Based on this article: Australian Open rocked by 'appalling' new controversy over ball kids
The total prize pool for the Australian $76.5m to get knocked out in the first round a player gets $106k which is more then most people make in an entire year….I personally think we can pay the ball kids but that's just my opinion…
However, i understand it is a character building experience for the kids as they get to [I assume] meet some of the worlds best tennis players.
I think the comment that the “player getting knocked out first round earns 106k” belittles how much effort these players put in. They are the top 150 players of their sport for which all of them have dedicated their entire childhood and teenage life to. They also have no other source of income (to fund travel, accommodation, to pay for their coach) other than these competitions, especially the lower ranked players who wouldn’t be sponsored by any brands.
Being given the chance to play in the first round of a grand slam just might be enough funding to propel them into a proper career in professional tennis… otherwise they end up being your local tennis club teacher.
Addit - though, I admit, giving some pocket money for the ball kids to spend during the school holidays is probably inconsequential in the grand scheme of things. Afaik, I think the sponsors do give them little gifts for their volunteering such as free speakers, clothes from RL polo etc
i dont disagree with you there but it is a 'bit of perspective' in the sense that there is 'money to pay these kids' it isnt like tennis Australia is your local tennis or sports club on a shoe string budget and the community it playing for fun there is a lot of money in tennis - esp if you compare that to a number of other sports that are played in the Olympics etc
these 'kids' are expected to work up 3-4am for nothing which as i said does build character and would be cool to meet Nadal but i think they should be paid or should renumerated in someway ie a voucher or something of equivalent value to what they would of earned.
but regarding the hard work the players put in no doubt im not saying they dont deserve the money they get tennis like most sports are brutally competitive
Then may be 'really' underpaid. Poll and new post please.
Even if you get knocked out if the first round you still have to pay for travel and accommodation to attend, not just for you, but for your team as well. You also have to pay the salaries of your team. If you get knocked out in round one you would probably barely be taking home any cash after expenses…
i think people are taking that 'comment the wrong way' im not saying the players dont deserve the money im saying there isnt a 'shortage' of money to pay people 100 percent agree the players have massive expenses
although keep in mind there are 4 majors and multiple minor tournaments tennis is one of the few sports that you can essentially play year round as a professional like Golf
Depending on the level of the tournament, the accommodation is paid by the tournament for the duration the players stay in. AO is an ITF 1000 tournament. Income tax is paid in the country of the tournament and the player’s home country (if Australia), you also get the use of a car, even if only to drop you at the time tournament centre. Google Serena Williams’ diva car demands at Wimbledon 2022.
Airfares are not at bargain prices as the players do not know their day of departure obviously.
Interesting note- when returning Australian players had to quarantine after playing overseas, the cost of the hotel quarantine was a tax deduction.
While people are willing to volunteer and the job can discriminate by age there's probably many legal hurdles that would not be worth it.
Saw a Reddit thread on this the other day.
General consensus was that the ball boys and girls were more than happy to take part and not be paid; some would have infact paid for the experience to be a ball boy/girl. They're on the court with some of their heroes and idols, and that was more than enough for them.
Majority mentioned that they received free food, tickets for family and also gifts at the end of the tournament.
Edit: Found the thread
Previous ballkid here! Honestly I thought the gig was great. Money each day for food and snacks, great quality Lacoste sports gear, being on TV next to famous players and we were even given GoPros, Fitbits and other gifts at the end. Not a bad way to spend your summer!
It's normally junior players from clubs around the state/country I believe. Not condoning the lack of payment but in their shoes I'd be ecstatic to be on the same court as my role models.
Former ball kid here. When I did it we didn’t get paid- it was a volunteer gig but we got meal allowance for food, some free tix and merch The rumour was that it used to be paid, but it didn’t meet the minimum standards under workplace laws at the time, and so they scrapped payment and made it a volunteer gig. Honestly I didn’t mind the no payment because most ballkids are 12-15 anyway so it’s more for fun, to be close to the players, and to be involved anyway. Then did give us fuel vouchers to give to our parents to cover some of the cost of driving us to Melbourne park
Thought as much. At that age doing this sort of thing would be an experience kids would actually look forward to. Helps to build character IMO.
Not everyone only cares about money, and kids aren't old enough to be corrupted by it yet.
I wish I could get a whole summer's worth of work out of people and pay them in GoPros and Fitbits.
Saw a Reddit thread on this the other day.
General consensus was that the ball boys and girls were more than happy to take part and not be paid; some would have infact paid for the experience to be a ball boy/girl. They're on the court with some of their heroes and idols, and that was more than enough for them.
Majority mentioned that they received free food, tickets for family and also gifts at the end of the tournament.
Edit: Found the thread(reddit.com)
Previous ballkid here! Honestly I thought the gig was great. Money each day for food and snacks, great quality Lacoste sports gear, being on TV next to famous players and we were even given GoPros, Fitbits and other gifts at the end. Not a bad way to spend your summer!
It's normally junior players from clubs around the state/country I believe. Not condoning the lack of payment but in their shoes I'd be ecstatic to be on the same court as my role models.
Former ball kid here. When I did it we didn’t get paid- it was a volunteer gig but we got meal allowance for food, some free tix and merch The rumour was that it used to be paid, but it didn’t meet the minimum standards under workplace laws at the time, and so they scrapped payment and made it a volunteer gig. Honestly I didn’t mind the no payment because most ballkids are 12-15 anyway so it’s more for fun, to be close to the players, and to be involved anyway. Then did give us fuel vouchers to give to our parents to cover some of the cost of driving us to Melbourne park
that probably settles it on some level i 100 percent get the experience would be 'pretty' cool for kids that love tennis - but the other day when the match went up to 4am i thought to myself these kids are working harder then i do and doing it for free
Reddit is full of idiots. Reddit thinks you're a fascist if you buy a Harry Potter game and refuse to date women with longer (profanity) than you. Kids don't even need to be paid that much per hour and these tennis tournaments generate millions in profits.
Reddit is full of idiots. Reddit thinks you're a fascist if you buy a Harry Potter game and refuse to date women with longer (profanity) than you. Kids don't even need to be paid that much per hour and these tennis tournaments generate millions in profits.
i dont know why im getting down voted i agree with you but if the kids feel the experience is 'worth it' then im not going to argue with them
i personally think they should be paid i mean the tennis CEO is on millions but if kids want to do it and there parents let them im not arguing with them
i think of it from the perspective of my own children if they wanted to do it would i let them sure…would i push them to do it hell no - bit of a believer you should never work for free becuz someone will take advantage of your good will like we have seen in so many charities in the past couple decades
Also
Reddit is full of idiots. Reddit thinks you're a fascist if you buy a Harry Potter game and refuse to date women with longer
yep i 100% agree there are a lot of socialist on reddit i mean r/Australia is literally a hard left communist lunatic asylum these days
even r/Ausfinance has been infected with nutters and it used to be a great place to talk about money matters
Next polls from the OP: 'should girl scouts get paid?' followed shortly by 'are ball kids really underpaid?'
“Should we pay people for putting their rubbish in the bin?”
Why do people always feel like they have to have an opinion on everything?
Let the market sort it out - if one day nobody wants to be a ballkid, then that's the day they need to start paying up.
Why do people always feel like they have to have an opinion on everything?
well considering it i a half a billion dollar event, tennis Australia is largely funded by tax payers, there are 100s of volunteers and the Australian open is currently on so it is something people might talk about and it has been plastered over the newspapers…..
Let the market sort it out - if one day nobody wants to be a ballkid, then that's the day they need to start paying up.
i dont disagree but just because someone is willing to do something for free doesnt mean it should be done for free - as long as the balls kids doing it feel as though it is worth it for the experience im not against it but it is something worth discussing the fact the poll is fairly split [at time of posting] is proof of that….
Why do people always feel like they have to have an opinion on everything?
This is actually one of the more insightful comments I've read on here in a while. On this particular matter, the issue directly affects maybe 1,000-odd people (the ballkids themselves) and has no real link to anything that may affect the community at large.
Why anyone other than the kids and their parents (and the tournament organisers, etc.) need to canvass the issue at all is beyond me.
There is a broader principle at play here.
There are a number of areas where you could possibly find someone to volunteer to fill the role, but is that something our society is willing to permit?
Lots of entry-level jobs in glamorous careers might find they have no shortage of volunteers for unpaid internships of many months working long hours in big businesses.
That doesn't mean that we should necessarily permit that to occur.
I am a bit torn on the issue personally.
I hear where you are coming from, but would humbly submit there is at least one degree of separation here … namely being a ball kid is not an "entry level" to anything. It is what it is over a couple of weeks and there are no career prospects that are enhanced/fettered from being/not being involved.
Other than Andy Murray … who would deadset boo Santa Claus … kicking up a stink because he had to play until 4 in the morning, it's just a non-issue beyond those directly involved IMHO.
I don't mind that they aren't getting paid. I'm sure for some junior players it would be a dream come true to be seen on TV at a Grand Slam. What does bother me is them being up at stupid hours like Murrays 4am game. They are kids and they need their sleep. Going back to school this week too.
O.P.'s username doesn't checkout.
why it isnt my money….and how do you know i am not a ball kid bahahah ;]
false equivalence at it again.
I would be at least 3x the age of all the ball boys and I would volunteer and run around collecting balls if it meant getting up close and personal with some of the players I have watched over the last decade or two.
fair enough i cannot argue with that
Why hello there Kramer
Ballkids, paid. Wheelchair volunteers, paid. AO is a business and money making endeavour, why shouldn't all people involved be paid. At a minimum, expenses should be paid.
They already get meal/food allowances, merch and tickets for the family (have read of the Reddit comments above, they're getting Lacoste shirts and Fitbits). That stuff is worth more than the $14 an hour or whatever they'd otherwise be 'paid' for their age. This is why there's dozens, hundreds of volunteers to do this "unpaid" work.
If you really wanted to you could probably offer them 2 packages: $14 an hour and no perks or "merch and family tickets" package. But realistically they'd take the latter because if they just wanted teenager pay they'd be behind the counter at HJ's.
I wonder if those kids get autographs from their idols too. Surely that's worth more than the wage paid.
Should meals on wheels volunteers be paid along withe RFS, wildlife rescuers, the pink or red men and ladies at hospitals, the 1000s at the Sydney Olympics, SES etc.
There are 5,900,000 volunteers in OZ.
https://www.aihw.gov.au/reports/australias-welfare/volunteer…
They should all be paid, but our economy relies on people doing stuff for nothing while CEO's earn $23.7M.
Working for a charity is a bit different to working for a for-profit business.
I would think there is a ballot system where they apply from tennis clubs in Victoria. It's a huge opportunity if you play tennis - maybe getting a chance to be on the court with your hero, meeting other kids around the area, getting free entry and food and even the chance to get on TV.
The profit from the AO does go back to Tennis Australia and I assume some of it goes back to some of the clubs the kids come from.
There's an application asking for your experience and then try outs for places. Hundreds apply, they don't need to offer payment at all with the volume of applications. The perks aren't bad either.
OP, you know there's other volunteer positions that are unpaid too at the AO? Not just ball kids. Also some paid positions eg linespeople (back when they had them…).
The Australian Open is like most Australian businesses - a shameless cash grab to rob punters of every cent. I am not surprised at all they don't pay the ball kids. I have been to other major opens and it is nothing like the Aus Open for how expensive and exclusive everything is. It is a real shame as I have no intention of ever going back but would go back to any of the others in an instant.
US Open ground pass is 70 USD - far more expensive than Australian Open. Ground pass at Wimbledon is lower but oh boy that two hour queue around the oval just to get to the ticket sales counter.
Middle Saturday Australian Open at John Cain Arena is great. Bring your own food.
Right now ball kids do it because they genuinely want to - they're aspiring tennis players and it's their passion. It's an incredible opportunity and extremely exclusive - most kids don't have access to a grand slam let alone get the opportunity to be there, meet their idols and have the best view in the arena. It's an experience they will cherish for the rest of their lives.
Add pay to the mix, and then you'll have kids wanting to do it because it's an opportunity to make some money.
Their passion is squatting around and chasing balls between being screamed at by overpaid players?
No, their passion is tennis. I figured that was obvious.
I've been watching a lot of the tennis, haven't seen a single ball kid be screamed at by anyone. It's got to be a pretty rare occurrence - but I'm not sure paying minimum wage will change that.
I was going to post an example but after Googling "screamed at ballboy" it seems it's so common that it would be easier to post examples of a male pro tennis player not abusing a ballboy.
@AustriaBargain: So you think players are overpaid, ball kids don't enjoy doing what they do, players scream at ball kids more often than not.
Clearly you don't watch the tennis, and have very little interest in the sport.
But hey, glad you have an opinion on what direction the sport should take and how it should be run.
@Harold Halfprice: I think they should shut the whole sport down and use the stadiums to run Yu-Gi-Oh! tournaments instead.
The Australian Open is a commercial event. People who work at a commercial event where other people get paid should also get paid. This idea of some people, especially young people, being expected to work at a commercial event and not get paid is as silly as young people being expected to work at McDonalds for the experience and not get paid. The term for that is exploitation. It is one of those crazy ideas that have come to us from America where young people are expected to fill out their resume by doing unpaid work before they can get a real job.
There are non-commercial events, community events, where no-one gets paid that young people working at should not expect to get paid. But the Australian Open is not a community event, it is a commercial event. If the organisers and the players expect to get paid so should those who work to run it. All of them.
I agree with you 100 percent
Most "community" events are a mixture of paid and unpaid participants however. e.g. school fair, church fetes: Parents run some of the stalls, paid caterers and entertainers operate other stalls, etc.
The "everyone gets paid or no one gets paid" model doesn't apply in most cases.
School fairs, church fetes, etc., are not businesses.
Are you pretending the paid/unpaid worker mix doesn't exist, or are you saying I didn't pick a big enough example of an annual event that collects money for its own purposes?
I think you'll find the Catholic church is one of the biggest businesses going!
I too agree.
I'm not even sure why children are used for this role; is it only because they can be used for free?
It was adults only for the Sydney Olympics.
Ok, but this post is about the tennis.
If you are talking about my post, people are paid that run 'community events' as you call them. RFS, SES, Salvos, Smith family, Vinnies etc. Plus I wouldn't call the Sydney Olympics a community event.
Many people who assist in sporting events do so on a volunteer basis, regardless of age. Events like the Olympics, World Cups and F1 all use volunteers.
As others have mentioned, some do it for the love of their sport, some do it to be up close with their sporting idols, or just for the experience to be a part of a major event. I know people who treasure their Sydney 2000 gear and even have it framed.
If all these people were paid ('fairly' or not), I can only see event organisers like Aus Open/FIFA/IOC/FIA passing all the costs onto the patrons to protect their profits, and tickets or other expenses at these events are already exorbitant enough.
As someone else mentioned above, the time to pay these people may come when people stop volunteering. The experience and other intangible benefits seem to be sufficient remuneration for volunteers to keep volunteering.
I think there have been other posts on here discussing volunteers at these major 'events', with mixed opinions.
My view is that these are all commercial endeavours and should therefore pay all employees. If that results in higher prices for tickets, and perhaps lower attendances from that, perhaps there is something wrong in the commercial model for those businesses.
Anyone remember seeing that ball girl who took a tennis ball being hit by a pro full speed to the gut? I saw it on the news I think.
Honestly felt sorry for her. What happened was she tried to keep her composure for the camera's but you could tell she was tearing up, so they paused the game for a second to let her off the court and another kid replaced her.
I didn't know they were being paid in lunch + cool points.
Edit: And to anyone who thinks she was being over dramatic (it's the internet I am expecting this kind of comment). I would like to see how you handle a tennis ball hitting you in the gut at 100km/h to 130km/h.
They’re too young to be payed, something about child labour laws.
Next it’ll be the ball boys at the footy wanting some dosh.