Australian Government cheating over International Students

Lspiderman3fan on 29/07/2015 - 20:10

I'm an international student who got my visa in late 2010 and recently wrapped up my degree. One of the big incentives to choose Australia over other popular study destinations was the option of a 2 year post-study visa, regardless of degree, which i felt could be an opportunity to gain some experience in my field, perhaps doing an internship to gain a bit of an advantage for when i return home, or just to earn a bit of money i can take home with me. I just recently learnt that in 2013 the rules were changed and now if you applied for your visa before November 2011, you had no opportunity to get a post-study visa unless your degree was part of the Skilled Occupations List. However applicants after Nov 2011 could get an 18 month post study visa regardless of their degree because they had gone through a newer visa application process.

To me this seems like a massive breach of trust to just cancel one of the major incentives that international students factored in before they spent tens of thousands of dollars on education here. Can they even legally do this or do they have carte blanche just because they are the government? If i were to take legal action against them what would be good way to start? I feel cheated and i'm determined to get some compensation.

Education & Work

Comments

        • spiderman3fan on 30/07/2015 - 00:26
          +1

          @GnarlyKnuckles:

          i've seen it, and i accept responsibility. But it's clear that even though my initial assumption was correct i would have been treated like crap here, which is sad, But patriotism and all that i guess. peace out

        • GnarlyKnuckles on 30/07/2015 - 01:47
          +7

          @spiderman3fan:
          "Treated like crap"? Sweet Jesus.

          You've asked people what they think, and they have told you. The fact that they disagree with you does not equate to you being "treated like crap".

          You've also asked people for their interpretation of the facts. They have provided that, and told you that they think yours is incorrect, and some have even done some research for you/ sourced some information for you and provided you with link/s to it. None of that equates to to you being "treated like crap".

          You have received a few tongue-in-cheek/"silly" responses, but only in cases where you've well-and-truly brought them on yourself by making childish comments of your own ("so if the government came and took your house…" etc.). That does not equate to you being "treated like crap".

          Nothing anyone has said to you has anything to do with patriotism, and the fact that you've interpreted people disagreeing with you as you being "treated like crap" suggests that you still have a bit of growing up to do. Peace out.

        • amkssg on 30/07/2015 - 09:57
          +8

          @spiderman3fan: What has become clear in your comments is that, before commencing your degree, you did not do sufficient research on post-degree visas.
          I was an international student and commenced my degree in 2008, and even I knew that there was no guarentee of a post-degree visa (If I am correct, visa rules changed a year or 2 before that). In fact, if using the education route, all TR and PR visa are never guarenteed as you have to meet the "Visa Criteria" and "Job Requirements" at "Time of Visa application", and not "Time of commencement of degree" (Used to be "time of commencement of degree" prior to 2007, I think).

          That means, should the govt decide to drop your "Job" off the SOL list mid-way through your degree, "poof" your chance of getting a visa after graduation just vanished.

          Regardless, you have no case. (I have a strong suspicion that you might have seen a Chinese/China migration agent that gave you incorrect advise. I know this because, in the education field, many chinese students are told that if their course is too short, they can apply for "Master of Education" or "Diploma in Early Childhood Studies (Research)", in order to qualify as a "Teacher" on the SOL list. Unfortunately, neither of those are teaching qualifications, and therefore DOES NOT qualify you for TR/PR.)

        • lightstream on 31/07/2015 - 10:47
          +1

          @spiderman3fan:
          Not sure about the UK, but I studied in America as an "alien". There are NO guarantees of any jobs or post-grad work experience options after you are done with your studies. You can, however, apply for a job (usually if you got an F-1 visa), and IF you get a job, you then have to apply to get another visa. Of course, getting a job simply does not guarantee you will get the visa.

          I say, go for it, sue the government :p, you'll only end up losing more monies.

        • hayne on 31/07/2015 - 15:25

          @spiderman3fan: Yeah, but I wouldn't have assumed that consumer protections apply in the context of government policies on migration. It's not like you went and bought a dud TV from Dick Smith. You were granted a visa under a scheme which can change at any time. It doesn't come with a warranty or a 30-day return or exchange policy. This is government policy.

          As someone notes later in the discussion, this is more a constitutional law issue than a trade practices issue.

      • Lysander on 30/07/2015 - 09:30
        +2

        Unfortunately, courts have to go by laws, no matter how unfair they are provided they are constitutional. The government enjoys a great deal of immunity in the area of immigration.
        You might want to consider getting help from your embassy.

        It helped a few clients of mine as the immigration department does not want negative international publicity as immigration is an industry worth a lot of money.
        That might make them listen to you a bit more fairly and favourably.

        You have to understand one thing: the business principle in Australia is: if somebody complains, asks for a refund - the first reaction is always to deny. That gets rid off of about 90% of people who cannot be bothered with continuing the complaint. Only if you then persist and continue businesses and the government start to comply and are willing to rectify the situation as they realise you won;t be going away.

        In all my years here this held true - regardless of whether I was dealing with a private business or a government department.

        • GnarlyKnuckles on 31/07/2015 - 02:26
          +2

          "You might want to consider getting help from your embassy."

          Actually, you might want to consider the distinct possibility that Lysmo needs to 'get his hand off it', and stop spreading false hope/ shamelessly trying to 'drum up litigation' that is destined to waste the time and money of all involved, except the lawyers; who conversely, will have their nests further feathered by the flawed folly.

      • melfes on 02/08/2015 - 11:22

        Id feel the same my friend and to me also its more of principle than else. I guess the trick is the whole deal was not a fair one from the beginning given the fineprint of "subject to change". And if i could say one thing, the seller didnt do enough to highlight this and it shoulda been mandantory to mention along with sales pitches

  • itbargainhunter on 29/07/2015 - 20:42
    +21

    Perhaps it was your major consideration when you chose Australia to finish your degree. But any government can change immigration law any time.

    In your case your visa was granted when post-study visa was restricted but later on it is released to people who applied later than you.

    I can feel your frustration, but that is life. Tough luck.

    • rodinthink on 31/07/2015 - 00:47
      +12

      This is what most OZbargainers comment standard should be.
      Honest, direct yet also polite and sensitive.
      Insightful and really emphatic, rare.

  • chumlee on 29/07/2015 - 21:04
    +17

    My advice is to take this all the way to the High Court. I would be giving Denis Denuto a call first thing tomorrow morning if I were you.

    • spackbace on 29/07/2015 - 21:04
      -2

      There is a vibe here!

      Just wait till I get back from Bonnydoon!

    • Lequ83 on 29/07/2015 - 21:21
      +1

      Clearly it's just the vibe of the thing

  • ChocDooder on 29/07/2015 - 21:07
    +23

    I've gone through a quick summary provided at:

    http://www.bravomigration.com.au/blog/the-post-study-work-vi…

    • No mention of a post-study visa prior to the new one in 2013. Was there actually a different post-study visa before this one?

    • Post-study visa (changes?) were announced way back in 2011, but details were released in 2013.

    • There is a graduate work visa mentioned, but you were not eligible for that one anyway.

    Specifically, what visa were you on prior to the changes in 2013? At the moment it seems likely you applied initially on a faulty assumption (maybe provided by an agent or someone) that you would be eligible for a post-study visa when the planned changes were announced in 2011, but before the requirements were finalised in 2013.

    Also, it seems like a mistake to only realise your visa requirements changed 2 years after the fact (it's 2015 now …)

    • spiderman3fan on 29/07/2015 - 21:29
      +4

      thank you for the info, perhaps that could be the case. I will look more into this

      • redforever on 29/07/2015 - 22:03
        +15

        Chocdooder is correct. The new post study stream was announced in late 2011, after you were granted your student visa. Prior to that, you can only apply for a temporary visa if your degree is in the SOL. This requirement is exactly the same as the graduate work stream in the new 485 visa. The reason for this stream is for those who were granted their student visa prior to the new visa announcement, like you.

        So in your case, your ability to apply a temp visa has not changed. You are not worse off. If anything, it's a bit more lenient as the age limit has increased from 45 to 50. You are just not eligible to apply for the new class of visa announced in late 2011.

        • spiderman3fan on 29/07/2015 - 22:59
          +4

          thanks for that, that was a big help

      • sal78 on 31/07/2015 - 16:37

        this is the aus govt.. they change visa laws every other year. even aussies hate the government.

    • amkssg on 30/07/2015 - 10:01

      There used to be a 2-year work visa prior to 2013. It has since ceased.
      For new students, as you mentioned, there is an 18 month work visa.
      This visa is NOT a replacement for the previous visa.

      Lets just say, the Visa system has changed significantly. Options have changed.

  • [Deactivated] on 29/07/2015 - 23:39
    +8

    I suggest you use all your money to sue Australia for some compensation. Im sure it will work out fine.

    • hashtagbargain on 30/07/2015 - 16:17
      +5

      Dont forget to use CashRewards!

    • Bunnyburger on 30/07/2015 - 14:23
      +3

      I'm sorry I thought I was being edgy by trying to channel Frank Underwood and fell flat on my face!

      If it makes you feel better I was affected the same way, the 2010 skills list changes really f*ed things up for me, I studied five years only to have it just riiiiight before I graduated.

  • iridiumstem on 30/07/2015 - 02:39
    +3

    Hmmm, I don't like how the things are changing with the visa law (I would've easily been in your position and my family have lost fair bit of money from the changes, due to my incompetent brother getting rejected), but I will tell you what I've heard from a high up in the embassy of my country. Granting visa is what the country has the rights on doing so, the country can pretty much do whatever it wants to do with granting visa and whatnot (even though unfair treatments can be protested, embassies will not likely move on one single case because it's touching upon the rights that a country has).

    It feels slightly unfair, but, in some sense, it's a privilege, not a right, to be here. I hate the new changes in law, if a person who've studied here since grade 2 (well we've went in and out but still) cannot grab a student visa after being accepted in one of the G8 university after graduating from an Australian high school, I think there is something wrong with the law. That said, it's what Australia can do, I'd accept it and move on (since there is nothing we could do).

    • amkssg on 30/07/2015 - 10:37
      +5

      I hate how Visa laws keep changing, but I do not think that is the OP's problem.
      In his case, he assumed that he will be guarenteed a 2-years visa once he graduates, which is simply not true.
      Look, if I appplied for a Visa knowing that I meet its criteria, and the govt decides to change the law AFTER I applied for the Visa, then I have every right to be pissed.
      In the OP's case, HE HAS NOT EVEN APPLIED FOR THE VISA!!! (at the point of the change in law).

      He is argueing that he is entitled to a Visa because the 2010's law said so.
      Based on that logic, I am entitled to keep slaves since the 1800's law said so.

      (TLDR: If he had a a valid Work Visa application made BEFORE 2010, which approval is contingent on him completing the course, then he is DEFINITELY entitled to the visa. However, if he HAS NOT applied for the visa BEFORE the law changed, and assumed that the law would not change, than TOUGH LUCK!)

      • iridiumstem on 30/07/2015 - 10:43
        +1

        Hmmm, I apologise. I didn't really read the entire post thoroughly (also, since my family got burnt by the changes done to the visa law, I was more inclined to sympathy).

        • amkssg on 30/07/2015 - 11:54
          +2

          I am totally sympathetic to eveyone's situation as I too had to deal with the nonsense of Visa changes, but we all went into this, knowing that it will be messy, and there is no guarentee that we can get a visa at the end (as we only know the current/prior visa rules, and there is no way of predicting what will happen in the future). I knew since day 1 that should the govt decide to change the SOL list, my entire plan would be in ruins. (Aside: My sis had the misfortune of graduating during the few year when "Accounting" was dropped off the list, and couldn't get her PR).

          I sympathise with the OP, but disagree that he should be ENTITLED to a visa.

        • iridiumstem on 30/07/2015 - 12:05
          +1

          @bsmksg: Yeah, as I've said visa granting business is something that Australian government can do whatever they want to do; they do it according to the laws and stuff, but the country holds all the rights.

          I should've read the things through, I actually thought he was asking for something that he is entitled, well it's clear that it wasn't.

      • Lysander on 30/07/2015 - 22:28
        +1

        I have been told by the government more than once that when it comes to immigration one is NOT entitled to anything so I would not hold my breath regarding the entitlement. The government keeps referring to it as a privilege and if one takes that thought further that means there is no entitlement but a chance of being granted a privilege. This would also conform with the various rules and regulations explicitly excluding any appeal or recourse in relation to decisions made by immigration officials, for example in relation to refund applications or skills assessment acceptance.

        See for example: http://www.border.gov.au/FormsAndDocuments/Documents/1424.pd…

        No review rights.

    • Lysander on 30/07/2015 - 15:33
      +2

      I think the people here should realise one thing, namely that other countries have the same autonomy in deciding visas as Australia has. However, whenever another country changes its visa requirements (say, increase of payment of fee from $50 to $75) all hell breaks loose here when Australia charges so much more.

      I know as a fact that a lot of European countries and the EU are looking at imposing restrictions on Australians to make it a level playing field.
      Some countries have done so already. That is the reason why England now requires Australian nurses for examples, to take an English test. Australia made the English do it, so the English now make the Aussies do it.
      This is the way it will go and while the government does not care it will affect all of you people who travel, study abroad, or want to live abroad.

      Hence I would be calling for the Australian government to be fairer and be more open to the countries that treat Australians fairly as otherwise the world will not open up more for Australians but close down and become more expensive and difficult to navigate.

      • iridiumstem on 30/07/2015 - 15:40
        +1

        It's simple, if you are not on the receiving end of the negativity, it's going to look miniscule compared to when you are on the receiving end. Everyone would be in the same boat in terms of that.

  • slewis69au on 30/07/2015 - 07:49
    +41

    I wouldn't normally chime in on something like this.

    It is now clear from above that nothing was changed and the OP either misunderstood the rules or had them misstated to him by an agent.

    It's also clear from above that some people are acting a little "one nation" on the OP. I agree he came off sounding entitled and especially since we've now figured out the rules DIDN'T change he looks a little silly. However some of the comments above were blatantly anti foreign student which is a stupid attitude to have given their contribution to our economy, setting aside the erosion of standards argument which clearly is NOT their fault they contribute hugely to our universities, rental income, food sales, blah, blah, blah and should not be regarded with Bogan "Go back to where you came from" attitudes. Having said that i do agree that the "taking your house" comment was a pretty ridiculous comparison.

    As a fat bastard myself my single argument for more immigration is better food - imagine if we'd stuck with what the British brought over!

    • [Deactivated] on 30/07/2015 - 12:25
      +2

      Bring back bangers and mash for dinner every night!

    • rodinthink on 31/07/2015 - 00:49
      +4

      This is what most OZbargainers comment standard should be.
      Honest, direct yet also polite and sensitive.
      Insightful and really emphatic, rare.

  • Snail on 30/07/2015 - 08:43
    +21

    I find it ironic that on a site where people whinge about getting short-changed by retailers because they supposedly didn't get all their consumer rights can have so many members from the same pool of people who don't have the willingness to extend their compassion to people who are having some issues that are much more serious than the most issues raised here. Instead I see too many posts that are sarcastic or facetious.

    • [Deactivated] on 30/07/2015 - 12:55

      I suppose in real life, ozbargain business people would hate to do business with ozbargain customers and vice versa, and in the end we are a divided people….

    • GnarlyKnuckles on 30/07/2015 - 13:00
      +1

      Snail, this post has nothing to do with "extending compassion" (though some have in fact expressed their sympathy anyway). The OP came here and asked for opinions on what they perceived the case to be, and how to go about seeking monetary compensation from the Australian government.
      They were swiftly told 'en masse' that their perceptions of the facts were incorrect, and why, and that they were not entitled to any compensation.

      Comparing this post to someone posting about getting short-changed by a retailer is completely erroneous.

      • Snail on 30/07/2015 - 13:40
        +20

        If people just corrected the OP then I wouldn't have a problem with this. Instead, for example, the first comment (which is also the most upvoted one) is "Cool story,sounds like the rules have changed for a good reason."

        I don't see why this can't be compared with a bad experience with a retailer. Australia is selling a service to him, which the OP thought it was going to give him the right of certain opportunities later on. Now, it turns out that OP may have misunderstood, but that is no excuse for some of the response.

        This is quite similar to a number of other posts here, and you get similar snarky and unhelpful comments. I just took exceptional to this case because it has implications for someone's life much more than usual so I expected a higher level of decency.

  • DealzEddy123 on 30/07/2015 - 10:29
    +4

    a study visa is not an opportunity for you to stay, it's an opportunity for you to get an Australian degree

    • abh_gup on 31/07/2015 - 22:41

      With Student visas, the purpose is quite different from the end goal. IF you read in-depth into the entire education policy and attend community functions at a uni regularly, you may understand this better after just a few interaction. Just a systematic process of keeping fees low for locals at the expense of international students, who take life changing risks. Well, Is good; is bad!

      • DealzEddy123 on 01/08/2015 - 08:39

        I do understand this. I used to work at a large university and we quite often discussed this.
        Why is taking a degree a "life changing risk"? Don't you take a degree because you believe the Australian degree has more to offer you than your degree at home, therefore you're willing to pay 3-4 times the price?

        • abh_gup on 02/08/2015 - 22:33

          Not always true that an Australian degree has more to offer. (For me, it's just a paper degree). Just different personal situations: for quite a few it is residency here (PR, citizenship) down the line, some have family issues and run away, some want to study 'abroad' or 'in foreign' for the added respect for going abroad, many are smart but admissions in good unis in many countries like India are really really difficult to crack because of the new gen population, pressure from parents (this is true!).

          Case scenario: for many Indian/Asian students, organising the funding for upfront payments is very tough, many who reverse mortgage their ancestral homes or ever have their parent's life savings and principal residence as collateral loan security to pay premium international student fees. The student works hard, max 20 hours a week. They seek not-so-nice jobs, just for some pocket money. Balance work and study commitments for at least 2 years. May struggle to get residency or fulfill whatever the purpose is. Without residency, getting a proper job is not east. Cash flow is low, life is tough, commitments rise. He/she then usually starts life with a big debt and spends few (or may be up to 10 years) to pay that off.

          Not everyone speaks of these reality. But when you have close friends in similar situations/back grounds, you do discuss the hardships. All for a dream!

  • shinichiduy on 30/07/2015 - 10:52
    +7

    There is a head of power explicitly in the Australian Constitution for the Commonwealth Government to make rules with respect to immigration. This power is plenary, subject to some limitations, whether express or implied, within the Constitution. Making retrospective rules generally does not fall within any said limitations and therefore, the rule is constitutionally valid. Having said that, and to link with your example, the Cth Government cannot come and seize your house without paying a just compensation. This right is provided for within the Constitution. This should answer your question about what the Government can and can't do.

    Generally, international students bring benefits to the Australian economy in NET term. That means any detriments incurred would be outweighed by the benefits. Imagine that without international students, the low population would lead to low level of domestic consumption, which would result in extremely low demand level and significantly hinder the growth of our economy. International students not only subsidise our education system but also create demand, which would stimulate the economy. This generally creates more opportunities in doing business, which in turn creates more jobs for the locals. Remember that there are always some detriment as mentioned above by other people, but the benefits I am talking is the one in the NET term.

    The low standard in terms of academic competency and english language is not the fault of the students themselves. One needs to blame the government and the university in not strictly enforcing those standards to a high or at least sufficient level before granting a visa/offer to study, which could have been done via looking at their academic history and/or a English Language Test.

    There is a comment about the how the University needs the invest extra resources to cater for the surge in the number of international students and how the university has to lower the standard of academic competency to get rid of the international students faster in the need to free up resources and by arguing that, the person denies any benefits coming from international students. The argument is flawed because the university is in full control in admitting students via the grant of the offers and they could have enforced the standard of academic competency more strictly. If the resources had been scare, they could have limited the number of international students they admitted without the need for investing more money in expanding. The fact that the university still increasingly grants offers to international students and investing money in expanding clearly prove the point that there are benefits in doing that in the NET term and there are still needs for admitting international students.

    People should now stop discriminating international students, stop the "go back to where you live" altitude and start appreciating the benefits those students bring to our economy

    • iridiumstem on 30/07/2015 - 11:38
      +2

      I am slightly hurt by this. I've never taken any of the ESL kind of class after my middle school, I've competed with Australians in Australian system (albeit in Queensland system) with same courses, same standards and in same classroom as them. I've got into the university I am in with my marks, solely with my own marks, using the same standard as the Australians. If at all, I was disadvantaged because there were no grants that targets someone like me, international students who've finished their high school in Australia.

      In university, I've never ever taken any of the special considerations, except once with one of my assignments (extended due date), when I had been in personal distress (My brother's visa (almost got himself deported), finding a place to stay (almost went to court for that and due to that I had no home for 2 weeks) while studying for 3 mid-sem exams when I've just got back from 2 years of hiatus due to my duty calling).

      I don't think I've ever had those privileges that international students get and I can say this without feeling guilty or feeling bad about it. If anything, I feel like I am disadvantaged, since I personally find the full load that we have to take slightly overwhelming for myself (double degree means almost all my courses are important ones I have to take), I'd rather do the courses at my pace.

      • burningrage on 30/07/2015 - 12:33

        I was an international student who came here since Year 10.

        The fee I paid was about 4-5x the locals would have paid. I complained nothing out of the system, I realized I was a foreigner so knew my limits.

        However, there was no subsidy/grant I ever knew off. The only one was a part scholarship that everyone could get and you really had to be good.

        So I think it's false to say the locals are "disadvantaged". Best of it (pun intended), we didn't have HECS.

        The OP stance in using words such as "sue", "cheated", etc etc etc… seriously? Does Australia owe you that much?

        Having said that, the comment on Chocodect and Redforever above are correct so I won't add to that.

        • iridiumstem on 30/07/2015 - 12:37

          There were a few grants that I could've been able to grab if I were a local (I had the ATAR score). There were a few if I were from a system abroad (i.e. for kids with marks from oversea)

        • Lysander on 30/07/2015 - 16:12
          +1

          That's the alleged privilege. International students get the privilege of being 5 times the fees the Australians pay without being able to access significant grants.
          When I looked into medicine 5 years ago, it would cost an international student 270000 in tuition fees alone to do the course with no access to any grants whatsoever. How is that not a rip-off?

          I think it is the international students that are disadvantaged.

          In terms of rights and support there are four classes of people in Oz:

          1. Citizens
          2. Permanent Residents
          3. Asylum Seekers/Humanitarian Refugees
          4. International students

          So, where again are the privileges of international students???!????

        • [Deactivated] on 30/07/2015 - 22:51
          +3

          International are just customers of a fee paying service. It's not supposed to be avenue for permanent work/life in Australia. While some may enjoy their time here and bring something to the country e.g fix a job shortage and stay permanently, it's not supposed to be a migration route.

        • virhlpool on 31/07/2015 - 01:12

          @Davo93:

          But for all you know, most of those are already working casual jobs illegally at half the minimum wages and getting paid in cash. All thanks to our lenient, money-minded unis and colleges - all they need is fees and admission/ degrees are granted!

        • [Deactivated] on 31/07/2015 - 01:17

          Noones holding a gun at their head and telling them to take on financial strain and travel to another country to study. Some would say even a luxury. I would struggle to fund overseas study and could only do so with proper planning.

        • GnarlyKnuckles on 31/07/2015 - 03:15
          +2

          @Lysander:

          For the love of 'Jah' Lysmo, please try and communicate like an adult.

          "Get the privilege of being 5 times the fees" is incomprehensible.

          Ranking large unrelated groups of people numerically based on your (obviously warped) personal perceptions of their 'rights and support' is clearly childish/foolish, as is the fact that you've ranked asylum seekers (many of whom are actually incarcerated) above international students.

          Lastly, what purpose do you think it serves ending your 'contribution' with seven question marks with an exclamation mark in the middle? Note that most of the adults on this site refrain from using such tedious 'punctuation'.

          To end on a positive note Lysmo (sort of), in the words of Cher, for your posts "the only way is up"…

        • burningrage on 31/07/2015 - 10:19
          +1

          @GnarlyKnuckles:

          Asylum seekers many are incarcerated are debatable in my view.

          Many are considered "economic" migrants so I think that has to be set aside in this argument.

    • GnarlyKnuckles on 30/07/2015 - 13:11

      "There is a comment about the how the University needs the invest extra resources to cater for the surge in the number of international students and how the university has to lower the standard of academic competency to get rid of the international students faster in the need to free up resources and by arguing that, the person denies any benefits coming from international students."

      Nobody said any of this. If you are referring to any of my comments above, you need to reread them because you have read into them a whole bunch of crap that is simply not there/not stated.

      "the University needs the invest extra resources to cater for the surge in the number of international students…"

      It's common knowledge that universities make money from international students, and no one claimed otherwise here.

      "… has to lower the standard of academic competency to get rid of the international students faster in the need to free up resources…"

      It's undeniable that the standard of academic competency required to pass has been lowered, but it has nothing to do with "getting rid of international students" (in fact, it's about retaining them), or "freeing up resources". Those are simply bizarre things to say, and I can't really fathom what you are on about there.

    • [Deactivated] on 30/07/2015 - 23:00

      "go back where you live", do you think it's some bundle deal? Get a degree and get a visa and eventaully citizenship. For those filling job shortages they'll have no issues.

    • pxrnm on 01/08/2015 - 17:16
      +1

      At the end of the day it's supply & demand. If there's a drop of international students by 50-60% in this country,I kid you not, we WILL feel the economic impacts. I bet your ass of we will start giving out generous visas for these students.

      If you are old enough, in the 70-80's coming to work here and subsequently geting a citizenship was not that of a big deal. Again supply & demand.

      For the future however, it will be just a matter of time that there will be a competitor country that takes our share of the pie. Sit on your high horse and keep on treating them like cash cows, they will go to a better place for their hard earned cash.

  • [Deactivated] on 30/07/2015 - 12:22
    +5

    Fellow ozbargainers please dont take this the wrong way.

    THIS IS THE DARK SIDE OF THIS BUSINESS:

    The city where I live is full of young female overseas students looking to score a permanent visa to remain in aus after finishing thd degree. So much so that many are pimping themselves out to any man who promises to 'marry' them. I know a couple of guys who take advantage of this. The are often 2 or 3 times older than the young students. Often married with wife and kids at home. They pick them up, promise to marry them, string them along for a few months, then discard them and go on to the next one. This is not illegal as the stufents are over age, and they are not forced into a relatiinship.

    This is the shame of australia's foreign students system.

    FYI only.

    • burningrage on 30/07/2015 - 12:34
      -1

      I hope you're not one of them…

      • [Deactivated] on 30/07/2015 - 13:00

        not even worth replying

    • outlander on 30/07/2015 - 14:24

      That is despicable. I can't believe that happens, it set my stomach churning to read that. How could someone do that?

      • [Deactivated] on 30/07/2015 - 15:49

        It's true. He's a friend of a friend. Been to his house a long time ago and I know he has 2 daughters older than the stuents he goes out with

        • thirtysixd on 30/07/2015 - 17:09
          -4

          Disgusting!

          Women should be ashamed of themselves

        • CraigZheng on 30/07/2015 - 22:04

          Dammit, this guy is the ugly side of human beings.

        • outlander on 31/07/2015 - 11:09

          @CraigZheng:

          how..how…
          how could he be promising to marry them for free? He could easily be scamming them for extra 10-15 grand. These women are desperate remember, and obviously have some cash on them if they're paying for inflated school courses.
          Someone has to stop these clowns, before they ruin the game for the rest of us.

    • Ughhh on 30/07/2015 - 18:02
      +5

      I've come across quite a lot of international female students too, 90% of them said they wanted to stay in Aust and find a local Aussie boy to marry. When one saw my male older cousin, she subtly raised the length of her skirt.

    • noshopping on 30/07/2015 - 22:59
      +1

      Yep, this is how our VISA system gets abused. Families try and raise $30-50k, get their kids to study here. They come here, get married and if desperate will marry anyone. I know a girl who was 20 years old, she married a 45yr guy. Furthermore, once they get here, they bring their entire family over. I really don't know why people pay smugglers $20-30k to go by boat to Australia when this is just as good - except its legal and far far safer, plus you get a degree.

      • virhlpool on 31/07/2015 - 01:17

        While most part of your comment is correct, bringing the family (siblings or parents) to Australia on a dependent permanent resident visa is almost impossible. The queue is at least 15 years long if not more. So, I don't take that point. Only person one can bring easily is the partner.

        • juventino on 31/07/2015 - 04:18
          +2

          haha 15 years queue is nothing. Check again. The queue is now up to 56 years. You might as well buy a coffin for your parents before attempting to bring your parents over.

        • virhlpool on 31/07/2015 - 08:34

          @juventino: Exactly, mate!!

    • neonlight on 31/07/2015 - 09:56
      -1

      I believe you, many Sugar daddys doing that to take advantage of young females. Probably mainly Asian background. I see a trend that Aussie local man is now preferring or having affair with Asian

  • [Deactivated] on 30/07/2015 - 12:23
    +1

    Refugees (moral high ground), Locally trained migrants (education and economic benefits + slightly easier to integrate), overseas educated migrants (larger numbers, wide pool + easy access) or super rich migrants ($$$$ injection). Every option has its pros and cons. The government is going to make you pick one eventually. The government does not discriminate against nationality/ethnicity/religion so that is almost all the demographics you've got to pick from.

    • dealman on 01/08/2015 - 08:32

      The government does not discriminate against nationality/ethnicity/religion

      NOW,

  • quirki on 30/07/2015 - 12:56
    +1

    OP, visa policy changes usually do not apply retroactively. Chances are you were misinformed / haven't done enough research. For this to be a consideration only after you have wrapped up your degree shows carelessness on your part. What did you study?

    • GnarlyKnuckles on 30/07/2015 - 13:13

      The OP informed us above that he/she studied economics and advertising.

      • quirki on 30/07/2015 - 13:29
        +4

        I apologize for not reading the whole thread in it's entirety.

        Instead of suing the govt, you might be better off putting the money towards a Masters in Accounting (which you can possibly get some advanced standing for), and then applying for a subclass 485 under the graduate work stream.

        Good luck OP.

        Disclaimer: I am not a migration agent, the information above may not be accurate and is offered in good faith.

        • GnarlyKnuckles on 30/07/2015 - 13:51
          +1

          Nice one quirki. OP, this is exactly the type of advice I thought might be forthcoming if you told us what you got your degree in. I suspect it is possibly the most useful advice in this entire thread.

        • virhlpool on 31/07/2015 - 01:20

          @GnarlyKnuckles:

          I doubt if OP would have been really waiting for this advice for so long. I guess he knew about these things in his 1st year in Australia. These are the first things people naturally try to know when they go to a foreign land to study!

        • spiderman3fan on 31/07/2015 - 03:09

          Thanks for the solid advice, though i never planned to settle here, i strictly just wanted at most a year of work experience in my field after my undergrad, so there's no way i'd do another couple of years of school (in a course i hate, no less) just for an year long internship.

        • GnarlyKnuckles on 31/07/2015 - 03:23

          @virhlpool:

          "These are the first things people naturally try to know when they go to a foreign land to study!"

          Sometimes yes, sometimes no… and sometimes the person in question fails to conclusively verify all the relevant facts. That would seem to be what has happened here.

        • spiderman3fan on 31/07/2015 - 03:46

          @GnarlyKnuckles:

          i agree with you, given what was at stake it was stupid on my part to not do my own in depth research into the system, but this is definitely something i will pass on to others.

        • GnarlyKnuckles on 31/07/2015 - 04:29
          +1

          @spiderman3fan:
          Don't give up just yet!

          Does your current Visa allow you to work in Australia (either paid, or as a volunteer)?
          Two months left on it you say? My advice would be to try and get some VOLUNTEER work at a company that is either already in or is attempting to expand into a country that speaks your mother tongue (which I'm guessing is Hindi, Mandarin or Cantonese).

          If you do some volunteer work for such a company here in Australia and impress them with your drive/ability, they could easily sponsor you to stay on as a junior employee, for an indefinite period of time. Your Qualifications in economics and advertising (the advertising is more important in this context, I think), combined with your age (you would know how to 'appeal to the younger consumer'), and your proficiency in the languages of both the target market AND English (your English is very good I must say… way better than Lysander's ;P) are obvious assets.

          May I ask whether you have been able to do any work at all while you have been in Australia, or was it not allowed under the terms of your Visa?

        • spiderman3fan on 31/07/2015 - 13:43

          @GnarlyKnuckles:

          Thank you for the advice, yeah my visa allows me the standard student 20 hours a week, and i have done casual jobs through the majority of my studies. The volunteer route is an interesting avenue to explore, however this was not about staying here to work for the sake of working, i really wanted to get into a firm relevant to my field to gain valuable experience from an internship and if i didn't actually manage to get that in 7-8 months i would have returned home sooner. Though perhaps several months of temporary volunteer work could lead to an extension of my visa and from there i could hunt for those internships.

  • Maki on 30/07/2015 - 13:16

    I was an international student, and I think you need to respect the country's rule. It was unfortunate that your plan didn't work out, but I heard even worse stories.

    And more importantly, if you think the government has cheated on you, leave the country.

  • rompastompa on 30/07/2015 - 14:15
    +2

    The below has nothing to do with the original post

    I'd like to just mention that I have appreciated the majority of comments from international students above regarding their appreciation of our education system, and most importantly, our home.

  • vroomkroom on 30/07/2015 - 14:24
    +1

    Op you sound like you genuinely like this country and want to contribute more. You also think that your contribution so far ( paying Uni fee ) should give you access to temp visa. Nothing wrong with your wishful thinking but the labor market ( Skilled & non-skilled ) market is very limited in Australia. Therefore the policies keep changing in very short duration. This is one of the reasons !!

  • symeonc on 30/07/2015 - 14:26
    +2

    I may be incorrect here, but hopefully this will point you in the right direction, regardless.

    The change I think you are referring to in March 2013, introduced a new less restrictive post study work visa without a link to the skilled occupation list, backdated to apply to students who were granted a visa after Nov 2011.

    But I don't believe anything has changed to exclude you as such, you may have just thought you were eligible for this type of post study work visa, when unfortunately you're eligible for only the other original one which is linked to the Skilled Occupation List.

    The immigration department (border force) website section on post-study work rights may have some useful information, however I suspect it is lacking in terms of changes and how previous visas are/aren't affected retrospectively:
    http://www.border.gov.au/Trav/Stud/Post

    You could also try contacting the Council of International Students in Australia (CISA). I'm not sure if they actually provide advice in this way, but they are representative of international students and advocate on behalf of them, and I'd be very surprised if they couldn't put you in touch with someone who CAN give you accurate advice.
    http://www.cisa.edu.au/

    Disclaimer: Not formal/official advice, I am just familiar with this subject as I work with the sector.

  • mightyfes on 30/07/2015 - 15:52
    +1

    Wait so international students don't come here for our dumbed down academic curriculum and easy admission into w/e program?

  • spiderman3fan on 30/07/2015 - 16:21
    +6

    Just to update here is what i'm assuming happened:

    I got my visa through a very reputable migrant agent, who had strong ties to the embassy. I think that through these ties she knew that they were upcoming changes to post-study work arrangements before they were announced and so sold us that i would able to get an 2 year post study visa regardless of degree, and sold it like this was an option that was already in place, whilst in reality it had not been commenced yet. I guess she did this because she assumed that new visa would extend to all current students, and not have a cut-off date for people who applied before Nov 2011 (due to a newer visa process that was implemented at this time ).

    I do feel that they should at least have had an option for people who applied before the cut-off date to have a different path to the post study visa by having us resubmit info to satisfy the new visa standards, but at the same time i do realise that it's totally reasonable they don't give that option either. Though i also find it weird they felt the old visa process wasn't stringent enough because even when i was applying for my visa the requirements were super strict.

    While this is disappointing, i had never planned to settle here and was well aware my degree was not part of the SOL. What i was hoping for was to do a year long internship and then return home with some work experience on my hands. So it isn't an absolutely terrible situation that's destroyed my plans for the future, and i really enjoyed my time here, i got to experience a different culture in a beautiful country, and at a great school in a great city. If i had to do it again i would still have chosen oz. Thanks to the helpful posts, especially redforever and chocdodder, who helped me start figuring stuff out.

    • KaTst3R on 30/07/2015 - 17:50
      +2

      Have you tried applying for internships?…you may be able to get an employer to apply an employment visa for you. Usually big companies are not so fussed with applying visas. Small companies wont bother due to effort and cost…

      • spiderman3fan on 30/07/2015 - 21:08
        +2

        I'm exploring if sponsorship options are available, though with less than 2 months until my visa expires the window is tight and it probably wont work out.

        • KaTst3R on 30/07/2015 - 23:03
          +2

          ok go out with all guns blazin' till the end…all the best mate..

    • Serapis on 30/07/2015 - 21:06
      +1

      I'd say you have a better chance taking it up against the migrant agent than the government. She either made an error in judgement or was eager enough for commission that she didn't care.

      • spiderman3fan on 30/07/2015 - 21:18
        +2

        Yep will definitely have a word with her, you can't sell people on assumptions especially when the costs are this high. The case might be she herself was misinformed by her contacts at the embassy, but still she should have given us full disclosure that the new visa's were only proposed at that time. And of course i should have done my own homework as well, and i will pass this on to any other person i know who wants to study abroad.

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