How Can I Convince My Partner to Buy BEV?

[Deactivated] on 24/01/2023 - 17:40
Last edited 24/01/2023 - 17:41

I initially found all BEVs to be particularly too simplistic IMO; it's like putting 15-inch tablet in a car like 'are you kidding me?' when I saw the likes of Tesla Model Y.

However I kind of grew on it for some odd reason I couldn't explained. I felt simplistic is good and it jolts me even more when I saw Jung Kyoung-Ho riding on Hyundai (pronounced hunday) Ioniq 5 in his latest KDrama Crash Course in Romance.

Long story short, I've been telling my partner that we should be going with PHEVs line for our next car because of FBT exemption. I sold it well to her because we normally do city rides most of the times and when kids grown up, they would want more longer road trips which is still a win win in PHEV.

Now that I want BEV, I am trying to find the weak points of PHEVs which I can't fault really. She has asked me in the past if we needed to queue up for those charging station in the middle of nowhere, on which I proudly said 'no because we have a fallback in our ICE' and with BEV …. the answer will now be 'yes, we will have to and if we are really in shortage of juice, we will need to queue up and wait for those people to finish with their charging which may takes minimum of 30 mins or longer'.

By the way, going to pure ICE is not an option. Based on my Novated Lease calculation, going for $80K ICE vehicle is completely silly when there's an option of $80K EVs or PHEVs (remember FBT exempt), simply because the ICE will cost us more at the end of the lease.

With that in mind, how can I convince my partner to buy BEV and not PHEV please?

Automotive Electric Vehicle

Comments

  • AustriaBargain on 24/01/2023 - 17:47
    +3

    Why do you only have one car anyway? Why can't she get the car she wants and you get the car you want.

    • Taro Milk Tea on 24/01/2023 - 17:49
      +1

      Maybe no money

      • AustriaBargain on 24/01/2023 - 17:52
        +1

        I guess one must work from home. Who is going to be driving this one car more is probably an important question.

        • [Deactivated] on 24/01/2023 - 18:10

          I will be the main chauffeur but she is in the steering committee; I just pitch the idea and make my justifications clear as to why I like the car. I'm in a bit of pickle right now.

          • AustriaBargain on 24/01/2023 - 18:12

            @[Deactivated]: And who is paying for most of it? If you selling the old car, who actually owned the old car before the relationship?

            • [Deactivated] on 24/01/2023 - 18:12

              @AustriaBargain: her but again it is a matter of justifying that purchase, justifying that car

              • AustriaBargain on 24/01/2023 - 18:16
                +6

                @[Deactivated]: Sounds like it's ultimately up to her. Can't you let her get the car she wants and then you buy yourself an EV later on?

          • bobbified on 24/01/2023 - 18:17
            +2

            @[Deactivated]:

            …but she is in the steering committee

            Are you a PM? lol

    • coffeeinmyveins on 24/01/2023 - 22:05
      +4

      why do you only have one car anyway

      I love how we are so horny for cars that the first thing people say is why do two people "only have one car".

      • AustriaBargain on 24/01/2023 - 22:47
        +1

        Just seems odd. A lot of jobs expect you to have a car, if OP drives the car to and from work then what does gf do, catch the bus? Work from home? Can she not go shopping with more than an armful of groceries on the bus while OP as at work. If gf drives interstate to visit family for a week does OP just not have a car for a week? I guess working from home can make this all a lot easier, and if you both work from home them you barely need one car. Still seems odd to spend 80k on one car when you can get two for 40k each.

        Maybe gf finds it odd too for all we know.

        • coffeeinmyveins on 25/01/2023 - 09:54
          +2

          A lot of jobs expect you to have a car

          Depends who you run with. Of my entire friends circle none of them need a car for work, they all either live close enough to walk to their office or catch public transport. But I understand a lot of people don't have that luxury.

          Still seems odd to spend 80k on one car when you can get two for 40k each.

          True but two cars means two sets of rego, two lots of insurances, maybe they don't have garage space etc.

        • jacross on 27/01/2023 - 08:39

          My family unit went from two cars to one a few years ago. It's an adjustment but not too bad at all actually. I like to ride my bike and we also use public transport a reasonable amount. It worked before WFH became a thing. Our kids are under 10. Teens may change things.

          People need to judge based on their own circumstances but I was surprised at how little of a detriment it was. I think the default for most is you need multiple cars and I seek to change that as the default.

      • 2esc on 25/01/2023 - 10:07

        In regional areas you have no choice with lack of public transport and when they can access public transport its not often enough. Constantly asking friends for lifts many feel is rude.

        • coffeeinmyveins on 25/01/2023 - 14:16

          Yeah definitely, and I totally appreciate my luxury in being able to use public transport and have one vehicle.

  • bobbified on 24/01/2023 - 17:55
    +2

    ….then I saw the likes of Tesla Model Y.

    Is it just me or do other people find that Tesla's feel more like an 'appliance' (as opposed to a more luxurious interior) with luxury car price tag?

    Me personally, I think there's not enough charging stations just yet to justify a BEV. As a second car, maybe… but definitely not as the only vehicle in the house.

    By the way, going to pure ICE is not an option. Based on my Novated Lease calculation, going for $80K ICE vehicle is completely silly when there's an option of $80K EVs or PHEVs (remember FBT exempt), simply because the ICE will cost us more at the end of the lease.

    You do know that there's ICE vehicles that are less than $80K, right? You don't have to spend the whole amount.

    • [Deactivated] on 24/01/2023 - 18:07
      -4

      You do know that there's ICE vehicles that are less than $80K, right? You don't have to spend the whole amount.

      Just trying to make a fair apple to apple comparison with $80K ICE vs $80K EV. In saying that, our kids are growing too so we want something on par if not bigger than our previous car (X5) for legroom purposes.

      • Liamv4696 on 25/01/2023 - 20:49
        +1

        'We need something bigger than an X5 for legroom'
        How tall are you and your kids, 7 foot 2? An X5 is practically a house on wheels already. Jesus..

        • [Deactivated] on 26/01/2023 - 08:22

          If you're going to quote someone, please don't remove a single word from their statement. To answer your question, I am 7' and partner is 6'2, we're tall hence legroom is important. Anyway, perhaps I deviated from the subject matter.

      • bomberswarm2 on 26/01/2023 - 21:22

        That's not a fair comparison at all. You're comparing a mid cost EV ($80k) to a ultra high end ICE. Instead compare it to a mid cost ICE, about 30k. The fact the EV is double the cost is one of the disadvantages of EVs right now. I agree, nobody should buy an 80k ICE these days. That's just plain obvious because the EV will hold far more value over the next 5 years and be cheaper to run than the ICE.

    • coffeeinmyveins on 24/01/2023 - 22:06
      +3

      Is it just me or do other people find that Tesla's feel more like an 'appliance' (as opposed to a more luxurious interior) with luxury car price tag?

      Because they are, and the interiors are generally poor quality. Had a mate buy a new 3 and it was laughable how bad the QC was on that thing.

      To me Teslas are the pinnacle in bad UX. I'm surprised there aren't more accidents because people are fiddling around with a flat screen as opposed to muscle memory with physical buttons.

  • Seraphin7 on 24/01/2023 - 17:57
    +23

    You seem to have a slightly unnatural fascination with the various acronyms in your post.

  • Drakesy on 24/01/2023 - 18:09
    +3

    Just buy a BYD
    PHEVs as cool as they are are overpriced tbh.

    Just get a cheap secondhand ICE and a BYD for running around town.
    Sorted.

  • mskeggs on 24/01/2023 - 18:10
    +3

    I live outside Sydney, go camping and plenty of visits to family in the country, and have done one trip in the last 15 years where a Tesla’s range would have required a mid journey recharge.
    IMO, if you are buying a car for what “might happen in future” you aren’t optimising for your real needs.
    Plenty of people need to drive 500km+ in a single session, who might have concerns about battery range, but the bulk of drivers need this very rarely.

    And if you do need long range once in a while, there are plenty of charging places, and a swag more on the drawing board.
    If you want to do an outback roadtrip in a few years, rent a 4wd for a week.

    • pegaxs on 24/01/2023 - 20:33
      +11

      Plenty of people need to drive 500km+ in a single session…

      Yeah, but not many. And even when they do, it's very infrequent. And even when you do, you can drive for 2~3 hours, get out, stretch a walk around, a have piss have, order a coffee all while your car is on a fast charger to get you the rest of the way.

      I literally just did this over the weekend in my EV. 515km. Drove for about 300~ish km, got to a fast charger and plugged in. Went for a piss, came back ordered a drink and had an ice cream while I waited the 20 min for the charge. Unplugged, got back in and kept driving to the destination.

      The other things is, I dont think people should be driving 500+km in a single stint. I cant do it as a truck driver, I cant see why car drivers can. People need to get over this unrealistic expectation of "Well, when I can do 1000km in one sitting, I'll get an EV." when 95+% of their driving is to work, 5~10km away and back. Or their favorite holiday spot is at most 3 or less hours away.

      And there is also this fascination with thinking you always have to be charging to 100%. You dont need to charge to 100% if you are only going another 100km down the road. You slap in what it needs and keep going. 5 to 15 mins might be all the charge you need.

      I agree that there is always a case for having ICE vehicles. I dont think I would attempt the Tanami track in an EV, but Sydney to Melb or Brisbane to Sydney, absolutely.

      InB4: But Syd to Mel takes 14+ hours and an overnight stay in an EV and only 6 hours in an ICEV… Yeah, nah, if it does, you are doing it wrong.

      Let's do an example: (I'll use my BYD Atto 3 as the test car for EV range)
      According to Google Maps, A trip from Parramatta to Middle of Melbourne is 870km. So, let's use that.

      With charging included, ABRP says I can do the trip in 11h 13m. The longest charge I would need to do is 51 mins. The shortest charge is 24 mins.

      Google maps says 9h 3m if I could drive the whole way without stopping. Not many ICE cars can do 870km on a single fill up, so let's throw in 1 fuel stop and because its 9+ hours, let's throw in a rest break at the same time. So, if we add an hour for the rest/lunch break and a fuel stop in an ICE, it takes it out to 10h 3 mins.

      So, over 870km, an ICE would save you about 1h 10m. Add kids into the mix and you are stopping way more often in an ICE than doing a solid 10h non-stop, so that 1h 10m shrinks even further.

      Using your example of "500km", from Wahroonga to Coffs Harbour, it is 503km. Google says, non stop, 5h 14mins. In my EV, I would need to make one stop at Taree (after driving for 2 hours) for 55 mins. Sounds like a good "piss break, stretch and a coffee" break to me. 6h 4 mins including all the stops I need to make in an EV. Again, kids in the ICE car and you are not going to have a fun drive for 5+ hours. Any stop in the ICE for pissing and drinks/food for the kids just cuts into your 50~ish min headstart.

      would have required a mid journey recharge.

      Have you literally never stopped to get out, stretch, have a toilet break, fuel up or get some food? You dont have to sit there and watch an EV charge. You can walk off and do other things… ICE owners acting like charging is this massive imposition on their life.

      • Euphemistic on 24/01/2023 - 20:58

        InB4: But Syd to Mel takes 14+ hours and an overnight stay in an EV and only 6 hours in an ICEV… Yeah, nah, if it does, you are doing it wrong.

        watched a YouTube clip a few days ago where the ‘raced’ an ice against a BEV Sydney to melb. Yes, the ICE was driving at 90 to hypermile and get there on one tank, but the time difference was insignificant with the EV having several charge stops. If the ice had kept to the speed limit it would have had to refuel costing time.

        Yes, it was just a YouTube ‘stunt’ and park sky edited and biased but showed what you can attempt.

        https://youtu.be/uEEBq1AXhJw

        • [Deactivated] on 25/01/2023 - 06:28
          +1

          The Aldi guy was a Guinea pig for the detour; Kia guy should have followed exactly his route and then detour the same way. Without being bias to any of the vehicle, the test itself is just unfair.

          • Euphemistic on 25/01/2023 - 08:12

            @[Deactivated]: While effectively it wasn’t ‘fai’r, it did show that depending on your travel arrangements it is entirely possible to get from Sydney to Melbourne within a similar amount of time.

            I’d guess that most drivers who do Sydney to Melbourne don’t want to drive as fast as possible without stopping.

            Having done my fair share of day long trips it is far more pleasant to break it up with several 20-30min (or more) stops along the way. Especially if you have passengers.

        • pegaxs on 25/01/2023 - 10:36

          I did watch that, and I thought it was hilarous that the car that did the best out of all of them was the hybrid Kia (??) camera car… The one that wasnt even in the race… :D

  • brendanm on 24/01/2023 - 18:21
    +1

    I felt simplistic is good and it jolts me even more when I saw Jung Kyoung-Ho riding on Hyundai (pronounced hunday) Ioniq 5 in his latest KDrama Crash Course in Romance.

    😂😂😂

    • 87percent on 24/01/2023 - 19:03
      +1

      Watch Hometown Cha Cha Cha and see the Audi

  • Euphemistic on 24/01/2023 - 19:51
    +5

    When was the last time you actually drove more than the range of your proposed EV? How many times per year will you actually need to use a public charger, let alone wait for one? Unless you require a public charge more than once a month what the big imposition? Don’t many of the ‘EV bad’ stories are aimed at keeping us buying petrol. More and more public chargers are being installed. You may be able to slow charge overnight wherever you travel too just by taking and extension cord.

    PHEV is a poor compromise. Still needs to stop at the servo for fuel. Still needs regular oil changes and servicing. More systems to go wrong in it. EV range is probably insufficient for a commute plus kiddie transport every afternoon.

    • [Deactivated] on 26/01/2023 - 08:45

      When was the last time you actually drove more than the range of your proposed EV? How many times per year will you actually need to use a public charger, let alone wait for one? Unless you require a public charge more than once a month what the big imposition?

      During school holidays, there's always that opportunity to travel, either by plane or just road trips. For the latter, just like any other households, sometimes we just don't do nothing, sometimes we travel 30-40 km (one-way) to nearby CBDs and sometimes we can travel interstate like to Canberra which is 250-280 km (one-way).

      Frequency wise (from the most to the least): the nearby trips, do nothing, interstate travel (longer road trips).

      The interstate travel is the one I couldn't justify BEV to her.

      The question that she will ask 'if we are going to Melbourne/Brisbane from Sydney, do we need to look for public charging on our way?' And the answer to this is 'regardless even we're travelling by ICE/PHEV, we will need to still stop by petrol station to refuel'.

      The next question I could envisage 'how long does it take to charge BEV? And during school holidays, as more BEVs on the road, what's the likelihood there will be queue to charge? What if out of 5 chargers, only 3 is working? Queue will build up'. The answer to this is 'even petrol station can have faulty pumps' which is…. really a weak answer because I could already see the counter 'How long does it take to fill up an ICE vehicle? And even if the queue does not move, we can always find another nearby petrol station, which you wouldn't be able to do with BEVs because the infrastructure is not there yet. Let me ask you how many charging stations compared to petrol stations? I let you figure that out'. And I would be stuck here, speechless because she got a point.

      • Euphemistic on 26/01/2023 - 12:43

        Stop thinking about what if (bad thing) happens and start thinking about all the other times when you don’t need to go get fuel. When was the last time you actually needed to refuel during a trip home? You probably made the choice to do so because it’s quick and easy. You likely could have just as easily refueled the day before and not stopped.

        You’ve pretty much indicated you never drive further than the expected range of an EV. For that one time where you might, you just need to plan ahead a little tiny bit more than you do now. As for ‘all the public chargers are full’. It’s probably as rare as you actually needing one. If you are on holidays and planning a long trip home and expect it to be busy, fully charge the day before, then plan a route that is a little more out of the way so there’s less chance of needing a charge during a busy time. - but then, you don’t travel further than a full charge anyway.

  • Hydralyte on 24/01/2023 - 20:24
    -2

    Reading your OP is aids.

    What the hell is BEV, FBT, PHEDAD, DSADASD, URMUM etc.

  • ass3ts on 24/01/2023 - 21:59
    +3

    It's not pronounced 'hunday'

    • Euphemistic on 25/01/2023 - 06:20

      Say Hi to Hi-oon-die.

      All day, every day Hee-unn-day.

      What is it really?

      • ass3ts on 25/01/2023 - 21:54

        People made up so many different ways to pronounce it except in its original language. Should start anglicising French too to be fair.

  • seanfoite on 24/01/2023 - 22:17
    +1

    All of your wording reads as you have decided on what you want and you are looking for advice on how to steamroll your partner's concerns until they give in. How about a reasonable discussion and then a compromise (which from the sounds of it is exactly what a PHEV is).

  • djkelly69 on 24/01/2023 - 23:32
    +1

    Don't really care about the philosophical debate part of this thread.

    To answer your question, I would be focussing on the fact that you can (presumably?) just charge the BEV at home, and the extra servicing costs, more potential for extra costs, etc, associated with a PHEV compared to a BEV.

    • [Deactivated] on 25/01/2023 - 06:34
      -1

      Having the ICE in PHEV can be double edged sword, is that what you are referring to? It's a good fallback when battery juice fully exhausted but that also means double the maintenance because it has both ICE & EV in it. Good point. Maybe I could use that point.

  • Thinkscape on 25/01/2023 - 08:19
    +1

    Easy. Go to https://www.evee.com.au/, borrow one or two models for weekend, or a short road trip, load it up with toys, luggage, family etc. and have a go. Go shopping, school drop off, usual daily chores and see how it feels. Come back, show partner how trivial it is to plug in, charge with with your solar at home, try out all the features. I’d sprinkle it with learning basics about localised pollution and the harm from fossil exhaust, esp to children.
    Also keep in mind hybrids are mostly used by legacy manufacturers to greenwash, get carbon credits in US and EU, while still pedalling fossil engines (with attached underpowered electric motor and tiny battery). Hybrids are notoriously expensive to maintain after warranty period, overcomplicated, service hates them for a reason.

  • iCandy on 25/01/2023 - 08:19

    There are quite a few 2019-2022 Teslas for sale on Marketplace. Wonder why?

    • Thinkscape on 25/01/2023 - 08:48
      +2

      Because Model Y started shipping late last year and some families upgrade from 3 to the SUV form factor. Also some people have enough money to upgrade cars every 2 years or so.

      • coffeeinmyveins on 25/01/2023 - 09:56

        Also some people have enough money to upgrade cars every 2 years or so.

        One doesn't always relate to the other. I know plenty of people that have fancy cars, the latest gen phones, designer clothes etc but live on crippling credit card debt, eat packets of Campbells soups and never go on holiday to support that image.

    • coffeeinmyveins on 25/01/2023 - 09:57
      -1

      Because they've started falling apart already?

  • Ghost47 on 25/01/2023 - 10:31
    +1

    Just wait til BYD become more popular in Aus, Tesla will be forced to drop their prices.

    Sounds to me like you want to buy it ASAP due to emotion?

  • gyrex on 25/01/2023 - 12:23
    +1

    We picked up a Tesla Model Y in September and we've never had to use a public charger. The car has 400km of real world range and it charges overnight to 100% so the only time, realistically, you'd need to charge publicly is if one was going on a driving holiday. This public charger anxiety is irrational.

    • [Deactivated] on 25/01/2023 - 12:38

      This is assuming you've got 3-phase charger at home, which is additional cost on top of the car and we need to have licensed electrician to install?

      • gyrex on 25/01/2023 - 12:45
        +1

        A 3-phase charger is a nice to have but not required. A single phase 32A (7kW) install will still charge the car overnight from 0-100%. We're currently renting at the moment while we build a house and have no dedicated charger installed at the rental and are currently using the UMC (mobile charger) using a standard 10A tail and still haven't required a public charger - we just plug in whenever we get home so the car is always charging. Admittedly we don't drive long distances on a daily basis (we probably average 50-80km/day) but even trips from the Sunshine Coast to Brisbane and back (~200km) will still charge the car overnight or when we're not using it.

  • freefall101 on 25/01/2023 - 17:17
    -1

    You watched a movie and now you want a BEV? I’d listen to your partner, only because you sound as stupidly impulsive as I am and it sounds like they’re rightfully keeping you in check.

  • md333 on 25/01/2023 - 17:22
    +1

    I just got an outlander PHEV as our long range car. Seems like a good compromise if you want to get out into regional WA at the moment where there is little charging infrastructure. The planned roll out over the next couple of years should fix that though. Ive already done a number of trips that would be much less convenient in an EV. Probably possible though, but gets very inconvenient if one fast charger is down. Even Tesla don't have much in WA at the moment.

    All the local running around is pure EV so filling with petrol only néeded for regional trips.

    It had the advantage of being half the price of a long range EV. (1 year old). Not sure Id pay full price for a new one, and second hand EV prices are slowly starting to come down so may be an option in future.

    • [Deactivated] on 25/01/2023 - 17:28

      which MY of Outlander PHEV you got there? and do you agree/disagree with this statement; in short as Outlander PHEV has the best of both world, being ICE & EV, does this mean double maintenance cost as you need to service your fuel engine and also your electrical?

      • md333 on 25/01/2023 - 17:43
        +2

        I have a Dec 2021, with the larger 2.4L engine and battery, but not the current model with much larger battery. Typically only does 40-50km in EV mode.
        Its certainly not double maintenance cost, but does need an annual oil change that an EV won't. Tesla seem very generous with their warranty allowing you to largely skip servicing (I think partly because the car monitors itself and reports back if there are issues), but most other EV manufacturers still require an annual service. Hopefully not as ridiculously priced now as the last service on our i-MiEV was (first production EV in Aus, $600 for major service at dealer).

        I do think most of the other PHEV options are relatively unattractive, as they still have an automatic gearbox to maintain and lug around. The Mitsubishi's have a fully electric AWD drive train, and typically run entirely on the electric motors, just with the motor generating electricity once the battery is depleted. They do allow the engine to drive the front wheels directly at higher speeds(basically only has top gear) for slightly better efficiency on highway runs outside battery range.
        If you are not in WA I think the charging infrastructure is a lot better elsewhere, but can still be inconvenient especially if critical chargers are out of order, there is not a lot of redundancy yet, so a small chance of getting stuck somewhere for hours waiting for a charger or slow charging, not a high chance but probably higher than running out of petrol these days.

        • md333 on 25/01/2023 - 17:46

          I should mention the current Outlander PHEV, as well as being expensive, seems fairly sold out, might have trouble getting one before the FBT deal for PHEVs runs out. Thats a pretty good argument for a BEV, I think the BYD and Tesla are in fairly good supply now at least.

          • [Deactivated] on 25/01/2023 - 17:54

            @md333:

            might have trouble getting one before the FBT deal for PHEVs runs out

            there is timeline pressing on this for April 2025 end date for PHEV. Sounds might be plenty of time (2 years 2 months) but you're right, we need to find decision by mid year this year the max as delivery date is normally 12 months++ from the order date.

            • Euphemistic on 25/01/2023 - 19:36
              +2

              @[Deactivated]: Something to consider with a PHEV i that you will have to charge EVERY NIGHT otherwise you’ve got an ICE with extra weight to cart around and you’ll lose the big advantage of running on sparks. If you get a current model BEV with 300km range you likely won’t NEED to charge every night if your daily travel is only 50km like most people.

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