Employer Not Paying Correct Super?

Mentallysick on 16/08/2019 - 09:22
Last edited 16/08/2019 - 09:31 by 1 other user

Any Accountants in this forum?

I am a casual worker doing shift works.

Last week I worked 32 hours which includes of 10.5 hours on Thursday, 11 hours on Saturday and 10.50 hours on Sunday. When I received my payslip, I found out that my employer paid super only on Thursday work. She basically paid only 9.5% of Thursday wages.

Does she not have to pay super on Saturday and Sunday work? Checked ATO and it says they have to pay super on ordinary hours. Saturday and Sunday work is not ordinary? This is how they have shown un payslip.

Wages and Earnings
Casual - Sunday
Casual - Saturday
Casual - Ordinary Hours

Cheers

Financial

Comments

  • o53djz7qTPY4der on 16/08/2019 - 09:29

    It could be they have a cut-off for super payments (i.e. they're done on Thursday's/Friday's).

    Perhaps ask HR?

    • Mentallysick on 16/08/2019 - 11:13

      No they are not as the pay day is monday. It is from sunday - monday.

  • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 16/08/2019 - 09:32
    +8

    What did your employer say when you asked them?

    • Mentallysick on 16/08/2019 - 11:13

      Have not asked them yet. I want to find out what the rule is first

      • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 16/08/2019 - 11:23
        +4

        Seems like an incredible waste of time when a 20 second chat with them will likely result in:
        "Not paid because…."

        Allowing you to narrow your enquiries and save yourself a lot of time.

        • HighAndDry on 16/08/2019 - 12:27
          +5

          Sometimes yes, but also sometimes no. There's value in not being the (troublesome) employee who asks about information that's publicly available, especially if the questions can be taken badly as a potential accusation.

          • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 16/08/2019 - 13:08

            @HighAndDry: Asking for clarification of a payslip in a polite manner is not being troublesome, nor is the specific answer to OP's question publicly available - as seen by the differing responses in this thread.

  • HighAndDry on 16/08/2019 - 09:46
    +2

    Wages and Earnings
    Casual - Sunday
    Casual - Saturday
    Casual - Ordinary Hours

    From that, it seems it counted Sat+Sun as overtime, since it's NOT counted in your Ordinary Hours. Easy way to check - were you paid a higher rate of pay for Sat and Sun?

    • Mentallysick on 16/08/2019 - 11:12
      +1

      yes i am paid $5.00 extra on saturday and $10.00 extra on sunday.

      I have not asked employer yet. Just want to make sure first myself what the rule is.
      That is what my assumption is as well that sat & sun is OT.

      • HighAndDry on 16/08/2019 - 11:13

        Per hour? Nice. And yeah - I'd definitely rather that than an extra 9.5% that I can't touch for 40 years.

  • pformag on 16/08/2019 - 10:24
    +2

    Phone the ATO, they are very helpful with questions like this.

    • HighAndDry on 16/08/2019 - 10:58
      +3

      Great way to magically end up not rostered.

      • pformag on 16/08/2019 - 11:25

        You don't have to give any info about the company, they can advise on what OP has mentioned on this site.

        • HighAndDry on 16/08/2019 - 11:25
          +1

          Oh - but that's just general advice OP can get from their site. I absolutely hate calling the ATO - the fastest I've been able to get through was over 30mins.

          • Baysew on 16/08/2019 - 11:29
            +7

            @HighAndDry:

            I absolutely hate calling the ATO

            But nowhere near the hate when the ATO calls you.

  • one man clan on 16/08/2019 - 11:43
    +1

    It depends on what your contract/award says, but i'd suggest that your weekend shifts aren't "overtime" (which doesn't count for super) but rather a shit allowance (which does).

    https://www.ato.gov.au/Business/Super-for-employers/How-much…

    At the very least they should probably be paying super on your base rate for saturday/sunday.

    • HighAndDry on 16/08/2019 - 12:25
      -1

      This is just… completely wrong. OP was paid a higher rate for ALL of their hours on Sat + Sun.

      From your link:

      Overtime hours – award stipulates ordinary hours to be worked and employee works additional hours for which they are paid overtime rates

      OP was being paid at OT rates, therefore it's all OT.

      And from Fairwork Australia too:

      https://www.fairwork.gov.au/pay/penalty-rates-and-allowances

      Penalty rates
      Employees often get a higher pay rate when working:

      • weekends
      • Nalar on 16/08/2019 - 12:37
        +4

        Weekend casual work is usually under a penalty rate, this is not OT. OT is when you've already fulfilled your weekly hours and do additional since OP week is only 32 hours long, I don't think is 10.5 hours + 21.5 OT. If it is it's an AWESOME contract to be on.

        Also I haven't heard of a casuals getting OT, but I only work in hospitality so maybe other industries do it?

        • HighAndDry on 16/08/2019 - 12:59
          -1

          OT is when you've already fulfilled your weekly hours

          OP is casual which generally means there are no "minimum weekly hours", only what they usually work. Anything outside those usual hours (or a bandwidth of usual hours). You're right though, it's still possible the weekend hours would be counted as ordinary time earnings, but a quick look at the award says there's no penalty rates for Saturdays, so if OP is being paid extra, that'd mean it's OT.

          • one man clan on 16/08/2019 - 13:27
            +1

            @HighAndDry: Where did you see the award?

            Where did you see that he's paid as "overtime rates" other than him asserting it? If it's +$5 +$10 an hour depending on the day, that doesn't sound like overtime to me.

            I've assumed based on the fact that he's a casual and working weekends that it's retail or the like, which means the weekend shifts would be paid as penalty rates not overtime. I agree if it's a 9-5 monday to friday job it would be overtime, but a shop open 7 days a week the weeknd shifts aren't overtime, they are core.

        • tomsco on 16/08/2019 - 13:34
          +1

          Just FYI, if you work in hospitality, OT applies for casuals, if:

          • You work more than 12 hours per day or per shift; or

          • You work more than 38 hours a week; or

          • Where you work in accordance with a roster and you work more than an average of 38 hours per week over a roster cycle (which may not exceed 4 weeks).

          • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 16/08/2019 - 13:41
            +1

            @tomsco: I have no idea why everyone is going down the tangent of overtime.

            Anyways the answer to OP's question is likely their employer makes super contributions monthly (in fact most awards they only have to make the payments quarterly) and OP's shifts fall smack inbetween the date they process super contributions each month.

            OP should ask their employer themselves.

            • tomsco on 16/08/2019 - 13:49

              @Typical16-bitEnjoyer: I'm only mentioning it in response to Nalar's comment about OT in the hospitality industry.

              I hope it's nothing sinister (more likely ignorance), but I doubt your explanation would fit as the pay period is for a week mid month (ie. 5th to 11th). I doubt on the 12th of the month they would randomly be making a SG payment up until the 8th (or 9th), especially when pay day is the 12th.

              • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 16/08/2019 - 13:53
                +1

                @tomsco: Wasn't singling your post out in anyway, just meant in general.

                Plenty of legitimate reasons.

                Employer's book keeper works random days.
                Employer is lazy and knows they have up to 3 months to sort it out.
                Employer may have paid super for a single days work from the previous calendar month and hasn't paid any for this month yet.

                Thus why OP should ask their employer.

                • tomsco on 16/08/2019 - 13:56
                  +1

                  @Typical16-bitEnjoyer:

                  Wasn't singling your post out in anyway, just meant in general.

                  Fair enough :)

                  Thus why OP should ask their employer.

                  Agree 100%

            • one man clan on 16/08/2019 - 13:59

              @Typical16-bitEnjoyer: I think the overtime thing started when HighAndDry replied above. I personally think it might be a bit more sinister (employer trying to not pay full entitlements) but as you say, only the employer can explain that and sort it out. And if it is the latter, an adverse action claim in the FWC would probably resolve it (after OP leaves employment)

            • HighAndDry on 16/08/2019 - 16:55

              @Typical16-bitEnjoyer:

              I have no idea why everyone is going down the tangent of overtime.

              Because super is paid on ordinary time earnings, not on overtime earnings. Even if it's not physically paid per pay cycle, it does usually show up on the payslip.

              I'm actually starting to revise my opinion that it's definitely OT, but because OP is a casual worker, their "ordinary hours" is not well-defined.

              • Soluble on 16/08/2019 - 17:44
                +3

                @HighAndDry: It is 100% not OT, it is an allowance. https://community.ato.gov.au/t5/General-super-questions/Supe…

                You have things like standard casual with is 1.2x, you then have 1.5x 1.6x etc. Based in time of day worked/weekends, public holidays at 2.75x they all fall into ordinary hours.

                • HighAndDry on 16/08/2019 - 21:20
                  -1

                  @Soluble: What? Your link starts with:

                  Hi, if I offer to pay my staff an ‘out of hours’ loading… This is not overtime

                  No shit sherlock if she offered to pay them an out-of-hours loading, then that's a loading and not overtime. When she specifically says it's not overtime.

                  • Soluble on 16/08/2019 - 21:22

                    @HighAndDry: Which is exactly what OP is getting. Weekend loading, not overtime. Also she didn't offer to pay them loading, she's required to by law.

                    • HighAndDry on 16/08/2019 - 21:23

                      @Soluble: We don't know that unless we know what their usual hours of work are. It could be weekend loading. Or it could be overtime. Nothing in that link helps because it's basically self-referential - if you're paying loading and it's not overtime, then it's loading and not overtime. OP or OP's boss hasn't said that here.

                      • Soluble on 16/08/2019 - 21:30

                        @HighAndDry: You're reading into the usual hours too much, it's a casual working weekends, not a 9-5 office job. Usual.hours become wherever OP works standard operational hours.

                        Trust me, if it Was legal to pay someone an extra $5 an hour on a Saturday call it overtime and not pay super on it, I'd be doing it.

                        • HighAndDry on 16/08/2019 - 21:32

                          @Soluble:

                          You're reading into the usual hours too much

                          Well, yeah, because that determines if super is payable or not.

                          Usual.hours become wherever OP works standard operational hours.

                          But we don't know what OP's standard operational hours are. Heck, we don't even know if OP is in hospitality or not - maybe it's an office job, which would mean Sat/Sun would be overtime.

                          (Or, yes, OP could work Sat/Sun every week and they would be usual hours.)

                          • Soluble on 16/08/2019 - 21:33

                            @HighAndDry: Overtime for 21.5 hours would be a lot more than $5 and $10 an hour.

                            • HighAndDry on 16/08/2019 - 21:34

                              @Soluble: True (or at least pretty highly unlikely), I'll grant you that.

  • tomsco on 16/08/2019 - 13:07
    +1

    As others have mentioned, the extra you receive for Saturday and Sunday is a penalty rate, not overtime.

    The hospitality award does not exclude Saturday or Sunday from Ordinary Hours.

    I would say it is a technical issue where they have setup the pay items without realising they need to select that SG needs to be paid on those items (quite possible if they are using software like Xero or the like).

    EDIT: Not sure why I assumed you're a hospitality worker. Do you know what award you would fall under?

    • Soluble on 16/08/2019 - 18:05

      Just spoke to the wife, it's literally a checkbox in xero, so whatever they're using when they've added in the rates of pay they've selected to exclude super on those rates. So id say you're right

  • Soluble on 16/08/2019 - 14:19
    +4

    There's a few comments above but not sure which to reply to. So I'll chuck it here. Regardless of when the employer pays the super, I pay my employees quarterly, it should still appear on the payslip in the week it was earned.

    As for the Saturday and Sunday rates they are simply penalty rates, for those days, not over time. 100% super should be paid for those shifts.

    The only time super isn't paid is if the employee earns below a threshold for that month. That being $450.

    E.g. week 1 employee earns $440, payroll software will calculate no super. Second week employee earns $200, payroll software will then calculate super on $640. If the employee works no more that month after earning $440 no super gets paid

  • HeWhoKnows on 17/08/2019 - 18:17

    I believe its ordinary hours vs overtime hours

    Causal hours fall into neigther but certainly you are not working overtime hours.

    best to check with the tax office. Free advice over the phone

  • Mentallysick on 19/08/2019 - 11:03
    -3

    Stop Ranting Over my posts.

    I am here to settle all you down.

    It is a mistake from bookkeeper.

    Cheers :P

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