ISPs with a Commitment to No Discretionary Censorship

puyo on 20/03/2019 - 14:34

Hey,

Just found out Telstra, Optus, Vodafone and TPG have started blocking some websites using their own discretion. I'm wondering if anyone has seen, or possibly any smaller ISP reps exist here on OZB, any ISP make a statement they wouldn't selectively block any website beyond an official government list. Usually I'd go check the threads on Whirlpool for this sort of thing, but Simon Wright seems to be going around locking all the threads discussing it.

Some quotes:

Telstra released a statement in which Networks and IT Executive Nikos Katinakis explained, “We understand this may inconvenience some legitimate users of these sites, but these are extreme circumstances, and we feel this is the right thing to do.”

A spokesperson for Vodafone said that the company would only usually block access to a site on the request of law enforcement or the courts, but that this “was an extreme case which we think requires an extraordinary response… While there were discussions at an industry level about this issue, this is a decision Vodafone Australia came to independently,” the statement said. Optus said it made its decision after “reflecting on community expectations.”

I'm aware that I could use an alternate DNS or VPN to bypass these blocks, and I'm sure the people seeking the content in question will go ahead and do just that. Really just looking for an ISP that isn't going to block access depending on what they feel is the "right thing to do".

I'm also aware I can (and will) contact ISPs myself to ask them myself, as well as complain to my own - however I see OZB as a useful tool for crowd sourced discussion on lawful consumer options, so hopefully this doesn't get wiped here too.

Cheers

Internet

Comments

      • wyrmy on 22/03/2019 - 09:24

        You realise he is still alive right?

    • Baysew on 21/03/2019 - 13:11

      He wasnt even an Aussie

      As reported from your source -

      Australian…

    • brendanm on 21/03/2019 - 18:14
      +3

      He's from Grafton, I know someone that went to school with him. The song is a Serbian song denigrating Muslims. Nothing to do with him being Serbian.

  • Jabba the Hutt on 21/03/2019 - 12:52

    What about mobile data? All three networks (Telstra, Optus, Vodafone) imposed blocks, and the smaller players that piggyback off them were reportedly affected as well. That leaves no 'market solution' aka 'voting with your wallet', other than refraining from mobile telephony altogether.

    • OzBarAnon on 21/03/2019 - 15:46

      Only solution i can think of easily is getting a VPN on your mobile. Market is smaller than the wide range available on desktop, but it's there

  • DiscoJango on 21/03/2019 - 13:46

    Rate my poo

  • ipiok on 21/03/2019 - 14:30

    rate my bed

  • pformag on 21/03/2019 - 15:13

    It is ISP level, so change your DNS settings to google or IBN. Then you can see the websites.

    • OzBarAnon on 21/03/2019 - 15:47
      +1

      On Optus and it doesn't work because apparently Optus has implemented the DNS configs through the router itself. Not sure about Vodafone and Telstra

      • bugsucher on 22/03/2019 - 21:35

        Change your host level DNS settings.

        • OzBarAnon on 22/03/2019 - 21:45

          Set them to the Google DNS and no luck. Everything still blocked. Flushed DNS cache too

          • brendanm on 22/03/2019 - 22:03
            +1

            @OzBarAnon: Buy another router. Use a VPN. Dump Optus.

          • bugsucher on 22/03/2019 - 22:05
            +1

            @OzBarAnon: It seems that the IP addresses and/or hostname are also blocked (just verified with my own Optus connection). This is different to DNS blocking, and has nothing to do with the router DNS config.
            In this case, you'll have to use a proxy / VPN or a different ISP. :)

  • This Guy on 21/03/2019 - 15:26
    +14

    I believe Telstra should go all the way and block Facebook. From what I understand, some of the sites Telstra is blocking published or privately shared the video between 1 to 300 times.

    Facebook was the source of the video. No one on Facebook reported the live stream. Facebook published the video 300,000 times in the first 24 hours (1.5 million uploads, 1.2 million blocked on upload equals 300,000 copies published). I heard one commentator speculate that 50 million people viewed that video on Facebook. Block Facebook.

    I believe Telstra should block Youtube. I found it ridiculously easy to find that video on Youtube in the first 24 hours. The links I found all had 10's of thousands of views. I am sure it would be just as easy to find it now (I really don't want to). Block Youtube.

    I believe if Telstra wants to continue to associate it's self with two major hosts of this terrorist video, it is Telstra's business. I believe blocking the sites listed is just a facade to make Telstra seem socially responsible.

    • MessyG on 21/03/2019 - 20:16

      I think who they're choosing to block is based on the specific websites attitude toward moderating their own content.

      • This Guy on 22/03/2019 - 01:47
        +2

        I disagree.

        Telstra has chosen sites with both a poor reputation or objectionable name with a low user base. Telstra would partner with many NZ companies and needs to be shown to be doing something to keep these business relationships ongoing.

        To counter your argument:

        Liveleak had the video blocked well before Youtube and Facebook. This video even violates Liveleak's terms or service.

        The other blocked sites I know of are chat boards, not video hosts like Facebook, Liveleak and Youtube. I doubt any of the chat on these blocked boards was near the worst of what you can find on Facebook.

        If Facebook was serious about fixing their toxic communities they would work on diversifying the ideas presented to users instead of locking them in idea bubbles.

        Youtube has it's own series of issues, like time stamping availability on videos with children.

        Liveleak just shows a variety of traditionally hidden videos, including industrial incidents and traffic accidents. These videos are often available on both Youtube and Facebook, with Facebook often being the source of the video

  • babablack on 21/03/2019 - 16:29
    +1

    im using aussie BB all are unlocked even warez-bb.org

  • ozbjunkie on 21/03/2019 - 17:25
    +1

    TPG blocks many torrent sites, so I hear.

    I also hear you just use opera browsers built in VPN and it all works fine.

    I hear lots of things.

    • D6C1 on 22/03/2019 - 13:04

      hear lots of things.

      I also hear that there's medication to help.

    • bert-lifts on 22/03/2019 - 13:08

      I hear it's a crappy DNS block which is extremely easy to get around with cloudflare or google DNS.

    • Thaal Sinestro on 23/03/2019 - 02:28
      +1

      Yes, all piracy sites have a DNS block on TPG, except for the really new ones. The Aussie government does everything big business tells it to. It doesn't take much to bribe an Australian official.

  • hunterhalo on 21/03/2019 - 18:01

    People keep talking that optus router doesn't allow changing dns, why not buy another router? Cuz my contract with dodo about to finish and I'm thinking about switch to optus

    • knk on 21/03/2019 - 18:57
      +2

      The routers most ISPs give you are trash anyway.

    • bugsucher on 22/03/2019 - 21:38
      +1

      You don't have to use the DNS setting given by your router. People keep talking because they don't know how it works.

  • brendanm on 21/03/2019 - 18:16

    Aussie don't block, and I'm pretty sure Phil has stated a number of times that they will not do this.

  • Captain M on 21/03/2019 - 19:54

    Just use a Raspberry PI with Pi-hole as your own DNS server. https://pi-hole.net/
    Problem solved. You get ad blocking thrown in. If you use 1.1.1.1 as the upstream DNS then your queries won't be logged, so its more private.

  • meowsers on 21/03/2019 - 19:58

    Anyone have any luck canceling their contract or securing a concession from Telstra for this?

  • luffyex2010 on 22/03/2019 - 09:27

    Wait until Game Thrones season 8 and one punch man season 2 comes out in April, Australia piracy rate will be back on track lol

  • Dack Smith on 22/03/2019 - 13:56
    +2

    Who would have thought the so called free country called Australia would put up the great firewall of noob censorship.

    I had no idea we lived in a totalitarian state ?

    I guess this is called Australian democracy…..and dumb people have the gall to criticize China lol

    Morons

    • bugsucher on 22/03/2019 - 21:41

      This is called 'double standard'. It happens all the time.

    • brendanm on 22/03/2019 - 22:07

      Correct, people laugh at the censorship of China and North Korea, yet are happy to be censored. Eurasia was always at war with eastasia, and noone can say any different as we aren't allowed to discuss it.

  • MementoMori on 22/03/2019 - 14:14
    +2

    Gee, I wonder why ISPs are practicing their indiscriminate, illegal blocking of sites?

    It's almost like there is a huge narrative war about to take place… FISA abuse scandal, OIG report, huge arrests in Washington DC…

    • brendanm on 22/03/2019 - 22:08

      Look away please, nothing to see here…

  • [Deactivated] on 22/03/2019 - 20:53

    Telstra blocked ZeroHedge for a day or two.

    Very big brother to block these alternative news sites. I read sites like ZH, not that I agree with Trumpism or the neo-con agenda but because it provides another view point.

    The block was easily by-passed, but thats not the point

    I (don't) wonder why Sky didn't get blocked?

  • Cave Fire on 23/03/2019 - 01:43
    +1

    So apparently Scott Morrison had a 'meeting' with the ISP's before this happened. It's straight out of the Liberal/neo-con playbook. Same thing happened after 9/11. They have to be seen as doing something. I wonder if they know what 4chan actually hosts… if they did, they would probably realise how misplaced this is.

    • Speckled Jim on 25/03/2019 - 09:24
      +1

      Aussie Clusterf*ck Grill:

      1. 1 cup Bill of rights
      2. 2 Tbsp Crisis-management
      3. 1 cup distraction
      4. 1 tsp Knee-Jerky
      5. 1 cup Societal division

      Method: Combine ingredients using the smuggest smirk-faced tool available. Employ Whack-a-mole technique until flavour of political career has soured.

      Process time: Indefinite. Keep conga-line moving to avoid revolution.

  • cosmos on 23/03/2019 - 08:17
    -2

    If the ISPs are blocking the websites to block Christchurch attack video, then for me there is no problem, the block is okay. By the way, I t’s not just the ISPs will to block the site, is mostly also echoed by others too.

    If you want to access the site, use other means that you may know.

    • brendanm on 23/03/2019 - 13:55
      +1

      Viewing the video is not illegal, there is no legal basis for the block. People sure love throwing away their rights…

  • epicttiimm on 23/03/2019 - 16:53

    1.1.1.1

  • Godric on 24/03/2019 - 16:27

    They blocked liveleak, 4chan for sharing same images fb and yt did

  • JPerez on 24/03/2019 - 19:17

    Use DNS servers from this list:

    https://www.quora.com/What-are-some-uncensored-DNS-servers?s…

  • Xetrok on 25/03/2019 - 19:33
    +1

    Now that ISP's have the ability and self imposed accountability to block content they deem inappropriate, would they then no longer be exempt as a carriage provider for copyright infringement as they are not minimising damage to affected parties?

    From a contractual perspective, I'm interested to know what provisions that allows them to do this and what notification period they need to provide for non-legislative changes. I didn't sign up for a service that allows my ISP to block what they want willy nilly.

    It's very much setting a precedent for the future of net neutrality. You want access to lifestyle websites - that's going to be a $5 add-on. Entertainment website - $10 add-on.

  • meowsers on 05/04/2019 - 17:46

    Contacted Telstra. Was let out of my contract early with no charge because I complained….

    However the official contract states the following: (which is arguably still wrong and anti-freespeech, and you could argue I was not generating material)

    Content on information services
    2.11 We are not responsible for the content of information services provided by third parties. We are under no obligation to monitor or censor the material generated by users of information services, although we may do so.

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