I've been observing for quite some time now when I fill up my car, most people rather not use E10 for their car. (of course excluding diesel engine)
My anecdotal evidence suggests about 50-60% of people use premium 95, about 20-30% use premium 98. About 10-20% is E10. With the rest being spread with other fuel types.
I personally owned CR-V 2003 and use premium 95.
Do you use E10 with your car? Why/why not?
I'm confused. How does one exactly measure fuel used?
Do you fill up till it overflows, drive around until your car stops, then take a speedo reading, then fill up using a spare gallon of fuel and then fill up at the servo till it overflows and repeat?
How do you manage to safely pull over to the side of the road once the fuel suddenly runs out!?! Cant picture someone filling up from a gallon on the drivers side while cars are flying past at 100+ kmph.
I can’t picture that this post is actually serious…
It’s not hard. Fill up. Record your kms or set trip meter. Drive for a while. When you get fuel the next time record how many kms on the trip meter and see how many litres it takes to fill up again. Litres per 100km.
If you want to be extra accurate use the same filling station and the same pump. Always stop at the same click on the pump as there is a difference in when the pump will cut out and may slightly vary the amount of fuel in the tank.
Tank to tank you will get some variance, but averaging will give you a good indication.
Use an app to track fuel usage. Fuel Log isn’t bad. When you fill up, you just put in the odometer reading, how many litres you put in and the cost of the fuel. It will calculate everything else out for you.
I use road trip le. Free and easy.
Really glad for ozbargain and all the awesome input both technical and humourous/commentary in this particular post - also realised there is/seems to be quite a vast difference between E10 and 95/98 fuels when travelling longer distances or at higher speeds = i was pumping up about 30%more on E10 and confused, but suspicions confirmed here with info in this post. Totally a personal choice end of day i guess but definitely would not recommend E10 for savings of $1-2 when it actually doesn't perform as well - perhaps what would help would be the statistics of say city driving / long distance driving vs each fuel type to reflect economy
If you search the net you will find several "lab tests" where the same car (designed to run on U91) was driven on E10, 91 and 98.
Results:
E10 - cheaper to buy but used more fuel than 91 and also a drop in performance - worked out much more expensive than 91
U91 - good overall performance and economy. Worked out the cheapest fuel to use.
U95 - Similar to 91 but slightly more kms travelled using same amount of fuel. Higher cost of 95 outweighed the savings of using lesser fuel
U98 - Slightly better result than 95 but much higher cost of fuel made 98 very uneconomical to use.
A couple of quick points-
-E10 is okay for your car (but always follow manufacturer's recommendation ie don't use in marine applications due to ethanols affinity to water).
-Ethanol has a lower energy content per unit of volume compared to petrol (but higher octane) this equates to a 2-3% less distance travelled on E10. ie E10 should be sold at a lower price to make it worth your while to use.
-Ethanol is a renewable liqued fuel source and is an industry that will boom when the price of a barrel of oil gets too high.
-The burning of ethanol is clean in emissions as it only emits water and CO2, using E10 reduces harmful emissions.
BTW when i had a petrol car I used E10, 91 and 95 when I wanted a bit more go. Now I have diesels.
PS don't forget the V8 super cars use E85
I have a Camry 2004 3L V6. And even though it says 91, I have noticed i get more Kms if i use 95 or 98. On the Toyota forums thats what a lot of people seem to have experienced as well. Its basically the same engine as what the Lexus used to use. I am unsure if due to that or just the way it was designed, it does seem to make better use of the 95 / 98 fuels…
Also in my partner's Honda HRV, i have noticed the Kms before refilling the tank seems to report i get an extra 70-80Kms if i use 98 as opposed to 91…?
What do you guys reckon? I can never decided if i should stick with 91 or go to premium.
Sounds like you need to do some real sums to work out which fuel is best. Not just one tank either, get an average over several tanks worth.
You are not mistaken. You get a bump in mileage and the car drives better on 98. Run a few tanks on 91 and you will see what I am talking about.
But is the increase in range worth the extra coins when you fill?
No, it's not but it's not far off. Your car will drive better on 98 and lower carbon buildup in the heads is what you gain.
@antler: All I said was the difference you pay in price between Super and Regular you get some back in Millage, Some in performance and some in the longevity of the engine.
But all the conspiracy theorists want the cheapest to be the best which is not the case with most things in life. I own 3 Subarus and they all are known for carbon build up in the engine heads. 98 keeps them clean. I am happy and my Mechanic doesn't even bother with the Upper Engine clean which is mandatory during every service because he checked there is Zero buildup. My oldest one I stopped using premium and there was buildup in the last service which was removed using Subaru Upper Engine Cleaner sa459. The cans are $22 + Labour (it's a process 15-20 mins). I would just pay a little more for my petrol.
I use E10 in my 04 corolla as there was little to no difference when logging the results v's 91 in terms of fuel useage (driving purely to and from work each day in the same traffic conditions)
I dont use E10 to save $ per se, typically most servos have more E10 boswers then 91 (I reside in newcastle nsw and say a typical servo may have 10 bowsers 2 are 91) and ethanol in small quantities also has some positive benefits of cleaning the fuel system.
E10 is less economical, but is better for the environment and cheaper. It’s less economical because it is higher octane and you will therefore get more power when you use it as fuel. Does not damage your car! As long as it was made past the 90’s.
Source - my dad runs and ethanol plant.
I think your dad will need to educate you more on fuel energy density if you simply state higher octane = more power.
98 Because engine sounds better and acceleration is smoother and less strained. My car takes 91 but "recommends 95 or higher for optimal performance".
I use Unleaded 91, unless I accidentally park next to a pump that has E10 instead. Then I am lazy and use E10.
You should only use what the car manufacturer specifies for your car.
Anything better is a waste of money. Anything inferior can damage your engine.
Interestingly I dont know one manufacturer that actually recommends E10 for their vehicles.
They may "say" you can use it but they will never put that in writing.
I dont know a single mechanic that supports E10 either
They have seen what happens to engines running E10 and it aint pretty in the medium to long term.
Futhermore cars running on E10 actually have less power and use more fuel.
Hence the tiny amount you save at the bowswer is quickly burnt away in extra fuel consumption as tests have proven over and over again.
So E10 is false econmoy
I rest my case.
Your case may be rested but the mechanic pegaxs posting here seems to differ in opinion. Of course he may well be only an internet mechanic, but there are also mechanics out there that will change your blinker fluid for you if you ask and tell you your engine is ruined because it’s over 100,000km old and needs a timing belt.
I doubt mechanic pegaxs knows better than the other 99.9999% of mechanics or know more about cars than the manufcaturers do
But there is always a self made expert that thinks they know better than everyone else.
And we all know what an ex-spirt is???
There is no point talking to you, because it’s people like you that propagate the bullshit surrounding fuel.
I could supply plenty of references to who I am, what I do and what I have done. I would say my expertise comes from over 25 years in the automotive industry. My experience comes from years and years of hands on time with cars, trucks, motorcycles, engines and fuels. I have spent a good portion of time researching things like fuel. Least of all, due to being in this field of work most of my life, I know a lot more mechanics than you do, and the only ones that don’t like E10 are the dumb arse filter spinners types at Lubemobile…
I would like to see where you got your 99.9% of mechanics hate E10 stats from. Got the source on that? Or just more made up shit?
I have read over all your posts in this thread, and while some of them have tiny glimmers of truth to them, most of it is utter bullshit. When I write, I sound like a schooled up automotive technician, when you write, you sound like a gullible desk jockey…
Consider yourself blocked.
I don't use E10 and usually go with unleaded 91/95. I've heard a few of my friends say that E10 is really bad for cars and you get much less fuel economy. Either way u91 has served me fine so far so I don't see any point in changing.
Yes, when your car is designed to run on 91 its the safest and most economical bet you will ever make
My car is a 2012 Nissan Micra, it's fine to run on E10 I just don't like it.
I use ULP 91 in my 2013 Suburu Impreza, even though I have a fuel card. My perception is that ULP 95 is not important for the use of this car, as it is as boring as unflavoured milk.
Only time I used ULP 95/98 was when I had a turbo Mitsu, and a MX-5. No more however.
my car specifies 95RON and that's all i use.
previous owner used to put 91RON and wondered why the car was running poorly.
i've tried various brands of 98RON — makes no difference to performance or economy, and strangely, causes rough starts in the morning.
My fully sick toyota 86 requires 98 only.
My car only runs on United E85 and the other one is diesel so no I don't use E10…
I use 91. Ethanol has a lower energy content per unit of volume compared to petrol, this equates to a 3-4% higher fuel consumption. Hence its a scam.
It won’t be a scam if it’s 5-6% cheaper than 91 :D
It's not tho..
Where I live it usually is
It usually is only a few cents difference, but where I live it sometimes does get considerably cheaper. So it isn’t a scam for everyone.
Have you measured the actual fuel consumption in your car? Plenty of responses in here with differing opinions on how much the economy is affected from negligible to 10%. Much of it is anecdotal, not evidence based.
Edit: the only tests I’ve seen done have been hardly scientific. One tank of fuel, people driving. Two ‘identical’ cars when we know that there are differences in manufacturing tolerances etc. no double blind testing, no statistically valid multiple runs all that sort of rigorous stuff and yet many people quote them as gospel.
I got 70-110 kilometres less from a 50 litre tank when driving under the same conditions. This compared to 91 octane. Car was a 2005 Astra classic, based on the opel model.
Other than the noticable milage, this particular case didn't seem to perform any different.
Now I'm more curious about the higher octane fuels. Same car, didn't notice any real difference in milage between 91 and 98, though performance was noticably better.
Then again, I swear I can feel a slight difference between bp ultimate and shells 98.
Both my work car and my personal car are turbocharged performance models that recommend premium. Even if they didn't I would still only use premium. I haven't bought regular unleaded in 15 years and have never bought E10.
My vehicle manufacturer recommends not to
Anyone who owns a modern Mazda with a SkyActiv Motor must put at least the recommended 95 octane in the tank. Mazda loves their high-comp NA motors.
2016 ASX Petrol (30,000km in 18 months). Manual says to use 91.
In both this and the previous (1998 Camry 3l - 240,000km in 18 years) if I use E10, I lose 100k per tank. That is not worth the slight difference in price.
I will use E10 if if I'm stuck & it's the only choice, but only at a part tank until I can get the 91 again.
Poll is missing an option for those who use E10 regardless of price or what others tell them to do. Burning more fossil fuel makes no sense to me when I'm given a convenient alternative.
Poll is messed up. Stupid provisos are inconsistent, as you have noted.
I can't vote for Unleaded 91 as my car isn't old.
Option on poll wasn't even there when first posted. Shows lack of thought by OP.
You would have to be retarded to fill up with E10 it’s sugar
Sugar makes me feel good, why wouldn't it make my car run good?
I use e10 when it’s significantly cheaper. When it’s only a few cents difference rather use 91 unleaded. I found a slight difference in fuel economy with the e10 being less efficient. So it might end up costing more for the e10 at a few cents less. When it’s 15-20 cents less than e10 makes sense, it occasionally does get that much cheaper at my local servo. It’s 10 cents cheaper at the moment for instance.
Use 98 because car is an import from japan and its the closest we have to their RON ratings.
Not keen on saving a few cents/L just to have pinging and potential major issues down the line.
e85 (profanity)
I use e10 and 91 interchangably… I havent seen any econ difference.
If petrol gets real cheap where premium is like $1.25 then I use that but even then I dont see a huge econ difference even with that.
I really wish they would just make 95 the standard and make it like 5c more than e10.
You can use fuelly.com to track your usage. They also have an APP for Apple and Android. Beats entering the data into a spreadsheet.
I use RON98 and average 7.4l/100km on a Q50 hybrid mainly city driving.
Does anyone know the story with United E10 95 VS. E10 94 sold by every other major service station?
Is it the case that 91 fuel with 10% ethanol scientifically is raised to 95RON?…. I’ve always suspected the major companies under report the octane rating with their e10 so they can still sell their premium 95 with no ethanol.
If the above isn’t the case, are United adding something else to their e10 so it becomes 95RON?
Hardly have E10 in the ACT at all.
I have definitely noted a drop in efficiency when using E10 and even fillup with 91 when in NSW.
I would never buy a car that uses 98/95 exclusively. The 20c extra per L would add up over the years and this would be very unozbargainy of me.
Personally, I wouldn't touch e10 unless you're renting the car and need to return it full tank. My car is tuned for 95 but I only pour 98. I haven't read anyone elses comments but I feel it's best for the longevity of the car. The exhaust pipes don't have that layer of black dust that could be accumulating into the engine and I do about 600-780km on a 65L tank (highway Canberra to Sydney). I'm not going to try 95 as my car is probably use to 98 now. That's my opinion though.. seems like the car learns your driving style (gear wise) so it might have to learn 95 petrol if I pour different petrols. In my opinion, stick with what it's tuned for or better and then stick with it. I personally only pour at only 2 BP stations I know since I know some petrol stations have had water enter their tanks (might be because it's a petrol station and car wash) and have been sued for engine damages (word of mouth from my mechanic). Their rep has gone down even though they fixed the problem, but I personally wouldn't risk it.
E10 is bad for your engine even if your car is capable of running on it, ask any mechanic. I tried to put E10, 95 and 98 for the driving on motorway to see which one will last longer. Full tank of E10 got me 480 km, full tank of 95 got me about 520 km and I almost did 600 km on full tank of 98. The car was 2 y.o. Mazda 3.
Not saying whether or not it is bad or good for your engine, but worse fuel economy =/= worse for your engine
And to add to that, E10 =/= 140km less per tank on a Mazda 3. Unless the Mazda 3 was designed for 98RON, then this comment is total malarkey…
Disabled user account. No doubt it was opened for trolling after a statement like that.
I got told to specifically used premium for my vehicle. On the odd occasion when I've accidentally put E10 in the car - you can notice a distinct difference.
Accidentally put e10 in? More than once? Jeepers, take notice of what you are doing, next time you might put diesel in.
What vehicle?
I alternate between full tanks of 91 and 95 (Forester 2014 non-turbo).
Manual recommendation is 95, but also specifies 91 is ok.
I definitely notice more pinging with 91.