People smoking in no-smoking zones?

Has anyone else noticed this recently or has it always been common? It's like security is too busy enforcing all the COVID runaround regulations so they haven't bothered enforcing no-smoking laws.

AFAIK all hospital grounds are supposed to be smoke-free yet I see a lot of nurses and patients sitting casually next to the entrance lighting up.

This also happens at my workplace where a lot of people sit and smoke right in front of a no-smoking sign. When told not to smoke there, they walk 2 metres to their car, sit inside, open the window and smart smoking from their vehicle.

I even saw someone smoking in the middle of a crowded outdoor shopping centre walkway.

This isn't anything new for smokers since they've always been rather inconsiderate but I feel like the rules used to be enforced a lot better. Have people just stopped giving a **** since all the COVID drama?

Comments

  • +8

    They should make a dedicated smoking area. Patients, doctors, and nurses are always gonna smoke.

    • +18

      they have… the issue is nobody uses those areas..

      • -5

        Maybe the smoking areas should be nicer.

        • +1

          If it helps smokers stay away from non smokers, does it matter if the smoking area is nice?

          • +2

            @AustriaBargain: I'm a non-smoker and I honestly think this can play a part especially with staff who have poor smoking areas. This can include inadequate protections against the elements….

            I mean how would feel if the places you where provided to smoke had no cover during a cold and windy day or worse when it's bucketing down rain on your head…..

            Frankly that seems like a punishment.

            But hey look over there….cover…less wind….more comfortable….possibly warm or cool depending on the weather…. But hey stuff the smokers right?

        • +25

          Maybe the smoking areas should be nicer.

          To encourage smoking?

          The aim is provide a space for chronically addicted smokers.
          Like an injecting room but with cigarettes and tobacco rather than niddles.

          Smoking should be discouraged: pricing, publicity, limited "smoking" areas, scarcity. The lot.
          Anything and everything

          Once they quit they will be free of the addiction and could focus in being healthy again.

          • +1

            @LFO: Except the needle drugs are most likely illegal and they provide the rooms for safety only…

            Cigarettes are unfortunately still legal and while actively discouraged the government isn't deeming them as doing anything wrong by a legal or societal definition….

            But, In the spirit of what the OP was saying it is unfair for smokers to smoke where it is prohibited to do so…. for example bus stops(in SA), In which you can literally stand anywhere around the stop and smoke except under the roof/cover….

          • +6

            @LFO: Yeah that’s right, the smoking areas just looked so comfy I had to start smoking…

            • @Blitz001: I'll recommend quitting then. As soon as possible.

              Still go to those areas if they feel so inviting but take a book or just meditate in silence.
              Cheaper and healthier. A lot.

          • +1

            @LFO: You're acting as if people that smoke have a disease, they're not heroin addicts in need of curing.

            • +1

              @sk3iron: No, they are smokers in need of curing.

              Nicotine is a drug as well.

        • -3

          This is a super valid point that alot of non-smokers don't get, the smokers area is often down a dodgy alleyway near a bin thats behind the toilet block. It's not a super inviting place for anyone to choose to go ever; especially when trying to get a peaceful 5 minute break from the stress of the day.

          • +2

            @sk3iron: You could also say that's part and parcel of an activity that inevitably bothers others near you… Choosing to take it up is implicitly accepting that you can only smoke in smoking zones that attract less foot traffic.

          • +1

            @sk3iron: No, the non smokers understand perfectly what it's like to have to walk through an uninviting place clouded by second hand smoke which ruins your clothes and increases your risk of cancer.

            It makes more sense that you should be uncomfortable while partaking in a filthy habit than the rest of society being uncomfortable due to your filthy habit.

          • +1

            @sk3iron:

            a peaceful 5 minute break from the stress of the day

            How about something healthy, some meditation, breathing, relaxation, prayers?.
            Something that IS NOT INVASIVE to others, to their right to breath clean air.

          • @sk3iron: I don't think it's supposed to be a great place. It's generally areas away from where people naturally congregate. That way they (building owners) are not accused of breaching rules by being too close to eating/enclosed/safe zones.

      • +1

        Actually in QLD there aren’t any designated smoking areas, you have to go completely off hospital grounds, so there’s usually a gathering of smokers in the nearest street.

      • +2

        Most places no longer have dedicated smoking areas as a strategy to discourage the habit.

    • +10

      they do, they all go to one place
      hospital bed with lung cancer

  • +46

    Typical inconsiderate bastards

    Be careful if you decide to challenge them (or anyone to be honest)

    https://www.theage.com.au/national/victoria/man-who-killed-s...

    • -12

      A very sad story but 10 years is not a bad sentence for the scumbag.

      • +34

        Takes longer than 10 years to train as a cardiothoracic surgeon

      • +15

        Too short and too lenient a sentence.

        • -3

          Myself and the criminal justice system apparently disagrees with you.

          I don't think any more is justified for a punch. It wasn't blatant intentional murder and doesn't deserve a sentence like one.

          To all the people downvoting me, stop and think why you disagree with the highly qualified courts and judges that gave this sentence.

          • +1

            @watwatwat: Highly qualified courts? Lol.

            Jill Meagher and Masa Vukotic's friends and family would think otherwise. Blatant failure of the criminal justice system.

            • -2

              @mrvaluepack:

              Highly qualified courts? Lol.

              Oh, what is funny about that? Care to elaborate on your critique?

              Ok what are your qualifications on justice?

              Please advise how many years of jail you would give this guy for punching someone.

              • +3

                @watwatwat: Nothing funny, just think that Australia's justice system can sometimes be a joke.

                My qualifications you ask? Just using my common sense.
                I have realised over the years that the "justice system" can also be highly politically motivated.

                My take on punishment sentence is based on the severity of consequence of the crime:
                - if you are violent enough to punch a person that hard and he/she dies, you should not be allowed back into society and be jailed for life.

                • +1

                  @mrvaluepack:

                  punch a person that hard and he/she dies, you should not be allowed back into society and be jailed for life.

                  Wow. Life in prison for a young person for punching someone once. And I'm sure you have taken in to account the risk to society of re-offence/chance for rehabilitation.

                  I suppose your sentence is the same for a mass rapist/serial killer.

                  Also if the doctor fell a different way and survived the attack perhaps you wouldn't impose any jail time at all. So being able to walk free vs life in prison is all dependent upon some luck.

                  Just using my common sense.

                  And yet your opinion likely wildly inverses every single criminal sentencing imposed in society. How is it that you are so smart with so much common sense yet the teams of highly qualified courts and judges dedicating their lives to justice have it so wrong every time? You must be so frustrated that the whole criminal justice system fails yet you are a genius being undervalued right now.

                  • -2

                    @watwatwat: Its because of people like you and your pathetic hopeful thinking of rehabilitation and leniency that allow violent people to reoffend and innocent lives to be lost.

                    • -1

                      @mrvaluepack: Well thankfully we'll continue to allow our courts to do their jobs.

                      You can continue to give your opinion on sentences. Write down exactly what you think they should get on a piece of paper, then throw the paper in the bin and reflect upon why you disagree with people much smarter than you.

                      • -3

                        @watwatwat: Smarter is a subjective term. I am quite content with knowing that I have a higher IQ than you based on your postings.

                        That's why laws and sentences continually change through lobbying because they become ancient and ineffective over time.

                        You can continue to live in your fairyland where everyone will be a better person after going to prison.

                        When someone on parole hurts someone you love and care about or you get robbed by a junkie who is straight out of jail, I would love to hear from you again.

                • +2

                  @mrvaluepack: They are also motivated by money. It costs the tax payer around $150,000 per inmate per year. We spend more on the scumbags of our society than we do on nursing homes.

    • +17

      A worthless excuse for a human being. Kills the man, who does good in this world, saving lives. He should be jailed for life at the minimum

    • +1

      Smokers are often quick to anger and like a bit of confrontation when asked to go elsewhere with their poison.

  • +9

    This is super common. It's just you who have noticed this recently.

    • +1

      Yep, it’s been super common for quite a long time. I think it’s one of those things where once you notice it you see it everywhere. I’m not a fan either, but it’s so much better in Australia than Europe. When in Paris (pre-COVID) I was amazed at how popular smoking was, especially for people sitting outside eating.

      • +1

        Maybe they were shooting a movie?

  • +85

    Lets be honest here. Smokers are disgusting and inconsiderate of others.

    • -19

      As a smoker that goes out of thier way to find designated areas, I find your comment disgusting and inconsiderate!

      • +28

        Yeah but the smoke doesnt stay in the designated area

        • -13

          Suppose troĺls be trollin everywhere, ozb isn't free of kids, sigh.

      • +10

        If you like getting cancer, that's your problem.
        No need to bring everyone down along with you.

        Yes, you might find it inconsiderate that disgusting people like you gets called out. I understand thiefs don't like the cops. No news there.

        • +1

          Thieves*.

      • +2

        When I have to speak to someone, face to face, who has just been for a smoke, the place they choose to smoke is of little comfort to me.
        Sometimes I'll feel like I'm smoking just from talking to someone who has just had a smoke. It is disgusting.

        • +1

          It sure is! I'm not a heavy smoker but banning smoking in majority of public spaces was the best thing in long time. I find the smoke and odour unpleasant.

          This doesn't change the fact at the disgusting generalization I've been dealt in this forum.

          There is always a choice to say something to the person that reaks of smoke that you find it unpleasant! Just as easily as some on here who are so quick to spill their vile feelings behind a screen.

          • +3

            @Steakz:

            There is always a choice to say something to the person that reaks of smoke that you find it unpleasant!

            Most people don't have the balls to say that because it makes you look like a Karen, so we just go along with it.

            But perhaps if smokers were considerate in the first place, they'd understand that people shouldn't have to tell them about personal hygiene. They should be able to recognise that their filthy habit affects other people without being told.

            We had the same issue with a guy at work who never showered. The stench produced by the human body after days of no washing is unbearable…but I truly feel for the person who has to break the news to him. People shouldn't be forced into shaming you.

            • +3

              @SlavOz: This is heading in a ridiculous direction, now you're saying all smokers have bad hygiene!

              Like I said before I go beyond reules and laws to have my smoke, again as I said I don't like the smell and odour and I agree on many views mentioned.
              What feel is disgusting and vile is how those views are put forward.
              Just because I choose to have a puff 2-3 times a day, I've been labelled inconsiderate, disgusting, smelly person! Funnily it couldn't be further from the truth!

        • +1

          As a vegan feminist I think fat people and carnivores have their own unique and disgusting smell yet I haven't had the need to post on a public forum about it until now. I tolerate it as I am considerate of others in our diverse society. We don't all exist to please you.

          • +1

            @elixe: Maybe keep those feelings to yourself.
            Being someone who describes yourself as a vegan feminist, the people you are talking to probably find you more obnoxious than you find them.

            • @O15: Elixe has to be a troll, if not then quite silly.
              Either way not worth your time.

              • +1

                @Steakz: Sorry mate gave you a neg accidentally so upvoted your other comment above hopefully someone will up vote your comment to fix it. Cancel culture is commo 101. Old people, homeless, some women and men all have a distinctive smell where do we draw the line. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dmMleBjkn2U. How am I trolling? Are you all perpetually offended?

        • -1

          @015 I will post this here in the hope that you will wake up.

          https://www.awm.gov.au/collection/C281510
          http://crossingtheline.co/2020/07/fellow-australians-melanch...

          Tell Private William Oswald Wallace Johnson of your disgust and need for comfort. Tell him how his having a cigarette upsets you. Tell your forebears who fought and died, if they weren't cowards, how you conflict with their values, and your needs are absolute. Or perhaps think about who will be by your shoulder or has your back. Think of your Nation and not yourself. Harden up stop being so fragile.

  • +32

    Smoking creates such a large burden on our health system.

    • +14

      It's estimated that tobacco excise in Australia brought in $12B in 2017/2018(treasury.gov.au)
      According to https://www1.racgp.org.au/newsgp/professional/smoking-costs-...
      The direct cost to our health system is only $6.8B.
      There are a lot of indirect costs that blow the figure way out. But as it currently stands, the tax more than pays the healthcare bill.
      Smoking is awful. Did it myself for 20 odd years until I quit last year.
      The issue I have with the tax is it smashes those most vulnerable in our society, as easy as it is for a non smoker to say "just quit" it is extremely difficult and hits your mental health in a big way.
      I feel for the kids that are going without because their parents are spending all of their income on durrie tax.

      • +4

        Exactly. The tax on tobacco is almost a regressive tax, but isn't as bad as the taxes on gaming/wagering, which definitely is a regressive tax!

        • +2

          The tax on tobacco at least encourages people to quit. The taxes on gaming is just folded into the odds.

          • +1

            @Shacktool: From memory the rate of smoking decreased for people aged in their 20s and 30s, but did not decrease significantly for people in their 40s - 60s.

            If the government were really keen to decrease the rates of smokers, they'd legalise vaping with nicotine. However, that would eat into their tax dollars so are not rushing to do that.

      • Maybe the direct cost is $6.8billion, but does this figure include things like the cost of running Quitline, subsidised NRT etc? I think some of these programs wouldn’t be included in that figure. There’s also the cost of things like cleaning up littered cigarette butts, costs of treating children of smokers for asthma and developmental delays etc.

        I do agree it’s hard for people who are already addicted and the cost doesn’t always just hit the smoker but their kids and families. There are actually heaps of gov supports for people wanting to quit, I suspect people don’t always want to or don’t know where to look for help. The strategy seems to be working to reduce prevalence.

        • There are definitely other costs but your examples aren't high costs. NRT subsidising reduces costs in the longer term as it gets more people to stop smoking. A big part of the overall cost is early death or health affected life in the years before death. A dead smoker doesn't contribute to the economy or to their family. That's often factored in with these calculations (DALYs/HALYs etc.) but tends to be conveniently forgotten in figures that try to play down the costs of smoking.

        • As per the link I posted, the indirect cost is estimated at 138B

    • Let's not forget alcohol.

  • +2

    I'm glad this thread is smoke free.

  • +9

    Just on smokers - why do they get priority at the checkout? they never queue up like everyone else but as soon as they show up, Karen from register 1 - the 10 items or less queue - rushes over and serves them…. GAGF - get to the back of the line and wait ya turn,

    • +2

      I guess because the Smokers have less time to live and the greedy Supermarket figure you won't abandon your trolley and will wait.

    • That would be because by law they can not sell tobacco products at the checkout. Only at the designated counter you've mentioned.
      I wouldn't have a problem standing in a checkout line as most of the time it's faster!

    • Oh that's where Karen was!
      I was looking for her

    • +2

      I've had to go to the smoking/manager counter at ww/coles a few times to correct mistakes made by cashiers and get refunds, my experience is that you wait aaages at that counter. Manager is normally off doing something and express checkout person usually serving express lane as first priority from my experiences at different stores

    • company protocol

    • +24

      It's illegal to smoke in a no-smoke area. There's no such thing as the right to break the law.

        • +19

          No, you're wrong

          In all states and territories, it’s illegal to smoke in enclosed public places including:

          public transport such as trains, planes and buses
          office buildings
          shopping malls
          schools
          cinemas
          airports

          EDIT - there are also laws governing smoking in outdoor areas

          • @SlavOz: And I said private property is not enforceable. Nothing to do with the comments / replies.

            • @jimbobaus: Like inconsiderate people parking in timed spaces for as long as they like on private property? i.e. supermarkets & shopping centres?

        • +8

          Outdoor smoke-free areas in NSW are enforceable.

          The North Sydney CBD is a smoke-free zone https://www.9news.com.au/national/smoking-ban-north-sydney-c.... The smokers may be issued with a $300 on the spot fine.

          The fine can be bigger if they're asked to leave but refuse to do so from an outdoor smoke-free area that is regulated by the liquor, club and casino laws.

          https://www.health.nsw.gov.au/tobacco/Pages/smoke-free-laws....

          Enforcement of smoking bans
          NSW Health inspectors conduct regular compliance monitoring and enforcement activity. They can issue cautions or on the spot fines of $300 to people who break the smoking bans.

          https://www.legislation.nsw.gov.au/view/whole/html/inforce/c...

          20A Penalty notices
          (1) An inspector may issue a penalty notice to a person if it appears to the inspector that the person has committed a penalty notice offence.
          (2) A penalty notice offence is an offence against this Act or the regulations that is prescribed by the regulations as a penalty notice offence.
          (3) The Fines Act 1996 applies to a penalty notice issued under this section.
          Note—
          The Fines Act 1996 provides that, if a person issued with a penalty notice does not wish to have the matter determined by a court, the person may pay the amount specified in the notice and is not liable to any further proceedings for the alleged offence.
          (4) The amount payable under a penalty notice issued under this section is the amount prescribed for the alleged offence by the regulations (not exceeding the maximum amount of penalty that could be imposed for the offence by a court).
          (5) This section does not limit the operation of any other provision of, or made under, this or any other Act relating to proceedings that may be taken in respect of offences.

          https://www.legislation.nsw.gov.au/view/html/inforce/current...

          11 Penalty notice may be given for smoking in a smoke free area
          For the purposes of section 20A of the Act, an offence under section 7 (1) of the Act is an offence for which a penalty notice may be served and the penalty prescribed for the offence is $300.

          https://www.health.nsw.gov.au/news/Pages/20140811_00.aspx

          Over five thousand smokers fined across NSW for lighting up in public places
          11 August 2014
          A total of 5,178 smokers across NSW have been fined for lighting up in designated smoke-free areas since January 2013, according to figures released today by NSW Health and Transport for NSW.

          The vast majority of fines were issued to people smoking in public transport settings such as bus stops and train station platforms.

          NSW Health inspectors can issue infringement notices (on the spot fines) at a range of public outdoor areas under the Smoke-free Environment Act 2000. NSW Police Officers can also issue fines for smoking at transport stops under the Passenger Transport Regulation 2007 and the Smoke-free Environment Act 2000. An on the spot fine of $300 applies to anyone who fails to comply.

          https://www.northsydney.nsw.gov.au/Community_Services/Safety...

          Smoke Free North Sydney CBD
          North Sydney Council has voted to ban smoking in the North Sydney CBD, making it the first Sydney Council to do so.
          https://www.northsydney.nsw.gov.au/files/assets/public/docs/...

          https://www.liquorandgaming.nsw.gov.au/community-and-stakeho...

          Penalties applying to patrons under the liquor, club, and casino laws
          Under the Liquor Act 2007, the Registered Clubs Act 1976 and the Casino Control Act 1992 venues are able to ask a patron to leave if they continues to smoke in a smoke-free area.

          If a patron fails to leave when asked, they may receive an on-the-spot fine of $550 or a maximum penalty of up to $5,500.

          • @whooah1979: Exactly, let's issue licences to smoke renewed annually for a hefty fee. We can then pay for more enforcement, re-education and training for smokers requiring them to be aware of the rules and their obligation to others. Smoking is a privilege and not a right you know.

      • It's illegal to smoke in a no-smoke area.

        It is legal on the street, yet people still complain.

        Whether it's majority or minority - just because you don't like it, it doesn't mean it's wrong. If there are so many people against it, then lobby for it to become illegal.

        The people who are complaining about the health hazards of cigarette smoke probably had a good laugh at this lady! Yes, BBQ smoke is carciogenic too, but we can't call for all BBQs to be cancelled now, can we? (btw, I'm not vegan or anything remotely close!)

    • +2

      I don't believe your comment holds any Tegridy.

  • +9

    This is how I feel about alcohol. Bring back prohibition.

    • -1

      :(

    • +12

      Yeah, I hate it when people are drinking around me and I have to drink their second-hand liquid.

      Wait, that sounded worse than expected.

      • Well during covid that sounds particularly bad…. But free booze :P

      • They are not like for like … that’s like saying, I hate it when my friends shoot up heroin and their needles get stuck in my arm.

      • +9

        I hated watching my grandfather slowly succumb to liver failure (direct result of alcohol) and die painfully
        I hate it when people with alcohol related injuries fill up our emergency wards every weekend.
        I hate it when drink drivers kill completely innocent people.
        I hate it when families are destroyed by alcohol.
        I hate it when people drinking around me act aggressive and violent.

        Completely agree with TheBilly. Alcohol needs to go. The damage to health/families/society far far outweighs smoking now. The taxes need to be raised inline with smoking. Both are toxic poisons.

        • I guess while we are here, a ban on sugar, salt, caffeine and fatty foods should be added because this is killing us and filling hospitals also….. Though making a comment like this I'd have to concede it would be less likely to kill people via the road and causing people to fight….. Still as unhealthy as cigarettes though…..

          • @Forfiet: I don’t think we have to ban those foods. Just ban fat people. Simple solution is if a person is fat, they don’t get access to Medicare. Every hospital and doctor visit they have to pay for.

    • That, or consider laws making it illegal to throw your drink over peoples' clothing or force them to sip it.

    • +13

      Exactly what I thought. Many people fail to realize the damage and burden alcohol has on society. Visit ER rooms at night on weekends and what about domestic violence. A smoker never tried to pick a fight with me as I was walking up the mall after a night out. Now, the same could be said about a lot of other drugs but alcohol seems to get a pass because it's socially acceptable and we're all responsible drinkers, right? Just to clarify I definitely don't want prohibition but people seem to frown on smoking but think alcohol is perfectly fine. Bring on the negs :-)

      • Frankly it would be great if we could take the alcohol out of the 'night out' equation…. That having one automatically means the other. But it seems if you want to party: Drugs or Alcohol…. :( Wish we could slowly shape the perception…..

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