eBay and PayPal are F&#%'d up

L[Deactivated] on 24/06/2016 - 23:34
Last edited 24/06/2016 - 23:43

I'm completely terrified to use both Paypal and Ebay now, it was never like this before - now they've honestly gone to s^$* - fees are insane and there is NO SELLER PROTECTION. Sites a joke, we need alternatives!

From the top, I put a brand new laptop I have for sale as buy now for $1200. Boom I get a sale, from Nigeria saying that "my lovely gift will bring their village great happiness" and they even want to give me MORE money - $1500! So time WASTED!

So i put it up again but for bidding this time, luckily I have a coupon for free listing and no final value fees (would have been 150 bucks by itself which is insane), and ok I get a winner, he pays the $1200 via paypal and fah here we go - $40 in paypal fees for just receiving the payment. How much do you want!

Then I see this: http://i.imgur.com/VALViaF.png

HOW CAN A MULTIBILLION DOLLAR CORPORATION WORK LIKE THIS (I should say NOT work)

Do I send it? Do I not? Will I need to time travel back marty to get my payment WTF IS THIS BS

If that wasn't enough, the person who bought it on ebay sends me a message that he wants express delivery - that he'll pay $5 extra for it. Well I took a look at the 'seller protection' for paypal and if I have any chance of getting money back in a scam I CANT as =

S5.1 The PayPal Seller Protection Policy will not apply to a transaction if:

More than one payment is received for a single transaction;

.. So Do i tell him to f887 off or what? I can't do anything I lose my protection if i take his money, PAYPAL AND EBAY's GOT ME PARANOID LIKE NO COMPANY EVER HAS. If I cancel the paypal payment PAYPAL will even charge me the fees and give their complete money back. Also 21 days waiting for money to be put into my account, wtf is that

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closed Comments

  • altomic on 24/06/2016 - 23:38
    -4

    Nigeria

    do not send.

    Cancel sale as the dude is outside your postage area.

    seriously!? you'd send it to Nigeria?!?!

    it's a scam.

    use bank transfer in the future if you don't want to use a companies money transfer system.

    • [Deactivated] on 24/06/2016 - 23:41
      +10

      I may have not made that bit clear, i put it for 'buy it now', nigerian bought it. Then it got cancelled by ebay as it was scam so i put it for bidding that time, and someone new bought it from Australia

    • garetz on 25/06/2016 - 20:04

      When you sell on ebay, you have no choice but to accept paypal, or they can cancel your sale at any time.

      • frewer on 26/06/2016 - 15:12

        For what reason ?!?!?

  • Almost Banned on 24/06/2016 - 23:59
    +9

    Yep - now you know why people call it 'Feebay'.
    And Paypal is always getting criticised for failing to protect sellers.

  • Ughhh on 25/06/2016 - 00:09
    +10

    Firstly, yes the ebay and paypal fees are crap, but in comparison to Cash Converters, its a lot better as CC will only pay you 1/3 of the market price. Gumtree's only good for local pick up and it has just as many scumbags and scammers.

    Secondly, no one forced you to sell it for $1200. You could have done the maths and added an extra $40 or so to cover the fees. Same thing with postage, hope you did the maths before jumping on board.

    Thirdly, I experienced the 1970 thing as well, covered here. Mine was later reduced to about 2 weeks. Yours may be reduced too, depending how often you sell and your feedback. Im sure that if you have all the required evidence for proof of postage, you should be fine. I sent my parcels before funds being released.

    I remember seeing somewhere that express post does not provide sufficient evidence for ebay/paypal (could be updated now). I honestly would just say "sorry too late".

    Any game that you are unfamiliar with is always "F&#%'d up"

    • [Deactivated] on 25/06/2016 - 00:36

      Express post doesn't provide sufficient evidence, that is bizarre. Like really, the strangest thing that one may have been a rule. I'll definitely do the "too late" thing

      And yes I did take into account the ebay fees, I made the mistake of thinking this was a normal institution that doesnt charge to receive funds. Never heard of such a thing

      • scrimshaw on 25/06/2016 - 00:45

        I always offer Express Post now. On any item that's remotely expensive — Express Post. My buyers don't get a choice.

        If you want to give them a choice, make sure you manually plug in "additional postage options" — this only appears if you use the advanced listing tool, not the basic one.

        • [Deactivated] on 25/06/2016 - 00:47
          +2

          You may not be protected then, paypal apparently doesn't support your fast delivery antics

        • cheesecactus on 26/06/2016 - 15:06

          @DisabledUser106196:

          I belive express is supported if you add insurance or some sort of cover to the postage

      • Ughhh on 25/06/2016 - 11:26
        +3

        And yes I did take into account the ebay fees, I made the mistake of thinking this was a normal institution that doesnt charge to receive funds. Never heard of such a thing

        You realise that they're a business, not a charity. No such thing as free lunch. Every business institution charges a fee, or something in return for their "free" services e.g.. Your information. Same thing with any banks and social media companies.

        • Ughhh on 25/06/2016 - 13:40
          +4

          It's a free country, you're welcome to put all your money under your mattress, to sell your crap on other websites or other free avenues. You're not a slave, you had the freedom to sell elsewhere, yet you chose to suck ebays and paypal big D.

          Maybe you'll get a better picture of reality when you pull your head out for a second.

        • [Deactivated] on 25/06/2016 - 13:54
          +2

          @Ughhh:

          Yes and I have the freedom to complain as it IS a monopoly, so don't give me this BS that they're a business and not a charity, I'm not saying anything about the fact they're taking money they should be - but treating your users like crap should be accounted for - especially SELLER protection.

          In your reality the Mafia would be just another business too ay, have some respect for yourself and stand up to bs

        • Ughhh on 25/06/2016 - 14:52
          +1

          @pezpera:

          Seeing this is most likely your first time selling on eBay, you obviously know everything about seller protection.

          I'm not saying anything about the fact they're taking money they should be

          Umm ….

          So funny seeing people like you s the d's of corportations who are there to take all their money unfairly.

          I made the mistake of thinking this was a normal institution that doesnt charge to receive funds.

          Take your time to think things through before replying. Get your stories and opinions straight first.

          The Mafia is a business and believe it or not, Universities are also a business. The difference is whether its legal or not. I respect myself, as well as education, which some apparently do not.

        • Ughhh on 25/06/2016 - 17:07
          +3

          @pezpera:

          Oh great now you're a doctor who is brilliant at insulting people. claps

          I didn't say how educated I was, I just said that I respect education (ie. how important it is), just like I respect other religions even though I am non-religious. If you just give your mouth a rest and pull out, maybe you can read properly- what a great picture! Interesting now that you agree with me that the Mafia is a business, if an "absolute idiot" can change your mind that easily, what would that make you?

          I suggest you stay from eBay, it's not a playground for children.

          edit: you're hilarious btw, I'll give you that.

      • snook on 25/06/2016 - 20:08

        It's got something to do with Ebay and businesses selling stuff because I (have) received funds via paypal for airbnb and there are no fees.

        • stickyfingers on 26/06/2016 - 17:43

          If your PayPal transaction is marked for goods or services it is subject to fees.

          Sending as 'Friends & Family' is usually fee free.

    • herysoe on 26/06/2016 - 18:00

      Initially I had same issue with funds takes 4 weeks to be released. chatted with paypal support and they told me i need to send the item and funds will be released soon… Hecks NOO.. takes another 2-3 weeks to actually get release, then takes time for the actual funds to get transferred to your bank account and withdraw.

      After selling on ebay about 5-9 items in a couple of months, paypal/ebay verified your reputation (sending item and no issue arise from transaction ..etc), my funds becomes available as soonest the buyers pays and i can withdraw asap.

      The fee it self for paypal, ebay item and shipping are really the killer parts? my question is, how can you increase your fee just to cover all these, as all these fee are percentage based on your price? more you increase the price, more fee you will have to pay..

      • Ughhh on 26/06/2016 - 18:13
        +1

        I have an excel spreadsheet where I enter the numbers;
        - cost of item (if applicable)
        - how much money I want in my pocket ($X)
        - how much for postage
        - how much I need to sell to obtain $X after ebay+paypal fees
        - how much the fees are
        - Whether it's a profit or loss

        So basically, you need to know how much money you want (after fees and postage), then add on the extra cost. If the total amount you need to sell to get $X > what the item is actually worth, then maybe you need to look at lowering the price or selling else where. If excel isn't for you, then Im sure there are website who can do the calculations for you.

        From memory, quicksales is 100% free, but it's basically a ghost town, no buyers and only a couple of sellers (unless it has changed).

  • jackofspade on 25/06/2016 - 00:16

    I recently got a credit card chargeback from PayPal. Seller Protection is just a marketing BS.

    • [Deactivated] on 25/06/2016 - 00:35

      man, thats scary - what did you do?

      • jackofspade on 25/06/2016 - 01:02

        Buyer lodged a credit card chargeback for unauthorised payment.

        • [Deactivated] on 26/06/2016 - 09:20

          happened to me as well, the buyer lodged a >$1000 chargeback and later he also sold the item he was purchased from me previously on ebay.

          a bit dumb on his side, as his ebay feedback clearly showed he bought the item from me and few months later got another feedback for the same item sold to someone else.

          still, paypal and ebay took sweet time 'investigating' the case, around 3-4 months or so.

        • stickyfingers on 26/06/2016 - 17:44

          @zan123: Happened to me too. Then PayPal tried to charge me $15 for the chargeback which I was able to get reversed via phone support.

    • jenkemjunkie on 25/06/2016 - 16:04

      so did you plead your case? What was the amount involved because I wouldn't tolerate this and you could get your money back

      • jackofspade on 25/06/2016 - 16:17
        +1

        I provided tracking number which showed it was delivered to the buyer's suburb. PayPal is still reviewing it. If I don't get my money back then I will escalate it to FOS.

        • Jonc on 26/06/2016 - 00:56

          Consumers always have allot more rights than businesses/sellers… It's the way life is (use to be the other way but pendulum has swung the other way)… Middle ground would be nice but thats not reality…

          As a business owner we've had customers do chargebacks on us as well and it's for us the business to prove we were authorised to charge the customer (they don't call or let us know and get our side first… they simply revers the charges, take the money back and weeks of back and forth for us to prove the money does belong to us of which we are not compensated for other than possibly getting our money back!)… Bit crazy really but nothing we can do!

          Being a seller on Ebay… welcome to the introduction of being a seller/business… enjoy your reduced rights, privileges and entry to allot more paperwork and wasted unpaid time than what should ever be required!

        • akyeeeahdude on 26/06/2016 - 09:22
          +1

          Wow, hopefully they won't take your money, should be fine as tracking shows it delivered.

          Reminds me of my recent ebay/paypal fiasco. I sold an iPhone 6 on ebay which was carded and delivered to their buyer's local post office as the buyer wasn't at home at the time. Since it sat there for more than a day, I sent an ebay message to the buyer advising them the item was waiting to be picked up. They then responded later advising they had collected the item and said they were very happy with it (but didn't leave feedback).

          Fast forward nearly FIVE MONTHS LATER, they open up an paypal dispute claiming the item is significantly not as described as the screen has been replaced and the home button doesn't work (the screen had never been replaced and home button worked). Luckily I stumbled across the above message and attached it to the paypal case along with a promise that it my money was not released ASAP, I'd be taking it to FOS. Within three days, the case was ruled in my favour and I had my money released.

          Incredible, I didn't mind ebay's dispute system which has a much shorter time frame but was unaware paypal let you dispute up to 180 days later.

          My all time favourite ebay sale happened late last year. I sold another iphone 6 on ebay which had a 7cm diagonal faint scratch down the screen. I clearly described it in the listing and you could see the scratch in the photos if you looked carefully at the photos. When the buyer received it they said they didn't know about the damage but advised they didn't want to return it but started trying to fleece me out of money to get the screen replaced. They lodged an ebay case, ebay ruled in my favour. The buyer then disputed it and won - BUT ebay did not take my money back but rather refunded the purchase cost to the buyer at their expense. I questioned ebay about this and was also advised the buyer did not have to return the phone to ebay but they could request the buyer return the phone to me. For a laugh I said ok, they then did that and the seller replied the item had been disposed of.

        • chumbucket on 26/06/2016 - 15:27
          +2

          @Alister: Try having the IMEI blocked for that phone. If the legal ownership has been reverted back to you, you're more than entitled to screw up their plans to use or resell the phone.

  • Diji1 on 25/06/2016 - 00:36
    +14

    No arguments about fees but you have to ask yourself what is the alternatives?

    Anyhow, the way to stop a lot of scammers is when you make the listing there's an "use advanced listing tool" link (or some words to that effect and you'll need to google if you can't find it on eBay).

    Click the link and eBay will give you a warning about you not being smart enough to use it which you can ignore :D, then make your listing as normal.

    At the bottom of this page is why we use advanced: you can prevent many types of potentially risky buyers by not allowing them to see the listing, for example:

    -If you aren't shipping outside of Australia there's no point in allowing anyone but people in Australia to see it.

    -Why take the risk on new users? Don't allow users with less than X feedback to see listing.

    -Why take the risk on users that may be scamming? Dont allow users with X disputes going in the last X months. (or something to that effect, see the listing tool)

    You can set it how you like, I never had an issue with being as safe as possible with these settings - meaning almost everyone not scamming will see it so I always use it.

  • Savas on 25/06/2016 - 10:02

    I will sell you a time machine for $300, guaranteed to work.

  • Mysterious on 25/06/2016 - 12:15
    +1

    Complete overreaction with the postage…

    Any rational person will just pay $5 out of their own pocket to pay for express shipping just to not have to handle the stress. Also, $40 total fees on a $1200 sale is not bad. Where are you getting $40 from? It should be $35.10.

    I do agree that eBays fees are too much though. They'd charge about $120 to sell that $1200 laptop, which is outrageous in my opinion. Also don't get me started on seller protection, it's literally a free hit for buyers to scam sellers.

  • jiberz on 25/06/2016 - 12:51
    +2

    I only sell things on ebay I can't sell on gumtree. I am also paranoid about ebay, I take picutres, get serial numbers and always send with sign required. Too easy to get scammed.

  • jenkemjunkie on 25/06/2016 - 16:01
    +3

    Paypal usually try to pull the refund stunt because they assume the seller is unaware of their own rights. If someone made any sort of claim regarding unreceived goods, or items not as requested and paypal just ripped the money out of my account the financial ombudsman would be all up in their ass about it. Paypal will hate it because as soon as a case opens they get charged for it.

    I have never had a problem selling high value products on ebay. I'm just meticulous with my record keeping if an issue does arise. I would also have no problem serving someone and generally making their life miserable if they try. I think you need to fine tune your auction a bit more to avoid the international buyers, but I don't think the fees are that bad considering the market they expose you to.

  • davlap on 25/06/2016 - 16:13
    -1

    Let me know if off topic, but I agree that sellers are shafted.

    Had 2 non payers recently - both on a laptop. To make a quick sale with another bidder, I cancel the transaction - then I have to wait TEN days for the non payer to confirm he got a refund - but didn't pay in the first place !

    I did this to avoid the 4 day wait before I can even report the non payer and then the wait (not sure how long - 7 days?) for them to decide if they want it. Then after the time expires, I can't leave any negative feedback.

    How do you deal with non payers, whats the best / quickest most efficient ?

    • jenkemjunkie on 25/06/2016 - 23:15
      +1

      Just re list it and let automatic non payer take care of it. If they pay so be it and cancel the auction, if it gets sold again then just cancel their payment if they do pay days later, too bad for them for being tardy. That's why I set my sales require immediate payment. Don't have time to waste

  • Herbse on 25/06/2016 - 18:15
    +2

    Its 20% to use a site with the most exposure worldwide, and a payment service that IS secure, assuming you are not stupid enough to fall for fake emails or not follow their postage rules.

    You might get one or two transactions where the experience was not ideal, but how many sales would you have missed out on if it wasn't for the service?

    People who cry about fees and one bad experience in a hundred need to stop making new threads and use a consolidated one on here now, there are too many

  • juventino on 25/06/2016 - 18:19
    +10

    you dont know shit about how paypal and ebay work, thats why you are paranoid. educate yourself please

    go to the consignment store and see how much fees they charge
    go to gumtree and see how much lowballing you get
    go to local market, set up a stand, see how much you have to pay for that and how long it will take you to sell

    • Herbse on 25/06/2016 - 19:10
      -1

      Amen brother

  • smartazz104 on 25/06/2016 - 19:53

    and ok I get a winner, he pays the $1200 via paypal and fah here we go - $40 in paypal fees for just receiving the payment. How much do you want!

    That's around 3%; your time must be worth less if you think posting this rant was worthwhile. Try using other means to sell your new laptop and see how you go.

  • badg3rz on 25/06/2016 - 20:27

    Hehehe… I remember back when someone sold an 'Air Guitar' on ebay. I wonder how they sorted that out.

    • jenkemjunkie on 25/06/2016 - 23:22
      +1

      Someone sold 'lol toast' for quite a bit. It was literally bread with lol toasted in it hahah

    • thebargainhunter on 26/06/2016 - 08:59

      That was me!!! The 'winning' bidder said he'd pay the the couple hundred in 'air dollars'. We both left positive feedback.

  • tonsta on 25/06/2016 - 20:33
    +2

    This is where Bitcoin type payments might have a business opportunity if they get there act together, it will disrupt the current norm of Ebay and PayPal payments.

  • Elnato on 25/06/2016 - 23:43

    Ebay provides a massive audience, PayPal provides a secure payment method to sellers, all up this totals 13% at most, of your entire sale amount, a small price to pay in my opinion for selling your item and getting cash safely, I do agree though that eBay fees, in particular, should be decreased on pricier items, there should be a fee ceiling, so to speak

  • Hirolol on 26/06/2016 - 02:50
    +1

    Feebay or scumtree, take your pic!!

  • Aceboy884 on 26/06/2016 - 08:26
    -1

    Stop being a drama queen and manage your own risk

    Send the item with registered post,

    Or if you are paranoid, book a courier so you have a receipt with full address for delivery

    Done

  • FittyFitty on 26/06/2016 - 09:01

    There IS a way; put up a BIN sale, take offers and negotiate offline sale with best offer, then can ebay sale. Works for me…

    • whooah1979 on 26/06/2016 - 09:12
      +1

      There IS a way; put up a BIN sale, take offers and negotiate offline sale with best offer, then can ebay sale. Works for me…

      I would rather keep the pp buyer protection and pay 10% more to ebay than get scammed for $1200.

  • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 26/06/2016 - 12:14

    It's Feebay, what do you expect?

    The audience is bigger, and the auction format gets you the highest price compared to Facebook or Gumtree, where usually you get time wasters or lowball offers.

    Even detracting Feebay and paypal fees I doubt I'd get a higher sell price elsewhere for $500+ valued items.

  • Borat on 26/06/2016 - 13:10

    10% commission charged to the seller for shipping is the one i cannot accept.

    • Ughhh on 26/06/2016 - 18:23

      I think the reason for that is because people were listing items for $1, but then setting the postage cost as $60. Doesn't make much difference to the buyer as buyers only care about the total cost, but makes a big difference for sellers and ebay.

      I guess a group of naughty people ruined it for everyone.

  • dcam on 26/06/2016 - 15:07

    I am completely banned from having an eBay account, for life. My wife and I had 100% rating for years and we've never run an eBay store, just selling a bits and pieces online.

    Basically what happened was one school holidays my son rang up ebay and they said he was too young to have an account but they said that if he was using his parents account then it could be OK. So he set up an account in my name and bid on some things but then didn't pay.

    They then banned me and my wife who had nothing to do with it and even my mother who was accessing eBay from the same internet address had her sale cancelled.

    If I phone up and talk to them there is no comeback. They will not listen.

    It is absolutely pathetic. I can't talk to anyone there who can help in the situation. They are judge, jury and executioner.

    I can't recommend them at all.

    • Bargaingeek on 26/06/2016 - 15:21
      +1

      Looks like it's Ur sons fault for trying to scam people on eBay by not paying up.

  • Bargaingeek on 26/06/2016 - 15:12

    U guys have to understand the thing from a buyers perspective too. As a regular ebay buyer I have dealt so many times with faulty or defective items being sold to me and then the seller refusing return or low balling me. So many times I had to ask PayPal or ebay to step in.

    This is a risk u have to take as a seller, if Ur a low volume seller, sell 1 item a Month or so I don't recommend ebay better use gumtree or something else more direct. eBay works better for larger sellers as any loss can easily be recovered in future sales

    There are scams on both sides, striking a balance is very difficult

  • berger on 26/06/2016 - 15:29

    I love eBay!

    I accept their fees and still sell, my average item value is $1500 and my fees are approx $500-800 a month.

    I know the fees are there, I know PayPal take a cut too. All my items are Buy it Now with offer. I have allowed 12% in my sell price to go towards eBay and PayPal.

    At the end of the day,, it's cheaper than running a shop, I get higher prices than gumtree and built up a reputation that now people contact me direct if they want something.

    I know a lot of 'first time' sellers get a surprise, but not sure why they expect it to cost next to nothing?!

    • immortalbjr on 26/06/2016 - 16:20

      Because everyone wants everything for nothing.

      Like you say its not like you cant work out roughly (or exactly) what the selling costs are going to be and from there determine if its worth selling or adding a little extra onto the price to help cover it - but at the end of the day people are stupid.

  • wonderboy on 26/06/2016 - 20:22

    Yeah I'm done selling on ebay. Sold a 3DS a few months ago and the total fee including postage was nearly $50 on a $270. The worst thing was I had to wait 2 weeks to get the payment cleared. Searched online to find out this is a protection feature on new accounts but I have no idea why I had to wait since my account is 6 years old and have sold over 30 things already.

  • serpserpserp on 26/06/2016 - 20:46

    Why don't you just call PayPal support on a business day and see if they can tell you when you'll get your funds? Also just tell the buyer that postage is what he paid for no exceptions. Sorry etc.

  • cantstanzya on 26/06/2016 - 21:04

    Kinda feel bad for people who make a rant thread and then have to disable their ozbargain account that they have had for years.

    • Ughhh on 26/06/2016 - 21:06

      Yeh, it didn't have to end this way, but the OP chose to make a fool out of himself.
      Perhaps OP thought he was going to gain a fan group or something!

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