Employer Is Paying Peanuts

Ash-Say on 30/09/2014 - 08:25
Last edited 30/09/2014 - 08:33

My company has hired a new person and this employee has same title as mine and not much experience in my field. I have been working with this company for more than 3 years at the same position.

My concern is the employee has been hired on 90K per annum package (I found from a reliable source) and my salary is almost 40K lesser. I have been given lot of extra responsibilities/projects recently which I was able to deliver before deadline.

How can I be strategic and ask my manager to increase my pay to make it market competitive salary in the next meeting?

Education & Work

Comments

  • rambutann on 30/09/2014 - 08:29
    +4

    Be blunt an honest.

    I obtained an internship with a company and basically just told them why I thought the pay rate they were offering me was unfair and what I believe I should be paid at and they said fair enough and gave it to me. Bearing in mind the type of internship I was going for was very hard to get and they could have easily gone and offered the job to somebody else.

    I guess its a bit harder because its 40k.. but it depends on the size of your company.

    If when you signed up they asked you what you would be happy with and you said that figure then they most likely had 90k set aside for you in the first place.

    I dunno, in my opinion you should be seeking the wage you deserve.

    • Ash-Say on 30/09/2014 - 08:38

      I am not asking for 90K but it should be around 70K to be fair.

      Is there any way to tell manager I am aware of package got by new employee?

      • onlyletters on 30/09/2014 - 09:01
        +24

        remember that employers never remember the good that you do for them, they only remember when you screwed up. make dot points of why you should be paid more, dont tell them you know how much the other guy is getting because this could put you in hot water. anyway good luck. remember that your reliable source might not be so reliable.

        • Ash-Say on 30/09/2014 - 09:03
          +9

          I hate to disclose it but I saw print out of payslip so it is 100% correct :)

        • lplau on 30/09/2014 - 16:35
          +11

          @bluecasper: Don't bring it up saying "oh that guy is earning more, therefore you need to pay me more".

          Just pretend you didn't know the other guy's salary. Just make a list of how you provide the business value, and ask if you can get more money. lol.

        • onlyletters on 02/10/2014 - 09:17

          doesn't matter. if your employer says no, it doesn't change anything.

        • patinadiary on 02/10/2014 - 16:50
          +6

          @bluecasper : Id start with finding similar advertised jobs online which are paying the salary you desire. Also look for annual salary surveys by various recruitment firms, again choose the surveys which are are close to your desired salary range.

          I'd start with telling your boss how positive you are about your role and how you see yourself growing here.

          Then I'd make a case based on the what the market pays for a similar job(show the jobs advertised and highlight the salary range), also, what the annual surveys from a few recruiters say(again, show those surveys and highlight the roles and salaries) and most importantly how you are/can add value to the company.

          Close by saying something on the lines of "i don't work this hard to keep staying where i currently am" and politely request for a salary review and make sure you quote a number higher than what you would eventually settle for.

          Never mention that 40k isn't cutting it anymore and your expenses have gone up or any personal circumstances as to why you should be given a raise. The employer doesn't care what you do with your money Goes without saying never bring up because he gets so much i should do too.

          All the best.

        • viper8548 on 03/10/2014 - 15:43

          @bluecasper:
          Any chance it may be including back pay? (ie 1.5 months or 2 months of pay) this is quite common for new employees as paperwork can take time, especially if some info was not supplied in the first round.

      • zeomega on 30/09/2014 - 22:54
        +4

        Have a chat with your boss by first HIGHLIGHTING all you've done for the company in 2 minutes MAX, then say that you've done a little research you would like to request for a pay rise to bring yourself up to market rate.

        Do a little research and find out market rate for someone in your position and experience, which i assume is going to be more than the 50K. If the company is willing to pay 90k for him, there must be a reason, or his nego skills is really pretty good.

      • [Deactivated] on 01/10/2014 - 11:33
        -1

        I can see why you're still on
        half the position is valued at by the company.

        If your original post is accurate you should ask for at least $100k. You may not get it but you should ask for it. And doing so would not be arrogant or presumptuous or excessive or any other negative descriptor. It would be fair.

        And if your boss has any concept of fairness they'll counter offer at least $90k.

        • Tnetennba on 01/10/2014 - 17:45
          +6

          He should just ask for a cool $1 million, the boss will probably settle at around $900k ;)

        • [Deactivated] on 01/10/2014 - 19:56
          +3

          @brezzo: OP's claiming they're a more experienced and in the same role.

          They are willing to pay $90k for a worse version of OP.

          Why do you mock the idea of him being paid the same?

        • Tnetennba on 04/10/2014 - 00:49

          @tantryl: It was a joke :( I do think OP should be getting at least $90k, but I was just playing on the whole "if you ask for x, you'll get at least 9/10 of x"

        • [Deactivated] on 04/10/2014 - 12:09

          @brezzo: I know it was a joke. That's what mocking is - making fun of someone or something in a cruel way. That's literally the dictionary definition of the word.

          I left in the qualifier "if your boss has any concept of fairness" for a reason. Many bosses don't.

      • [Deactivated] on 01/10/2014 - 17:36
        +1

        Ask for $200,000 beans, baby.

        Grow a pair and don't mess around.

    • onlyletters on 02/10/2014 - 15:02
      +1

      Another thing to add:

      Make sure you genuinely think you deserve it.
      Approach your boss politely and ask to meet privately for a discussion. Sit down in an office or something and give several valid points as to why you think your work deserves a raise. What sets you apart from the others?
      Do not explain that you need money for your family/college/etc., that isn't why raises are given. This is where the entitlement comes from.
      Raises are given to people whose work is valuable enough to be paid more
      It seems harsh, but it is reality.
      Just be polite and have good reasons and your chances will be good

  • snappy1234 on 30/09/2014 - 08:30

    Gee you are a rep for these two companies from your profile and you posted that up ?

    • Ash-Say on 30/09/2014 - 08:37
      +9

      Those are just part time activities to make some extra coins as it's hard to feed family on the current pay.

      At least I am not relying on loans!

      • snappy1234 on 30/09/2014 - 08:40
        +2

        @ bluecasper

        Fair enough :)

        Good Luck…you must be feeling hard done by (i would)

      • rack on 30/09/2014 - 13:01
        +2

        OMG are you Troy from Detroit ?

  • djones145 on 30/09/2014 - 08:34
    +40

    apply for a new job

    it sucks but the best way to get a pay rise these days is getting a new job

    • na8an on 30/09/2014 - 14:39
      +1

      or quietly let mgmt know you are looking of new job to create competitiveness, this worked for me in the past but only works if you are really in a strong position.

    • mls82 on 30/09/2014 - 19:08
      +4

      This.

      It also makes sense to look for another position while you are still employed, as it provides you with more bargaining power. I was made redundant from a company and took the first job that I was offered (slightly less pay and worse conditions). Six months later I was contacted by a recruiter through LinkedIn and moved to another company, circa 70% more pay but with the same roles & responsibilities. I have reason to believe people at my current company in the same role as me are on similar pay to what I was at my last job. Is it unfair that they are paid less than me? Perhaps. Does that mean I should be paid any less? No, its up to the individual to negotiate their own salary.

      Failing that get a trade and join a union. They're great for the little guys that can't negotiate a decent wage, but the other side of the coin is that "the lazy guy that does nothing all day gets paid the same as me".

      • wittyusername on 30/09/2014 - 21:05
        +6

        "Get a trade".

        Since OP has a family to look after, it seems unlikely that he can go for four years on shitty pay.

        • mls82 on 01/10/2014 - 06:35

          I agree. But bear in mind that OP has implied he is on approx 50k. Thats in line with some first year adult apprentices, depending on the industry (e.g. Ergon - $52,311).

        • Serapis on 02/10/2014 - 20:31
          +1

          @mls82:

          Lol what industry? Adult apprentice minimum wages never really go above $16 to $20 / hr and you flat line on that until the last year of the apprenticeship. That's 3 years on a salary of less than 40k (exclusive of allowances, weekends and ot)

    • fujay on 01/10/2014 - 12:34

      Sad but true…

  • IIGnomeII on 30/09/2014 - 08:51
    +6

    I am in a similar position, the company I work for doesn't have a yearly pay review and doesn't increase wage with inflation.
    I was stuck on the same wage for about 4 years until I spoke up and all I got was an extra few $K.
    The problem being is that the people I work with at the company are great, but the pay is low and I am sure that other people that have come on board are on what I struggled to get after 6 years working at the same place.
    The one other senior guy above me is on about $30K more than me for the same amount of work.

    My position now is to move to a bigger company after all these years. Why? Well with a bigger company they have more money to invest in their employees, there are departments like HR setup where you can discuss your issues and above all else there is structure.
    As much as I would like to stay working for the same group of great people at the end of the day I need to be able to support a family and pay for a house, you sometimes have to take the chance on a new company to get what you are after otherwise you end up getting too comfortable at the same place like me.

    • Ash-Say on 30/09/2014 - 09:02
      +2

      I agree - I will love to keep working for this company because the colleagues are nice however I cannot deny the fact that I have family to support.

      I have spent lot of efforts, in my current role, to learn in and out of different systems and became Subject Matter Expert in lot of areas but the new person does not even know ABC of systems and they still got almost double pay.

      This company has well structured HR so if my manager does not agree, can I request formal meeting with HR and question why my salary is too low?

      • IIGnomeII on 30/09/2014 - 09:14
        +1

        I would have the meeting with your HR but go in with a solid case.
        Don't say because X is on more than me I should be getting more as that may get you and the other person in trouble as the contract wage is meant to be confidential.

        I would put together a case where you are worried that recent employs are being paid higher than your current wage for the same work. Then provide info that shows that the current market rate in your state pays X on average.
        List out the things you do on a daily basis and what you have brought to the company and then finally say that you wish to be on $X for the work that you are doing. Add a few extra thousand as a buffer in case they turn around and say that they can't do that as you can then ask what they think is fair.

        • Ash-Say on 30/09/2014 - 09:34

          Thanks - I will get an idea of market rate based on reports available on My Career and Payscale for my position and prepare a case.

        • Serapis on 02/10/2014 - 20:33

          @bluecasper:

          This should also help:

          http://joboutlook.gov.au

      • kautuak on 01/10/2014 - 08:40

        Just give yourself a go. It doesn't hurt.
        At other Ops have suggested that you should do a bit of research of how much you should get for your role and use these facts to negotiate your pay raise.
        If it doesn't work out then you should move on.There is no point to hang around the current company because you will need to expand your connections and learning a different things in life which you will benefit in the future.

  • cloudy on 30/09/2014 - 09:26
    +3

    AS others have said, it's best u approach ur boss on what u think u are worth. Not based on a comparison with another person.

    You may have seen the pay figure, but u haven't seen their employment contract compared to urs. U don't know what kind of extra conditions he or she may have signed up for, unless you do happen to know this, it is really comparing apples with oranges in a sense.

  • airzone on 30/09/2014 - 10:04
    +4

    The 90k package will include ~ 10% super - so about 81k base. Do you have a phone? Laptop? Car? Allowances? Something you have by (s)he does not? Does he have a higher degree of education, or vendor certs?

    As other posters have mentioned, go armed with what you are worth, not what the other guy is getting.

    Edit: As others have alluded to, the most effective way to readjust a large gap in market value is to change jobs… And for gods sake, when the new company asks how much you were being paid, you say "Market average!"

    • Ash-Say on 30/09/2014 - 10:15

      90K is the base salary excluding super and none of us get any allowance including laptop, car and phone.

      We do get yearly bonus but I assume the new person will also get higher bonus because of higher base pay.

        • Ash-Say on 30/09/2014 - 17:18
          +1

          Thanks for the links and the minimum base salary comes out to be 70k so I will demand this package based on market rate.

        • nicksinternet on 30/09/2014 - 21:40
          +7

          @bluecasper:

          I know its easier said than done, but I feel you should be aiming for 90k. You know they will pay that and are paying someone else this for the same contribution you make. Why cut yourself short.

          In fact ask for $95k. Whats the worst that can happen? whats the best?

        • Supe on 01/10/2014 - 00:21
          +5

          @nicksinternet:

          Yes! Asking for 70K might get you 60K. Aim high. I was a trainee casual and went for a permanent position. I asked for and received a pay increase that beat senior guys who had been working there well before my time. You may get knocked back - or you may receive a big fat increase along with the massive grin that goes with it. As others have said - do not reference the other person's pay in the discussion. You'll devalue your position.

        • Ash-Say on 01/10/2014 - 07:41
          +2

          @Supe: I will make sure to not refer to other person's pay in our discussion. To be honest, it will be my first time asking for pay rise so I did not have any clue how to approach it but thanks to Ozbargainers for your valuable feedback.

          I agree that I should aim for 85k+ which means either they will reject it alogether or give fat pay rise to make it close to the demand.

        • nicksinternet on 01/10/2014 - 08:48
          +4

          @bluecasper:

          I'd be asking for $95k then 'compromising' from that position.

          If its rejected, then as you clearly think you are a good and decent working employee you should start looking for a 'promotion' pay or career wise with a competitor company.

        • rain on 01/10/2014 - 18:19
          +1

          @bluecasper:
          Go for with what [@nicksinternet] said, ask for $95-100k, they will never negotiate up but it will give you some room to negotiate, and from the sounds of it you are better experienced and more skilled or at least equal to the new guy ($90k) you should definitely being aiming for higher, always make some room for yourself or look at competitors.

        • Ash-Say on 01/10/2014 - 18:39
          +1

          @rain: I am not sure if it will be good approach to ask for $90K. I don't want to make a fool out of myself in front of manager.

  • sparkles on 30/09/2014 - 13:02
    +13

    Honestly, finding out that they hired someone less experienced than me for $40K more (for certain) would make me want to quit. I'd be quietly seething. You seem to be taking it well.

    • c0balt on 01/10/2014 - 17:07
      +5

      I'm in this position now myself and will be walking soon.

      I have been at a company for 3 years without a raise yet my productivity has skyrocketed. Instead of being given a raise, promotion or a stake in the company, my new efficiency became the new baseline and all the additional services I provided (not in the job description) are considered part of the job now.

      To further my pain - as a specialised technician my boss makes me train fresh out of uni recruits (again not part of the job description but OK I can understand that training in small companies is done by the technicians and not specialised training) at the same time as doing my actual job - and then pays the new recruits the same as me and I end up providing daily training catchups and getting the tougher jobs.

      So I am doing 2x the work than people who I have trained up are getting the same pay for. It's soul crushing. There's a lot of stories like this in my industry though - it's all contracts between bosses and rather than compete with eachother a lot of companies will only work a few months a year and shift their staff between companies as sub-contractors. So there's no job protection, kick up a fuss and you can be expected to have your contract terminated. It's hell.

      Bosses can be pricks. My advice to the OP is that what ever happens, don't quit until you have another job lined up or you have saved up enough money for a long, long wait until your next job could possibly happen (it's tough out there). There's a small chance that even if you bring up your issues with HR or your boss, that they won't take kindly to it even though you are 100% in the right.

    • CleverCounter on 03/10/2014 - 06:49

      Its a deal breaker for me… you have been clearly overlooked and will have that struggle with that company for many years to come… better start fresh

  • mooney on 30/09/2014 - 13:34
    +1

    Whenever these types of posts appear my only question is "What is the result of your most recent performance appraisal?" (Obviously I am assuming you work in a company that holds these)

    If it's average or below, do not even bother to speak to your boss, you will be wasting your time. Your tenure in the role is completely irrelevant, time served is nothing to do with your worth.

    What IS relevant is that they have given you additional responsibilities, that coupled with a strong appraisal is justification for you entering into a salary discussion although I would echo others here- NEVER make reference to what other people in the company are earning, it will be held against you. Your job is to demonstrate your worth to the business is more than your current salary- prove that and you will get what you want. Fail to prove that and you can either stay and suck it up, or go get a new job.

    Let us know how you go!

    • Ash-Say on 30/09/2014 - 14:45

      The last performance rating was 2 out of 5.

      I have completed so many tasks which do not form part of my day to day responsibilities but I have been given these projects to support business and I have also received lot of accolades from colleagues.

      • airzone on 30/09/2014 - 15:21
        +11

        TBH, if one of my staff were a 2/5 (assuming 5 is best), I wouldn't be entertaining pay raise requests. Actually, I'd be considering if I should spend more effort in developing them, or replacing them. I suppose it depended on how many years they were getting this kind of score.

        Your peers seem to think you are good. But I don't know about your boss. What was the type of feedback on the review? Don't take it personally - I've seen many people who are blind to the message that their bosses are trying to deliver. It's often hard to accept, but acceptance of the fact that there are opportunities to improve is the first step to getting there.

        tl;dr - I would be considering how to bring that score up first, then pay second.

        • Sshanaz on 30/09/2014 - 15:34

          I agree with above comment

  • Shadow54 on 30/09/2014 - 14:33
    -7

    Careful they don't replace you with somebody on a 457 visa and pay you $4 an hour like the mushroom pickers in my area…………………….

  • stargalaxy on 30/09/2014 - 15:00

    I would suggest you look for a new job, what usually happens in most companies is the employer will not adjust your pay if you don't ask for it or you are not leaving. If you boss don't appreciate your service, why stay on, I am sure you are not there for the fun of it. You can indirectly hint to the boss that your pay is too low compare to what you contribute and cost of living pressures is getting on to you, maybe take sick leave every week and when your boss ask, you can hint that you are sleepless at night worrying about bills to pay and that is why you are sick. If your boss appreciate you and wants to keep you on, surely he will do something about it, else it is sayonara time.

    • Ash-Say on 30/09/2014 - 15:52
      +1

      That's exactly what I plan to d - I'll ask for pay rise and if they don't agree, I will start looking for another job.

      • ferguscan on 30/09/2014 - 17:06
        +11

        Wrong way 'round. Find another job, then ask for the pay rise from your current employer. Negotiate from a position of strength, not weakness.

        • stargalaxy on 30/09/2014 - 17:40
          +2

          Yes, find a job first before resigning. Also, usually employer is suspicious on why you are unemployed when you are applying for them, they may think something is wrong with you. Also, you may actually find a job with $90K pay in the process. Good luck.

  • Ash-Say on 30/09/2014 - 15:38
    +5

    @airzone… 1 is the top rating and I am targeting for 1 this year so 2 isn't bad.

    • airzone on 30/09/2014 - 18:03
      +1

      Ok. Ours are more = better. 2/5 isn't bad then.

  • hts on 30/09/2014 - 16:39
    +6

    I recently left my previous job because of similar circumstances. I found out the pay of another employee performing the same duties/tasks etc as myself, has been there a year or so longer (9 yrs to my 7.5 yrs) and there was a $30k pay gap between us. Both of us have the same level of educations (bachelors, certifications) so there is nothing seperating us. I asked the boss for a pay rise (after working for a solid 3 years without any increase) and got the boiler plate we don't have extra funds for pay increases, so I queried the pay gap and his answer was that the other bloke has kids so he should get paid more.

    I told him that was a bullshit answer, just because someone has kids or not shouldn't factor into their wage, especially 30k. I gave my notice and started looking for another job, I'm working for myself now, earning less than I was but at least I no longer have to deal with that kind of crap!

    Good luck OP, hopefully your boss is a better person than my old one and if they don't value your work, shop around for a company that does.

    • Ash-Say on 30/09/2014 - 17:01

      I have kids so I assume I have good chance here..lol

      We get pay rise in March and I was thinking to discuss pay rise early December but I now think I should do it within next couple of weeks to give him plenty of time to escalate with senior managment.

      ANy feedback on this approach?

      • unswgeek on 30/09/2014 - 18:53
        +7

        Well in that case I might need to start thinking to borrow some kids from some one.

    • sickllama on 24/12/2014 - 19:55

      That's discrimination. Isn't that illegal in Australia?

  • lord henry on 30/09/2014 - 17:57

    Unfortunately about the only thing you can do is to actively start looking for another job.
    When you find one you can use it as leverage to get a substantial pay rise if that is what you want - but you have to be prepared to walk.

    As your performance reviews don't appear stellar, you are going to need more bargaining power and the only way to do that is to have other offers.

  • [Deactivated] on 30/09/2014 - 18:03
    +10

    "People don't disclose their income with each other because it's considered rude", employers really love this sentiment.

  • unswgeek on 30/09/2014 - 18:45

    Go search and get a new job hold the offer:

    a) if you like your current company: politely negotiate with them to get you a salary match.

    b) else, just reassign and go to your new role.

    doing so you would at least get 30% pay rise, if your descriptions are real.

  • Ash-Say on 30/09/2014 - 20:10
    +2

    Ok everyone..Thank you so much for your feedback and guidance. I have reviewed 2014 salary guide provided by Robert Half, Robert Walter, Kelly Recruitment, Pay Scale and Salary Rates Australia. All reports state that the minimum base salary for my position is 70K.

    I think I have strong written evidence that I am being paid well below the market rate and I have also complied list of my recent achievements, initiatives I took that resulted in positive outcome and extra responsibilities that were assigned to me on the top of my job profile.

    One final feedback is required - Should I organise meeting now or wait for Performance Review which is due in December?

    • [Deactivated] on 02/10/2014 - 18:59

      Now - if you wait until later you'll get the line that they've already put the budgets together and their hands are tied.

  • jason101 on 30/09/2014 - 21:43
    +2

    "I have also complied list of my recent achievements, initiatives I took that resulted in positive outcome and extra responsibilities that were assigned to me on the top of my job profile."

    Focus on this above anything else (ie I feel the fact they pay someone else more than you (with the same job title)is irrelevant), I manage multiple teams of people who effectively all do the same job - many of the rates of pay differ. The job doesn't determine the pay, the person and their ability to deliver the required outcomes for their company matters.

    I would acknowledge to your superior that you understand you are due for a review in December, but an earlier meeting to discuss your request would be appreciated as you feel concerned and aggrieved by the issues you wish to discuss. Most managers will be happy to speak to their staff in a formal setting outside of prescribed times if the meeting is structured appropriately.

    Demanding a review, at which you then demand a pay rise isn't something that would bode well with me.

  • JimmyF on 30/09/2014 - 22:13
    +22

    Been there, done that before… You won't get much from your current company. Strangely they won't want to 'increase' your pay that much to keep you, maybe 10-20k TOPS…… You will have to leave to get the 'market rate' pay.

    Companies are strange, they wouldn't want to pay YOU 90K as thats a 40K pay increase, but are happy to pay market rates of 90K if you leave. Go figure…

    As I said, been there and done that before. Be direct with your boss, say you have looked at market rates and you are way below them. What can be done to bring you up to market rates based on experience etc. If the newbie is getting 90k, then ask for 100-110k, settle for 80k plus. If they bork, pose the question to them like "Without telling me what they earn. How does my pay level compare to the recent new hire? Based that they have less experience than I currently have, are you paying them more or less that my current package?"

    • theStinge on 01/10/2014 - 11:59

      ^This. I would give this more than one +1 if I could!

  • big on 30/09/2014 - 22:41
    +2

    And as you can't tell your boss where you have your information from, have a look at recruiting websites that advertised the role of your new team member. Usually they are advertised with a salary range.

    They might be advertised via recruiting companys, but usually its not
    hard to figure out.

    In our case we found that similar roles to ours were advertised for much more than current staff earns and the team used a printout from the position in seek in their end of year discussions.

  • chukkii on 01/10/2014 - 08:31
    +1

    My advice is for OP to look elsewhere for a new job if possible.

    My experience is that if you're having to ask for such large pay raises then your employer doesn't really value you all that much.

    Even if you get your $20k pay rise today, you're going to have to fight for another pay rise tomorrow.

    Unless you're really attached to the company I would strongly suggest having a look at the market and see if you can't find something for even more than $90k

    • backpaqer on 01/10/2014 - 10:29
      +2

      Obviously if the market supports 90K for doing your job with your experience and the employer doesn't match the market - go get a job offer from somewhere and then take that offer back to your employer and ask them to be reasonable about matching the offer (if you like the location/people etc and want to stay there) otherwise take the offer and enjoy the new job.

      As a team lead in a large corp, I found my hands tied when trying to go in to bat for pay increases for my team, so I recommended they do this and I would support them with references etc hoping that they would come back with a solid negotiating position to help me keep them - it worked. But it helps if your manager does empathise with you and is supportive.

  • Daedalus on 01/10/2014 - 12:03
    +1

    I would take your market info to your employer (70k+), then provide your points on your additional responsibilities and ask for $100k.

    If they counter with >$90k then its all good

    If the decline or counter offer too low you can then start to look for another job. Why bother looking for another job if you are happy here and they are willing to give you what you want?

    Be aware that there are many articles online on why you should not accept a counter offer from the current employer if you find a new job.

  • tonka on 01/10/2014 - 13:45

    Best way I have seen, get another job. If your current employer values you they will match the offer at the new place. if not you have a new job to go to. When hiring people I have had this happen so many times, the candidate doesn't want the job, just the contract.

    All other methods really depend on your employer.

    Many will refuse outright to consider paying more based on what someone else gets on the grounds pay is dependent on individual merit.
    At the very same time though if they are doing their rem by current standards they should have you measured against a base market salary and know if you are under.

    Approach your manager, don't say you want a pay rise, say you are not meeting your personal financial goals and need to earn more. Say before you look at other options you would like to know if there is an opportunity to earn more, change roles to earn more.

  • snook on 01/10/2014 - 13:47
    -2

    The new employee is linked to Tony and they hired him specifically for marketing value? I hear this goes on.

    • c0balt on 01/10/2014 - 14:32
      +1

      Today I woke up with a little bit of dandruff.. thanks Tony!

  • Cave Fire on 01/10/2014 - 16:22
    +2

    New person might have some connections in the company? Family etc?

    • gk0r on 01/10/2014 - 18:53
      +1

      Exactly. I assume that this is private sector, in which case, remuneration often has little to do with job performance. Especially the 'outlier' cases. If the market average is 70, and this person is getting 90 - there is probably more to the story than what you know (seeing their pay slip).

      Moreover, what you have to consider is that that person was hired for what they brought with them - not what they are doing right now. Of course they might not know the 'ins and outs' of the current system the same way you do - but they weren't hired based on that. They were hired based on what the employer expected them to contribute and perhaps change the way you do things to drive the business output even higher. They might only be learning the "as is" system because they need to understand it before improving it.

      There could be any number of other things that explain the wage discrepancy (at least to the employer, if not you) - it could be family or client relations. It could be because of his or her past experience and the plans for the business. It could be just plain old favouritism and pay discrimination.

      See if you can discreetly dig a little more. Ask your boss about the new hire. Frame your questions around the focus on you wanting to be market competitive and ask questions like 'What made this candidate stand out ahead of others?' or 'What strengths did you see in this person?'. You can then ask more targeted questions like 'How did they demonstrate this strength/quality to you?' or 'What was that critical factor that put this candidate ahead of the others in the final selection decision?'

      Also, I don't see anyone mentioning the GlassDoor - check that out as well http://www.glassdoor.com.au/index.htm

      Good luck

  • Windows7forever on 01/10/2014 - 18:57

    …then buy an elephant :P

  • Ash-Say on 01/10/2014 - 21:06

    Here are my recent research findings

    1) Recruitment Salary Guides suggest a pay range between $75K to $90K.

    2) Found a friend of friend who works in the same fields at the same position. I discussed my situation with him and he agrees that I am well underpaid as he is getting 85K+ though he did not disclose the exact figures.

    3) I found a job ad from Randstad on Seek with the same responsibilities as I do on a daily basis and the offered pay range is between $80K to $90K.

    I believe I have a strong case based on above three sources, 3 years experience and recent project deliverables. I am going to demand for pay adjustment in line with market rate rather than pay rise because I am underpaid.

    • tonka on 01/10/2014 - 21:36

      When you say 'demand', make sure you have a good read on your boss/HR.
      Some people will really dig their heels in against salary 'demands'. Sometimes though it is how you get ahead.

    • microsnot on 01/10/2014 - 22:44
      +1

      I always line up another job first before negotiating as this gives me better leverage. If the employer thinks I'm worth it then I get what I want from them otherwise I simply move on. Hopefully your employer wants to invest in and keep their people. The easiest way to get a decent pay rise is to be a flight risk or actually move on. Good luck.

      BTW, I'm not sure why you think that your title entitles you to the same pay as the new employee. Could it be that you have the same title but they have more proven experience or contacts that the business deems to be of value? In my previous role most of us had the same titles but the difference between the low end and the high end of the scale was around $70K.

  • lindol on 01/10/2014 - 22:53

    it also depends on your qualifications: the other bloke is getting paid more if he has a degree,doctorate and so on

    • Ash-Say on 02/10/2014 - 05:27

      I have two Master Degrees and I also completed globally recognised certification last month.

  • peterpeterpumpkin on 01/10/2014 - 23:52

    Reminded me of this article 2 days ago.

    http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/sep/29/neolibe…

  • mangoman on 02/10/2014 - 01:32

    If you are getting under paid by that much you should perhaps consider finding a new employer, but make sure you look for a job while you are still working. IMO employers are more likely to employ someone is working.

    Its difficult to really assess your situation without having first hand knowledge. Your manager may be looking for someone with for instance management skills. Rightly or wrongly assuming you are not capable.

    But IMO your biggest issue is that its not uncommon for managers to think along the lines of once a junior always a junior and to have a hard time accepting you are capable of other things or deserving of a substantial raise.

    I worked at a company where i made a move which was too aggressive (under similar circumstances to yourself), my sub-manager never explained what i did to the top manager so when i went to him with regards to my position and he basically said this is "B*** S***" to my face, and after that i always felt uneasy around him as i had made him look stupid.

    Lucky for me i was retrenched when i was starting consider my options and trying to bring myself to leave a place where i had a lot of very bright/talented friends. I was told they had to bring in 3 full time contractors to take up the slack and lets just say i wasnt earning much.

    Oh ultimately not really sure what to say.
    Go in with a clear action plan like you would for a job interview, especially work out specifically what you are good at and offer to the company if possible. You dont want to be too demanding and push your manager around but you need to get across your points across clearly.

    I hope it goes well for you.

  • t_c on 02/10/2014 - 09:36
    -1

    What kind of delicate geniuses earn 90k, man I thought $1000 a week is what well off people make and you guys are almost talking 6 figure salaries. FML

    • [Deactivated] on 02/10/2014 - 10:29

      From OP:

      I have two Master Degrees and I also completed globally recognised certification last month.

      That probably helps.

      But there are plenty of jobs that don't need that, although they generally require that you work up to it. If you really want to earn more money you're going to have to look at your current career path and try and figure out how to get there. And if you can't see the way to do it with your current career, change careers.

  • steff on 02/10/2014 - 10:56

    As most others have said, its time you should be looking for a new job. However, in the meantime, consider taking up these extra projects if you can manage them and use these for your creating a strong resume.

    I know its not the ideal thing to do - work more for less money but you could use this situation to your advantage when moving on to your next job

  • Davo1111 on 02/10/2014 - 11:55

    They obviously don't value you. Either they want you to leave, or they don't GAF about you.

    Find a new job, then leave. When they ask, tell them why.

    • edgar28 on 02/10/2014 - 13:10

      your manager might value you, but HR might not allow your manager to increase your pay easily without tonnes of justifications.

      • Davo1111 on 03/10/2014 - 12:16

        That sounds like a BS excuse to me.

        • edgar28 on 04/10/2014 - 11:35

          I encountered that before. The manager did fight for me for increment for a long time….. And my manager didn't tell me that "long battle" . I found out from another sources and my manager did upset the HR too…..

      • 2ndeffort on 06/10/2014 - 01:03

        So Basically you are working for a dysfunctional organisation, your prospects for payrises are limited and despite getting on with your line management your best long term prospects are…..to leave!

  • edgar28 on 02/10/2014 - 13:09

    you live in Australia, sounds about right? Like others said, look for new job if you think LIFO is not an issue.

  • arbok on 02/10/2014 - 13:09

    OP you should be on 100k, go talk to your boss, but don't ramble. Be concise state your reasons you deserve a higher salary. Don't mention the other guy/girl.

    I find it crazy that you think you should still be 20k less than the other person with LESS experience.

    If they don't pay you more, that's fine, keep working, but start looking for another job ASAP. Do not keep working there for your current salary.

    • yannyrjl on 03/10/2014 - 16:42

      Companies always pay internal candidates less. There is a reluctance to move or a "Comfort" factor (i.e. People holding out for long service leave, existing goodwill built within the organisation etc) which is in the company's favour. (Job hunting is tiresome and unpleasant to most)

      It's difficult to stay in the same role and be always market aligned. Good employers use bonuses as the equaliser (although to me that's still not good enough)

    • edgar28 on 04/10/2014 - 11:36

      Talk to union for min bracket?

  • chaosmaster on 02/10/2014 - 13:14
    +1

    For some reason the thinking here seems to be present them with the current market rates that you are underpaid.

    They already know the current market rates…they just hired someone for 90k.

    Your not going to get paid what your "worth" or what you read on your coworkers payslip,
    your going to get paid what you negotiate.

    Here's what you need to negotiate:
    Clear number you want to earn
    Be willing to leave the job if you don't get it

    If you walk into negotiations without both of those, you've already lost. They may bump your pay slightly
    but I doubt you will get matched to the new employee.

    If the people making decisions don't need you or like you then you've already lost by default also.

    Also note because your getting paid 50k now, thats what they are used to paying for you. Asking
    them to jump to 100k even if you were worth it is just too large a mental hurdle. For this reason
    it's likely if you do want to maximise how much your getting paid you will need to find another job.

    disclaimer: as mentioned already its hard to give exact advice without knowing the exact situation.

Login or Join to leave a comment
Login Join