation using ANSYS
        • CFD using Autodesk Simulation

        You never know what might pique the interest of an employer based on what you list there

        • pyro love bird on 29/04/2014 - 12:05
          +1

          I had to do a double take because I read that as "Synthesis of Data using METHLAB"

        • zeomega on 29/04/2014 - 14:42

          Agreed, put in a bit of emphasis on your FYP. That generally shows what you're interested in and also what you've achieved. Unless you got assigned your FYP rather than scouting for something you want.

      • massafiri on 28/04/2014 - 20:03
        +2

        Hey Mate - I'm no professional, this is all my opinion (and what I have heard from HR Reps at my work who screen CVs)

        Stick to CV1 - Much cleaner and easier to read.

        For every employee that you list, you should include at least one referee.
        "Referee on request" is just another step that HR doesn't have time to do.

        Put your referee's on your CV. Make sure you let them know that you have put them on your CV. Tell them to expect calls and they will give you a glowing review.

        Otherwise, it looks like you have a solid CV and cover letter. Good luck.

  • Sshanaz on 26/04/2014 - 20:04
    +2

    Your cover letter should start with how you come to know about the position e.g seek, my career etc.

    You should not use generic cover letter. A cover letter is an opportunity for a candidate to demonstrate their skills required in the job. All employers tend to list skills they are looking for in the job advertisement. Always tweak your cover letter to show how you are the best candidate by demonstrating how you developed skills required for the job.

    Remove the sentence "you are the outstanding applicant" as recruiter don't like this kind of bragging.

    Your resume is missing career objective. I understand you have only worked part time or casually but you should always list your achievements for each work experience.

    • Rizzy on 26/04/2014 - 21:07

      Hi Sshanaz,

      Thanks for your input. I will remove that line immediately.

  • brickwall on 26/04/2014 - 20:45
    +2

    I agree with the above post. Add your achievements in your work experience, other than listing what your tasks are.
    For example you mentioned you are I.T consultant, maybe you think it's just a troubleshooting job, but dig deeper.. Do you always solve issues within the required timeframe? Any compliments or positive feedbacks on your work? Have you done something major, like fixing major network issues ? Just try to find something… Anything, and make it sounds very very important ;)

    And yes, please remove the part that says you are outstanding applicant. It's always better to include words like can-do attitude, willing to learn, good at meeting deadlines and efficient.

    Hope that helps and good luck!

    • Rizzy on 26/04/2014 - 21:08

      Thanks moonlite51.

      I will draft a new cover letter and resume and add what you and the others have suggested.

      Thank you for your post.

    • Rizzy on 27/04/2014 - 16:18

      Hi Moonlite51,

      Is this better?

      Information Technology consultant.

      Information Technology troubleshooting -
      - Fixed major network issues.
      - Installed sound/music system for gym which works over wireless network.
      - Fixed hardware and software issues for gym computers.

      Website design and marketing through social media –
      - Created new website for McAllister’s Fitness (mcallistersfitness.com.au.
      - Improved layout and made it client friendly.
      - Made website more responsive, concise and detailed.
      - Used Facebook and Youtube to market McAllister’s Fitness.

      • zeomega on 27/04/2014 - 22:28
        +10

        Phrase your points better.

        Information Technology consultant.

        Information Technology troubleshooting -
        - Investigated and resolved major network issues. (your choice if you want to put quickly/within short timeframe, etc)
        - Designed and commissioned audio system over wireless network.
        - Performed troubleshooting and repairs for both hardware and software for gym computers.

        Website design and marketing through social media –
        - Redesigned and deployed website for McAllister’s Fitness (mcallistersfitness.com.au.
        - Significantly improved website allowing for more concise information…yada yada bla bla.
        - Integrated social media (facebook, youtube, twitter, etc) allowing for wider reach of target audience.

        Something like that…. it can be phrased much better but requires some sitdown time and also a background on what you did.
        You need to use more english/technical jargons as you're from a Engineering background. Show how the 4 years of uni differs from a highschool leaver. I was doing what you did at the age of 16 and I would have phrased it like you did. Obviously I'm older now and seemingly more "wise" (highly debatable, LoL), but i was where you were before. Remember what it means to be an engineer and show it in your CV.

        Also big tip. Remember any significant events. Like how there was an issue no one else could solve but yet you could… use it to your advantage, bring it up in the interviews, etc. Spend a good couple of days tweaking the CV and remembering what you did.

        Just my 0.2c worth.

        • Rizzy on 28/04/2014 - 15:10
          +1

          Hi Zeomega,

          After re-reading my CV last night, I came up with the same conclusion. The words I was using were very mehhh. I have since then changed it around.

          Thanks for your post.

      • brickwall on 28/04/2014 - 22:44

        Hi,

        Sorry for my late reply :) but yeah as per the reply for zeomega - that's an awesome feedback given by fellow ozbargainer there! :)
        My advice (as you have experienced it yourself) after modifying your cv, sleep it off and red it gain with fresh point of view. Also, in my case when I read my own cv, I tend to pretend I'm reading someone else's cv that I'm looking to hire. It helps a lot! Many times I think to myself "Wow, I wouldn't hire myself!" And then write down what I think I want to see there.

      • Savvymum on 29/04/2014 - 06:17

        I like this idea

  • Adz81 on 26/04/2014 - 21:22

    Good luck Rizzy, took a look at my company's job vacancies, but there's sod all going for them at the moment… Good luck, I hope you find a job soon :)

    • Rizzy on 26/04/2014 - 21:26

      Thanks Adz81. If anything pops up please let me know (if this post still exists). Really want to start work and getting some experience.

  • mskeggs on 26/04/2014 - 21:47
    +1

    Is there contract or temp work offered in your field that might be a path to getting some experience?
    If you have genuinely applied for 200 graduate/entry level jobs with only 5 interviews, something is wrong.
    Did you target jobs outside your specialty, or jobs with experience requirements?
    The only change beside those noted above, is whether you want to comment of the 'rotating roles' in the general engineering. If the position is actually doing one part of it, and the same thing every day, that might be a negative to an employer. They could think you would be unhappy with that sort of role.

    Are you getting any call backs from your submissions? Perhaps your resume is OK, but you need to work on that initial phone call to turn it into an interview?
    Also, as a general comment, where are your classmates/friends working? Do any of them have opportunities they could put you forward for?

    • Rizzy on 27/04/2014 - 00:14

      Hi MsKeggs,

      I have applied for contract, temp and casual work experience (with no pay) and still nothing. 200 is a bit excessive (just frustrated at the situation). I have genuinely applied to around 150 jobs with 0 experience to up to 5 years experience. I write in the first paragraph in my cover letter, "I understand that I do not have the required experience for this position. However, I am submitting my application to show that I am interested in working and gaining experience at the engineering firm* whether it be part time, full time or just work experience. " for the ones that say 1-5 years experience.

      *Changed to company name.

      My classmates have been unlucky as well. None of them have jobs related to Civil Engineering. Mates that were a year ahead of me got jobs 8-12 months after they completed their degree.

      Thank you for your help.

  • CI on 26/04/2014 - 22:27
    +2

    Rizzy, I am in the same position as you. But now I have started getting interviews, I changed two things. Firstly, my resume used to be only 1.5 pages long then I detailed it more, NOW its 3.5 pages. Secondly, this is the worst, but I write a brand new cover letter for each application, I know it takes painstakingly long time but I have to build up the motivation and do it. Also, I would start with how you came to know about the position and then write about how you recently graduated. I have been looking 12 months now man! with only contractual work inbetween!

    • Rizzy on 27/04/2014 - 00:16
      +1

      Hi Usama91,

      I think that is what I will have to do. First task tomorrow morning is to update/fix up my resume. I tweak my cover letter every application. I have to change something.

      Thank you for your input. Good Luck with your job hunting.

  • Luminary on 26/04/2014 - 22:43

    I've been to careers advisors and spoken to HR people and as a general rule you shouldn't go over two pages. I don't think it's the fact that the CV is longer, but it's what details you've added. It's better to be shorter and concise because keep in mind that your CV will probably get looked at for about 10 seconds so you need to get the get across as much strong evidence of your abilities in the shortest amount of time. I put the most relevant things on my CV then have all my work experiences on my LinkedIn which is at the top of my CV.

    You should seriously see if the university will look over your documents even though you've graduated.

    • Rizzy on 27/04/2014 - 00:22

      Yeah, I have been told that too. I think I will go "sell" myself more on LinkedIn.

      I will call up Melb Uni on Monday and see if they will.

      To finish the uni degree we had to submit a fake application (resume, cover letter and key selection criteria) to the Engineering Coordinators. You had to pass this to get your degree. The mark had to be more than 75% to pass this hurdle. I ended up getting 80 something. This was with another resume with less information and a crappy layout.

      I keep hearing the Civil Engineering/Construction industry is a bit down at the moment. Hopefully it picks up.

      Thank you for your posts :)

  • jason101 on 27/04/2014 - 00:28
    +5

    Do not use a generic cover letter, I employ staff on behalf of the company I work for (which has an element of building design / construction) and I bin every resume / cover letter that does not show the applicant has specifically researched our firm and wants the job we are offering specifically.

    I like applicants to talk about our firm specifically and why they would like to join our firm.

    There are a number of noobs that try to do this by a simple cut and paste "XXX company name" in certain spots - this is worse than just using a generic template.

    Research the company online
    Visit / research their work sites
    Make note of something within your field you have noted they did well (there will be ego's at any construction company that love newbies telling them how much they loved the way the carried out XYZ which make ABC project stand out from the rest)

    Also join your professional association and go to the functions actively prospecting for work - get a card made up hand it around….Sounds like hard work, it is - but eventually someone will notice you and the offers will come to you.

    • Rizzy on 27/04/2014 - 00:35
      +1

      Hi Jason101,

      I have a cover letter that I change around and talk about projects that the company was involved in. I also change it to suit the job advertisement. I may need to write more and go into depth more.

      Thank you for your suggestions.

  • maybeamacy on 27/04/2014 - 01:59

    Isn't there a shortage of Civil Engineers at the moment? I know my friend graduated as a Chemical Engineer in 2012 and still hasn't found a job, I think he didn't have enough work experience during his degree (and the fact that the chem eng market is apparently bad).

    • scrimshaw on 27/04/2014 - 04:11
      +1

      I'd say there is a lack of experienced civil engineers and firms aren't ready to take on graduates because they end up being a cost to the business (because the more experienced engineers have to be taken off projects in order to have time to train and guide them, as well as paying wages to the graduate). So instead of hiring fresh graduates they hire seasoned ones from overseas instead.

      It's kind of like a vicious cycle because by not taking graduates, there will always be a shortage of skilled engineers. All the uni students have to know is that the biggest issue right now is that there are more engy graduates than there are grad job openings, so it ends up being a hunger games of sorts where only a few get to enter the industry.

    • pyro love bird on 28/04/2014 - 01:51

      Is chem enge really that bad? I've been told by a fair few people that chem enge has a lot of flexibility so it's a good field to be in, in regards to enge :/

    • pointblank on 28/04/2014 - 19:22

      There was a shortage, but I think everything started going sour at the end of 2011/start of 2012. I graduated from civil eng at the end of 2011 and was very lucky to get a job.

    • Caped Baldy on 28/04/2014 - 19:33

      Nah there's a shortage of civil engineering work and lots of redundancies.

  • Skinnerr on 27/04/2014 - 02:31

    You can try traineeships that dont pay very much just to get valuable experience to put on your resume.
    Just some various hits for engineering in general on seek ie. - http://www.seek.com.au/jobs/in-melbourne/#dateRange=999&work… and specifically - http://www.seek.com.au/graduate-job/26396387
    Good luck!

    • Rizzy on 27/04/2014 - 15:07

      Thanks TheDude23

  • Hoju on 27/04/2014 - 07:14
    +1

    My tip: Go small company, and diversify - just to get experience in some form of professional engineering field.
    I had the same problem with environmental science bachelor and masters degrees. Hundreds of applications, few interviews, harassing the big companies.

    Eventually I found a job with a very very small company that no one had ever heard of, and I was doing something only very loosely related to my field. I'd totally compromised my training and what I wanted to do for some experience, and eventually that got me into a company I did want to work for, doing what I wanted to do.

    Everyone wants professional experience but how do you get it?… stupid job world.

    • Rizzy on 27/04/2014 - 15:09
      +2

      Thanks Greenspoon. Yeah every company wants you to have 1-2 years experience. How do I get experience when no one is giving me a job.

      • pyro love bird on 28/04/2014 - 01:53

        This is exactly the problem with the industry atm.
        They all want graduates who have experience, but no one is willing to offer the experience that graduates need to get a job. Urgh!

  • super8 on 27/04/2014 - 08:55

    Im a geologist and there are no jobs now as there is a huge reduction in mining capital expenditure. Im doing my Taxi Driver course next week.

    • MATTDAMON on 27/04/2014 - 09:07

      And yet up here in the hunter valley, they have just started the rix creek expansion, also they are about to get approval on the Mt Thorley expansion and ol'faithful Wambo as well has submissions in. Been very busy up the valley so far this year.

  • ms_caz on 27/04/2014 - 09:20

    Usama91 correctly advises to write a new cover letter for each position you apply for. Obviously your basic format remains similar but it MUST be specifically for the position in question. It's not just a matter of changing some of the details. Your cover letter should be tailored to the job advertisement. Think about it in this way:
    1. identify what the company is looking for (think about the type of person, the company's vision statement, their motto, the projects they are involved in, the actual skills required for the position)
    2. identify some of the things that you have done which demonstrates that you meet the things identified in 1.(especially if you have not actually had engineering experience - this is where your transferable skills come into play)
    3. explain how you will be able to apply your previous experience to the role under offer.

    If the position has selection criteria, make sure that you write a response to each of these.

    If the advertisement provides a contact for more information, make sure you actually do make that contact. use this as an opportunity to interview the company before even writing the application letter. Have questions ready about the company in general, as well as the specifics of the position advertised.

    You may also need to re-jig your CV for each position advertised. Consider the format which highlights key skills you have developed, rather than a chronological listing of things you have done (especially if you haven't done much). In this kind of resume, you read through all of the information about the company and the position in detail to come up with three to five main skill categories eg team work; financial management; project management; administrative skills; attention to detail (and/or whatever specific engineering topics you may have). Then make a list of everything you have ever done, including extracurricular activities, casual jobs etc. Now try to allocate items from this list to your key categories already mentioned. In this way, you will be able to show how and why you could fit the company and the position, rather than just listing things you have done.

    These methods do take time - but as is often said, when you are unemployed, your job is to find a job,

    good luck

    • Rizzy on 27/04/2014 - 15:12

      Hi Ms_Caz,

      Thanks for your post. Appreciate your help.

  • Ether on 27/04/2014 - 09:40

    Have you tried China? Its the first thing I could think of.

    • Rizzy on 27/04/2014 - 15:10

      Thanks for your post Ether. I really don't want to work in a country outside of Australia.

      • altomic on 30/04/2014 - 21:08

        working in another country can lead to big things.

  • bs0 on 27/04/2014 - 09:55

    Can we get an insight into what kind of companies, and where these companies' projects are based? My roommates bf is graduating late this year and I believe he had enquired about jobs in the around mid north coast - few highway reconstruction here atm.

  • hahaboy on 27/04/2014 - 10:19
    +4

    Just a few pointers that could be used to improve your CV:

    • Include employment history right after university degree info. It should be well highlighted
    • Change 'Casual Employment' to 'Employment History'
    • Highlight more experiences/skills you learnt from your previous jobs.
    • Include your WAM/GPA if it's good
    • Include extra-curricular and volunteer work you've done. That is a critical component missing from your resume. If you haven't done it, get on it.
    • Consistency/formatting - Use full stops everywhere or no where etc.

    For your cover letter, it needs to be more personalised. Have a section in your cover letter talking about the values/culture/size of the company and why you want to work there. HR that way pick up you've done your research on their website and not submitted a generic application.

    • Rizzy on 27/04/2014 - 15:16

      Hi Hahaboy,

      Thank you for your input. I have altered my CV and cover letter with what you and others have said.

      Thanks for your help.

  • MrGareth on 27/04/2014 - 10:55
    +1

    I'm an engineer (though not civil) and have the dubious honour of having to review applications from time to time, and there have been some very good points made so far on what to look out for.

    Top tips already listed so far:

    • Customize EVERYTHING for each job you apply for. Spend an hour per application customising the cover letter, and tweak the CV for the position (not always needed for the CV though).

    • No spelling errors and correct grammar! I can promise you that applications often get binned if they're poorly written. Your CV and cover letter will be reviewed not just by HR, but also by the senior engineers. If as part of your career you need to create / review a lot of documentation, then they don't want to see a poorly written application.

    For your resumes, I prefer CV1 - it looks a lot cleaner. In saying that, I'd tweak it as follows:

    For the "Course Highlights -" section, as per hahaboy's comments above, be consistent with the formatting (missing full stops).

    For the "Cabinet Express, Victoria (2009 – 2013) – Part Time" section, it looks like the hidden table isn't wide enough. Adjust it to match the McAllister’s Fitness entry right above it.

    Keeping it consistent shows you have an eye for detail (or have OCD! ha!).

    The one thing you're missing for your resume that I think is necessary is a "Summary" at the top, which would fit between the Name section and the Education section. Keep it short and sweet. Basically - a well written one (or two at most) paragraph blurb about you and what you're looking for. Keep it generic. It's sort of like an extra-short generic version of a cover letter.

    Even if it's something simple like:

    "Summary

    Having recently graduated university with an Honours Degree in Civil Engineering, I am keen to enter the workforce in a graduate position to begin my career as an Engineer. I am hard working, loyal and believe I have the skills and abilities needed to strive within your company".

    I'm sure a lot of people will disagree with putting something like that in a CV, however I find it's always easier - particularly if the CV and cover letter are separated (as they pass by the desks of HR and the senior engineers who review them).

    • Rizzy on 27/04/2014 - 15:20

      Hi WebbieGareth,

      Thank you for putting out your time and writing a detailed post on what to change.

      I will spend all of today editing my coverletter/CV, watching V8 supercars and NRL :P

      Thanks again for your post.

    • Marty131 on 29/04/2014 - 07:52

      Webbiegareth, you make a very good point about cover letters and CVs getting separated, especially at the later stages of a review process.

  • Polde on 27/04/2014 - 12:49

    As someone who is 2 years into the same degree, this is indeed interesting to me.
    Best of luck OP, hopefully someone will give you a chance.

    • Rizzy on 27/04/2014 - 15:22

      Hi Polde,

      It is terrible! I want to get some experience asap!

      Good Luck with the rest of your studies. Years 3 and 4 are the most fun!

      • Polde on 27/04/2014 - 20:46

        Yeah the old Catch-22 is really the worst.

        I know someone who is in their 3rd year, and they managed to get an internship with a local government. Have you tried any local governments around your area?.

        Looking forward to Years 3 & 4, for better or worse…

  • GameChanger on 27/04/2014 - 13:05

    OP don't feel to bad! My friend exact same situation as you, ended up working some entry level mech tafe qualification job. He wonders sometimes if he should of got a tafe qualification whilst doing engineering part time!!

    Its pretty shocking how a uni of melb graduation is struggling to find a job. Any chance you're a international student? As you got like no chance sorry.

  • 2ndeffort on 27/04/2014 - 14:08
    +3

    Seriously, I haven't read your CV but it seems plenty of others have and if you aren't getting through it probably isn't the wording of your CV that is holding you back. I spent 10 years working in the Melbourne Office of a multinational engineering company. My best friend is the State Manager there at the moment, his son is in 3rd yr civil engineering at Swinburne and my mate reckons the market is very flat. If some of the big construction jobs come out from the government (ie actually get awarded) then there might be opportunities. My friend tells me that they only took 3 in their grad program this year, not so long ago they would take 15 - 20. He reckons some of the other firms aren't taking any.

    Although the big construction firms hire engineers, Most of the JVs/industry teams that form to try and win big projects (and therefore have a need for young engineers) include a design consultancy as part of the team. The government also normally requires that a design consultancy is engaged to check the designs of the winning tenderer. Have you tried the design houses or just looking at the big and obvious construction houses.

    My advice would be to find another way in, any way in. Are you on 'LinkedIn'? If not I would recommend getting a profile on LinkedIn ASAP. Loads of recruiters use LinkedIn to qualify candidates now. There will be loads of groups on LinkedIn for civil engineers, join a couple and take part in the discussions. Ask your Uni professors etc if you can 'friend' them and then use their network to make connections. Just be careful as many professional people hate getting sent unsolicited requests to 'sell them something' via LinkedIn. You need to be subtle if you want to use this path.

    Are you wanting to do structural design work? Process Work? I was a Program Director overseeing loads of projects run by engineers and many became very specific in the course of their careers. We had a guy that was a guru on pipe turbines. He started off as a civil engineer but became the 'go to' guy for anything related to turbines, to the point where we flew him around the country and gave him payrises because his inclusion on bids won us jobs. Same with another guy that started as an electrical engineer and ended up being a tram overheads and signalling guru. Have you thought about related areas like Project Mangement, Risk Management, Estimating etc. These are all areas that most engineers detest, many believing it is 'below' their highly developed 'design' skills. Big companies need people doing all of these things to maintain their quality certifications and to make sure they don't make costly mistakes on big jobs. I have a friend that is an electrical Engineer who now works for one of the big constructors as a 'Risk Manager'. She headed in that direction because companies were screaming out for Risk people but nobody wanted to do the job. General electrical engineers were commonplace. The stereotypical design guy that sits around calculating loads playing with CAD tools is probably a bit more vulnerable in this day and age.

    Your main goal should be to get a start. I wouldn't worry too much about where or what you did to get a start. Ideally you get a design job with an SKM, KBR, Fluor, Coffey etc etc but if that isn't happening, get a start doing anything else and once you are in the door try and transfer across by proving your work ethic and desire to the folks that make the personnel decisions. I know of draftsmen that studied at night school to upgrade their qualifications and then transferred across to be engineers in the same workplace once they graduated.

    • Rizzy on 27/04/2014 - 15:36

      Hi 2ndEffort,

      I have heard it is very flat too. I have a LinkedIn account and I think I have to sell myself a bit more on it.

      I want to do structural design, whether it be for residential or commercial buildings. I want to be able to work for a company on the weekends and do private jobs (own business) on the weekend for people who want renovations, extensions etc. That's why I want to gain experience (~5 years) in the structural side of civil eng.

      Thanks for your post. I appreciate it a lot.

  • backpaqer on 27/04/2014 - 17:25
    +8

    Having hired a lot of people my advice is this…

    1. Craft the CV to talk specifically to the requirements of the role PD - even to the point of using terms or phrases in their job advert as they will read your CV and it will strike a chord as it will almost seem like they are reading their job advert back to themselves. Tick.

    2. Don't lie…ever. (should actually be point #1)

    3. Don't go into too much detail and ambiguity is OK…remember a CV is only to get your foot in the door and get you in front of the person either making the decision or influencing the decision to hire.

    4. Understand the company you want to work for…what sort of job are you targeting…find out if there is a job progression within the company that will get you where you want to be and be prepared to start lower within the role and work up from the inside (we've all heard the story about the mailroom clerk becoming CEO…it does happen).

    5. There are 3 critical criteria in hiring someone (a) can they do the work, (b) will they do the work and (c) will they fit in? (c) is usually the most important one…sometimes it is worth listing your hobbies but only if they are network-worthy (ie golf - but only if your handicap is single digit or at least poke some fun at yourself by admitting you help the groundstaff dig up the course from time to time, cycling, team sports etc - but only if serious about it…don't mention crafts or collections of any sort, and travel is so ho-hum unless you've done several treks with Bear Grylls or been on the Amazing Race).

    6. Try keep the resume to one page - even if you've been in the industry for 30 years. Employers and/or recruiters are usually hit with a lot of resumes so each resume will only get a cursory scan for keywords or historical context.

    7. Don't use a shotgun approach to posting resumes out - you dilute your value in the market. Maybe not if you're targeting individual companies but recruiters may all represent the same company and it doesn't look good if multiple copies of your resume ends up at the same place - normally a recruiter will ask if you have been represented to Co XYZ already before sending your resume in…ideally you say no…but if you say yes, the recruiter is now aware they are competing with others to secure you a role - chances are you will end up in their "keyword database" and only hear from them if you have specific skills that they can't find elsewhere. You wont be high priority.

    good luck

    • MrGareth on 27/04/2014 - 17:49

      This guy (or girl!!!) knows his or her stuff… especially take note of Point 5 part (c).

      That's actually how I was hired in my very first engineering job - they even told me that some of the other applicants had better grades but they felt I'd fit in more (this was a job contracting to Defense).

    • Rizzy on 27/04/2014 - 19:53
      +1

      Hi BackPaqer,

      Thank you for your detailed post. I have made changes accordingly to your and other people's suggestions.

      I can say my CV looks a lot better from what it was to now. It looks much more appealing.

      Thanks again.

    • lplau on 27/04/2014 - 20:03

      Point 2, not always correct, although it is ethically correct.

      It should read:
      Don't lie ….. EVER only if you are bad at lying.

      I know a friend who was awesome at lying no tells at all, the first job he landed was using a resume which was around 90% fabricated.

      If you are a person who cannot lie perfectly, then don't lie, the interviewers are VERY good at picking lies out, they are almost a human lie detector.

      However if you are REALLY good at lying then, you have a good edge in this section to get a job.

      A tip when you lie:
      Rehearse it and convince yourself that the lie is the truth.

      • Rizzy on 27/04/2014 - 20:10
        +1

        I'm not much of a liar. I have never liked deceiving people or getting deceived myself.

        • mls82 on 28/04/2014 - 21:56
          +1

          Why Old Men Don't Get Hired…..

          Human Resources Manager: "What is your greatest weakness?"

          Old Man : "Honesty!"

          Human Resources Manager: "I don't think honesty is a weakness."

          Old Man : "I don't give a fu*k what you think."

      • gummibears on 27/04/2014 - 21:56

        Become George Costanza.

      • cannedhams on 27/04/2014 - 22:44

        I remember Maxine McKew got her start in the ABC by typing up some glowing reference on BBC letterhead that she swiped from there whilst working as a secretary. It obviously worked for her.

      • 2ndeffort on 28/04/2014 - 11:32
        +1

        There is a difference between maximising your potential and lying. Straight out lying might work to get you into a non-skilled job but it is potentially life threatening for engineering. At the engineering firm I worked for we had a graduate design a garage for maintenance vehicles at a water treatment plant. Considered to be a very simple task compared to the complex tasks around the main infrastructure. He claimed to have done this kind of thing before.

        There was a problem with insufficient oversight by his supervisor but long story short, he neglected to account for wind load on the side of the building. The garage was built and in the first strong wind on site it blew over. Very embarrassing for a multinational design consultancy when your designs get blown over by the wind. Luckily there was nobody inside when it blew over and the only damage was the write-off of a utility vehicle parked inside. I cant remember what happened to him but I think the experienced supervisor that was meant to have checked the calcs (and didn't) was fired.

        I was also in the Army when they uncovered that the local Army doctor had lied about his qualifications and wasn't a doctor after all. He had somehow deceived loads of people and had been examining patients and prescribing medicine etc. There was massive fallout from that, made the papers at the time (late 90's).

  • edfrane on 27/04/2014 - 18:58
    +1

    Sadly the real problem would be experience. Employers just want experienced people, but won't give it.

    Retardedly they have 1-3 years experience requirements even for Entry-level, Junior, & Graduates Jobs.

    So your chances are, either
    -Fake/lie about your work experience (there are businesses for that, because you know why)
    -continue job hunting and hope to lucky, with someone that's not screwed up like everyone else(aim for small businesses)
    -Find some small businesses(job advertised or not), and request for work experience.

    Also try and avoid recruitment agency job posts. Their good to get opinions on your CV & resume, but other than that they'll just waste your time. They'll only pass through, who could earn the most (which is the most experienced).

    My best bet is to search for small-mid business(advertised or not), and question them whether they need a hand with CV and cover letter. Those often turn out for the best, as you'll get the most "real" experience out from them.

    • Rizzy on 27/04/2014 - 19:51

      Hi Edfrane,

      Thanks for your opinion. I am trying to get into a small company. I think I will be able to learn more in small companies.

      Thanks again.

      • lplau on 27/04/2014 - 20:04

        Small companies are better at learning more, as they usually have less procedures in place, which means you will have more work to do, and know how to do stuff manually not just pressing a few buttons somewhere and out pops the answer.

    • zeomega on 27/04/2014 - 22:36
      +3

      This… I recently came across a requirement by an advertiser.

      HTML5 experience required : 5 years.

      LoL.

  • resubaehtgnolhcs on 27/04/2014 - 19:23

    Rizzy,

    I know it's been mentioned a couple of times here, but if you don't have work experience to pad out your CV, then the next logical thing an employer will look at is your academic transcript, if you make it available to them. And, if your academic transcript stands out (as you would expect from an honours student), then you may get a call for an interview - especially for trainee/intern positions. Could you include your academic transcript with your CV?

    • Rizzy on 27/04/2014 - 19:50

      Hi Schlongtheabuser,

      I have attached my transcript multiple times to applications with no luck.

      Thanks for your post.

  • tissue on 27/04/2014 - 19:40

    I work for one of the largest construction companies in Australia, based in Brisbane, and cant highlight the work experience factor enough, not just for OP but for anyone in the current market. We typically would take on 80-100 grads of all disciplines nationwide per year, this year will be around 30. Of those 30, probably 90% have been selected from a pool of 40-45 students doing work experience, which means:

    a) the main way to get a job was through work experience, and
    b) there were still a few people in work experience who didnt get offered a position, and
    c) the odds of getting a job as a fresh face from outside the company are even slimmer than usual.

    Rizzy - Not a dig at you but can I ask how you managed to graduate in Engineering with 0 work experience? I thought it was a requirement from Engineers Australia to have 3 months of work experience?

    You have said you want to do structural/residential design, have you tried some of the very small consulting engineers, e.g. STA or similar, or even some of the soil testing guys? I also wouldnt limit myself to being too selective on any role if you are struggling to get anything, its easier to switch around once you have something under your belt.

    • Rizzy on 27/04/2014 - 19:49

      Hi Tissue,

      Thanks for your post.

      You do not need to have 3 months work experience to graduate if you went to Melbourne Uni. I prefer structural/residential design, however at this stage I don't really care. I just need to get my foot in the door and do anything related to my degree. I have been applying for Civil Engineering, Structural, Project Manager, Construction, Site Manager, Estimator, pretty much everything I could think of.

      How do I get experience when no one is giving me a chance to work?

      • lplau on 27/04/2014 - 19:59

        I think the most important thing people look for when looking for a potential candidate is "Potential" and "Initiative".

        Not somebody who knows it all. You may not know much, but you may have a lot of potential to achieve high.

        I would say, when you go to an interview, try to show these 2 skills. That you have potential, and that you are happy to take the initiative.

        Be persistent, don't look at the money, but look at the end goal, you can always earn higher, you just need to take 1 step through the door. I often see people lose a chance, when they are like "graduate jobs should give at least 40k a year, I will make myself hard to get if they offer me lower, then they will want me since they know i'm not cheap".

        Bad attitude, if they offer you 30k then just do it, then get in and climb the ladder to earning the big bucks.

        • Rizzy on 27/04/2014 - 20:08

          Hi Iplau,

          Agreed. Money isn't the issue with me. What is most important is getting experience.

          $30k a year is better than $0k a year.

          Thanks for your post.

  • imcold on 27/04/2014 - 20:36

    HI Rizzy, welcome to Ozbargain, the foremost place to come when your seeking a bargain. As for advice on getting a job….

    You should certainly post your cover letter up so we can take a look, be sure to redact anything you consider private and can be used to identify you. Beyond that there quite a selection of FREE self help books on amazon or udemy that are posted here. They might or might not help you.

  • GameChanger on 27/04/2014 - 21:12

    Hey Rizzy,

    Curious what have you being doing for 1 year since graduating? What do you tell your family and friends? Have a friend in a similar position and has no idea how to explain it to people.

    • hahaboy on 27/04/2014 - 21:41
      +1

      Yeh, judgmental people are a pain to deal with. Would love to hear what others say to this as well.

      • Rizzy on 28/04/2014 - 01:39
        +1

        Judgmental/negative people fuel me with motivation to make me work hard to prove them wrong. I have a mate everyone except his parents and mates said he will never be a doctor…well he's a few years out from being a qualified surgeon.

    • Rizzy on 28/04/2014 - 01:35
      +1

      Hey Gamechanger,

      I wasn't too serious in 2013. After finishing VCE and getting straight into uni I didn't have much family/holiday time. So once I finished I went for a holiday with the family for about a month and then went and explored NSW, QLD and North QLD for a total of 3 months. The start of 2014 is when I got serious trying to find a job.

      When family ask what's happening I just tell them the market is down. I have also been doing some IT contracting work for companies in Vic, NSW and the Whitsundays. Luckily enough I haven't been interrogated by any family yet. My friends are normal. They don't bother being judgmental.

      Best way for me to deal with judgmental people is to avoid getting into a situation where they will ask you uncomfortable questions.

      • GameChanger on 28/04/2014 - 17:24

        Thats great you not surrounded by people who judge! Worst feeling having to deal with people who expect you should be instantly in big jobs.

  • maybeamacy on 27/04/2014 - 23:27

    If you can't find a job for like 3 years after you finish your degree, does it effectively become worthless as companies are looking for fresh graduates with fresh knowledge/experience? That's what my friend that graduated in Chem Eng said so he just switched on and did another degree.

  • wc on 27/04/2014 - 23:56

    Sometimes to get a job is who you know, do you have friends/relatives in the same field ? Let them know that you are looking for a job even if someone is willing to employ you for work experience/no pay is a start. By doing this may lead you to a job.

    • Rizzy on 28/04/2014 - 15:15

      I have reached out to all my contacts - Civil Engineers, Mechanical Engineers, Surveyors and still nothing. Just hoping the market will get better. Thanks for your post.

  • stringbean402 on 28/04/2014 - 01:06
    +1

    To put it in perspective my 47yo Father in Law who has been a qualified and practicing civil/consulting/construction engineer is currently out of work and struggling to find another job.

    There is an oversupply of engineers currently due to the ass falling out of the 'mining boom'. If a person with 25 years of real experience is having issues I don't like the chances of a fresh faced uni graduate with no experience getting a job very easily.

    Might be time to broaden your horizons a little and try and find some industry related experience for a bit and re-visit the engineering side of things once the job market cools down.

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