What Do Kids Actually Cost?

The wife and I have considered having kids in the next few years and I've been trying to forecast what that truly would cost.

What costs popped up that you didn't expect but actually cost a small fortune.

What did it cost you a fortnight to basically take care of this extra person in your middle-income family? I understand this can go really high or low, but on average.

Your experience would be a great help!

Comments

  • +88

    A lot

    • +48

      but this is OzBargain, the more kids you have the cheaper they become.

      • +27

        You sure you're not thinking of Eneloops instead?

      • +29

        but this is OzBargain, the more kids you have the cheaper they become.

        How many would I need to make a profit? 🤔

        • +11

          One cannot predict a lottery result
          If you hit a jackpot, maybe your kid can be the next billionaire

        • +85

          @Blugok: all you need is for one to get into westpac. Kid drops 80 large on high yielding investment car. Bam! You are set for life.

        • +9

          @Blugok:

          One cannot predict a lottery result
          If you hit a jackpot, maybe your kid can be the next billionaire

          You've gotta be in it to win it!

          The more I'm in it the better my chances.

        • +1
        • +3

          @xoom:

          Brainstorming: If we use free range macaroni, we could sell their artwork at the vegan market for $$$! 🤔

        • +8

          @Scrooge McDuck:

          I don't think militant nazis vegans have enough money left over for such things after they buy all those supplements they need to prove they're morally superior account for their protein and vitamin deficiencies.

        • +3

          With a small loan of a million dollars you'd only need one.

        • +1

          centrelink will pay you lots of money if you have >4 kids. 37.5% of my tax is used for welfare.

        • +2

          @blaccdong:

          The government should require vasectomy/tubal ligation for long-term access to welfare.

        • +7

          @blaccdong: If it makes you feel better, 'dole' bludgers only account for roughly 6% ($10b) of welfare spending.

          2.5% ($4b) is general administration (Department of Human Services / Centrelink).

        • +2

          @Online Bathroomware:

          We need to outsource these administration jobs to overseas.

        • +2

          @Online Bathroomware: The irony is this welfare tax is not used for my welfare at all. This is the only country where your hard earned money is used to pay for someone else welfare.

        • +4

          @blaccdong:

          This is the only country where your hard earned money is used to pay for someone else welfare.
          You mean apart from every other first world country?
          Or are you thinking about UK National Insurance or US unemployment insurance where the 'dole' payment is related to your previous income contributions?
          I can assure you that if you have the misfortune to become unemployed in Australia and you are of modest means, you too will be eligible for Newstart.
          And even in the utopias of the US or UK they often pay out unemployment benefits funded by consolidated revenue that exceed the beneficiaries individual contributions.

        • +1

          @xoom:

          10/10

        • +1

          @Online Bathroomware:

          Doesn't make me feel any better.

        • -1

          @Online Bathroomware: The Australia Cash balance is -$40b so if we do cut the dole bludgers out. It would dramatically reduce the debt we are in even if it is minuscule compared to the US. Also, We should have the right to choose where a percentage of our tax money goes into. From your statistics it could be said 8.5% of the tax I pay is used to hire workers to pay dole bludgers money.

        • @t_c: to make the dole bludgers 8.5% :-)

        • @mskeggs:

          I have income protection. If I have the misfortune of becoming unemployed I will probably holiday for the many month period the policy covers.

          I also try and work hard… I believe people can show their worth and stay employed without summoning the unions to try help them…. co-incidentally the welfare crowd and unions crowd are closely related.

      • +3

        Your sanity and sex life.

    • +4

      A lot

      More than a supercar or a mid-sized boat. I know which one I'd rather have!

    • +2

      Priceless

  • +73

    biggest expense was "loss of income".
    maternity leave, part time employment, school holidays.

    this was followed by DAY CARE COSTS - work on $50/day out of pocket (this might be conservative). Day Care cost us more than school. so $2500 for 1 day a week, $15,000 for 5 days a week.

    this was followed by Schooling (if you are not planning on sending them to private school then this cost will be small compared to your day care costs).
    don't forget your work hours may are affected with pick ups and drop offs.. and the kids get about 12 weeks off per year (whos going to look after them?)

    followed by Drink bottles and lunch boxes.. kids lose these every 2 weeks.

      • +78

        Do you mean My parents that work themselves? Or the in laws that retired at 70?
        Do you really think the grandparents should be expected to babysit so I can maintain my own lifestyle?

        • +66

          It's quite common in the Asian culture, where the grandparents insist on looking after the grandchildren. So yes, there is an expectation.

        • +3

          @ronnknee: What if the grandparents are working? Do they quit their jobs to look after the grandchildren?

        • +12

          @ronnknee: Might save you money, but I believe it puts them behind the 8 ball by not being exposed to the routine and structure that only qualified educators at early learning centres can provide. The exposure to other children helps them learn a lot quicker academically and socially. Also helps them build up their immunity to germs (to some extent).

        • +12

          I am lucky. My in laws look after my kids on Monday (their one day off work). My in laws are 65 &70 and still both work.
          The kids are at day care for 2 days, and my wife works from home 1 day , and has another day off.

          We are lucky.
          But I would never expect the grandparents to stop working (and earning money) just so hey can stay home and babysit. They have earnt their time off.

        • +12

          @ihbh:

          What if the grandparents are working?

          Then ask the great-grandparents to mind them. 👴👵

        • +7

          @John Kimble:

          Also helps them build up their immunity to germs (to some extent)

          and the aggravating behaviours of other humans. 😣

        • +5

          @John Kimble: Also allows them to learn all the bad behaviours by other children at daycare.

        • +23

          @ronnknee: Common in the Armenian culture as well. Mothers usually cook, clean, look after the baby while the father brings home the money. Unfortunately nowadays it's difficult to follow this trend because both parents are working. If both parents are working, there are two grandmothers and if neither of them are available, the aunt may look after the baby. Sending the baby to day care is usually not an option. People might argue that babies might be missing out on valuable lessons learnt from early learning centers but I somewhat disagree with this. My brother and I were raised by my mum (housewife) and my brother is a qualified actuary while I'm a qualified engineer completing my seconds masters. I think one of the most important lessons in life is family values.

        • @dogboy: True! Everything has pros and cons :/

        • @gezza90:

          Congratulations, what were/are your masters topics?

        • @gezza90:

          I agree. I was raised by my grandmother while my parents were working; similarly, my aunts and uncles are raising their grandchildren, so it's naturally an option to me. Not sure why I'm being negged heavily. Others should consider it if the grandparents are free, don't mind and money is a problem.

        • +1

          @Scrooge McDuck: Bit off topic but here goes.
          Degree (UTS): Bachelor of Engineering in Civil Engineering (Structural major) / Diploma in Engineering Practice
          Dissertation: Assessment of drying shrinkage behaviour of fibre reinforced concrete
          1st Masters (UTS): Master of Engineering Management
          2nd Masters (ADFA @UNSW): Master of Systems Engineering

          Would probably recommend a Grad cert for the engineering management masters.

        • +3

          @ronnknee: As it is in most cutures?

          Both Grand mother's helped us but only a selfish fool would dump a baby on a 70yr old. Various things to consider, does Grandma drive, etc.

        • +1

          @Suckerzpayretail:

          Well I don't know about others and I didn't want to generalise.

          If the option is not unheard of, then why are people disagreeing that it is an option?

          I'm not saying that one should just dump a baby with the grandparents. There would have to be considerations, arrangements and ultimately an agreement.

          This is all under the assumption that the kids are being left with the grandparents because the parents have to go to work. If the parents are just chilling instead, then obviously it is an abuse of the privilege.

        • +1

          @John Kimble:

          Ah yes, get them ready for their future cubical farm by the time they're three. I'll grant it does augment their vocabulary. My grandson was telling us to "F off" and "suck my D" after only a few months.

        • @John Kimble: I have to disagree…

        • @John Kimble: While your comment is valid and correct, I am sorry to say that so called 'qualification' of many educators in most of the childcare centres is in sorry state. You know how difficult it is to earn 'Certificate 4' or 'Diploma' in Childcare education from private colleges who run for just a single motive - make money no matter what!

        • +1

          @ronnknee:

          Genius. How do I become Asian so I can take advantage of your sage advice?

        • +1

          @ronnknee:

          I think it may be because the expectation might be construed as an obligation for the grandparents. If the grandparents are free, don't mind and it isn't a problem and they want to do it, then by all means.

          Personally, I too find it upsetting when I hear of young parents complaining why the grandparents don't do more to help out.

        • @ronnknee: Yeah but there's like 20 million Aussies and only a few asians in the world, so I'd say our approach is more common… ;)

        • +1

          @John Kimble: Early learning centers exist to occupy kids, not educate them. 15 minutes of reading a night with a child would be 20x more useful to their education.

        • @gezza90:
          Hi

          Fellow engineer here, totally agree about family values and spending time with loved ones as much as possible.

          How are you finding the MSysEng?

        • +1

          @Suspect420: Quite demanding but by far the best coursework I've done. Because I'm based in Sydney and lectures are in Canberra, I'm doing distance. It combines technical engineering with engineering management. The course is very well put together by Mike Ryan, Ian Faulconbridge and the usual systems engineering culprits 🙂. On my last subject now Requirements practice and I'll be done. Some subjects such as T&E and Capability options analysis might be a little defence focused but the assignments aren't. In some assignments you choose your own SOI but others they give you the system (i.e. Health management system for a national park, declared weeds eradication system etc…).
          Pm me if you want to know more..
          Oh and if you're working full time, maximum 1 subject a semester. Would not recommend two just so you get more out of a subject and so you don't kill yourself with stress.

        • @gezza90:cheers for the insight.

          Contemplating on a 2nd masters or an MBA..trying to decide if its worth pursuing since I have 2 kids below the age of 2…
          Oh yhe decisions!

          Good luck with your final subject 😀

        • +1

          @btst7000:
          Sorry have to disagree. My daughter attends an ELC attached to a school and she has learnt so much more than a book could teach.

          She knows the days of the week, months and seasons. They go on a bush walk every week, climb trees' scramble over rocks and jump in muddy puddles.

          They learn about almost every thing, magnetism, hot air rising, musical instruments, how you can eat herbs.. etc etc.

          An ELC is far different to daycare!

        • @btst7000: Books can only teach you so much. Everything else comes from interaction with others and the world.

          I'm not saying ELCs are a magic bullet (most kids get there in the end); like everything there's good and bad ones, but if it gives them a head start why not (if you can afford it!)?

        • @btst7000:
          Does your child attend one of these centers? They often give the parents a run down of every day's activities, including photos and videos.

        • +1

          @btst7000: Social skills are very important. You can't learn to get along with other children if you are looked after by adults 24 hours a day. Kids that went to child care and preschool have a much easier time at kindergarten!

      • +1

        This! Shows exactly how much your kids may cost you, even after they are old enough to have their own kids.

      • +2

        wow so many dislikes.. geez it's not a wrong question but just a difference of culture. The grandparents want to help out and they want to bond with grand kids.. well some do n some dont so respect whatever they want.

        For asian culture if u refuse help they may even of accuse you of denying them time with grand kids. They genuinely want to be needed. However our culture also involves us taking care of our parents in their old age, take them to heaps of docs appts, translate, live with us and pay for everything. It's a mutual non spoken but must do asian thing. By being so filial to our parents is setting good example for my children.

        My kids went to Childcare 2 days a week and my mum helped out 2 days a week bit dhe could only handle 1 baby at a time. I have twins. I worked part time. That was yrs ago. Now my kids r in primary school they're way too busy to see grandparents much.. after school activities, weekend activities, never stops. I'm so happy my parents n in laws got to spend those precious yrs with them…

        I would love to help look after grandchildren one day.

        Now I have 3 kids at school, we both work full time, occasionally my mum will come by when we r not home n help clean, mop, vacuum and even do a grocery shop and bring cooked food. I'm so grateful n blessed and I will def do that for my kids. My mum feels sorry for how busy we are n how hard we work.

      • lol that's another hidden cost of parenting…youll feel in in about 30-40 years…hoping Robo nannies will be available before I become a grandparent

    • Makes total sense. Damn that's pricey!

      • +4

        More like $75 per day after childcare benefit and rebate in Sydney and if you put them in childcare for 5 days, you use up all your rebates by 3rd quarter and your paying full price on the 4th.

        Stock up during specials for nappies, and wipes.

        Others have given good advice already.

        Also something I learner along the way in ozbargain, if your on family tax benefit a, you get electricity rebate end of the year. Google it. Applies to new. Don't know with other states.

        Also you get full Govt support some dental items like cleaning for kids when they are younger.

        If you want to go private insurance for childbirth, there will still be added cost as much as $5000. Plus you pay a high amount of premiums for 12 months minimum.

    • +2

      Drink bottles and lunch boxes - started with Sistema, then I just bought
      no brand ones. And they still get lost.

      Mysteriously pencils, rulers also go walkabout.

      Loosing school jumpers and jackets - these things are not cheap too.
      (They mysteriously appear in Lost & Found, usually a year or two later and
      after they are too big to fit in them!)

      • We had probs with lost clothing until we found duct tape and staples.

    • this was followed by DAY CARE COSTS - work on $50/day out of pocket (this might be conservative).

      This is indeed conservative. Take $130-$150/ day as an average cost and deduct $7500/year that government gives back as a capped (max) rebate per year. You will probably end up paying $75-$90 out of pocket per day easily.

      There are two issues here: Childcare cost is too high (not sure if govt is planning to regulate/ reduce it further) and it varies across centres. On other hand, rebate is capped at only $7500/year which is just 1/3rd of the total yearly cost in many cases. This is assuming both parents work 5 days a week and have one kid going to childcare.

      This probably makes us the costliest nation for childcare expenses though I am not 100% sure. I am surprised this is never addressed as a concern during election debates and it is still considered a 'generous' benefit.

  • +13

    I find the biggest cost is not being able to work the hours you used too, so money in that way.

    • I hadn't ever considered this to be honest, but looks like this has been mentioned a few times.

  • +87

    If you really want them you just need to love them and provide basic living, health and education. Anything on top of that is a bonus. If you worry about money before kids you will never have them.

    • +25

      If you worry about money before kids you will never have them.

      This.

      • +3

        So what you're saying is… just wing it?

         

        Sounds responsible…

        /SARCASM!!!🚨🚨🚨

        • +15

          Yep, Scrooge McDuck, just wing it ;)

      • Thanks for your input.

        • +1

          Thanks for yours! :)

    • +52

      I think OP has a very valid concern. Too many people go into parenthood without any kind of rational consideration of their current and future circumstances. Bringing a child into a world where you are not able to financially support them is not just irresponsible; it's downright stupid.

      • +4

        I get both points but I agree with this one. I want to at least see if I'm living on the poverty line to raise these future kids.

        Thanks!

        • +5

          Depends what you spend on luxuries now… Those dinners out, Bali holidays, etc etc, don't need any of it when you have kids if you do really wanna make ends meet.

          So by budgeting now, yes they'll be an expense but you'll cut down on other spending.

        • @Spackbace: fair point

      • +7

        Too many people go into parenthood without any kind of rational consideration of their current and future circumstances. Bringing a child into a world where you are not able to financially support them is not just irresponsible; it's downright stupid.

        × infinity!

        You need a permit to sell lemonade at a stand, but just anyone is allowed to make a baby.

        Most people should just stick to practice. ✂️🥜

      • +1

        So rich people arn't stupid?!

      • +4

        Agreed, too many people just doing what's 'always been done'. 'You'll be right, they did it..' Why not stop every now and then and question the method. We are living in a different time now, with a higher cost of living, more and more families with both parents having to work full-time and with increasing technological advancements creating both promise and uncertainty at the same time.

        Nothing wrong with having a kid, but I don't believe people should just settle for 'just wing it' or live by the mentality that your apparently 'never ready'.. That's just too much of a blanket statement, there is always room for some planning.

    • +7

      That was basically the plot of the movie Idiocracy.

  • +4

    and I've been trying to forecast what that truly would cost.

    Budget about $1M each….. for 18 years…..

    http://www.heraldsun.com.au/archive/money/cost-of-raising-a-…

    • +15

      more like $2-4 million since that article was published 8 years ago

      • +8

        Double that if you have a daughter - the shoes, handbags and clothes costs will go up compared to sons

        • +61

          I got two daughters. Lucky I introduced ozbargain to them early in their lives.

        • +3

          And the gun licence and guns.

        • +9

          @scotty:

          Lucky I introduced ozbargain to them early in their lives.

          I'll be reading the Freebies page to my little one from conception.

    • +151

      These articles always make me laugh.
      According to them, my kids cost me double what I earn…
      Yet somehow we manage to have a nice lifestyle without much stress about money.
      The ABS suggest the cost of a child is 50% the cost of an adult, I think that is overstating it too.
      If you can make a couple of really simple compromises, you can afford kids.
      Things we do:

      • young kids share a bedroom with a sibling
      • everyone goes to good public schools
      • moderate your housing desires (not reading the property pages is a good start)
      • each kid gets one paid activity, unless very cheap (so nobody rides horses, everybody has had a chance to learn an instrument - with varying success, everyone learnt to swim, but it isn't Monday Ballet, Tuesday Karate, Wednesday piano. Thursday tutoring, Friday pony club, Saturday soccer)
      • when they are old enough to get a job, they get a job if they want spending money
      • lunch is a sandwich with water and fruit, not a lunch order, not a little packet of chips, not a popper
      • drive old cars
      • kids get a supermarket phone when they enter high school. We will cover a very, very modest prepaid plan (see OVO) they can pay for a better phone or plan if a priority
      • kids get bikes (secondhand) and ride or walk or bus to school
      • xmas and birthday presents are a main gift up to $100 and a handful of minor presents like new clothes, a couple of books, stationery for school. Not ipads or PS4s.
      • kids birthday parties are sausage sizzles in the park with a homemade cake, or video night sleepover, not lasertag/go-karting

      Pretty much there is a free magazine called "Sydney Child" that consists of articles worrying about trivialities and advertisements for luxury child goods. If you do everything the opposite of what it recommends, you will raise happy, affordable kids.

      PS - they still want ipads and PS4s and ponies and go-kart rides. But they can save up for them or not get them. It isn't bad to hear no occasionally when you are a kid…

      • +19

        This is the best practical advice in this thread.

      • +3

        When your child can't keep up with their peers:

        http://i.imgur.com/qRsp3Mf.jpg

        • +7

          Ironically, that is one of the charities we give to each month!

      • +2

        This. And to be honest it seems to be kids raised like this end up being far more well adjusted. My kids don't get a lot of material things but we do try to give them more of our attention.
        I look at the how much it costs to raise a child figures with amusement, I have however seen parents spend exhorbatent on their kids and work massive hours to buy them the latest and greatest and sure they love all they get but all to often it seems they would much rather more attention from their mum and dad, but they are to busy working so they can buy the more "stuff"

        • +1

          I have however seen parents spend exhorbatent on their kids and work massive hours to buy them the latest and greatest and sure they love all they get but all to often it seems they would much rather more attention from their mum and dad,

          To hell with that!

          Show me the money!! 😍💵👞🥋🎻🐎️⚽️💻📱🎮

        • +1

          @Scrooge McDuck: Show me the money!!
          power overwhelming

        • +1

          @Scrooge McDuck:

          Easy to say when you're diving in a mansion full of gold!!

      • Pretty much there is a free magazine called "Sydney Child"

        Interesting marketing decision. 🤔

        • Magazines like that rely on advertising revenue. It's a reasonably common business model.

      • -1

        You obviously don't understand the recent increases in childcare, or kids sports.

        Your advice would have worked well….in the 80s and early 90s.

        Oh and there are all sorts of rules about what kids can and can't take to pre-school, child care and school now too. Some of them are sensible - no aromatic allergens (peanut butter) saves lives. Others…well it's not working in terms of health but it sure makes it hard to give your kids their lunch.

        Your sausage sizzle in the park might be a novel idea though compared to all the over the top parties. You can at least still do that.

        • +9

          My youngest kid is in year 3, so while it is a while since I paid for newborn daycare, I think I am ok with prices.
          Are you seriously arguing that because you can't send a peanut butter sandwich to school, that invalidates the idea of choosing inexpensive lunches like sandwiches rather than lunch orders etc?

          My kids currently learn to swim, learn drums and learn ballet. The eldest recently quit roller derby. The costliest of these activities was $30 a week, the cheapest $5.
          We haven't done soccer or athletics for a few years, but again, fees are reasonable. I just looked and registration and uniform was under $200 for the season. It mounts up quickly if they are doing four $30 activities, which is why we don't do that.

          The cost of childcare is astronomical, I agree, and you need to do what you can to manage this, such as getting family help, working part time etc. to minimise this. In our family this meant juggling early/late starts at work, and lots of disruption until we had our 3rd kid and the costs meant it was cheaper for one parent to stay home for a few years. School will take the kids at 4 1/2yro, so it isn't like they need childcare till they are 18.

          I guess I am suggesting that there is little need to spend up on kids, but there are plenty of wants (I want my child not to eat a sandwich for lunch for health reasons).

        • +1

          @mskeggs:

          I am seriously arguing life has gotten harder with more regulation all the time and that your plans are going to come unstuck.

          The price of regulation to make us safer is one major cost that has changed from when I was a child. Not just with kids. People use to do their own plumbing and electrical work. No I'm not saying that was a good idea. The laws changed because people died. BUT it is more expensive and has a huge impact on cost of living. Likewise our parents didn't need car seats, could let us walk ourselves to school at age 8 without fear the police would have them arrested. Many many more examples.

          A lot depends on where you are. Child care costs can vary wildly between Sydney/Melbourne and the suburbs.

          Where I am soccer is closer to $2000 per year than $200. I don't live in Melbourne but here's a good article:
          http://www.heraldsun.com.au/leader/sport/junior-soccer-fees-…

          Our kids are in cheaper activities. My daughter does 2 dance classes at about $15/week each. If she doesn't go she still pays. My daughter and son use to do Karate (but haven't gotten back into it since a couple of injuries) and little athletics. Karate works out to $15 per week but if they don't go they still pay as of last year. Athletics is the cheapest at under $100 each (not sure of exactly price this year). The cost of kids sports is getting completely out of hand.

          There is no way it's just a matter of being frugal these days. Costs have gotten out of hand even when you're careful.

        • +2

          @syousef:
          I do agree that many costs have become silly, but even in the link you posted, the costs for sports like athletics and netballs and AFL and some of the soccer clubs were under $15 a week. And as you point out, other interests also add up, but $15 to do ballet or karate is pretty reasonable too.
          It does add up if you have multiple kids doing multiple activities, which I guess was my original point - choose cheap ones like sports and don't over-schedule the kids.

          I don't think the cops will be troubling you if your 8yro walks to school. In NSW the gov won't give you a bus pass unless you live further than 1.6km from the time you are 8, and walking to school isn't a trigger for any DOCS risk assessment, so if a rogue cop who thought they knew better did get uppity, it doesn't seem like it could go anywhere.

          I also understand and share the concern that "safety" standards have become stupidly risk averse, to the cost of everybody's hip pocket. But the world is now at the point where people will only employ a licensed builder to clean their gutters (joking, I hope!)

          I think the biggest change isn't in all these incidentals anyway. The cost of a decent home is ridiculous today, forcing most families to have two incomes all the time, with it a struggle to take a couple of years off to look after very little kids. Government policies have driven this, and we will end up much poorer as a society because of it.

          I see in another post you mention the possibility of a health issue derailing finances. I sympathise, and am very lucky my family's health has been good. You make a very strong point that if the extended family isn't available to rally around and assist when there are health misfortunes, as it traditionally did here and overseas, there are a huge range of extra costs.

          It is analogous with childcare. When I was growing up, my grandmother didn't work at all, and my mother worked part time only when we were older. And my grandparents lived a 10min drive away. So my parents never paid for daycare.
          Fast forward to today and even if your parents are in the same city, and even if they don't work (which is much less common), the chances somebody in their late 20s can buy a house 10mins from where they grew up are pretty slim.
          So that support is gone, replaced by a $500+ a week daycare bill.

          And the reverse with caring for an aged relative. My Mum's ability to pop over and see her Dad in his later years 4 or 5 times a week will not be repeated by me as she is a 90min drive away. When she gets old she will need to get a home carer to visit a few times a week to provide the help a visiting child gave, but at a cost.

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