ABS Census Website Overloaded

Just want to get over and done with the compulsory census and continue on with my online shopping.

The census website is overloaded. Server is down. So annoying!

Your thought/tips.

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abs.gov.au
abs.gov.au

Comments

  • +25

    My tip no rush.

    Does not need submitting tonight.

    • +1

      Ozbargained, if they only got you to look after Census Scotty:)

      • +60

        Ozbargained

        Too many people trying to "save" $180/day?

    • +12

      It's not that they don't want the government to know their names, it's that they don't want the government to have their name attached to a bunch of other data - religion, etc. (I dunno exactly what they're asking because the servers are (profanity))

    • Why bother, if they as part of the political masters of this country, cant see the importance of the Census, why should we waste time filling in the forms.

      They are more interested in scoring political points.

      Personally anything that avoids a fine, is all I am now interested in.

      The previous census they never even bothered to knock on my door.

      • +3

        Rubbish, their positions are and have been consistent for years on invasions of privacy. It's just that there are not many pollies that get this new Internet thing… and many of them would not care even if they did.

    • +8

      Facebook is not compulsory.

      Facebook only knows what I want it to know. It doesn't know my address, my religion, etc.

      Facebook cannot cross-reference with my medical records, tax records, Centrelink records, etc, to build a profile of extremely sensitive information.

      • n keep them well organised in one place so someone can hack it

  • +13

    Just spent an hour filling all their BS out and it crashed when I submitted the form….Everyone I know thought this was going to happen… Yet no one at the census did?I wonder if the information is safe? This is complete BS if u ask me….

    • +3

      An hour? Wow how complicated is yours? Did our family of 4 in under 15mins :)

    • I reverted back to paper. (profanity) abs and their shit website

    • +2

      So you are THE person that crashed the ABS site!

  • +27

    15,000,000 are expected to do it online
    1,000,000 transactions per hour can be handled

    It was never going to be overloaded /s

    • +1

      Census of the Day! ;)

      • +7

        Let me tell you a joke.

        Census

    • +4

      Wow for the Bureau of Statistics that is a mega fail.

    • +17

      If only they had used some common census

      • +2

        This census makes no census

  • +3

    why they couldnt simulate xxx number of login at the same time many months ago when building and testing the website? im sure it is easy, right?

    • +2

      Yeah, they could have done a load test, based on anticipated connections.

      • +4

        probably the same bunch of lames overseas based IT team that created click frenzy?

        • I think Grant Arnott just downvoted you.

      • +2

        They did and they anticipated 1,000,000 transactions per hour.
        Very vague as a user can generate many many many transactions.

        See if all you Pastafarians and Jedis filled out the last census correctly, they'd better be able to gauge the load this time!

      • +1

        Apparently they did pay $325,000 for load testing services: http://www.lifehacker.com.au/2016/08/the-australian-census-w…

        • +1

          Yeah, I just read about it … more actually, nearly $500,000

        • +8

          More money was spent on indoor plants than was on testing.

          Data on government contracts reveal the Australian Bureau of Statistics (ABS) spent almost half a million dollars on pot plants last year, almost $100,000 more than testing the Census website for the entirely predictable onslaught of millions of people logging on simultaneously.

          ABS and Government under fire for Australia’s great Census fail

        • +3

          @Baysew: I don't think throwing more tax-payer money (than the almost $500,000) at load testing is the issue; more like they did not anticipate the peak load, hence their load testing passed without indicating any problems.

        • +4

          @Baysew: "Data on government contracts reveal the Australian Bureau of Statistics (ABS) spent almost half a million dollars on pot…last year…"

          That explains the mismanagement of the census

    • +44

      Everything in IT is easy. Just ask any non technical person :)

      • +49

        I disagree, and I don't want this attitude anywhere near an important project. The census could have been well engineered, but it was not, and the evidence for it was their pre-census statement that their systems would not fail as they could accommodate 1m requests every hour.
        Disclosure: I project managed the first NSW HSC results online almost 20 years ago. Technology has changed, but common sense hasn't.

        It is really hard to engineer web sites for massive spikes in traffic. If you can space requests over twice as long, you can halve your server costs. And the opposite is true too, if you want everyone to access the system in half the time, you double the system resources required (very roughly).
        As the ABS assumed 15million online responses, they would need to accomodate those in the timeframe people were instructed to complete the forms. Since all my life the message has been "it's Census night." it is reasonable to assume that the bulk of people would complete these in the evening. So figure you need to accomodate 15m people between 7pm and 10pm, if you accept some of those people might have to wait up to 3 hours to successfully lodge their application.

        So reasonably, you probably want to double that capacity, so people can be accommodated in a shorter window, remembering that unsuccessful attempts place loads on the system too.

        I reckon a system with the capacity to handle 10million forms per hour would have resulted in most people being able to lodge on the first or second attempt. There still would have been a little grumbling, but the system would have "worked".
        To engineer a system with only a tenth of the capacity required, and then claim some bullshit about foreign hackers as the excuse is just the most abject fail.

        Or, to put it another way, this is a reassuring example that the ABS has the technical expertise and sophisticated risk management culture to adequately secure and handle the richest and most invasive set of private data to be assembled in one department.

        • +12

          Just plus to mskeggs comment,

          It's big failure from planning but also how they made people feared about getting fine.

          Seriously, if they have specified that this can be submitted over time and dead-line is mid-September, no one had to rushed in.
          The result of it, unexpected number of traffics - on their view - caused server down.

          This is quite similar to how DDoS works so someone could say this is caused by foreign hackers. But this is very stupid excuses as it means that they did not properly setup the securities.

      • -2

        Even for a 'technical person" they can be crap, especially govt/public workers and isn't this whole thread just an Example of how crap these 'technical ITs" are. They are bludgers, source? evidently your average worker. Not targeting this guy, but they bludge no doubt. But this is just an average worker, just imagine the other half govt workers doing worse..

  • -7

    Yeah! Me too!

  • +9

    should hire niantic programmer they can handle connections from 15 countries.

    • +12

      Except when there's a glitch, their way of fixing it is just remove the entire feature.

      • +2

        touche…

      • +4

        its a good idea actually, lets hope they remove the need to do census altogether as well!

        • hear hear

  • +1

    Now I can get through to main screen. But clicking on 'Complete My Census' displayed this message:

    Thank you for participating in the Census. The system is very busy at the moment. Please wait for 15 minutes before trying again. Your patience and cooperation are appreciated. [code 9]

  • +12

    A website crash not caused by a flood of OzBargainers … Now that's news to me!

    • +7

      "A website crash not caused by a flood of OzBargainers"
      Not this time. The website crash is caused by a flood of hackers trying to get everyone's personal information…
      But don't worry…you can trust the ABS to keep it SECRET because they have no compulsory reporting of privacy breaches.

      • The website crash is caused by a flood of hackers trying to get everyone's personal information…

        That freaked me out for a second, yeah that is concerning. I wonder if instead of complete names, names' initials are accepted as complete.

  • +17

    From SpacePoopin (www.reddit.com)

    The Australian Bureau of Statistics has repeatedly maintained that its system will be able to hold its own when 15 million people flood the census site. They are confident there will not be an internet meltdown.
    Asked about the ability of the online census database to cope with such heavytraffic, an ABS spokesman said the site could handle "1,000,000 form submissions every hour. That's twice the capacity we expect to need."
    "There is plenty of reserve capacity to cope if more than 80 per cent of Australians choose to complete the census online."

    …hope their claims on privacy and security are better than their certainty about capacity

    • +1

      “Hand on heart, the security set-up in order for people to submit their information — it’s encrypted all the way through from their browsers into the >ABS’s internal environment,” he said.

      “Then we go through the process of separation. The information is isolated so people who can access names can’t access the rest.”

      Real confidence boost.. not

    • +1

      "hope their claims on privacy and security are better than their certainty about capacity"
      Sure…you can trust them!!!

  • +2

    Completed it while at work yesterday. No rush, no stress.

    If you can't complete it tonight, just do it another day. You have a couple weeks before they even begin checking who hasn't completed it.

    • Yes i did the same at 5 PM AEST with no issues at all

    • actually, do they check it by names or by address to see if someone has completed the census?

      • The head of Census said on the radio that only 100 people were fined during the last census and that they were to people who 'outright refused' to complete it when requested.

        I would hazard a guess that the audit is random and on a small sample. No idea of the methodology they would use.

        • I mean do they fine per household basis or per person basis?

      • +1

        If the last census was in indication - then no. my Neighbour and I never even got a visit. When he rang to complain, they sent him a form. I said nothing and never got a form or a fine. And we have lived here for 3 previous census

  • +13

    To anyone trying to allay privacy concerns using the social media argument, GTFO.

    Last I checked, Facebook / Twatter / Youtube etc was not compulsory, did not carry punitive fines for non-participation and finally…you can use whatever name you like without fear of same.

    You might also want to read what former ABS chief, Bill McLennan has to say about the 2016 data-dump.

    Checkmate.

    • +1

      Ever used mygov?

      • -1

        myGov India

        Are our myGov outsourced to same group of programmers??

        • +8

          Looks way better than my.gov.au so definitely not.

        • @rvsure: my.gov.au probably outsourced to philipines then, cheaper than india.

        • +4

          @zan123: I don't understand why people link bad quality with outsourcing. Companies like Google and Microsoft opened delivery centres in India for a reason. There is no scarcity of talent in India and Philippines it's just how much money you want to spend determines the quality.

          I work in IT and I know the same offshore teams delivers different quality products depending on the timelines and money. Also the design part of the major projects happens here in Australia. It doesn't matter how good you code when the application is not designed with scalability in mind.

        • +1

          @rvsure: it appeals to their personal interest like lesser jobs in their own country and it comes out spite. It is irrational and it can often lead to xenophobic traits.

        • hope no understanding on what I meant. Outsource does not equal to poor quality, instead the opposite.Both sites call myGov hence thought they could be related.

      • +1

        Never, and hope I never have to.

        Whenever I pop my head up online, it's voluntary and anonymous. Whether certain agencies are evesdropping is outside my control and of questionable legality.

        The world has been playing a fragile game of Jenga since 2000. Soon, the key piece will be removed and everything will be flipped.

        /tinfoil

      • +8

        But apparently that's contradicting what he explains at the beginning, that the ABS "will match the Census records with various administrative records held by government (health, tax, New Start, social security, etc)"?

        Granted, he's not the best writer out there, but I think you missed the point.

        ^ That was a warning. That's what the ABS intend to do — build a longitudinal (birth to death) dossier on everyone.

        "…names would be used for projects that are both approved by a senior-level committee…"

        and,

        "The Privacy Impact Assessment identified a small number of potential risks to personal privacy associated with the retention of names and addresses from responses to the 2016 Census, but concluded that in each case the likelihood of these risks eventuating was ‘very low’."

        Neither of which is reassuring, unless you're prepared to accept "low risk" and a vaguely defined "senior committee".
        If they had any confidence, they'd have released their PIS widely, not just through the public service gazette and IT News.

        Previously, "name" could be omitted, but if it was supplied they'd gladly take it. It's never been compulsory. For the purpose of statistical analysis and reporting, all they would require from me is "Adult male" and "25 years" as D.O.B. (I'm not really that age btw).

        There are long-established conventions, limits, checks and balances for inter-agency data sharing and cross-checking. This is in the interests of protecting an individual's privacy. By trying to extract a unified dataset this year, retain it for "four years" and share it, they're sweeping away those legislated protections. By providing that information, you're voluntarily aiding the ABS in that objective.

        Today, they're claiming an overseas entity launched DDOS attacks — more BS. They're not about to admit their system wasn't up to the task and they were caught with their pants down, are they? And the punchline of "we won't be fining anyone". For their failures!?

        A penalty notice is a legal document. If they don't have your name, they can't fine you.

        • Will be interesting to see if ABS actually pursue people who don't provide names. They could send warning notices "to the resident" but there's no easy way to verify or identify which individuals left their names out.

      • +3

        This doesn't refute the fact that Xenophon and The Greens have voluntarily given their names to Facebook and Twitter.

        Do you realise that when they gave their names to those services, they didn't attach their annual income, religion, etc…

        • -4

          What is the worst case scenario if that information were released?

          Society is based on trust and we need to be able to trust the government and government agencies to safeguard our personal information. And over 99% of the time our information is used and handled appropriately.

          It's unhelpful to have the lawmakers encouraging us to break the law.

        • +1

          @inherentchoice:

          WCS? Ask the Jews of Europe that one.

        • +6

          @inherentchoice:

          I have always been a proponent of the census, for the valid reasons you cite. We do need to have census information.

          Sadly, due to hubris and over reach, the current ABS management and their supervising politicians have poisoned the well of trust because they needlessly required additional privacy invasive measures without justifying it.
          The attitude of all of their public comments was a patronising figurative pat on the head and 'don't you worry', that the requirement was too complex to explain to the stupid public, but that they were very smart, technically sophisticated and cautious. So trusting them was fine.

          There are plenty of people smarter than the ABS (note, not me!) who found this dismissal both offensive, and worrying, as it prevented them assessing whether the new requirements were necessary or whether adequate safe guards were in place.

          Trust in government is not built by hiding the facts, especially when the one thing everyone could see - the performance of their website - failed so blatantly, after similar dismissals and reassurances that all would be fine.

          Ultimately, the law is accountable to the electorate. We vote for the lawmakers we want, in the hope they will write laws we deem best. When the existing laws are being used in a coercive fashion with little explanation and accompanying failure, it is certainly correct for our elected law makers to question what is going on.

        • @inherentchoice:

          Society is based on trust and we need to be able to trust the government and government agencies to safeguard our personal information. And over 99% of the time our information is used and handled appropriately.

          I do not mean to be rude, but is that naivety or sarcasm?

          There are reciprocal info-sharing agreements in place with Aus, that may allow a particularly notorious "regime" to get access to information on Australian citizens/residents on an ongoing basis.

          The government is not some magical entity free of flaws and weaknesses. They are as fallible as any other human organisation. So why/how are you so certain that there cannot be a breach resulting in the theft of millions of PII?

          What is the worst case scenario if that information were released?

          Do you understand why people are scared sh1tless if they get doxxed? Identity theft is a significant concern, but there are a million and one ways to use that information. :)

        • Agenda 21 — our weasels in Canberra are tripping over themselves in service to their Overlords.

  • +1

    Thank you for participating in the Census. The system is very busy at the moment. Please wait for 15 minutes before trying again. Your patience and cooperation are appreciated. [code 9]

    • Thank you for participating in the Census. The system is very busy at the moment. Please wait for 15 minutes before trying again. Your patience and cooperation are appreciated. [code 9]

      • Thank you for participating in the Census. The system is very busy at the moment. Please wait for 15 minutes before trying again. Your patience and cooperation are appreciated. [code 9]

        • The Census website is unavailable
          We apologise for the inconvenience. There will be no fines for completing the Census after August 9. We will keep you updated.

  • +2

    We are experiencing a high volume of calls

    Do not worry if you have not received your Census materials.

    !!!! You will not be fined if you complete your Census after Census night. Try calling again after August 10 when we expect call volumes to reduce.!!!

  • +2

    Seems like we have till Sep 23 to complete the online form.

    This section from article is quite reassuring:

    WILL I BE FINED IF I DON’T COMPLETE THE FORM ON CENSUS NIGHT?

    No. While it’s ideal to complete the form on Census night, you have until September 23 to get it done. If you haven’t completed the form within two weeks, a Census field officer will come to your door to ensure you do by September 23. If you have missed out on a form, or lost it, they will be able to give you another one. Less than 100 fines were issued after the 2011 Census and they were only to those who refused to fill it in.

    • Some people like myself have poor memory.

      We forget when we wake up in the morning - so may not reflect accurately what had happened at census night in 2016 - was I with Jo, Andrea, Sam or Amar?

  • +3

    The ABS and Census website are unavailable. The service won’t be restored tonight. We will update you in the AM. We apologise for the inconvenience. There will be no fines for completing the Census after August 9. There’s still plenty of time to complete the Census. Thanks for your patience.

  • Is abs it outsourced? If so who?

    • +1

      IBM

  • +12

    Hey ABS, what is the likelihood that having an entire nation complete a census on one night might cause website issues? I mean statistically speaking?

    • It was DDOS'd.

      • +21

        DDOS planned by ABS and whole nation was participants

        • +2

          Hmm correct. The DDoS was something cooked up to cover their arse. I was misinformed.

    • How ironic!

  • +8

    They should have included the census form with the original letter.

    • My letter with online code came with the paper form.

      • Are you somewhere very remote? Everyone I know received a letter which did not include the census form. Our form arrived this morning. The whole process was quicker 100 years ago, and they had 5 years to prepare.

        • I am in regional victoria not remote i didn't get no letter no code came home to find census form on my doorstep just like the olden days filled it in & already posted it back this morning.

        • +1

          @Triple J: Ermm, I don't think you are supposed to post it. well my envelope said don't post, return to census officer (they come to your door)

        • No we definitely had to post ours back .Our neighbours are away travelling & theirs is still at their front door normally cenus collectors would retrieve any unanswered ones not this time it says quite clearly to put it in the recycle bin they will not be returning to collect any .That is in our area anyway.

  • +5

    Ahahaha, just enjoy watching the train crash. You have until late Sep to complete it anyway. Go to ABC and read the gems from social media that quote IT Crowd, etc.

    Sure is egg in their faces. If they can't handle load, can they handle security?

    • I'd assume security would be much better. Being able to plug cables in (and maybe a Cisco certification if you're being fancy) is enough for a networking job on such a hosting solution. Security on the other hand (usually) requires a uni course and years of experience, and liability is on you when (things) hit the fan.

      • It's about public perception.

    • did you mean "Egg and their faces were in alignment"

  • +4

    The data is being processed and stored in plain text.

    http://www.theregister.co.uk/2016/08/07/it_analyst_oz_census…

    • So they're terminating SSL at IBM itself. Ooooh goody! Guess the NSA is getting a buttload of info abt Aussie demographics which will really help when granting ESTA.

  • +1

    Must be that nasty Y2K bug, 16 years down the track…

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