People Getting Benefits off Centrelink Illegally

Hotpotcorn on 02/04/2015 - 22:33
Last edited 02/04/2015 - 22:34

seriously my dads a bus driver and he tells me how pretty much 50% of people who gets disability support benefits off centrelink are faking. it pisses me and my dad off because instead of the government paying all these fake disability people they could use it on something else… its just money wasted by the government… also there are so many people who are not even looking for work getting money off centrelink. My dad knows someone who has been receiving disability benefits from centrelink where he is perfectly fine for over 5 years and never have been caught…

what can i do about this? where can i report?

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Comments

  • airzone on 02/04/2015 - 22:43
    -1

    This is the website you want for that…

    http://bit.ly/1BTjCWS

  • [Deactivated] on 02/04/2015 - 23:07
    +21

    My dad knows someone who has been receiving disability benefits from centrelink where he is perfectly fine for over 5 years

    Just curious here - how well does your dad know this person, and has the person actually admitted to milking the system? Or is your dad assuming the person is "perfectly fine" based on how the person appears?

    Not saying that your dad is misled or lying here. There are certainly people out there who are claiming benefits in a dodgy manner… but there are also people out there who have illnesses which may not be overtly visible (ie. disability doesn't simply mean the person must be restricted to a wheelchair, or have difficulty getting about at all times etc) but still limit their ability to work full time or even part time.

    I guess my point is that perhaps it's best not to judge until you know for certain..

    • Hotpotcorn on 02/04/2015 - 23:37

      yeh maybe my dad was exaggerating, but it just pisses me off how centrelink doesnt do anything about people claiming benefits in a dodgy manner

      • [Deactivated] on 03/04/2015 - 00:46
        +11

        What makes you think Centrelink don't do anything about it? Have you actually looked into any of this in detail, or are you still making major assumptions without basis? As far as I'm aware, they do review people on benefits. They aren't simply thrown money year after year for decades without their circumstances being re-checked/reviewed. Even people on Disability are granted it for a certain amount of time - this is all covered in their application (ie. questions about how long their illness is expected to affect them etc).

        You also need written proof from medical practitioners. Granted, there are probably dodgy ones out there who are just as happy to sign off whatever paperwork you show them, but considering the enormous risk they'd be taking for seemingly no personal reward.. you'd expect that % to be quite low.

        Didn't someone post a thread on here some time last year about Centrelink demanding they pay back a certain amount of money, after it was deemed that they were not in fact eligible/entitled to that money at the time Centrelink had paid them? I swear there was. Anyway - one would expect the same punishments (and more?) if one is found to be rorting any pensions. I'd hardly call that "doing nothing".

        • lemc6125 on 05/04/2015 - 13:35
          +1

          I haven't posted on here before but I've had to pay back excessive youth allowance I was paid (after a stupid mistake c-link made). I wasn't trying to rort the system and they issued me with the overpayment notice years after I stopped getting benefits.

          Pretty sure c-link was 'doing something' about it because I didn't report any overpayment.

  • StalkingIbis on 02/04/2015 - 23:45

    there are some people claiming multiple benefits under fake aliases, they are the ones that need to get slammed first

    • mskeggs on 03/04/2015 - 00:07
      +4

      And these people are typically jailed when caught. There are not many doing this.
      Edit: here are some figures that show rates of fraud and punishments:
      http://www.armstronglegal.com.au/criminal-law/offences/centr…

      • GnarlyKnuckles on 03/04/2015 - 21:22

        "… here are some figures that show rates of fraud and punishments:"

        Erm, you do realise that the figures on successful frauds, i.e. those that are never detected, will never be known? And these are actually the ones that reflect the rate at which it is occurring; not the amount that they manage to detect. So it is entirely incorrect to conclude from the number that they detect/successfully prosecute/prove, that "There are not many doing this".

    • PVA on 14/04/2015 - 13:17

      sounds like A Current Affair/ Today Tonight story.

  • mskeggs on 03/04/2015 - 00:07
    +10

    Centrelink makes it incredibly difficult to claim benefits people are legitimately entitled to, and have draconian punishments for people who claim falsely, or even make errors in their applications. I recognise there is a tradition of attributing illegitimacy to Centrelink applicants, but all evidence suggests it is a small problem.
    Here is a report that has some facts and figures http://www.aic.gov.au/publications/current%20series/tandi/42…

    I think it is worth remembering that welfare payments are not very lavish, and nearly all recipients would much rather earn an income, or higher income, if they could. Consider the many families getting Family Tax Benefit payments. Do you think many would rather get the welfare, or earn $150,000+ so they didn't qualify?
    Similarly, the pension rate is around $500 a week. It isn't a lavish income compared to even low skill work like working in a shop (which is paid about $1000 a week for a 40hr casual).

    Now consider that a wealthy person with a single investment property worth the median in Sydney can lower their tax bill by $1300 a month thanks to negative gearing and it becomes clear the hole in the budget could be much more easily filled by changing tax arrangements for those who have lots of money, rather than pursuing the small number of people who might be rorting the pension.

    • DS2k on 03/04/2015 - 01:51
      -2

      "nearly all recipients would much rather earn an income, or higher income, if they could."
      I am yet to find one, let me know one who gets payment from Centrelink and is dying to get off it.. Just want to see one… I am serous..

      • [Deactivated] on 03/04/2015 - 02:56
        +10

        Me. I'm not on disability and never have been. I'm on a much lower $ allowance. I can't complain since we're incredibly lucky to even have such support in this country and I'm so grateful for it - but I'm a uni graduate and was on a $70k salary in my first year out of uni, in a career that I loved, prior to having to take time off. I'd much rather be working (for more reasons than just the cash) than have to make do with the little I do, when I have to pay for bills and necessities just like everyone else does.

        I've also had to drop thousands on hospital bills too (private treatment which isn't offered in the public system - at a time that I didn't have private health cover). Again, I'd much rather be independent and working, not only for the income, but for the psychological benefits of being a self-sufficient adult. It's not exactly good for the old self confidence being on any kind of government benefit. But anyway..

      • Geewhizz on 03/04/2015 - 08:07
        +7

        I am yet to find one, let me know one who gets payment from Centrelink and is dying to get off it.. Just want to see one… I am serous..

        You can't seriously believe that not a single recipient of centrelink support would be looking and hoping for an alternative? If so you've obviously led a very sheltered life.

    • BobD on 03/04/2015 - 08:41
      -1

      "The pension rate is around $500 a week"
      In your dreams.
      Disability pension payments here.
      http://www.humanservices.gov.au/customer/enablers/centrelink…

      • tomclancy on 03/04/2015 - 11:47
        +1

        According to your own link the payments vary between $800-$1200 per fortnight, or roughly $400-$600 per week.

        mskeggs is spot on

        • parisienne on 03/04/2015 - 12:36
          +4

          Damn..really,is THAT the going rate ? What the hell am i doing working for a few hundred more a week (shiftwork at that).

          Mskeggs…can you let me know where that job in a shop at $1000 a week is please,i could use a payrise and less stress.

        • mishrael on 04/04/2015 - 02:03
          +4

          You may want to note that high end of that scale is per couple. not for a single person.

        • parisienne on 04/04/2015 - 08:08

          @mishrael: Noted hun.but STILL,not an altogether bad deal (hubby has simple tastes,i am willing to forgo my shoe addiction,but i'll be damned if i'm giving up the 3 ply tootpaper…we are a civilised household here after all.HAHAHA)
          Honestly though,it is a thought creator yes ?

        • mskeggs on 06/04/2015 - 21:43
          +1

          @parisienne:
          If you work casual 40 hours a week in a cafe you will gross over $1000 if one of your days is Sunday.
          Award:
          https://extranet.deewr.gov.au/ccmsv8/CiLiteKnowledgeDetailsFrameset.htm?KNOWLEDGE_REF=216303&TYPE=X&ID=9275471786649605188889912894&DOCUMENT_REF=400831&DOCUMENT_TITLE=Hospitality%20Industry%20(General)%20Award%202010&DOCUMENT_CODE=MA000009

        • PVA on 14/04/2015 - 13:14

          @parisienne:
          $400 a week, doesnt leave you much after you pay rent does it?

    • nikey2k27 on 16/04/2015 - 20:16

      You right there my brother Get DSP after he pay his rent and food and bills he only get 40.00 per fortnight left. No life another down side he only leave Aus for 4 weeks per year. I dad chistmas treat my boyfriend i will pay 10,000 to take him oversea this year. He dream going Disneyland/ hollywood / mov studios. i told dad we do Christmas in UK with family and then take him to USA on way back to Aus so he go LA. 6 week all up never been oversea other then P&O boat trip. wheelchair also need to take with us everywhere. Centrelink told him no if you you will not get DSP and you will have reapply for it. WTF. No life no enjoyment.

    • [Deactivated] on 21/12/2015 - 22:47

      Your link states

      15.7 percent of reviews led to cancellations or reductions in payments.

      Isn't that significant?

      • mskeggs on 22/12/2015 - 07:34

        Old thread, but that figure isn't about fraud. It is those cases that have been reviewed, so isn't a figure that applies to all recipients, and includes errors etc. The system is complex, unnecessarily perhaps, and the result is it can be difficult for people to know if they are receiving the right help and reporting things like extra income correctly.
        Of those 4million reviews, about 5000 were referred for prosecution, 0.1%.

    • myfuturej on 27/12/2015 - 17:51

      Thanks mskeggs. Clearly, people should be wiser in identifying the actual rorts of the system instead on whining about the low-hanging fruit aka poor people on welfare. The main loophole is that the tax system is subsidising the investors through negative gearing, big businesses and the richer people, in terms of private faith-based schools, private insurance, and tax deductible donations.

  • coin saver on 03/04/2015 - 00:10
    +12

    my dads a bus driver and he tells me how pretty much 50% of people who gets disability support benefits off centrelink are faking.

    If your dad has the qualifications to make this statement why is he driving a bus?

    • mskeggs on 03/04/2015 - 00:15
      +7

      Maybe the stress of doing clinical assessments was high and he changed careers? It would be interesting to see his research that fully half of applicants are fraudulent, when the figures show it is more in the order of 1 or 2%

      • coin saver on 03/04/2015 - 00:30
        +11

        Next time i get ill i will make sure i get a second opinion from a bus driver.

  • Mijak on 03/04/2015 - 00:46
    +12

    Disabilities are not always visible or physical like missing an arm. Most disabilities are mental.

    Source: wife works in disability support.

    • ant meal on 26/12/2015 - 21:39
      +1

      You're quite correct, Mijak, my son is on a DP as he has an autistic spectrum disability. If you passed him in the street, you may not be aware that he is any different than any other person. It is only when you try to have a conversation with him that it becomes obvious he has the disability.

      It would be interesting to find out what "normal" people believe a disability is.

  • belongsinforums on 03/04/2015 - 01:31
    +1

    dont worry OP, when they get caught, they will be ordered to pay all the money back. centrelink overpaid a mate and asked for some of their payments back…3 years after they stopped paying him!

    • BobD on 03/04/2015 - 08:43
      +2

      Yes, even if they make a mistake and over pay, they will still claw it back.

      • belongsinforums on 03/04/2015 - 14:24

        Most people on centrelink would be spending the money quickly - I imagine. I do have another friend though that saved all his payments up and got himself a nice car

  • Hoju on 03/04/2015 - 07:19
    +10

    I'd rather the government paid more attention to corporate (think IKEA, Apple etc) and high income tax dodgers. Probably a few billion in that as opposed to the $200/week or so some dodgy sad geezer in Mount Druitt is getting.

  • djones145 on 03/04/2015 - 09:33

    ACA or today tonight
    they love stories like this
    you might get a spotter fee too!

  • iridiumstem on 03/04/2015 - 12:13
    +2

    There are no systems that has no errors in real life.
    What is the chance of giving the benefit to the person who doesn't deserve it?
    What is the chance of not giving benefit to the the person who doesn't it?
    More than often, those two chances are negatively correlated, i.e. reducing one increases another.
    Like, if the government implements stricter restriction on benefit collection, it would be reducing people wrongly receiving the benefit, but it would also increase the chance of right people not receiving the benefit.

    Of course, there are implementations that can reduce the overall chances of errors all together.
    i.e. more details of the household collected would allow better judgment. That comes with cost and possible invasion of privacy though.
    So if the savings from having more details (thus from removal of wrongly given out benefits), is less than the cost of collecting more details, for example,
    the government would not implement it.

    Though that being said, I have no clue what would be the best thing to describe the current Australian welfare system.

  • AJW on 03/04/2015 - 14:23
    +8

    Your first line in your post is of concern, how would your Dad know just by looking at a person as they hop on a bus??
    If you know of a definite case of fraud, then by all means you should report it. But don't judge a book by it's cover, many people don't look disabled or look like they fit the stereotype (not that there is one). My daughter had just had a double lung transplant a few weeks earlier, has a disability, and had also broken her foot, and we were on daily visits to the hospital (this was many years ago). We had been given an ACROD parking permit because parking was typically hard to find at the hospital, and yet we still had a note left on our windscreen one day saying we were scum because she was obviously not disabled and they had seen us parking here every day for most of the day for weeks on end. How on earth they surmised this I have no idea - she couldn't walk, I was giving her a piggy back from the car to the clinic…but if I had found the person that had left the note and accused us of abusing the system I would have put them in hospital myself.

    • coin saver on 03/04/2015 - 18:13
      +4

      Ignore people like Zfan111222 I bet his over qualified bus driving dad also described these people by their race creed and/or colour.

  • kronicmacstigator on 03/04/2015 - 15:11
    +1

    I have massive psychological problems from 10 years of school bullying (by students and teachers) as well as seeing a child who was abducted and held captive for years before being killed while the police ignored my phone call.

    I appear normal but I am completely insane in the membrane. I also catch the bus most of the time because it's cheaper than the car.

  • vikvance on 03/04/2015 - 15:28
    +1

    What does OP's post have to do with finding bargains in Financial Services ?

    OP's post is about a purely political issue.

  • Mad Max on 03/04/2015 - 22:58
    -4

    The whole Centrelink "welfare" system should be scrapped or overhauled.
    If you are on welfare (pension, dole or any other payment) you should not be able to afford luxuries like cigarettes, alcohol, holidays, new cars, etc.
    Welfare should be only and just enough to survive a VERY VERY thrifty lifestyle.
    It should be a handout for people that do not have enough money to survive. I would almost call it "charity".
    People may have been unlucky because life has dealt them a bad hand or they may have been unwise because they have stuffed thinghs up or they have squandered their money and they have not saved when they could.
    But that does not mean that they are entitled to have a "comfortable" life at the expenses of others.
    In many countries if you do not have money to survive and you do not have family that can help, you have to adapt and do whatever job you can find to survive. And be poor. Really poor.
    In Australia you can just rely on welfare and feel "entitled" to your keep. And even worst complain if you cannot afford a "nice" lifestyle when in fact you are receiving a handout and you should be grateful for whatever you get.
    What about working hard and saving for you retirement or for a rainy day?
    After saying that I admit that some people do not have a choice, but I am sure they are a really small percentage of people on welfare. And even then they should not feel like they are "entitled".

    • kronicmacstigator on 04/04/2015 - 00:30

      I was solely injured through others negligence, I have zero problem with accepting my pension which I stretch quite well

    • bargainmuncher on 06/04/2015 - 09:54
      +1

      Mate, I wish you were the treasurer!. Would make my day.. I very much agree.

  • dlakers3peat on 04/04/2015 - 00:06
    +2

    Don't beat yourself about it. My wife works for housing nsw and the stories she tells me about how people rort the system every day. It makes me wonder why I should work so hard, save up for house and then pay for a mortgage. But then i think to myself i am better than that.

  • This Guy on 04/04/2015 - 02:31
    +6

    People take pride in what they have and give excuses for what they consider weaknesses.

    Ripping the government off sounds clever to many disadvantaged people. Admitting that their own body or mind is considered worthless by employers is just depressing.

    What do we do with the destitute if not a government benefit?
    Leave them to steal then jail them? Lock women up in laundries? Force them to enlist and destroy the moral and standards of our armed forces?
    Are you happy to live in a society with more crime? Where divorce can mean a life of slavery? With a military hostile to its citizens?
    What do you propose?

  • TRS-80 on 05/04/2015 - 01:28
    +1

    The amount Centrelink is defrauded is less than 1% of the total amount it hands out, not too bad IMHO. Really, what we should doing is abolishing all welfare payments and giving everyone $30k/year (unconditional basic income/negative income tax). Then there's no claims of unfairness, everyone starts from the same point and if they want more, they can work for it. No welfare to cheat either.

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