Casual Fast Food Employee. If I'm Say 5 Mins Late to Work, Can My Boss Force Me to Stay Another 5 Minutes past My Rostered Time

Had a family member waiting in the parking lot to pick me up, they weren't really amused. I have a feeling the boss forced me to stay longer and forced my ride to sit in their car twiddling their thumbs to prove a point, but I'm just wondering is it legal to fire an employee for not staying beyond their rostered time even if they were late to that shift? Wouldn't normally care, but this isn't the first time I've been expected to work a few minutes longer than rostered time while my ride sits in the car wishing I would be let out on time so they can keep doing the rest of their chores, but this is the first time I've been a few minutes late. I'm usually about four minutes early and jump straight into the work, even though I don't mark those few minutes down in the time book unless it's like a full 15 minutes early (it's boring waiting around for your shift to start anyway).

It's just the being forced to stay longer than the rostered time that I'm wondering about. I have not seen that in this kind of job before, usually the clock out time is the rostered clock out time, unless the manager asks you nicely if you wouldn't mind staying a bit longer this shift with my permission. I'd just like to do whatever Fairwork says we should be doing, instead of wondering whether the boss is going to be grumpy today and demand some extra work. Also I'm not too bothered about the 40 cents per minute or whatever. I'm applying for full time work that matches my studies, so a bit of unpaid minimum wage work here and there won't exactly alter my longterm career plans and savings much.

closed Comments

      • You sound like an entitled 16 year old. Wait till you get a real job with salary where regular overtime is expected.

        Do you think you would get far working at a place like Google or Apple with an "I don't owe you a single minute more" attitude?

        • -5

          It’s ironic, because that’s exactly the kind of attitude the boss has when it comes to extracting free minutes from employees. The “I’m getting as many free minutes off you as I can” attitude. If I was in a salary like you say then it would be a different matter. But I’m not on a salary like you.

      • +1

        Don’t start and finish on the dot. Allow at least 5 mins either side to get yourself into gear and pack up etc. Common courtesy.

  • +2

    OP you’re the reason casual workers are not appreciated enough. Doing a few mins extra is nothing.

    I used to do and still do hours and hours extra without getting paid.

  • +6

    Just wait till you grow up and get a full-time job. I wish i only did 5 minutes of overtime. I probably do about 10 hours of overtime per week (every week) and I don't get paid a cent for it. And I get to work on time!

    • +1

    • I'm usually at least 1 hour - 30 minutes early and leave 30 minutes later, unpaid. But I'm weird and like to work lol

  • trolling aside, OP is rightly concerned. It can become an expectation. I'd advise you to clock-on and clock-off exactly on time every shift. Say no to 10 mins of extra work unless you get paid.

    • It's very convenient that the one time OP is expected to put in a few more minutes past rostered time is when he's late, and he's apparently never been late before.

      • Read the OP's post where they very clearly state they have worked back on many occasions, and only this time were they late.

  • +1

    5 minutes late to a fast food job.

    You categorically changed the category of the establishment.

    • It's sad how the OP is ignoring these good points and maintaining that its his boss's attitude that's the problem. I think we've lost him. R.I.P: work ethic, common courtesy, common sense, the future…

      • Maybe if people offered polite advice instead of insulting OP they might find their opinion better received.

  • It's hardly the bosses fault you need someone to pick you up. Can't believe you'd complain about making up the 5 minutes

  • If your argument is they shouldn't be allowed to make you stay back if you're late, then where do you draw the line? Could you show up an hour late? Two hours late? Half the shift late? And still go home on time and expect to be paid your normal wages?

    Don't make life harder for yourself by fighting over trivial things. If you insist they have no right to ask you to stay back, then they can get you in other ways, such as overlooking you when opportunities open up, not being accommodating of any requests you have (e.g. asking for short notice holiday leave, or taking a day off for non medical reasons on short notice), not giving you a good reference. It's not worth it.

    Remember, you're a casual. They can stop giving you shifts or cut your shifts. And they don't need to explain anything. By refusing to stay back 5 minutes, you're just giving them ammunition, even if you're legally in the right. It's not a smart thing to do since you are at fault for it.

  • +1

    This is how idiots ruin it for the rest of us. Not only do you have a job. Now you want to scam your employer to pay you for time you did NOT work. FTW?

    • Well, no. I was two minutes late but entered a five minute later start time on the time clock. I’ve never in my life asked for payment for work I didn’t do. Even near closing when staff are chatting and stuff I’d rather be working, clear some of the morning drudgery for the ops manager who would have to deal with it in the morning anyway.

  • No he cant force you. Its called kidnapping.

    • However if you want to keep your job, you better make up the time somehow

  • +1

    OP, (lets just assume) are you working for 7.55 hours or 8 full hours? Your boss is being nice and gave you flexibility.

    You should get fired from your work, AND OzB.

    • -2

      If I'm not making him money or if I'm disrupting operations somehow then he should fire me. If there is someone else who is better at the job and available for the times I am, then I should be fired and that person should be hired instead.

      • -1

        Nah, I changed my mind. You should quit altogether. Stubborn & immature. How the heck you got the job…

        All the best for your future endeavour. NOT.

        • Ah, the NOT after a period. One of the least stubborn and immature things you can say.

  • Troll

  • +1

    Your employer can get you to work reasonable overtime. If you were 5 minutes late, it would be more than reasonable for you to work 5 minutes over to make that up. Sure, you can walk out the door, but I would be firing you for sure if you did that to me.

    • Your employer can get you to work reasonable overtime

      I have never seen this stated in an Award or EBA for casual fast food workers.

  • You should reconsider your position; you agreed to work as per your casual contract. You are not forced to do anything, and can leave at any time, your employer also has the liberty to choose whether you are worth utilizing. If you are not a fan of this arrangement then you should seek something alternative, be thankful you have this choice.

    • Yeah I guess if he wants to keep my productivity the decision over whether or not these routine extra few minutes is worth it or not is up to me. Five or ten minutes of unpaid work per shift isn't really all that much, it's less than a fiver per day in the grand scheme of things. I think I just preferred it when it felt like I was volunteering this extra unpaid time to old mate the boss rather than it being expected, whether I was late for once or not.

  • IDK you should arrive before your shift about 10-15 mins early and may get out the door mins after COB. Just reality

    • +2

      I usually get to the site 15 minutes early and read my kindle nearby before going in. Often much earlier because that's the only time my ride can get me there. If I get to the site about five minutes early I'll just go in and start working, five minutes is not enough time to get anywhere in a book or drink a cup of coffee. The whole site is full of various fast food places and cafes. It's actually the only time I read my kindle these days so it's not so bad.

    • +1

      Arrive maybe but not start work - surely you're not suggesting that OP work 10-15 mins extra each shift just because… (The business pays him so well?)

  • Millennials. Amirite?

  • +3
    1. Fill out time sheet correctly. You're literally signing saying you've started that time, don't round it. Most managers are quite casual with employees being a couple of minutes early/late, but that doesn't mean you round it on your time sheet.

    2. Send a quick text to manager when you're going to be late, don't be a dick leaving him hanging waiting for you to arrive, or he'll do the same and leave your ride hanging waiting for you to leave… Nice job picking up on his tactics, but what do you expect?

    3. Have your ride arrive a few minutes after you knock off. Even if you have to chill and drink a frozen coke while you wait. This is usually common courtesy - if there's a chance of delays, have yourself waiting for your ride rather than your ride waiting for you.

    4. Discuss with your manager/boss and explain that you're not available for any overtime work due to out of work commitments and transportation arrangements. You don't need to really explain beyond that, if they do ask simply say study commitments/social commitments/etc - no need for details. Still keep #3 in mind - a few minutes overtime still isn't unreasonable.

  • +2

    OP save this thread, look back at it when/if you grow up and realise how stupid your actions were and how much worse that you actually posted this.

  • +1

    you should feel obligated to make up the time, its your fault for not turning up on time

  • Your boss is actually being quite fair you

    Consider from the bosses point of view 5 min in the morning getting ready is more important than the 5 min you made up

    It is also very common to lose 15min if you come even 1 min late.

    They could have let you leave on time and taken 15 min of pay, instead you get paid as normal and only have to make up lost time.

  • Depends on the work place, you'd certainly lose the 5 minutes or so off of your pay if you did leave early. True you don't want to be exploited by your work place, but yet you don't want to put anyone off side which then results in them making your work life harder and/or being unemployed in the near future.

    You should always work the amount of time your actual shift is. At my work I always sign in 5-10 minutes earlier than my actual shift (for those reading, yes I actually start working as soon as I sign on! Give myself a mini head start) and sign off exactly when I'm supposed to or 1-2 minutes later (times are adjusted to match the rostered on time).

    What you don't want to happen (which has happened to me in the past) is get permission from upper management to start early so you can finish early………. but then a lower manager makes you stay 30 minutes LATER (or 15 minutes over your normal finishing time) than the time you were previously ok'd to leave. I've had it happen a few times over the years. One time I was given another task to do with only 5 minutes left of my shift………. it won't take long despite my protesting that I do have a bus to catch and if I miss it I'm stuffed. I finish 25 minutes later, then as I am being let out the guy goes "how will I get home now ?" I just said it looks like I'll have to hitchhike home (as the next bus was not due for an hour).

  • Haha, wait until you get a "real" job

    Im assuming op will be one of those unfair dismissal types

    Waaaaaa i had to actually make up the time i cost my employer

    Boohoo my mum had to sit in her car for an entire 30 seconds longer than expected! I went home and got the wooden spoon waaaa.

  • +1

    Perhaps it is best to put this another way.

    If you paid 60 minutes for a buffet feast, massage, other 60 minute experience, would you be OK if they started 5 minutes late or finished 5 minutes early?

    There are certain cultures that absolutely hate tardiness (Dutch and Japanese come to mind). I know in Japan that even showing up 5 minutes before you are about to catchup with people would be considered extremely rude and in some instances if you are late do not even bother to show up.

      • Let's hope our train networks don't follow suit. I'd rather my tax money not go towards the huge new department of apologies they'd have to create to send letters after each day…. (and no, I have no hope that our train networks could run on time.)

        • I doubt that they sent letters to each commuter or dedicate any special resources towards it. Metro Trains in Melbourne already have a media/PR department, which is not unusual for a private company.

        • @The Land of Smeg: Not for 20 seconds, but I actually think in Japan they do - so that the commuters can file it with their work because companies there are also that strict about punctuality.

          http://www.realestate-tokyo.com/news/train-delay-certificate…

          And my subtle/oblique point is that the trains here are early or late so often they'll need entirely new dedicated departments just to send out these letters.

        • @HighAndDry: they don't send them out.

          from your link:

          How to get a Train Delay Certificate
          If your train is late, a station attendant will often be standing on the platform or else at the ticket gate handing out the certificates to exiting passengers. If not, go to the counter by the ticket gate and say the below:
          Chien shoumeishou onegai shimasu? (May I please have a chien shoumeishou?)

          also

          With the advent of the internet and modern smartphones, Japan's railway companies have implemented new online Train Delay Certificates that can be accessed any number of ways, including via smartphone or computer. If you are unable to acquire a certificate at the station where you disembark from the train, you can always pull it up on your phone or computer when you arrive at your destination.

  • This attitude is really unemployable. And I'm telling you this because i had the same attitude 10 years ago.

    Maybe its important for you to go through this, but once you meet people that dont complain, do the work much better than you, dont whinge about the time spent being at work, you'll be left behind occupationally.

    If you were the boss, would you employ someone with your attitude? You dont support efficiency, and you complain over 5 minutes.

    Get a good influence for working, someone with a good work ethic and attitude you can learn from. If youre lucky it'll be a boss.

  • Hi, I can confirm that this is pretty commonplace in casual and hospitality work (at least from my experience). I use to wash dishes/Work on floor at a chain of Max Brenner when I was a student. Was once looking at my roster and checking my next shift at the end of the current shift (5 min to go) when the supervisor came in and started yelling at me in the most degrading manner for not doing work. Asked him what his problem was, as I was ending my shift and got fired at the end of the month for talking back. Would get yelled at if I was standing waiting for an order because I was meant to keep moving : the supervisor said "I dont want to see you standing still" on a 5 hour shift. Basically you have no respect, are expected to constantly take shit from people, have a yes sir attitude and are disposable. After that I stuck with office jobs where people don't treat you like animals.

    • Must be a good office job

      • Indeed. Cant complain.

  • +1

    You're rostered to work x amount of hours and your boss expects you to work them… that's completely reasonable.

    You arrived late so it's your fault your ride was inconvenienced. Although 5 minutes is barely even an inconvenience. They thought you were getting food after your shift as you have done many other times. So they've had to wait gor you before. Why is this time an issue?

    The solution here is to get to work earlier.

  • +1

    guys this post has dragged on because people have scrutinized the OP's wording instead of the principle message.

    It's disappointing to know that your boss is looking at 5min intervals, if you were late by 30mins or 1hr, then diff story.
    I can assume on other circumstances you would arrive 5 mins early anyway, so it's all give & take.

    So here are some final points:

    • Its wrong for the boss the penalize you on 5mins
    • Yes Boss can (legally) ask you to stay back additional 5 mins, or even 10mins (if it's busy, etc)
    • If this is the way your boss is behaving, you're best bet is to start looking elsewhere…
    • +4

      It's disappointing to know that your boss is looking at 5min intervals

      What about the fact that OP is whining over a 5 minute interval?

  • +2

    Naewwe poor thing 5 minutes, fortnite can wait

    • +1

      Hahahahahaha!

  • You're in trouble now, Josh.

  • +2

    sometimes I really worry for the next generation.

    • +1

      yeah, me too

    • I'm a teacher (VET) by trade. I get this attitude regularly from <19 year olds. Not all, but an increasingly common theme of entitlement and inability to acknowledge when they are at wrong. Consequences of their laziness becomes everyone elses fault.

  • why not, you should stay for another 10mins, there is no reason for late!

  • why would your ride care about 5 minutes?

  • You have someone who can you pick you up on time, my god if I ever had that I'd be at work 15 minutes early.

    • -4

      Ha, I know right. But it just happened to fit in their schedule. It’s why my shift ends at that particular time, boss wanted to accomodate that schedule. But that was when he thought I’d be coding for him for free. I guess I’m just as valuable or invaluable as any other employee if don’t do side work for free.

  • No he cannot, dont expect to be paid the 5 minutes you were late.

  • Silly question.

    With a job there are certain expectations of you, one of those includes fulfilling the hours agreed on. You have a lifetime of work ahead of you and you're off to a bad start. Save yourself a lot of stress and take ownership of this one.

    If the real problem is the ride picking you up, show them respect by starting your shift early so you're ready when they turn up.

  • +1

    If it was a salary job coming into work and leaving a few minutes early in general is not a big deal (fyi I'm a salary man and on average work 50 hours a week and take very short lunch breaks), but if you're getting paid by the hour then I would arrive/leave on time.

    • True.

  • From prior experience, if you don't do what everyone else does they fire your arse. Make your choice!

  • So you put the blame on your employer and not explain to the person picking you up that you where late to your rostered shift and had to make up time?
    Or you couldn't call the person picking you during your shift break and ask them to come five minutes later?

    This is the product of "participation awards".

  • I dont know about you but if employers already come down to this, you may have a serious trust issue that is almost impossible to get out of.

    Usually when it comes down to this, you better off start looking around and start over.

  • +1

    This is why robots will replace us.

  • I'd have fired you even before it'd happen.
    Consider this… how about being a good employee, getting to work earlier and keeping everyone at your work happy.
    A few minutes, eh?

  • +1

    Man thats pretty rough. I didn't realise how tough life is for the part time uni workers now-a-days.

    How did the family member feel about being left out there for 5 minutes man. Are they ok?

    The struggle is real

    • So true. Op deserves a tv movie the hardships he's describing would appeal to all the unfortunate battlers out there.

  • +1

    I rock up 5 minutes late on occasions and as a personal punishment for doing that, I'll work 30 minutes extra. That isn't because my boss expects it of me, it's more so because I feel I have let my own expectations down. If you let yourself get too self entitled, you'll find yourself disgruntled when your boss expects you to make up 5 minutes time at the end of your shift, for the 5 minutes you ripped him off by turning up late. Wait, hang on…

    • -1

      is that true, you'll volunteer half an hour's time every time you are five minutes late? What does your boss say about this. and what do other union members say about it.

      For me it was unexpected. other employees have been late before and I've never seen anyone instructed to stay behind, everyone always leaves at the end of their shift. if it was normal practice then I would have expected it before he even said it. as I wasn't expecting it it was kind of jarring. like if someone usually does something for everyone else, but makes a point of not doing it for you, then you get get caught by surprise.

  • No one can force you to do anything. Just be ready to accept the consequences of your actions. If your the type to go to fair work for something as trivial as being asked to make up lost time you're in for a rude awakening when you enter the work force.

    My advice is to change your mindset now or you'll never get very far.

  • '>grumpy today and demand some extra work. Also I'm not too bothered about the 40 cents per minute or whatever. I'm applying for full time work that matches my studies, so a bit of unpaid minimum wage work here and there
    What unpaid or "extra work" did you do ? Sounds like the boss only asked you to complete the ammount of hours work you were paid for.
    Honestly, the boss should you to do the work you are being for. You should turn up and start work on time .
    Im not certain of the fair work laws, but it is my understanding, that as a casual employee the boss can fire you (or just give you no shifts) for no reason and without notice. If I was your boss, and found you were grumpy and whingeing online about being asked to work the hours you were paid for, I would never have you in to work again at all, unless you possess some exceptional skill, which the next employee on the casual list cannot provide.
    As a low level unskilled casual employee, you really dont have much bargaining power. What the boss has done (expecting you to work the hours you're paid for) is certainly not unethical. To be fair and polite, you should apologize for being late, and offer to work that amount of time later.

  • You would be casual. He dosnt need to fire you, just reduce your hours to zero.

    Some people just don’t get it. He’s doing you a favour and your getting annoyed about it. Sadly taking the time to explain it to you would be wasted as you wouldn’t grasp the point anyways.

  • I mean, the courteous thing wouldve been to call ahead that you were going to be late. Thats just standard practice for basically any job. It shows that you respect them enough to let them know, but also you care about your job. I know you probably dont care that much about the place youre at now, but that wouldve been the correct thing to do. Keeping you back 5 mins is unfair to the person picking you up, but its unfair for your boss to not have you for the 5 mins he was supposed to have you. Its unfair for one of you either way. Having said that, its 5 mins, its not the end of the world. Take it as a life lesson.

  • Mere fact that you don't feel obliged to make up for the time you were late indicates a personality flaw to your own detriment; the language used to depict your relative twiddling their thumbs for a whole 5 minutes in the agonising wait for your person (likely a figure of speech; they were probably enjoying their time on the smartphone…) supports the previous statement. In short, I would never hire an individual like you. :)

    PS: Your boss may well be an (profanity); but you really have made this about you…

  • I think most of y'all are missing that this is about 5 minutes. Whether you're on their side, or the boss, whether they have rights, or not… 5 minutes is inconsequential. The only reasonable conclusion is that you don't really need advice here, what you need is to get a grip.

  • -2

    Sounds like a crucial element is OPs ride is doing OP a favour fitting into their schedule to drop/pickup OP. OP feels bad for keeping them waiting. There’s agreed hours between OP and boss because of the ride schedule.

    Boss hasn’t accounted for shift transition of 5-10min overlap and boss sounds frustrated due to their own poor planning, because roster is down to the minute and any variance impacts service.

    I can empathize with OP, mostly does the hours or more and rarely late, yet boss picked that one time to have a go. Boss is probably stressed cas it happens frequently (with all employees) and he’s trying to be a frugal as possible with staff rosters.

    • When OP's ride is ready is OP's problem. Boss is annoyed because OP arrives late but wants to leave on time.

    • I can't sympathize.

      Be on time ~

      Then roster on and off at your rostered times.

      If you get sacked cause you're leaving "on-time" when you got there on time, take it up with fair work.

      OPs ride can blame OP or themselves for being late.

  • Common courtesy really… if you're 5 mins late and you expect your boss to be ok with it then you should stay back to make up for the lost time.

    That's only fair isn't it?

    Keeping family waiting in the car is really your fault for being late to work in the first place. I wouldn't be blaming your boss for holding you to account.

  • Could you not ask your ride to come 5 or 10 mins later? I used to ask my mum to pick me up 10 mins after shift - gives me time to clean up, get my stuff out of the locker, check roster or do anything. Usually I timed it that I could walk out onto the main road, so mum didn't have to drive into the shopping centre car park.

  • When I was in fast food, usually someone starting on a shift would replace someone coming off a shift. So, for fairness, you being late affects the person coming off shift more than the company should care about.

    Minimum shifts were 2 hours (don't know if they still are), so if your shift was only 2 hours, I would think it would be reasonable for management to expect you to work a full 2 hours.

    If you don't want to keep your family waiting, start on time.

  • you don't sound responsible, you sound like there's a sense of entitlement about yourself.

    you were late and got punished.

    maybe you should focus on getting to work on time instead of making posts here

    • Why are you posting here instead of focusing on your job?

      • day off.

        did you at least make an attempt to let your employer know you're running late?

        honestly i would've done the same thing your current boss has done.

        what industry are you employed in?

        maybe this will give you a sense of urgency.

        • Ah, you don’t post on OZB when it’s not your day off. I see.

      • Tea breaks ~ lunch breaks ~ toilet breaks ~ unemployed ~ [other reasons here]

        Summarizing most of these comments:

        1) Just don't be late.
        2) Don't be early - if u feel as though you're being used

        You won't have issues leaving on time.

  • I've worked at McDonald's through high school and uni with very similar experience. The boss was a tight ass and want every minute of your rostered hour and sometimes more. Take it as a lesson and find something you love doing, then you won't be complaining about that extra five munites. Jobs that depend on your intellect tends to value the quality of your output rather than the hours/minutes you put in.

  • Don't be late

  • I'm sure OP got the idea now. Thread closed.

Login or Join to leave a comment