Should I Stay or Should I Go? (Got a Job Offer from Opposition Company)

kelkel108 on 10/04/2019 - 09:08
Last edited 12/04/2019 - 09:22 by 1 other user

I am currently in a dead end job, I recently got a job offer from an opposition company for a different role, which might lead to more opportunities in the future. But the salary is cut by 6k

Current Company Pros:
- Good direct manager, with good team to work with
- More pay, and might be able to ask for pay rise
Current Company Cons:
- Upper management sucks
- Management would never let me leave my role

New Company Pros:
- Different job, different department, less stress (I have a mate working there in a similar role, he also worked for my current company before and he says management is so much better, and the company is much more structured)
- Might be able to enter other opportunities within the company (if it arise)
New Company Cons:
- Slightly less pay
- From talk of the industry they haven't had a pay rise in 7 years (not sure how accurate this is)

EDIT:
Follow up question, if I was to change jobs, the upper management would want to have a meeting with me. I am planning to tell them I don't want to do what I'm doing now, and I found new opportunities elsewhere within the industry. I want to try and not tell them which company I am going because, I have a few colleagues that have tried to change company and upper management would try and sabotage the offer by contacting the opposition company.

How should I ask their questions if they were to ask where I am going and what opportunities I have found?

Poll Options

  • 7
    Stay!
  • 60
    Leave!
Education & Work

Comments

  • crashloaded on 10/04/2019 - 09:13
    +5

    Less stress is always the biggest pro for me. Money can't take stress away.

    • cypher67 on 10/04/2019 - 09:21
      +8

      What if you are under financial stress?

      • crashloaded on 10/04/2019 - 09:24
        +6

        Don't spend beyond your means. Financial stress can come from earning more and maintaining a lifestyle. Financial stress is easily avoidable imo, in op's case anyway.

      • kelkel108 on 10/04/2019 - 09:34

        Not really under financial stress, but expecting a baby later in the year

        • Love a bargain on 10/04/2019 - 12:30
          +7

          then you should factor in the amount of quality time you'll have available to spend with the family

  • trustnoone on 10/04/2019 - 09:29
    +2

    It kind of depends on what the salary is, 6k pay cut might mean a lot less when you start to get tax and stuff involved it might really only be a 4k paycut. Stress is a big one for me, I'd rather more relaxed then money but again that assumes I can still live comfortably with the salary. The no pay rise is a bit of a worry, it sounds a bit like you're going from one place with no growth to another place where you don't get to grow?

    Might be worth asking for a bit higher pay? Depending on place.

    • kelkel108 on 10/04/2019 - 09:35

      It is from roughly 87k-81k plus super

      I'm not sure if I can ask for higher pay, since I don't really have experience in this role, I only have experience in the industry

      • Love a bargain on 10/04/2019 - 12:28

        Show you interest but gently suggest that the pay cut is making it hard to commit

      • pjcook on 11/04/2019 - 09:14
        +1

        Did you tell them your current pay? Ask them what they have to offer that makes it worth you taking a pay cut? I have always expected a pay increase, if an offer was below my current package I would ask for a higher offer, explaining that I am not willing to take a pay cut. This is your best opportunity to do so because all companies understand that you will negotiate yourself at the hiring stage.

        Also, I can pretty much guarantee you will not get pay rises without learning to negotiate your expectations.

  • Some Human on 10/04/2019 - 09:31

    Which one is closer to commute to?

    • kelkel108 on 10/04/2019 - 09:33
      +1

      New company - from 25km drive to 13-14km

      • abb on 10/04/2019 - 10:56
        +4

        In the city? That's worth at least $10k

        • kelkel108 on 10/04/2019 - 10:57

          In Sydney, outer west area

          • Some Human on 10/04/2019 - 11:27

            @kelkel108: I would definately factor that in

          • abb on 10/04/2019 - 12:02

            @kelkel108: How many minutes per day does the shorter commute give you?

  • altomic on 10/04/2019 - 09:36

    how long have you been in your current role?
    approx how old are you?

    • kelkel108 on 10/04/2019 - 10:01

      28 this year, a bit less than 4 years

  • MeesusEff on 10/04/2019 - 09:50
    +2

    Better commute, future opportunities. That $6k paycut = $115ish p/w less, I would say that it is worth it for a job with less stress as well.

  • dcep on 10/04/2019 - 10:04
    +8

    ask them to match current pay

    • [Deactivated] on 10/04/2019 - 10:18
      +3

      Agree, any job offers should match with your current pay as minimum requirement, unless its a industry change.

  • Ocker on 10/04/2019 - 10:19

    To ask the question means you obviously have reservations about accepting the new job? Just go with your gut feeling

  • Orpheon on 10/04/2019 - 10:23
    +12

    Took a pay cut for a job with more flexibility / work at home opportunities and much better management, I cannot tell you how much it has improved my mental outlook and relationship with my family.

    At my previous work, it didn't feel like I was paid for the shit they were putting me through:

    • Helicopter micro-management
    • Complete lack of direction in projects
    • No regard for process feedback or huge red flags ignored by upper management, later leaving them to wonder where they went wrong
    • Consistent abuse if you didn't rock up at work at 7am like the rest of team

    I remember waking up absolutely dreading going to work, that there is a sign in itself. Now, it's much more laid back - I'm not worried, I am happier, and I am more productive. The work I do has direct and meaningful impact in a way I both understand and can actively make better every day.

    Money will come, don't underestimate the value of time and the ability to be flexible: that's priceless.

    • kelkel108 on 10/04/2019 - 10:27

      Wow, sorry to hear about your previous workplace, but I can only relate to the second and third dot point, I currently have reservations about accepting the new job because of my direct manager, he is very good to me and doesn't micro-management me. I pretty much stayed in this company for 4 years just because of him.

      Thanks for the advise

      • Love a bargain on 10/04/2019 - 12:13
        +3

        Just spare a minute to consider what if your direct manager leaves and you're stuck in your current company

        • shortblack9 on 11/04/2019 - 10:58
          +1

          This happened to me… loyalty to a manager is not worth it. The company doesn't care about you.

  • Topdog on 10/04/2019 - 10:24
    +7

    Sometimes, (I know this from experience) You need to take a pay-cut, to better yourself, which in turn leads to more pay in the future, better job, and more experience.

  • [Deactivated] on 10/04/2019 - 10:26
    +1

    But the salary is cut by 6k

    If my disposable income (sans tax, mortgage, food, enecoins) is $60k, I'll be willing to part with 10% of that.

    If my disposable income is $6k, that decision is going to be extremely difficult.

    If my disposable income is <$6k, that decision is going to be very easy.

  • [Deactivated] on 10/04/2019 - 10:44
    +1

    Brexit.

  • myusername on 10/04/2019 - 10:55

    go where the money is

    • [Deactivated] on 10/04/2019 - 11:01
      +2

      Those alleys are very dark.

      • myusername on 10/04/2019 - 11:02

        everything is dark at 3am

        • [Deactivated] on 10/04/2019 - 11:02
          +2

          Certain streets are bright. Lots of red neon lights.

  • Chewiebacca on 10/04/2019 - 10:57
    +5

    which might lead to more opportunities in the future

    Switching jobs is usually the opportunity people takee to re-kickstart their career progression when your current workplace isn't willing/able to provide.

    I highly recommend against taking a pay cut, unless you were being overpaid in the first place, or going through a career/industry change. I'd be asking for 10% more than what you are being paid at the moment, if you're worth it to them 10-20% difference is absolutely minimal given you should be closing out that gap fairly quickly at a pay review.

    Don't underestimate the pay-cut, it can do a lot to demoralise you given you already have higher price tag on your skills, good luck.

  • psyren89 on 10/04/2019 - 11:06
    +2

    Go where you'll be happier, but do check that your current contract doesn't forbid you to work with competitors.

    • brad1-8tsi on 10/04/2019 - 12:34
      +1

      That's Restraint of Trade and has to be a reasonable basis, especially for PAYG employees that haven't got skin in the game.

      I've had 3 contracts where I've shown them to my solicitor (who is a mate and works for the cost of a meal and beers) and he's crossed them out as "unreasonable for the seniority level of employment". In all 3 cases the employer pretended they'd made a mistake in the contract and accepted the changes.

      • brendanb on 11/04/2019 - 12:54

        I've always been told Restrains of Trade clauses are not enforceable but the following article says otherwise. It's a good read. I like the part where they note if your position and/or duties have substantially changed since you entered your contract, the contract no longer covers you and they should have created a new one.

        https://www.madgwicks.com.au/thought-leadership/restraints-o…

        As a computer programmer, I've let this clause slide but I will be more careful in future to have this removed just in case. Too many companies think they can "own" you and your skills that you worked for and gained elsewhere just by hiring you.

        As mentioned in the article, the Restraint must be justified and tailored to the position and level of the employee and should clearly describe the type of work restrained, not just time and distance from employment. I had 3 different cascading times/distances supposedly in case one or two were deemed too restrictive, they hope the last will be allowed.

        If they insist on its inclusion, I would only accept for much more extra pay in compensation for limiting my future prospects especially if offered below or close to industry average.

        • brad1-8tsi on 11/04/2019 - 15:39

          It has to be quite specific. I had one contract that said "cannot work in any engineering roll in Sydney, NSW, Australia or Asia Pacific" and the numb nuts didn't even have a presence outside Sydney. He was just a middle man. His contract was so shonky that we edited down from 15 pages to 6 and even he had a laugh in the end.

          OTOH, my ex-wifes cousin sold his muffin factory to Sarak Lee and quite rightly had a 3 year non-compete in baked pastry goods. He got bored after playing golf and game fishing for 12 months and started a cheese cake factory (non-baked pastry goods). The last time I spoke to him he was ready to take them on in court.

          My GF works in FMCG fizzy drinks. They don't have a non-compete but when somebody resigns they have to clean their desk out under supervision straight away and leave.

  • ESEMCE on 10/04/2019 - 11:19
    +8

    Negotiate with the new company to match your current pay.
    It sounds like the only negative and if they truly want you, $6k is nothing to them.

    Definitely do not tell your current employer where you are going to.
    Definitely do tell them you're considering an offer for a new job.

    • Indiana1501 on 11/04/2019 - 12:25

      Definitely do not tell your current employer where you are going to.

      Exactly! There is no law that says you must tell your current employer where you are going OR you are thinking about leaving.
      Simply hand in your 4 week notice & take as many sickies as you can during that period!!!

      Negotiate your new salary too.

  • DarthAntz on 10/04/2019 - 11:22
    +2

    6k is not that much to worry about in changing a role. If the new company hasnt had a payrise in 7 years, they are due.

    Statistically, if you have been with the current company for 4 years and you're getting headhunted now, you're likely to take the offer. your current employer will show how much they value you with an offer to stay. As from a previous forum about value in the workplace, its not just about money but about your opportunities to develop and be trained. A role that keeps you valuable and learning from the best is also very important.

    OzBargain can give you some advice from experience, but do some extra research on role negotiations and what to say to your employers. there are youtube videos on the subject and books about climbing the ladder.

    • GenghisGun on 12/04/2019 - 14:20

      Recommend any books? I'd be interested to know more. Always handy. Thanks

      • DarthAntz on 12/04/2019 - 23:16
        +1

        this guy has plenty of youtube videos. I've only read 'what colour is your paracute' which is about finding a job. I'll always recommend the Robert Greene books. 48 laws of power is great in helping understand the boss-staff dynamics.

  • KaraZorEl on 10/04/2019 - 11:23
    +3

    If you are still young and don't have crushing financial obligations, always choose the experience. Money and opportunities will follow.

  • crentist on 10/04/2019 - 13:40
    +1

    I have a few colleagues that have tried to change company and upper management would try and sabotage the offer by contacting the opposition company.

    Pretty sure this is super illegal. Some companies have a policy of only providing ONLY factual info like employment dates and job title in reference letters, to avoid any risk of legal action that even positive subjective assessments opens up.

    There was an article in the last week about a 23yo child-care worker getting $238k in a defamation suit because he quit to go study, and his employer told parents that he was fired for being dishonest. Which was deemed harmful to his career, and worth a lot.

    So 3rd option: Let current co be (profanity) and work out how to prove it, sue them for sabotaging new opportunities and damaging your career, pay down at least half a property and get a small mortgage, take up part-time easygoing work, and enjoy a life with significantly reduced financial stress.

    • kelkel108 on 10/04/2019 - 13:44

      Wow, that payout is like half my mortgage, but let's hope it doesn't come to that.

  • moar bargains on 10/04/2019 - 16:01

    I was in this situation approximately 2 years ago. New job with slight pay cut, but shorter commute, more interesting and potentially better opportunities. I took the job, and I'm very glad I did! It's been fantastic, and I've grown professionally much more than I would have at the other place.

  • no user information on 11/04/2019 - 07:27

    Was in a similar situation almost 7 years back, took a 14k pay cut and a much junior position to join my current employer. Glad I made that call back then, grown so much both professionally and financially. Follow your instincts, 6K is nothing in long term. What is your job area ?

  • TightAssDude on 11/04/2019 - 07:52
    +2

    Money is like a new car… You really really want it, but when you get it, it's like Meh! after a short time. Work life / low stress is the pinnacle of success.

    PS: Winning power ball is a different ball game.

  • yadupinto on 11/04/2019 - 09:40

    never ever tell your boss which company you are joining… you are within your right not to disclose…
    if they still put pressure then share some other company name…later when you cross path with them you can always say you had multiple offers n decided to join someone else…

  • sietes on 11/04/2019 - 11:44

    "Follow up question, if I was to change jobs, the upper management would want to have a meeting with me. I am planning to tell them I don't want to do what I'm doing now, and I found new opportunities elsewhere within the industry. I want to try and not tell them which company I am going because, I have a few colleagues that have tried to change company and upper management would try and sabotage the offer by contacting the opposition company."

    This is illegal and unethical and I wouldn't want to work at a company with management that behaves this way. You do not have to tell them a thing about why you are leaving and where you are going. If they take any action against you it is "adverse action" and you should file a complaint with fair work if it affects you in any negative way.

  • sietes on 11/04/2019 - 11:47
    +1

    P.S. take a witness to any meeting like this and take notes.

    Any emails forward or BCC to a private account in case you need it as evidence in future.

    • brendanb on 11/04/2019 - 13:09

      I would also record the conversation just in case. I use "Cube ACR" on my Android phone but Voice recorder on iPhone is also fine.

      In my exit interview I was told I was being sued for $14 million by the company because they believed I had it in for the company and was going to a competitor, despite going from C++ app development to making websites. The boss was a dick and saw any software developer as a competitor. After many sleepless nights, I received a letter from their lawyer in the mail simply reminding me of my obligations under the NDA I had signed. The boss must have been disappointed he couldn't sue for damages unless there were actual damages.

      The "interview" was very threatening and incredibly stressful and caused me great mental stress. I often wish I had recorded this meeting as I would have sued them for the damage they did to me.

  • Never Pay RRP on 11/04/2019 - 15:08

    One thing you didn't mention is how you came to receive the new job offer. If they headhunted you, then they should be negotiable on salary, and you should actually ask for an increase in your salary to entice you to move. Bear in mind they don't know that you don't like the role, or are in 2 minds about it, their only motivation is to get you to join.

    If you applied and interviewed for the role, that's a bit different, and you should have been aware of the salary going into it. If that is the case, and you still went ahead, then it seems like your mind was made up initially…

    As the other commenters have noted, you don't have to tell them where you are going. However in my experience if you are a valued employee, when you tell them you are leaving (don't tell them the new salary), they will generally counter offer, and offer you more money, and perhaps try to address the issues you are having that cause your dissatisfaction.

    Good luck either way!

  • HeWhoKnows on 11/04/2019 - 19:45
    -3

    NEVER leave a job for a paycut.
    Opportunities are just a big MAYBE and nothing more.

    Unless you have an offer with MORE PAY and a better position stay with the devil you know.

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