Air Conditioning Install - Body Corporate Blocking

Hi All,
I'm wanting to get an air conditioning unit installed in my apartment. Its an older 80's style small block apartment. The only wall that I 'own' is one that is facing the driveway and hence my request to have the compressor side mounted to this wall was blocked for it being an eye-sore.

They have advised me to get the unit roof mounted, which (according to the 2/3 quotes I have received) would cost around $4k. I'm not wanting to spend this much but also not wanting to die this summer.

From what i've read portable A/C's are garbage and effectively do not work. So, I was looking at one of the window mounted A/Cs. Does anyone have any experience from these? Do you think I have to seek permission from body corp as this is effectively hanging out of my own window (ie. not fixing something to a common wall)?

Keen to hear your thoughts.

Comments

  • Do you think I have to seek permission from body corp as this is effectively hanging out of my own window (ie. not fixing something to a common wall)?

    Probably

    • Any basis for this? Nothing installed on common area would mean this is not a body corporate issue, I would assume.

      • +5

        Because most of the time at least one person will complain (look or noise, etc) when it is none of their business/have too much time on their hands and make it a hassle for you.

        Also the windows are technically common property.

        What do your by laws say?

        Portable ones are a last resort I suppose, they aren't great but they work within a certain range. And they are noisy due to the compressor being right there with you.

      • +7

        Because you don't own the space outside your window.

      • +2

        The external walls and external facade of the building are common property.

        If you choose to proceed with a wall mount against the body corps advice, your aircon unit will be removed and the cost of the removal and any repairs to the cladding and/or wall will be forwarded to you.

      • +2

        you dont own anything except the internals of your own apartment. Certain fixed items such as your Benchtop can even be classified as Owners Corp if its mounted to the boundary wall. Your lucky they are allowing you to mount it to the roof, otherwise you will need to raise a Bi Law and you will need to pay a lawyer to change the strata laws with no g/tee you will win if put to a vote. Suck it up or leave (I left/SOLD out of my building as too many old farts who wouldnt spend money and shortsighted).

  • What have your neighbors done? Anyone else installed an air conditioner somewhere?

    • Yes, most have but apart from my apartment, they all have access to their own commmon area or a non-street-facing wall where they have put the compressor.

      • +4

        In that case, I think you should go through whatever formal process is set out by the body corporate. It might even need to be escalated to the tribunal in your state for a ruling if the body corporate won't budge.

        Otherwise if you simply install it and it's in breach of a by-law, they have the power to ask you to remove it.

        • he lives with these people…its not worth the effort.

          • +3

            @sydsm: It's good to compromise here and there and get along, but there's no point suffering in silence while trying to be nice. If the neighbours in the block were reasonable people, they'd be able to see that what OP is asking for isn't unreasonable. Especially if they all already have AC units installed in their own apartments.

  • +1

    I'd suggest to,post a Layout Plan to get better result…. Or a photo.
    Have you considered have it at the back? Might cost more for pipes, but cheaper than roof-type.
    For window-type, I doubt the BC would be happy because it affects the appearance of the Complex.

    • Sure, plan that was submitted below, only shows my apartment, there is another one to the left of me:
      https://imgur.com/a/6mPz5Zb

      I don't think the back wall install is a possibility for me due to:
      -tennants against the back wall will be subject to any noise generated by my compressor (rather than just theirs)
      -pipes would have to travel up the wall and down into the roof to reach my apartment (assume a forklift would be required)

      • +1

        Looks to me like the unit below you has an A/C installed (existing ducting on wall below the red line on photo). If that is the case, are you able to install your compressor with theirs?

      • In my apartment my ac piping goes up into a ceiling, across my whole apartment and to a unit mounted down a wall on the opposite side. Meanwhile the drip drain goes down through the wall and into the garage, across the garage ceiling and into a drain. There are some freakishly complex installations out there. The drip drain is actually the worst part of the install (hard to unblock if blocked).

      • Having looked at the photo, I am quite certain that the BC wont agree to either Window or Split Unit in the front.

        Why wont the Tenants agree to having it at the back? Would they be turning both the Lounge and bedroom Unit at the same time? Is that one group of Tenants or two? Agree with Bargs, it's not impossible to have it at the back.

        Also concur with Chandler, find out what your neighbour downstairs has done….

  • You don't actually own that wall. Anything outside of your unit is considered common property.

    • Yes, I understand that. As I said, the plan for a window mounted would not be affixed to the wall, it sits about 25% in my window cavity and about 75% out.

      • +2

        Then 75% of it would be on common property. I wouldn't bother to fight it, I doubt you would win. I agree with the body corporate they are ugly and noisy. Save your money up and do what they suggest. In the meantime perhaps install ceiling fans.

    • not always the case and depends how the strata is setup. At my last strata we owned the outside walls.

      • Freestanding / townhouses?

        Would be bizarre for units to have individual ownership of external walls as it would make getting painting done etc a nightmare.

  • +4
    • Not bad, I doubt they'd go for it but worth a shot.

      • I think this is a great compromise, they started negotiations with asking you to outlay $4k, you respond by offering to spend $400 on an aesthetic camouflage device.

    • Some interesting ideas there.

    • Be sure to check manufacturer’s recommendation for minimum clearences - you don’t want to block the air flow.

    • +2

      Hi mate,
      I am a chair in a body corporate, and we have had these issues coming around quite often.

      I recommend you follow this suggestion. Propose the option of camouflage to the BC and suggest that the committee approve a standard for the building.

      Make sure you propose a camouflage that is easy to get and is from a local manufacturer / supplier so the BC will be satisfied that future owners will have access to it.

      Good luck

      • +1

        And if I may also add…. these matters are very bureaucratic, so you need to approach it intelligently.
        Point out that window mounted A/C units are LESS efficient, thus are WORSE for the environment, and that they pose a bigger DANGER in fixture. Sway the argument towards the "moral choice" to make is to use a proper/standard Air Conditioning. And if they go full-Armageddon on you, telling you that it is not possible for you to have Air Conditioning at all, tell them that you want to formally record their response so in the future when someone suffers a medical emergency due to heat/stress, that they become legally responsible for the incident including medical bills and other associated costs.

        Put a structured argument in such a way that they eventually come to agree with you.
        If that fails; bikies.

  • Remember the owners corp only represents the owners interests.
    Some people live in a small block of units/flats/whatever, with a small number of owners. If you can get a special resolution passed that says you can do it, then that's another way to get around their rules.

    The more owners there are the more work there is for you to convince everyone.

    • Thanks Bohn, I believe the rejection came after they emailed the other 7 owners so probably no luck there.

  • +1

    I got one of the Kogan portable AC units last summer, and find it works very well. It's reasonably noisy (But I'd imagine most window-mounted units are also loud). I usually use it in my main bedroom which is almost the size of your living room, but have also used it to cool down my double garage (6m x 7m) to a fairly cool temp. I wouldn't rule out a portable unit

    • +1

      Would you mind post the link or basic information? As I am eyeing on the portable AC.

      • +2

        The one I got about a year ago was this one:

        https://www.kogan.com/au/buy/kogan-41kw-portable-air-conditi…

        They have a few either side of the power rating, but when I ordered, this one came with free delivery so I went with that one.

        Interestingly, the guy who delivered it said that he was also the one who picked them up if they got any returns, and that he'd only picked up a handful despite delivering hundreds of them. I wouldn't use it as a definitive quality review, but it was somewhat reassuring.

        • I wanted that one too, but they were out of stock at the time I needed it. Got one from Bunnings instead.

          Have you tried the heat mode? Any good?

          • +1

            @John Kimble: No, sorry never used the heater. We’ve got in-slab heating so have never used this unit for anything but cooling.

            • @geech: Fair enough, but personally I would have tried it at least once to make sure it works ha

    • +1

      That's very surprising experience. I had the aldi one for couple of years and it was next to useless, it did cool down temperatures but with extremely poor thermal efficiency 😢. Taking probably 2 hour to get down to acceptable temperature (circa 30 degree while ambient temperatures was around 35) and the unit pretty much ran at full 10A load until well past midnight when outside temperature went below 25 and then switched between ramp up/idling mode that would made you losing sleep to the point turning the damn thing off. The only persons not bothering with those noise were my kids so we pretty much only used it on really hot day (above 35) to keep kids room cool to acceptable level for sleeping.
      Switched to split unit last year and it was like having a Bugatti. Room cooled in 15min,almost no noise and power consumption a fraction of the old falcon

      • Agree, in general they are pretty inefficient and way too noisy to sleep next to compared to a split system, but sometimes there are no other options.

  • +1

    It’s really pitty that the the body corporate wont let you install a proper ac. My neighbours upstairs have a window mounted one. We can hear the compressor noise at night, so you might get complaints about that, however it depends of the unit and how well you do the installation. If I was you, I would read the strata management act as well as your bylaws and look how you can get this done legally. They shouldn’t make you go into excessive expenses only to satisfy someone’s visual requirements. See if you can claim medical reasons to have a proper ac installed. I had a standalone portable one once, it was noisy and useless and it was one of the best ones out there. You can threaten the body corporate to take them to the tribunal if they are unreasonable in dealing with your request, but check the legalities first.

    • +1

      It’s really pitty that the the body corporate wont let you install a proper ac.

      It's certainly not a pity that the body corp has reasonable rules and enforces them. Is it unfortunate for OP? Sure, but that's OP's problem (to be blunt) and I don't think OP should be able to make it anyone else's problem.

      • +1

        Let's put it this way: if the body corporate had a majority of people like me, the op wouldn't have a problem. It's so unreasonable when people put their visual preferences before someone's wellbeing.

        • +1

          Oh please, OP has lived this long without an air-con, this isn't affecting anyone's well-being. And if the body corp had a majority of people like you, the values of the properties there would've plummeted because you'd bend-over for any and all requests so long as the person asking made puppy faces at you, until the building looked like a fun-house.

          Be glad most people aren't like you.

          • @HighAndDry: How do you know he hasn't just moved in, or moved in during autumn or winter? Do you think he has lived his whole life in this apartment?

            • -2

              @Quantumcat:

              How do you know he hasn't just moved in

              I don't. I assume OP isn't so unreasonable they'd buy a property and move-in while assuming they didn't have to abide by the same by-laws as everyone else and doing their due-diligence regarding potentially installing an air-con before buying.

              To be fair to OP - they're not actually saying anything about wanting to skirt by the by-laws, it's the unreasonable people in the comments who are.

    • +4

      It’s really pitty that the the body corporate wont let you install a proper ac.

      But they WILL let the OP install a proper AC, it just has to be roof mounted.

    • +1

      To be honest, it might not be just the visual. The aircond is mounted above a driveway, possibly a walkway as well. If anything's wrong with the mounting someday in the future, and it falls, there are chances it might damage someone's car, worse cause some injuries.

      I might vote no as well, as there are better options, it's just that OP has to pay more. That's part of the problem living in a community, you do need to think about other people.

      • Barring a freak accident, there should be no reason for it to fall if installed correctly. You could say that about anything.

      • +1

        She'll be right just don't let Happy Gilmore fix your AC lol.

        https://youtu.be/TxW3VRJznaI

        • You know that mister mister lady? I think I just killed her

  • +2

    I assume that nothing has changed in regard to your apartment since you purchased it, in that aircon was not already installed.

    I don't intend to be harsh, but in buying a strata apartment the purchaser should consider what changes / improvements they may want to do, assess what those impacts may be on others in the strata, and how likely it would be to convince other strata unit holders to approve the change.

  • You'd have a better chance mounting it under the window corner with a beige facade and pipes coming up.
    It didn't seem to bother them external coax cable without conduit running down the pier. tell them you'll cover that up as well with the pipes.

  • +10

    Another reason not to live in an apartment…

  • Do you think I have to seek permission from body corp as this is effectively hanging out of my own window

    If they are blocking you already for having eye-sores, I think you will find this will be the same.

  • +3

    I'm surprised that you are being rejected on the grounds of visual impact.

    not to be rude but it seems like the building itself is old and what sort of visual character of the building are they trying to preserve. the people living in your block are being unreasonable and agree with @loropy9.putting someones visual preference over a fellow human beings health is just plain rude.

    • You are probably correct but it doesn't matter (unless you are a unit holder in that specific strata title).
      The group of owners (who may or may not be residents) have the votes.

      A few people have mentioned health. I think this unit is in Melbourne. Yes, it gets hot in summer. And then it usually cools down. Melbourne has the same or similar weather that it always had, even when the block of units was built.

    • +4

      Can I point out how ridiculous it is that people are jumping on this "omg health and well-being" argument when OP has mentioned utterly nothing of the sort?

      Were people just dropping dead left and right before air-cons were invented? (Not to mention - OP has other options even for air-con).

      Hyperbolic much? This is why noone takes you people seriously.

      • -1

        Yet another aggressive and poorly thought out argument from you highanddry…

        The definition of well-being isn't "surviving". The fact people have lived without them is irrelevant. People live with no end of things that aren't essential for survival yet contribute to a happier life. Not to mention that exact same argument can be used in reverse.

        No offense to anyone who lives there, but that building looks pretty ugly… A well covered AC unit won't affect the visual appeal at all.

        • +1

          OP hasn't mentioned anything about "well-being". You're literally right now arguing that OP needs you to tell them what to think and feel. Yah. Great "argument". Also - OP can install an air-con unit, they'll just have to pay more because their unit is less suited to installing one in a way that doesn't breach the by-laws.

          You're at once saying: Other people's convenience and by-laws aren't as important as OP's "well-being", but apparently OP's money is more important than their own well-being. Again, great argument.

    • Jaywalking should be allowed so I don't have to stay in the hot/cold. How rude of drivers who are sitting in the comfort of their cars to want the rules enforced when I'm uncomfortably trying to get across an 8 lane freeway.

      How rude that I cannot just dump bags of trash in the northern suburbs of Melbourne. What visual character are they trying to preserve that's more important than removing trash from my living quarters.

  • +1

    What about an air-conditioner where you just stick a pipe out of the window?

    • I was going to suggest this. You can get a hole cut in the window with a cover.

    • That would be a portable unit that they already stated they wanted to avoid

      • Oh I see, wasn't sure on the terminology

      • i think you can do the same for window cassette type

        just put indoor and make an airtight duct out to window

  • Intresting they asked you to roof mount it are you the on the top level?

  • Thanks for all the help guys, I have been in the place for about 8 months. The last summer, it got unbearably hot; hence my desire to get this in place asap.

    I will have a look at Portal air conditioners meanwhile. Body corporate responded with a somewhat hopeful email I will follow up on:

    Thank you for your email.

    Unfortunately there is nothing further that we can do as the OC has voted against installation on the exterior of the building apart from the roof.

    The window mount is still common property and would alter the outward appearance of the building.

    Really your only option would be to take the OC to VCAT over their decision and you may have a very good case.

    • +1

      Really your only option would be to take the OC to VCAT over their decision and you may have a very good case.

      The body corp managers are trying to do you a solid, and VCAT is mostly free other than time and effort - not a bad idea. Just as basic prep, take photos of other units' air-con units and how they're installed.

    • +3

      I would carefully consider taking this to VCAT.
      Not because you may lose, you may win.

      But, you can be sure that the body corporate managing agent will charge their fees for their involvement.

      And, regardless of the outcome, you will still have the same neighbours.

      • +1

        I don't recommend OP taking this through the VCAT process all the way. Even if it's completely free money-wise (I'm pretty sure it's not), I'd be leery of the time and effort involved.

        I hadn't thought about the possibility the body corp might be egging OP on to charge more fees but it's certainly possible. They definitely get to charge money for any VCAT matters.

        I read it as the body corp managers subtly telling OP that if they took it to VCAT, the owners should cave pretty easily so go for it.

        • Doubt the body corporate can make the OP bears all of that charge. It will be shared by all the units.

          • +2

            @Love a bargain: Oh yeah, OP won't bear the manager's charges themselves - but the manager won't care where the money comes from (if they're being that shifty), they're still getting paid.

      • -2

        If your neighbours hold a grudge after that, then you might wanna consider moving cause they don't sounds like the reasonable kind of people to be around.

        • +1

          For the last time, there's nothing unreasonable about expecting OP to abide by the same by-laws as everyone else.

          • @HighAndDry: but to allow everyone else, but not OP, in the building to install an air-con the cost effective way is unfair and selfish

            each to their own. maybe you can trade places with OP

            • +4

              @Love a bargain: Everyone else has a place to install the air-con that doesn't breach the by-laws. OP chose to buy this unit in particular.

              • -1

                @HighAndDry: Nobody had anywhere to install an air-con that didn't require special approval. Everyone else got the approval except for the OP.

                OP probably, and quite reasonably, bought the unit thinking that if the BC gave permission to everyone else to install a AC, they would give me permission to do the same too.

                • +2

                  @Love a bargain: Seriously, have you ever lived in an apartment or even flipped through by-laws? "Visible from a public area" is a consideration for almost any change (or even action) that affects common property. This isn't a special case - OP just brought a unit that was more visible from the street. Other units aren't as visible from the street, and so applying the exact same by-laws in exactly the same way will lead to different outcomes.

                  • @HighAndDry: It's a factor but it doesn't mean anything that can be seen from the outside are automatically be disallowed. (I've lost count of how many times people have been given permission to put shades/ pergola/ other structures/ even air-con compressors etc that are visible from the outside - on their terraces/ balconies.) Ultimately, it's a decisions made by a bunch of people.

                    You're entitled to your opinion and so am I.

                    • @Love a bargain:

                      It's a factor but it doesn't mean anything that can be seen from the outside are automatically be disallowed.

                      Of course not. Which is why I think the suggestions by people to see if the body corp would allow it if it's vaguely camouflaged are good ideas and I haven't said anything against those.

          • -1

            @HighAndDry: So you're stating that laws are perfect, sacrosanct and should never be able to be questioned?

            • +1

              @callum9999: Almost textbook strawman. Even you can do better than that, Callum, surely?

  • Is it a tile or tin roof?

  • +1

    If you really do find the heat unbearable just stump up the cash and roof mount it.

  • +1

    Portable AC are crap. By window mount I assume you mean all in one box types, they are noisy and ugly, but very cheap to buy.

    Honestly stratas are toothless tigers, If you want to do something there is very little they can do to stop you other than send you a strongly worded letter. I would just install it.

  • I have a window air con and it works fine. It doesn't consume a lot of electricity but would still manage to keep my living room cooler or warmer. I also have a portable air conditioner in one of my other rooms and it does a great job of cooling/heating the room. Get something with a bigger BTU if the room is bigger. The power consumption is probably the same as a split system depending on the size and the noise levels are manageable

  • +3

    Thanks for reminding me never to purchase an apartment.

    Portable units work, they're just noisy.

    I'd probably sell to an airbnb owner (out of spite) and move on.

    • -1

      never to purchase an apartment/car without working air con :)

      • never to purchase an apartment/car without working air con :)

        In this case it's aircon, who knows what else could be overlooked. Maybe I'll want something in the future and my request will be denied.

        A conveyancer I used to know warned me never to buy an apartment for reasons like this.

        • Doesn't need to be unit, you can have house with body corp. Just try to avoid anything with body corp as you have to bind by the rules.

  • Do you have any balconies?

  • +3

    I think you should pay to have it installed on the roof. I know it is more expensive, but it is the best place for it - and perhaps the only place you’ll be allowed to put it anyway. At least it will be done well and properly.

    • +1

      Consider this. Place will probably have better resale value too

  • If it's not allowed facing the driveway it's definitely not allowed outside a window. Don't do it without permission because you will end up removing it.

  • btw how much was the non-roof mounted option ? Just interested in seeing the price difference

  • +9

    With all due respect, your apartment block hardly has the aesthetic glory of the Hanging Gardens of Babylon. Not even a quaint and historic Edwardian facade.

    So, really, it is the 'visual beauty' of the 1960's six-pack of flats that is being called into question. And it's just a bunch of obnoxious twats (all of whom have their own (lower cost) air-conditioned comfort), who want to deny such comfort to you.

    The strata by-laws are hardly the inscribed Word of God, handed down on stone tablets to Moses. They are tin-pot (probably largely-unenforceable) rules that busybody little would-be Napoleons obsess over, just so they can boost their own small egos at the expense of others.

    I would install Kramer's Commando 8 and damn the consequences.

    After a round of "tut-tuts" from your hypocrite neighbours, and a letter from the strata management, you can reply saying it was vital for your health. This is, in fact true. As by now your mental health is at jeopardy. But even simpler would be a letter from your GP stating that due to allergy/headaches/exhaustion/whatever, having an air conditioned room would be beneficial during the (increasingly longer) Australian summer. There's no lie. No fabrication here. And the letter doesn't buy into body corporate politics. It could be vague enough that a doctor would have no problem writing it, but also 'medically scary' enough to do its purpose.

    Armed with this you can just tell strata management that you have a legitimate medical reason for the egregious eyesore you have installed. And that you are quite happy to proceed to your state's relevant administrative tribunal should it be necessary.

    I can imagine, although still maybe not agree, that if your apartment block was a pristine example of 1890's Art Nouveau architecture, that was widely cited and admired throughout the known world, or that if it was perhaps the lovingly restored birthplace of a much-loved and sainted philanthropist/scientist/baby-saving surgeon, or that if the glorious parking-lot facing wall displayed precious revolutionary graffiti from our great war of independence from oppression, then perhaps in those circumstances politely requesting you to not further impinge on the importance and the beauty of your apartment's wall may almost be justifiable.

    But this is not the case. It's a six-pack. (Or eight, in your case.)

    Build it. The very worst that would happen is that months/years in the future a judgement at a tribunal may go against you, and you'd have to remove it. Very low probability. And even then you would have had both beautiful cool air for that period, as well as some resale value.

    *** Note: Not. Legal. Advice. (More like… sympathetic frustration venting.)

    • +4

      Blah blah blah blah you realise the body-corp has said OP can install an air-con, just in a more expensive way? Pray tell how spending slightly more money will apparently ruin OP's health and well-being.

      • +3

        Because OP's health and well being is tied to his ability to bargain/spend less money, like all OZB members.

  • +1

    Install ceiling fans throughout and get a good portable a/c unit.

    Yes portable units work well but you need a powerful one - 14,000 btu

    I have one so I well know. Perfect for cooling a large room but rather noisy.

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