Fights Broken out between Tiktok Guys and Parents at The Park

Aerith-Waifu on 22/02/2023 - 18:19
Last edited 22/02/2023 - 18:20

Witnessed a fight this morning, apparently some would be Tiktok guys was doing filming in a public park, however some parents having a birthday party not far away was not happy that the tiktok people was filming in their direction and was worried they will appear in the tiktok once their filming are finished.

Words got exchanged and it got physical, one of the filming guy was shouting this is a free country and we can film on public land, and the other parents was shouting back not if you are filming and have us in the video.

Interested in your thoughts on this, who is right and who is wrong here? Does the parents needs to give consent here? Or does the tiktok guys right about filming in public space? (Parks, walkways, etc)

There is alot of walking tours on YouTube, basically people with a 4k camera walking slowly and doing filming while at it. Some videos captures hundreds of people in it, does consent needed for these people?

Poll Options

  • 53
    1: Tiktok guys have the rights to film by law despite been aholes
  • 154
    2: parents have right to ask them stop as it's in a public park
  • 536
    3: Filming in public space is allowed
Home & Garden

Comments

  • bboyballsohard on 22/02/2023 - 18:29
    +16

    I hate it when kids film TikTok on my lawn!

    • Aerith-Waifu on 22/02/2023 - 18:42

      Can't you argue they are trespassing on private property?

      I mean if they filming on your lawn your house would be in it

      • Brian McGee on 22/02/2023 - 19:20
        +38

        Plot twist, it’s his own kids.

      • andrek on 23/02/2023 - 07:42
        +1

        I tried trespassing them, but then they call DOCS…

    • turk182 on 23/02/2023 - 09:04
      +2

      What's worse is those kids riding their skateboards on the sidewalks!

  • brendanm on 22/02/2023 - 18:30
    +110

    Sadly the tiktok degenerates are correct, they have every right to film on public property. However they should still be the ones who go away, as tiktok is terrible, and the people filming garbage for it are also terrible.

    • Aerith-Waifu on 22/02/2023 - 18:40
      +1

      Are the law the same across all states? This really sux if someone shooting films in my direction and I have no say in it.

      • Baysew on 22/02/2023 - 18:55
        +15

        Our local council (VIC) requires a permit -

        Filming and photography permit
        A permit is required for all professional and amateur filming or photography that takes place or impacts on any park, road reserve, foreshore area or any area that is under the jurisdiction and/or management of Council. Fees apply (but are not restricted to) the following categories:
        -commercial filming
        -amateur/emerging producers and/or directors
        -commercial still photography
        -community or student filming
        -parking of oversize vehicles during filming and photography.

        • Iwantthebestprice on 22/02/2023 - 18:59
          +6

          Interesting… talk about finding a creative way to get money from the people

          • Baysew on 22/02/2023 - 19:06
            +13

            @Iwantthebestprice: Better to get money out the people rather than ratepayers.

            Fees and Charges
            Commercial Filming (full day) Per Day $1,431.00
            Commercial Filming
            (half day, 4 hours or less) Half Day $798.00
            Commercial Filming-additional day (consecutive) Per Day $728.00
            Low Impact Filming Per Booking $168.00
            Amateur/Emerging Filming Per Day $786.00
            Community or Student Filming Per Booking $106.00
            Over Sized Vehicles (per vehicle, per day) Per Vehicle, Per Day $147.00
            Commercial Photography Per Day $623.00
            Commercial Photography-additional day
            (consecutive) Per Day $327.00
            Unit Base Per Day $246.00

            • Almost Banned on 23/02/2023 - 00:25
              -1

              @Baysew: Um, the ratepayers are people…

              • CommuterPolluter on 25/02/2023 - 02:19

                @Almost Banned: People paying these permits are likely to be commercial entities based in other LGAs. Otherwise the inner city rate payers are just subsiding photographers based in the outer suburbs.

          • Aerith-Waifu on 22/02/2023 - 20:40
            +3

            @Iwantthebestprice: How would they even enforce it though???

            • aliceisstupid on 23/02/2023 - 07:27
              +1

              @Aerith-Waifu: Real film shoots, as opposed to TikTok on your iPhone, are pretty obvious and usually take hours minimum. Council sends someone out to check your permit.

              Certain Melb councils are more popular for shooting in because they have the cheapest permits

          • ankor on 23/02/2023 - 20:20
            +2

            @Iwantthebestprice: Apparently, you're stung hard with these sorts of fees everywhere if you try and do things the right way. It's also said to be a lot worse in the U.S.

        • Love a bargain on 23/02/2023 - 12:41
          +1

          However much I dislike them, not sure TikTok falls into that category unless one can prove that the TikTok guy is making money from it to that point that it is classified as commercial.

        • Enuffstuff on 23/02/2023 - 23:25

          Hmm legal interpretation of amateur (photography) - where is the line drawn between family snaps and selfies, casual hobbyists and Flickr types?

          "Fees apply (but are not restricted to)" I hope that is qualified somewhere otherwise it's an open book to fine anyone with a phone taking a picture, depending on the council's mood. Maybe it's a legal test of reasonableness but as a hobbyist I wouldn't want to have to defend myself in court every time some jobsworth pulled me up for poking a macro lens at some spider.

        • cerealJay on 24/02/2023 - 00:56
          +2

          Our local council (VIC) requires a permit -

          LOL where did you get that from? It's not accurate. Amateur photographers DO NOT require a permit to take pictures!

          According to forestsandreserves.vic.gov.au:

          No permit is required for:
          most amateur filming or photography for personal interest
          low impact filming activities (six or fewer people including all crew and talent).

          This means that low impact commercial filming would not require a permit either. All the comments in this thread claiming you need a permit whenever you make money from a photo or video, are wrong. The only time you need a permit is when your gear has an impact - multiple tripods, lighting rigs, booms etc. The new gen professionals using their phone cameras and one friend/crew, do not need a permit in many cases. Nor could it ever be policed anyway. They'd need to ban ALL filming, including grandma's happy snaps at the park picnic.

            • cerealJay on 24/02/2023 - 11:27
              -1

              @Baysew: They have worded it incorrectly and contradict themselves. According to that page, "all amateur filming or photography" requires a permit if it "takes place in" a park or public area, which of course is not the case in Victoria.

              Further down the page it says:

              "A permit is not required for non-commercial wedding photo/filming shoots."

              LOL if someone in the crew is wearing a wedding dress, the council doesn't want your permit money!

              The permits are meant for filming that impacts the area, such as a crew of people blocking paths, needing traffic management etc. This is obvious when you look at the permit fees :

              Amateur/emerging producers or directors per $786.00
              Commercial filming in Council open space - Full Day $1,431.00

      • DashCam AKA Rolts on 22/02/2023 - 18:57
        +20

        I believe that if you are in a public space, you have no claim on privacy re photography/filming.

        • vchar on 23/02/2023 - 10:57
          -5

          i'm not sure nor trying to argue but each public school which my son has/had attended ask for parents' consent to do any photography or filming. not sure if it is the case here.

          • DashCam AKA Rolts on 23/02/2023 - 11:56
            +9

            @vchar: Even if it is a public school, it's not a public space.
            Children are required to be there and as such there are various legal protections in place to ensure their safety. Therefore education departments/schools/teachers err on the side of caution if moving outside the actual job of teaching, ie photography and filming.
            Might interest you to know that teachers who don't want their photo taken often get severe push back.

        • Bangers on 23/02/2023 - 11:04
          +5

          unless you have an expectation of privacy - which is the concept that underpins the prohibitions on recording people in public bathrooms, upskirting etc.

        • Poor Ass on 23/02/2023 - 12:57

          what about perverts that do close ups on boobies? if they get caught it's ok because there's no claim on privacy in a public space?

          • Sleeqb7 on 23/02/2023 - 13:33
            +1

            @Poor Ass: I would have to presume that falls under some other relevant laws.

          • skittlebrau on 23/02/2023 - 15:26
            +1

            @Poor Ass: That's different. The wording of the law will vary depending on the state, but there's provisions against things like upskirts, cleavage shots etc. in public.

            • Poor Ass on 23/02/2023 - 16:31
              -1

              @skittlebrau: talk about equality

              if women and men choose to be topless at a beach both topless photos should be same

          • Jenbrook on 23/02/2023 - 23:01

            @Poor Ass: Unless your in the tiktokers face with your tits out I doubt some kid with a iPhone is going to get any decent boob shots of you.

          • JumperC on 24/02/2023 - 01:17

            @Poor Ass: In most states that’s actually perfectly legal, NSW has particular laws that deal with such behaviour, however they have to prove the photo was for an indecent purpose. Just capturing someone’s naked breasts in the background of a beach photograph isn’t enough for it to be illegal.

            There’s also other laws in regards to stalking or harassment etc.

            More or less if what is captured by the camera is clearly visible to anyone walking by it’s perfectly legal to photograph and even sell that photograph commercially (note that for things like advertising campaigns you really need a model release if the person features as you can’t imply they endorse something they don’t)

            More info here:
            https://www.artslaw.com.au/information-sheet/street-photogra…

      • Iwantthebestprice on 22/02/2023 - 18:58
        +8

        Seems like it:
        Is it legal to film in public places in Australia?

        Yes. Everywhere in Australia, the law says you can record in public, even if the police tell you to stop but you need to be aware of your legal obligations. Generally, you can also record conversations or activities that are 'public' even if they happen on private property.

        It’s pretty sad that literally some guy can come up to you in a public park or shopping centre, shove their phone in your face and record yourself and your family and the entire interaction even if you are uncomfortable, then post it on the internet and there is nothing they have done wrong by the law. I don’t know if you have the right to push them out of your personal space, or even if personal space is defined by law?

        But the minute you push them, grab their phone or something you would be the one who is arrested..

        • Brian McGee on 22/02/2023 - 19:24
          +3

          I don’t think they can shove it in your face, but if they are 10m away in a park and filming themselves with you in the background then so what?
          Also shopping centers usually have their own terms and conditions of entry, so do shops, where filming may be banned.

        • Aerith-Waifu on 22/02/2023 - 20:41

          No consent needed when it goes to YouTube?

          • Ridiculous Panda on 22/02/2023 - 22:26
            +3

            @Aerith-Waifu: You can always contact youtube and they might remove the video or ask the uploader to blur your face if they think it is necessary (especially if the video is monetised). Doesn’t make it illegal though.

          • munecito on 23/02/2023 - 02:21

            @Aerith-Waifu: Not really. unless they are using it as part of a commercial in which you seem to be endorsing the product.

        • cerealJay on 24/02/2023 - 00:25
          -1

          I don’t know if you have the right to push them out of your personal space

          You have the human right to push them out of your personal space if they are harassing you.

          Doesn't matter if they're filming or not. If they're in your face, and you ask them to leave and they don't leave, then you are being harassed. Physical proximity matters in confrontations, it will be seen as threatening behaviour. Not to mention the increased risk of viral transmission, which has real physical consequences. So it's not just about "not liking someone's location", it's more than that.

          • banana365 on 25/02/2023 - 16:41

            @cerealJay:

            You have the human right to push them out of your personal space if they are harassing you

            Don't make that assumption. Pushing someone is definitely assault, whereas harassing someone may or may not be assault (it depends on whether the person being harassed feels they are under threat of harm).

            Pushing someone who's being an arse that could have been ignored or walked away from may end up with you being the one in greater trouble.

      • herpadurkastan on 23/02/2023 - 17:42

        Unfortunately anyone can film in a public place and say it's for personal use; that just comes down to human decency, which these marshmallows on tiktok obnoxiously do not possess. Not exactly sure how tiktok works but what qualifies for commercial use is if they're getting paid / financially gaining from views, in which case they'd need your consent.

        • cerealJay on 24/02/2023 - 00:39
          +2

          they'd need your consent.

          Consent isn't needed in many cases for commercial use. If the video doesn't defame you, there's not much you could do legally if you don't like the video. You were in public remember. It's why channel 7 or any commercial channel can film people on the street walking by, and not need their consent.

        • JumperC on 24/02/2023 - 01:22
          +1

          If you’re in a public place (street etc) it’s irrelevant whether it’s commercial or not. Anyone is free to photograph anything from a public place and profit from the photo/film.

          The caveat is that they can’t use that photo to represent you endorse a product in an ad etc. But a telephoto headshot of you on the front page of a photo book, newspaper or magazine, anyone absolutely can do, consent is not required.

          https://www.artslaw.com.au/information-sheet/street-photogra…

    • jv on 22/02/2023 - 19:35
      -6

      Sadly the tiktok degenerates are correct

      Not if they publish it without permission.

      • brendanm on 22/02/2023 - 19:38
        +2

        Off the top of my head, that only applies if the footage is used in a commercial way, happy to be corrected.

        • jv on 22/02/2023 - 19:39
          +8

          if the footage is used in a commercial way

          which is one reason people post on TikTok

          • brendanm on 22/02/2023 - 19:40
            +10

            @jv: I think you'd be hard pressed to win that one, its probably just some idiot with 10 followers doing a moronic dance, hardly classified as commercial.

          • furyou on 24/02/2023 - 22:24
            +1

            @jv: that's not what commercial means
            it's only if it's shown as an endorsement for a product

            again, just because you think it's wrong doesn't mean a professional TikToker doesn't know their laws and rights.

        • JumperC on 24/02/2023 - 01:23

          It still doesn’t apply even if used commercially. Consent is not required for any photography taken from a public place, regardless of if it’s used commercially, as long as it isn’t used to represent that you endorse a product etc.

          https://www.artslaw.com.au/information-sheet/street-photogra…

      • Aerith-Waifu on 22/02/2023 - 20:31

        Please explain, so it's ok to film, but not ok to publish for the world to see?

        • jjjaar on 22/02/2023 - 20:47
          +3

          It’s ok to film and to publish it, it’s about commercial gain that dictates whether or not you need permission for distribution. That is, whether or not you are making money DIRECTLY off the footage.

          That includes selling the footage/output for monetary gain or using it in a film that you will charge admission to.

          Posting to TikTok does not equal direct monetary gain, however, if it’s being used to satisfy a contract for a paid ad, then that could cross the line. Also possibly subscriber only content could be considered commercial too.

          • Aerith-Waifu on 22/02/2023 - 21:29

            @jjjaar: When you said there is no direct monetary gain, what happens if the video is sponsored by a company and the video gets millions of view and start to gain income? Or does that falls under the grey area?

            • jjjaar on 22/02/2023 - 21:36
              +1

              @Aerith-Waifu: I genuinely do not know the actual answers. My very basic understanding of this stems from being involved in amateur photography for absolutely no commercial gain, but needing to have enough information to defend myself if someone would question me in public.

              My guess is that both are in the grey area, though I would think that the one that is specifically sponsored could probably be considered for commercial purposes. If someone were to see themselves in the footage of a sponsored post, they should definitely seek legal advice on their options.

              In my view, the only difference here is that the tiktoker creates, produces and releases the “ad”, and is paid by the company, instead of the traditional way where a company creates, produces and releases the ad, and hires the actor to work on it.

              It’s also possibly why companies are engaging people on social media to do this. Not only do they not have to create, produce or release the ad, but there’s no admin associated with approvals to film in locations or needing to pay for extras in the background. Much easier and cheaper for them to get their product out there, with the added bonus of it being “vouched for” by a supposed “real consumer”.

              • Aerith-Waifu on 22/02/2023 - 21:57

                @jjjaar: Well thanks many for your input, really is an eye opener for me.

              • dtc on 22/02/2023 - 22:50
                +1

                @jjjaar: There will some additional nuances eg if you are in the background or a passer by or reacting to something but clearly not part of the main focus, then I dont know if a consent will be required to use a video with you in it, even for commercial purposes. However, if you talk or are a focus or involved in the main video, then your consent is probably needed

                • Aerith-Waifu on 22/02/2023 - 23:19

                  @dtc: If that's true then, how are those people getting away with it on all the random silly things they put on YouTube or Tiktok with that people been the whole focus of the stunt?

                • jjjaar on 23/02/2023 - 11:19

                  @dtc: I think that just displaying a sign in the vicinity that says who is filming, for what purpose and tells people how to opt out (usually it’s “leave the area”), that can satisfy a LOT for background people.

          • brendanm on 22/02/2023 - 21:29

            @jjjaar: Good info on how it would pass into commercial territory.

          • cerealJay on 24/02/2023 - 01:12
            +2

            @jjjaar:

            it’s about commercial gain that dictates whether or not you need permission for distribution

            That's not correct. Not sure why so many people are repeating this false information. There is no law that stops anyone making money from photos or video of people in public places where permission wasn't given by those seen in the photo or video.

            It's polite to seek permission where possible, but not required. It's common for commercial productions to seek permission, but not required. They are following guidelines, not laws. The subject in video couldn't sue unless the video defamed them in some way, or otherwise made false associations or representations about the people in the video.

          • JumperC on 24/02/2023 - 01:29
            +1

            @jjjaar: This is simply not true. Consent is still not required to publish photography of someone else taken in a public place, even if you sell that photo/film.

            They can’t take a photo of you drinking a coke and use it directly in an advertisement to represent that you endorse the product. But a close up photo of you drinking that coke in your front yard taken from a public place published in a photo book for $$$ is perfectly legal and doesn’t require any consent at all. There’s a reason street photographers and street photography/filming exists.

            More info:

            https://www.artslaw.com.au/information-sheet/street-photogra…

      • munecito on 23/02/2023 - 02:21

        Only for a commercial video

    • 1Kenobi on 23/02/2023 - 18:48
      -2

      Na … you cant go on a beach and take pics of all the pretty girls you like can you ?!
      Private or commercial use its not ok or tolerated

      • brendanm on 23/02/2023 - 21:18
        +2

        By law, it is legal. You have no assumption of privacy in a public space.

      • JumperC on 24/02/2023 - 01:34
        +1

        Technically yes, that’s not illegal. But some states like NSW have other laws where if they prove the photo was taken for indecent purposes that’s an entirely separate matter.

        It’s not enough to have someone incidentally in a photo of the beach but if they prove you’ve got a camera roll full of close ups of topless women on the beach and they get a complaint, then you’re probably in trouble.

        • Ok computer on 25/02/2023 - 13:20

          At Surfclub we had to order ( in a kind way )non associated members of the public not to film the kids

      • Scantu on 24/02/2023 - 13:48
        -1

        just wondering what inspires you to come on forums and fart out whatever incorrect thought pops into your head?

        • 1Kenobi on 24/02/2023 - 14:21
          -1

          I guess I had no idea it would trigger a hissy fit. I was wrong there too.
          It must be hard for those that are always right to tolerate the rest of us.
          I found some of the other comments instructive (and constructive) and Ive learned something.

          • Scantu on 24/02/2023 - 14:25

            @1Kenobi: What hissy fit…. projecting? I just don't understand why people say blatantly wrong stuff assertively it's weird.

    • belongsinforums on 23/02/2023 - 21:14

      how am i supposed to get off without watching tiktoks?

    • Thaal Sinestro on 24/02/2023 - 04:03

      Our society would be much improved if the government added Tiktok to the list of banned sites.

    • smpantsonfire on 24/02/2023 - 08:40

      This comment is quite ignorant.

      • brendanm on 24/02/2023 - 10:46

        What is ignorant about it?

    • morse on 24/02/2023 - 12:12
      -1

      I’m not sure if they have the right to publish it though if they specifically tell them that you don’t consent to them publishing the video. So yes they can film but publishing is more controversial from my understanding. The filmed people would of course hate to sue them to get any justice though, so highly unlikely.

      • brendanm on 24/02/2023 - 12:35

        They can publish whatever they like as long as it isn't for commercial purposes. Jjar explains this elsewhere in the thread.

        • morse on 24/02/2023 - 13:36

          I’m not really up with this but isn’t tik tok monetised? (Not that we know they were doing tik tok for sure)

          • brendanm on 24/02/2023 - 14:08

            @morse: That's not really the definition of commercial in this sense. Commercial would be someone filming an actual film, filming a commercial etc.

  • lachhelix on 22/02/2023 - 18:36
    -1

    😂

  • tsunamisurfer on 22/02/2023 - 18:42
    +18

    TikTok guys can film on public land but could be a bit cooperative.

    These days I am extra careful about taking photos or videos.

    At the beach, I will take photos / videos of my children from angles where other people are not in it. In fact its everywhere, the zoo, amusement parks, playground, etc.

    I don't want people thinking I am taking photos of them, just easier to avoid that drama even though I am allowed to take it.

    • Aerith-Waifu on 22/02/2023 - 18:44
      +2

      That's very consider of you. I just don't film while there is too many other people around. Especially in places like beach when lots of kids around

      • tsunamisurfer on 22/02/2023 - 18:47
        +1

        Yes…when its kids some people may get a bit more anxious.

        Just avoid the situation altogether, there's enough space to take photos of your own kids, selfies, tik tok shuffling or dance videos without alarming others.

        • Aerith-Waifu on 22/02/2023 - 20:42

          I wish more people are like this though

        • jjjaar on 22/02/2023 - 20:50
          +1

          Yes…when its kids some people may get a bit more anxious.

          The number of people that post every single photo of their children to Facebook/Instagram is crazy though. Definitely not all, but a truckload.

          Absolutely agree people should be wary about others filming their kids, but for many of them it would be good to look to their own behaviour too.

    • lachhelix on 22/02/2023 - 18:44
      +2

      I don't want people thinking I am taking photos of them, just easier to avoid that drama even though I am allowed to take it

      This is what I do too - much easier

    • brendanm on 22/02/2023 - 19:44
      -1

      This, it's not that hard.

    • mbck on 22/02/2023 - 20:45

      Why would you ever take photo or video with people in the background?

      Ohhhh the beach….right…

      • Aerith-Waifu on 22/02/2023 - 20:53
        +1

        Not long ago there was this guy taking up skirt photo of girls at one of the shopping centre and then uploaded online. Creepy as hell

      • Jenbrook on 23/02/2023 - 23:07
        +1

        Guess if you ever were to visit no one would know as you wouldn’t dare take a photo as it would be impossible at any major attraction to not have random people in the background.

  • harshbdmmaster718 on 22/02/2023 - 19:06

    Honestly first read the title as saying "TikTok Parents and Guys at the park". Disappointed lol. 😁

    • Aerith-Waifu on 22/02/2023 - 20:32

      What ideas are you into? Lol

      • harshbdmmaster718 on 22/02/2023 - 20:37

        I was expecting a story about degenerate Tiktok parents (they exist I am sure you know).

        Like trying to film a Tiktok video where they mouth words to a song and flip the camera around to their baby and do like 100 takes because the baby obviously can't act lol.
        Doing all this while in the full sun for that "best video quality" and then two guys came up to her and started telling her how what she was doing is wrong and then the Tiktok mommies husband gets involved and an argument/fight broke out.

        • Aerith-Waifu on 22/02/2023 - 20:42

          Oh dear! I know where you been watching all this time…..lol

          • harshbdmmaster718 on 22/02/2023 - 20:44

            @Aerith-Waifu: You honestly have never seen those before?? I have seen a few. They even have a name,"Facebook Mommies", but now they transition to Tiktok where instead of just their close friends they can brag about their child to the entire world.

            The worst ones though are when the parent deliberately puts their kid through something traumatic just to film their reaction. Honestly just garbage parents. Some are like purposely slapping ice cream out of their hand onto the ground or telling them they are going to shave all their hair off because they did something wrong. Both times the kid just starts crying and the parents think this will get them "views".

            • Aerith-Waifu on 22/02/2023 - 20:52

              @harshbdmmaster718: Well honestly no…..

              I don't go out much apart from doing delivery or going out with the kids.

              Certainly the first time I seen any tiktok video been made at the time I was there also.

              • harshbdmmaster718 on 22/02/2023 - 20:54

                @Aerith-Waifu: Yeah I guess we are a different generation then. At least we can agree on some points 😅. I don't have kids and definitely don't want any due to the current state of the world. Especially the effect the internet is having on people old and young. It's changing and affecting peoples personality and behaviour rapidly, which is where you end up with extreme behaviour which from the outside most times looks like attention seeking and self validation.

                I can even feel this changing behaviour myself just by using ozbargain, I say things I normally wouldn't or at least I don't think about it before I type something. And I think it's changing the way I might think in real life. But when talking in real life, you usually have to wait for the other person to "stop talking" so there is that short time you can actually think before you say something, or sometimes what they say at the very end changes what you decide to say. Anyway just what I have been thinking about lately.

                • Protractor on 22/02/2023 - 21:09

                  @harshbdmmaster718: Mate/miss, you win a cupee doll.
                  Once upon a time the majority of online convos were reasonable and there were about single % trolls. Now the opposite is the case. Being in the same position as you I can confidently say the time will come when all this chest beating on the net will amount to nothing. I have yet to attend a funeral where anyone values the wasted oxygen the deceased wasted on winning or wrecking a thread.
                  The current state of the world is the best it will ever be. Thanks to humans .
                  Jobs and growth (exponential) Vs finite resources is a very, very ugly evolutionary cul de sac.
                  Your unborn children will thank you eternally, ( and ditto whatever species survive our toxic impact as well.)
                  I have said it elsewhere.

                  • harshbdmmaster718 on 23/02/2023 - 15:59

                    @Protractor: I love kewpie mayo. Thanks!
                    Yeah it is no secret if you look at things 50 to 100 years ago in the developed world we are living in the equivalent of a paradise but what? People are still not doing well and lack fulfillment? Also what's with this "belief" that we are all constantly working towards an amazing future (utopia) and when we actually achieve it there is nothing but deeper problems (pepega). Honestly there is something extremely wrong when majority of people are being manipulated with complex algorithms (starting with the stock market computers developed by quants) and are not interested in what society has to offer.
                    My overall outlook is this. I participate in society, but reluctantly. There is nothing social that fulfills me (I feel like everyone is turned into a hollow NPC with nothing going on behind their eyes like myself) and of course the same is with material objects and the wonderful (cough) achievements we are taught to farm cultivate and acquire. I can feel as though I was preprogrammed to "want" these things from life (I acknowledge it by believing we are all packed into a train rocketing towards the final stop e.g. death with no brakes, but we are all in that same train), when the truth is everyone goes with it but dies unfulfilled and with doubt (e.g. athiesm). In other words I accept that I am an NPC that just "behaves according to plan" but I also feel as though something is deeply wrong so I can relate to those who withdraw from society and isolate themselves. Who knows I may end up like them one day so who I am I to judge them.

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