PayID reversal after Gumtree sale... Options? That easy?

Lparad0x on 07/09/2018 - 17:12

Hi Bargainers,

Just opened my phone and saw a similar topic, so I thought I'd ask the bank account experts!

I sold a laptop on Gumtree yesterday afternoon, who paid via PayID. He was very difficult before the sale, I almost told him not to come, I digress…

He spent a good 15min going over the laptop settings, software as well as asking to see the charger working, volume, screen rightness change etc. So he was thorough, which I'm fine with.

An hour later my phone is ringing like a school bell with a toddler tantrum contained within. He claimed numerous issues, I don't need to cover.

He demanded I take it back, then told me he was coming over today to return it no matter what etc. I maintained that he inspected the laptop with his own eyes, called it a sale, and there wasn't a problem until he got home. I was not going to refund because you've changed your mind, and most of all I did not want to have to deal with him again. I said this is done I'm sorry you're not happy and left the group. He followwd me into another sale item, said he's be at my house tomorrow, and I told him that I would ensure the police were there waiting to escort him away. Blocked him and got some peace.

Now I assumed PayID was instant, because it has been every other time I've used it, but his receipt said it could take up to 24hrs. OK, I verified the receipt, all was well, wait till today.

It's 26hrs later, no money has landed. I spoke with my bank and they have no visibility into the TX network. So it would appear as though he has reversed the transaction. Isn't there some procedure in place to validate transactions, or can anyone just request a payment get reversed?
Has PayID changed this?
Do I have any recourse through his bank, or is my only option now a legal one, or accepting a refund (which I cannot do after this long, with his mindset in possession of the property).

Sorry, became a little novel but $400 to me right now is the difference between eating and not for the next two weeks..

Cheers
Nasha

Financial Payid Commbank Gumtree

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Comments

  • parad0x on 07/09/2018 - 17:30
    +9

    PayID isn't instant, Osko is instant. Bank informed me of that today, PayID is merely the ease of use aspect.

    Couldn't request folding? I assume you mean cash? It was implied, he pulled the I forgot to stop, dsp you want me to go get some or just transfer.

    I've soul's tens of thousands of things, mainly in a trusted forum, so I didn't think twice about it.

    But, the funds have since arrived. It must have been 24hrs on the dot from the nearest hour.

    • HighAndDry on 07/09/2018 - 17:48
      +7

      Happy to hear it ended well. Also, thanks for the reminder that PayID isn't all that safe either - I think everyone can use a regular reminder that basically nothing other than cash (or bank cheques! you know who you are) is really safe.

      • [Deactivated] on 07/09/2018 - 18:48
        +3

        Bank cheques aren't safe.

    • spackbace on 07/09/2018 - 17:56
      +3

      Good to hear this ended well, many stories don't

  • HighAndDry on 07/09/2018 - 17:15

    From CBA's webpage:

    A payment may be held for up to 24 hours the first time it is directed to a sender’s account. The delay is so fraud security checks can take place. It gives you time to alert us about any unauthorised or suspicious activity on your account.

    I assume the buyer reported the transfer as fraud. If you know what bank he transferred from, you could try contacting them but I really really don't like your chances.

    I think the moral of your story is: PayID allows payments to be made and received instantly, but it doesn't guarantee that this happens and if you're using it, make sure that it has been received before parting with goods.

  • PissLUR on 07/09/2018 - 17:22
    -1

    payid is instant. if you are not on the same banks.
    you should see the money on your account before letting the item go with the buyer.

    • FSTB on 08/09/2018 - 17:47

      Payid is not instant in this case. For a first time transfer to a new recipient it's 24 hours.

      • PissLUR on 08/09/2018 - 18:37

        Only if it's the same bank.

  • spackbace on 07/09/2018 - 17:27
    +10

    $400 and you couldn't request folding?

    Sigh here we go again

    Who's got the popcorn this time?

    • follow on 07/09/2018 - 17:51
      +6

      Folding?

      • spackbace on 07/09/2018 - 17:55
        +1

        Cash

        • Illian on 08/09/2018 - 15:05
          -1

          Ah, English.

  • o53djz7qTPY4der on 07/09/2018 - 17:29
    +5

    Why did you not insist on cash? It's only $400, the buyer could have easily gone to the ATM.

  • [Deactivated] on 07/09/2018 - 17:29
    +5

    If they can do PayID, they can do cash. Do cash. Simple as that.

  • CyberMurning on 07/09/2018 - 17:30
    +2

    Ah.. another one…
    Cash only. If necessary drive him to ATM he has cash why not withdraw…

  • parad0x on 07/09/2018 - 17:32

    To all asking why not cash, cuz i didn't want to spent another additional second with this person than necessary.

    • SnoozeAndLose on 07/09/2018 - 17:36
      +12

      You shouldnt sell it to him if you are not confortable.

      People act like this normally means something fishy

    • 87percent on 08/09/2018 - 16:25
      +1

      If you didn't want to spend time with him, first thing is I wouldn't meet him WHERE YOU LIVE!!!

  • PissLUR on 07/09/2018 - 18:05

    payid payment using mobile number or email address.

    fyi - this is instant payment. you can see the money in your account straightaway.

  • mbck on 07/09/2018 - 19:03
    +1

    Gumtree…. Cash
    No excuses

  • [Deactivated] on 07/09/2018 - 20:10

    Payid can be reversed but only with the consent of the receiving party according to this article which is worth a read.

    https://www.lifehacker.com.au/2018/02/payid-faster-but-defin…

    • hopper on 23/07/2021 - 10:25

      that link takes me to other article

  • Diji1 on 07/09/2018 - 20:36

    You could have used cash but instead you gave a bank control of your transaction.

    What did you expect?

    BTW, convenience of payment and being completely divorced from any physical loss increases the amount of money that people lose by spending. Add incentives to that for credit card users who lose more again.

  • jason101 on 07/09/2018 - 20:58

    Irrespective of the story or reasons, if he has the item and you weren't paid, call the police and lodge a report regarding the internet fraud loss you have suffered.

  • nedski on 07/09/2018 - 21:09

    I have sold stuff on Gumtree and had stuff paid for with Payid and the cash came through instantly.

    It would undermine the whole system if payments could be reversed.

    If the guy has reversed the transaction, then I would allege that he has committed the fraud.

  • FullPrice on 08/09/2018 - 00:36

    I told him that I would ensure the police were there waiting to escort him away.

    Do you work for the government or something?

    Otherwise how would you achieve this?

  • UncommonName on 13/10/2019 - 07:44

    Guys, is PayID transfer reversible though?

  • bluesky on 13/10/2019 - 17:31

    PayID isn't instant, Osko is instant.

    Be very careful if your intention is to receive the funds immediately. I use Osko quite a bit, NOT using PayID (using the BSB/Account instead). And a few times, the transfer was not instant. Recently this happened, ING took 2 days before the money was finally in my account.

    Another time this happened (another institution), I noticed the message saying "submitted" instead of "processed". Turned out the staff had to make the transfer happen manually the next morning. And no, this was not the first time using OSKO transfer between the same sender/recipient, just that something went wrong (e.g., some component in the NPP platform went down).

    So, even if the counter-party does the fast payment in front of you, you really need to check your account to make sure the money is in. Otherwise, there could be delays. (Not sure for the instances I mentioned, the sender can reverse the transaction, but still, it means having to wait anxiously until the funds turn up).

    • [Deactivated] on 09/10/2021 - 12:44

      It really depends on a bank from which you're doing transfers, NAB in my experience is never instant, ANZ and most others are practically realtime up to some amount and processed in the evening if you transfer more than that, I think it's around 2K or somewhere close.

  • [Deactivated] on 07/03/2021 - 10:48

    What is the difference between OSKO and PayID?

    • Tleyx on 07/03/2021 - 13:47
      +1

      Pay id is the address osko is the road

      • hopper on 23/07/2021 - 10:24

        wow….u should become a teacher (well paid)

        • Tleyx on 23/07/2021 - 19:29

          Thanks man, that made my day

  • CrazyBargainer on 08/10/2021 - 23:09
    +1

    Just sharing my experience. Hope it helps others who are unaware of these tricks used by fraud buyers on gumtree.

    I have come across few fraud buyers on Gumtree, but luckily haven't fell victim.

    Few indications that you are dealing with fraud buyers:

    • You receive instant reply on your ad after posting it on Gumtree. (These idiots are always online. May be genuine enquiry, but hard to tell)
    • You get a message on whatsapp, enquiring about the item on Gumtree.
    • They send you an image file that shows various payment methods considered safe by Gumtree.
    • They ask you to post the item somewhere after you receive payment.
    • They insists other payment methods (Bank transfer, PayID, PayPal etc.) than cash. (Most, if not all, payments can be reversed)
    • Their partner or cousine would be coming to pickup the item because they are at work. (can be genuine, but mostly fraud)
    • They ask you to meet in quiet places, like railway station parking etc.
    • They agree to meet you during the day, but delay it until dark.
    • They have recently signed up on Gumtree and anything follows from the above list. (It may be genuine new user, but hard to tell)

    The list goes on…
    Feel free to add your suggestions or tips. Might be helpful to someone.

    Note: there is a difference between tough buyers (not sure if It is the right term i should use) and fraud buyers. Tough buyers are normally hard to deal with because they suspect that you are doing fraud, but still want to deal with you for whatever reason.

    • Kine on 22/06/2023 - 16:02

      Man I know this is an old post but as I went through your bullet points I went 'ticked ticked ticked'.

      Someone contacted me recently regarding my listing on fb marketplace and it's the same story - too busy at work, cousin will pick up, don't have cash (and we're talking about around $100 here which is when the alarms started going nuts in my head). Anyway, good tips.

  • Hargen on 09/10/2021 - 12:34

    Always insist on cash when selling a physical item if meeting in person, especially with anything over $300.

  • rektrading on 09/10/2021 - 13:12

    Ask to be paid over Twitter next time. The Tx is in real-time and irreversible.

  • af3556 on 12/10/2021 - 12:38

    Osko payments (including via PayID) can't be reversed - however some sending banks (only CBA that I know of first hand) do artificially delay the transaction - totally neutering the so-called "instant" payment.

    CBA/Commbank delay some? payments by 24 hours. I've been advised by CBA that their customers can cancel a pending Osko/PayID payment at any time in that 24 hour window. This is why I do not accept "instant" payments via CBA, at least until they've cleared and in my bank account.

    Once the payment has landed in your bank account it's there "for good". (Barring the usual ability for any bank to reach in to your account and reverse a transaction where they have been convinced a genuine mistake or fraud has occurred; be it via cash, EFT, cheque or Osko.)

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