Is This Racism or Matter of Choice?

Ironh59 on 14/04/2022 - 18:30
Last edited 16/04/2022 - 18:55

I am originally not from Australia and you can tell from my name. I have been here for a long time and luckily haven't encountered many racist people. I truly believe Australia is very tolerant and accepting of different cultures.

Recently I posted a job on one of the popular find-a-tradie websites (not Airtasker or Hipages). This is how the conversation went:

Tradie: I would like to do the job.
Me: When can you come over to provide the quote.
Tradie: Really busy
Tradie: Are you from ******?
Me: That's fine, I will look at the other responses for now if you are busy.
Tradie: I don't work for *******s
Tradie: They are cheap

I raised a concern with the website support and ask them to add a field for ethnicity, so tradies can choose which ad to respond to and people like me can avoid such encounters.
Customer service didn't see any issues with it, they said it's a matter of choice for tradies and they can choose who they work for.

I have no issues with choice, only how the point was put across. That guy knew my ethnicity form my name, yet he chose to respond to my job.

I just wanted to check if I am overreacting. It's not like he came with a mob to burn my house. May be he had too many bad experiences with ****** people and just wanted to vent.

So Ozbargainers, is this racism or just a matter of choice that person is entitled to?

Edit: Thank you all for your comments. Apologies for not being able to respond to all of you. So far the consensus is that tradie is racist, however the best course of action is to move on. I posted a comment about reporting this behaviour which got some negs. I just want to clarify that I was not planning to report the tradie, I was planning to report the platform for endorsing it.

It isn’t a small job either, it’s bathroom and kitchen renovation. It’s lot of money, and I definitely wouldn’t want to pay someone who hates me because of who I am or where I was born.

For those who are curious about my background, most of you have guessed it right. I am from a cricket crazy nation and I have the same last name as some very popular cricketers.

Education & Work

Comments

  • [Deactivated] on 17/04/2022 - 15:29
    -5

    Wondering, as some types of jobs are 'quotable' by certain/skilled tradesmen beforehand.
    Assuming a quote has been made and accepted isn't it bad form/manners/ethics to haggle AFTER the given job has been done?

    This is the land of the lowest IMO. Truly 'slimy'. Indeed a great way to lose a good tradesman forevermore.
    Wow, the outright hatred for tradesmen here is appalling.
    As if there are no good tradesmen out there who are worth every dollar (and more) that they charge.

    Imagine for a moment that some customers are awful and ungrateful as well and that some Tradesmen are above average, excellent and worthy of common respect as well.

  • LlamaOfDoom on 17/04/2022 - 18:20

    Edit: Thank you all for your comments. Apologies for not being able to respond to all of you. So far the consensus is that tradie is racist, however the best course of action is to move on. I posted a comment about reporting this behaviour which got some negs. I just want to clarify that I was not planning to report the tradie, I was planning to report the platform for endorsing it.

    I'd post a google review of his non-service tbh. Thats horse shit. (profanity) the OzB neggers.
    Reporting the platform will do nothing.
    Alternatively, use an alias name and get him to come quote it and then don't give him the job. He knew your name and knowingly wasted YOUR time.

  • superkieu on 17/04/2022 - 20:08
    +1

    It was a combination of both.
    More of a group bias discrimination than racism but that's splitting hair.

    Imaging this: a tradie with an ethnic background refusing to work for white Australian customers (the majority of the population), saying it directly to their face.
    If the White Aussies are offended in that situation, then you should be too.

    If they are being treated that way and don't see anything wrong with it, then may be you should get use to the cultural shock. Ask the locals why things are the way they are.

    Personally, I won't be using this kind of tradies. Their focus should be on the nature of the work, not who their customer is.

  • jaimex2 on 17/04/2022 - 20:14
    +2

    I avoid dealing with some cultures because they are cheap and argumentative about costs. Trade could have been more polite about it but most aren't exactly high class.

  • Stromae on 17/04/2022 - 20:31
    +2

    Casual racism in Australia is rife. Living in Europe for over a year now, I have not once heard a racist joke, or any mention of race. In Australia, these jokes were everywhere.

    I have English and Irish mates who moved to Australia and told me how shocked they were that aussies in the office would make regular racist jokes or comments, and not even think about the racist undertone, like it is normal there.

  • us3rnam3tak3n on 17/04/2022 - 22:05
    +1

    In my opinion the tradie was racist to treat the OP differently based on race rather than his own individual merits.

    When I sell on gumtree the lowball offers (below 50% of the asking price) have always come from Indians. I guess it's normal in Indian culture, even though I consider it to be rude. I've also had many positive interactions with Indians on gumtree. If I were to dismiss Indians on the assumption that they would try to rip me off then I would be racist too.

    • HealthHazard on 19/04/2022 - 10:54

      I really think that what most people don't understand that we don't send it out as a low ball offer, it's meant to be a starting point for a negotiation. I guess it's a cultural thing.

      • us3rnam3tak3n on 19/04/2022 - 13:59
        +2

        If I'm selling a bike for $100 and someone offers $30-50 I dismiss it as a non serious buyer. They've usually just pressed the auto reply button as well so I assume they've thrown dozens of offers hoping to find a desperate seller. I'm far more likely to negotiate with someone who writes a personal reply and/or makes an offer 80% or more of the asking price. I would actually prefer to give the item to a friend than sell to a lowballer.

        • HealthHazard on 19/04/2022 - 19:48

          Yeah bro . . I get you, personally I don't think a SEA person would give a joke offer if they're a serious buyer :)

  • rlay3 on 18/04/2022 - 08:28

    Discrimination should not be allowed in this setting, whether it be for age, gender, sexual orientation etc. It's not ok!

  • Hangryuman on 18/04/2022 - 09:27
    +1

    generally when I have heard overseas-born people complain about racism, and I've asked what happened, it seemed to me just general rude/bad service from an a$$hole that happens also to me regularly

    when I have contacted find-a-tradie websites and been called by potential tradespeople, firstly they have quoted WAY above what I considered reasonable, and secondly they have almost always had strong accents so are themselves born overseas.

    so chances are overseas-born OP actually communicated with another overseas-born person who simply wanted to rip off someone, and didn't want to deal with one of their own type as they knew they wouldn't be able to rip them off so easily.

    so - in general - https://cdn.someecards.com/someecards/usercards/MjAxMy1lZjZm…

    • leiiv on 18/04/2022 - 14:36
      -1

      This is it. It was just tradies want to maximise their profits by doing stereotyping based on racial profile.

  • Rob-4x4 on 18/04/2022 - 09:50

    Tradie you dealt with is basically an un-Australian (profanity)… you are probably better off not dealing with them as they are a bigot and racist and probably do crap work and overcharge …

  • yy89 on 18/04/2022 - 11:59

    Yes, people can choose who they work for — much in the same capacity that you can choose who works for you.

    But this is open discrimination based on race or ethnicity — this is overt racism.

    Name and shame the platform for giving such a shit response.

  • SlavOz on 18/04/2022 - 14:07
    -7

    Reposted as this comment really shouldn't be hidden:

    Looks the OP isn't above indulging in some discrimination themselves as they mentioned in an older post that they refuse to patronise Sydney hairdressers whose employees don't wear masks (despite the fact, there was no legal requirement for them to do so at the time of that post).

    Now apparently the OP doesn't like how them apples taste when he receives the same treatment from someone else, like a tradie refusing to do business with him on the basis of some arbitrary personal feeling.

    Where's my tiny violin now…

  • Look Up on 18/04/2022 - 15:30

    For a house in the Hills district, a total bathroom and kitchen reno with all new appliances is an easy $50K starter

    At this level, you are better off checking the local newspapers, asking friends/family for recommendations, spending time with localised Google searches and then hitting the phones for some proper old school quotes

    Ironh59 - this a great life lesson for you. Stop being passive on online platforms and get it done

    Anecdotally, many local neighbours from the sub continent don't bother with pricey renovations because a) there are few people from their own communities who are tradies and b) once they cost it out, a total knock down and rebuild is better value

  • spy on 18/04/2022 - 18:49
    +1

    "Can you do me a deal?"
    "What is your last price, kesh?"
    Betya he's just stick of hearing this all the time.

  • axlfan on 18/04/2022 - 20:11

    That tradie is definitely racist. No doubt abt it but I would not generalise. Almost all countries and societies are racist in one form or the other.

    I am originally from India and there is bigotry there as well (caste, religion and recently which party you vote for etc… u name it! ). But Indians themselves face racism abroad.

    I choose to focus on the positive and brush away such bigots. It is really their loss. Imagine living such a life with all that negativity. Yuck!

  • prinsenhof on 18/04/2022 - 20:58
    +1

    Definitely racist, the conversation was already over and they decided to insult you.

    Normally I would fight fire with fire and respond with something like "no worries, I was looking for a tradie anyway not a home handyman".

    Another one would have been "your mums cheap", if you wanted a few more foul-mouth responses for fun.

    But in this case you took the higher road.

    • [Deactivated] on 19/04/2022 - 12:25
      +1

      There is no need to counter a racist comment with a sexist comment.

      • prinsenhof on 19/04/2022 - 17:56

        Sorry, I fix for you

        "home handy(wo)man"

        • [Deactivated] on 19/04/2022 - 19:44

          You must be so proud

  • wtfnodeal on 18/04/2022 - 20:58
    -1

    For those who thinks it is not racist, ask yourself if this judgement is fair, alien:” I don’t work for human, they are cheap.”

  • sickaunt on 18/04/2022 - 23:46

    I've heard people say this about their own race. Not common but it definitely happened and I remember thinking 'what the (profanity)?' cos it caught me off guard. Chances are this tradie is just a scumbag racist POS, but he also could be same race as OP.

  • [Deactivated] on 19/04/2022 - 08:35

    Uber driver does the same with the less rated ride or normal price ride while surging.

  • drillvoice on 19/04/2022 - 09:49
    +1

    I'm sorry you had to face this! No question this is racist. I'm astonished that the company wasn't willing to do anything about it. This would likely be against anti-discrimination law. You may prefer to move on, but you could also have other options.

  • Blitzfx on 19/04/2022 - 10:52
    +7

    So many racists on OzBargain doing mental gymnastics to claim discrimination based on race =/= racism

  • roy125 on 19/04/2022 - 11:15
    +6

    Pretty shocking the number of posts here which are racist, prefaced by "this is not racist, just experience".

  • bobolo on 19/04/2022 - 13:36
    +4

    Honestly, I think everyone is racist deep down. Our differing looks and cultures will always divide us. Sometimes its great "x people has great food!" and sometimes its bad "x people are tightarses"

    white, brown, yellow, black - we've all got our pros and cons.

    My background is Asian and I can say with absolute certainty that asians are the most racist people on the planet especially towards black people. We are just more covert about it and don't have violent tendencies lol

    • PuntyBrah on 19/04/2022 - 20:47

      can confirm the covert abilities of us Asian lmao. Also I don't know why its backward but I'm finding our newer generations more racist.

    • inasero on 20/04/2022 - 11:21

      Exactly, you gotta take the good with the bad (or rather, the bad with the good). The sooner we all acknowledge this and move in, the better for society

  • Raj09 on 19/04/2022 - 14:11
    +1

    Not everyone will like you or will work with you and is meant to do so. If you have the choice then get someone else for your bathroom work 😊

  • plentifoo on 19/04/2022 - 15:18
    +3

    Racism only becomes a problem when it's verbalised or when a race is associated with something negative. I for one believe a majority of the human race racially stereotypes people in their heads whether for positive or negative reasons.

    It's the ones that are insensitive and care less about being politically correct in speech that get called out for non violent racism. I don't want to generalise vocations, but many blue collar tradies tend to be more direct and blunt in speech but harbour no ill intentions usually.

    I experienced this first hand when i was building a house last year with my wife. Friendly guy but made racial slurs all the time in conversation with us. I chalked it up to low EQ, lack of cultural sensitivity due to his upbringing and education, which is no fault of his.

    End of the day, it boils down to the OP or the person experiencing the purported racial abuse. Got to decide whether its out of malice or just ignorance and if it's the latter, is it really up to you to educate/punish them?

  • bargaino on 19/04/2022 - 19:54
    +3

    I listed a phone on Facebook Marketplace. First response profile pic was an Aboriginal woman in grotty clothes giving the middle finger to the camera. I felt a pang of middle-class guilt, but no thanks, blocked. Fortunately, next buyer was a well-presented African guy, so he gets the phone, and my middle-class guilt evaporates.

    Yes, I know Indian buyers online can be a PITA, but that is no excuse for the "tradie" being an arsehole. One can politely decline.

  • ozaym on 20/04/2022 - 10:08

    I don't get it, why wouldnt you report his douchbag? these scums are cancer to society, I would report him, to the website and the trade organisation that his part of, post his name/company/association/building ID etc here and on any other social media platform, stamping out racism and intolorance is part of our duty as a member of society, people who neg you for reporting him obviously hold unpleasent views themselves.

  • syousef on 20/04/2022 - 10:45

    I don't think you should move on. I think you should report the tradie and the board that refused to act.

    https://humanrights.gov.au/our-work/complaint-information-se…

  • cupcake on 20/04/2022 - 10:58

    You're better off not using such a horrible tradie.
    I prefer not to use certain tradies as well but won't say which one…

  • Carmen Sandiego on 20/04/2022 - 11:19
    +1

    Firstly, I view this is as racism. You had no bad faults but, the a-hole decided to go at you due to your name and literally nothing else. F that.

    As for my experiences as an Asian female, between the "yellow fever", the sexist remarks by everyone (especially from Korean males), and the racism, I couldn't tell you which one is worse. Although, the single worst way I got racism geared towards me was when my ex told me that when his co-worker found out I am Korean, the next sentence was "I hope she makes good Kimchi" wink wink, nudge nudge. It still makes me angry and disgusted that this "person" decided to respond like that.

    This is why I ban those who are monolingual in English from saying my legal name. They have to earn that right.

    • Hangryuman on 20/04/2022 - 14:33
      -2

      'Carmen Sandiego' - not your Korean name then ?

      "I hope she makes good Kimchi" wink wink, nudge nudge

      was 'the single worst way I got racism geared towards me' ?

      geez Louise - I wouldn't call that racism - I'd call that a stupid idiot who knows nothing about Korea except kimchi, trying to make a funny remark to a work colleague - and failing.

      if racism is defined as 'prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism' - as in negative comments intended to insult or put down, I wouldn't call your example racism at all.

      remarking on something specific to someone else is not necessarily racism, it's the basis for most normal daily conversation - or at least attempts at.

  • jmel on 20/04/2022 - 11:23

    no room for racism, no matter what their experiences are. Businesses just need to learn to deal and evolve based on their experience in a non racist way. absolutely disgusting

  • archieduh on 20/04/2022 - 12:32

    Racist and Arrogant.
    So happy for you that you avoided him because of him being "open".

  • dmcneice on 20/04/2022 - 12:43

    I'm generally in the camp that the term's "racist" or "racism" are overcalled when some people are just simply *****'s.

    However, it seems like in your specific situation, it appears clearly discriminatory racism.

  • Kempe on 20/04/2022 - 14:15
    +3

    I know a sparkie who doesnt have a racist bone in his body but he wont deal with a few nationalities.
    From his experience 75% of them offer less than the quote when the job is done, they seem to think that bargaining after the job is done is acceptable
    eg Quote is $500, job done and they offer $400 cash, when he reminds them the written quote they offer $420 and so it goes on.
    BTW this guy has been in the industry for 50 years so it a very broad experience

  • Hearthstone on 20/04/2022 - 21:45
    +3

    I try to sell my car once, we agree on the price, he turn up test it all is good, we about to sign the paper work then he lower the price WTF?
    I said no, and he keep haggle, I keep saying no, he finally agree to pay but by then I refuse to sell to him and sold to the next buyer.

    This just a matter of integrity and I hate people pulling this sort of stunt

  • dietCokeOnly on 24/04/2022 - 23:44

    Name and shame the platform! Totally messed up.

  • Chocobros on 30/04/2022 - 18:02

    Sounds like racism to me but you have to keep in mind you are dealing with someone who is likely from a lower socioeconomic class.

    I'm sure in time the more racism you experience the more of an effect it will have on you and you'll probably treat your clients/customers differently as a result (whatever job you do).

    That's the thing…. Racism is never fruitful but the perpetrators often don't understand this. The even more worrying ones are those that understand this yet still behave in a racist way. They are the broken animals of this world.

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