If you had a child in yr 12 graduating this year, what would be your advice to him/her?
In terms of useful degrees, cheap degrees, 3yr or 5yr duals, occupation, gap year etc
How to get ahead in life in a very challenging new world after Covid 19 with a looming recession that could last 10yrs.
It's more than this though.
Too many people in uni go because society defines this as success. In fact, nowadays university is mostly a finishing school for middle class white collar workers.
I spent a decade full time attempting to bail out with students failing at university because they didn't really know what they wanted to do with their lives.
In practice, university is a very expensive place to work out what you want to do with your life. Unless you are 100% sure that the degree you're studying is what you want to spend the next decade or more of your life doing you're better off not.
Work for a year. Or two. Find something you enjoy. Make money, see the world. Maybe you'll stumble into a decent career. Maybe you'll just work out that perhaps there is some benefit from going back to training.
Tertiary education nowadays is a business. There are dozens of pathways back in if you decide that there is in fact something you want to do, and just about all of them are less onerous, and often less expensive, than aiming for some mythical 99% TER.
And I say all of this as someone who only scraped through Year 11 and now has a Masters Degree.
Also, depending on which random blog post you get this information from, the average young person today is likely to have a dozen or more effective career changes in his or her lifetime. Almost no career or study decision a Year 12 student makes today will have any permanent effect on their life 10 years from now.
That's true. I think we have a bit of that entitled and lucky country mentality. I met an alumni from a top school at an open day who told everyone that she went to 7 different universities, has multiple degrees inc a masters degree and now teaches high school.
That would be totally unheard of in Asia because you must pay full fees up front. Less drop outs, more appreciative, more determined to finish…. well no choice if you don't want to get disowned by parents.
Re:
'uni isn't everything'
At the moment you would be mad not to acquire a well-paying trade qualification, as rapidly as possible; even if you are a 'really smart bloke/chick' who might like to get a uni degree one day later. More specifically a 'ticket' as an electrician, plumber, or carpenter.
There are many reasons for this, but I'll list a few below:
While 'getting a trade' you are actually paid while you acquire real experience. Conversely, while studying for a degree at uni you now rack up a huge HECS debt that increases each year, if you pay none of it off.
Various uni degrees fluctuate in 'value' re the marketability of your skills at a given location/in a given country/state. For example, a specific IT qualification may become highly uncompetitive (almost worthless) in Australia if a bunch of dudes in India or China suddenly decide to acquire that same qualification. There is zero risk of anything remotely like this happening if you acquire a qualification as an electrician, plumber, or carpenter—because these jobs simply cannot be performed 'remotely' by peeps in other countries, over the internet.
Job security re these three aforementioned trades is absolutely guaranteed; at least for the next 40 years.
Look up the various 'pay-scale' tables/charts applicable to Australia re these three trades, and you will note that these guys/gals are on a very good wicket, when you crunch the numbers (factoring in costs of getting qualified, time-taken to get qualified, time taken to make enough to buy a house, etc.).
After 'making a small fortune' by the time you are 30 years of age, setting yourself and your family up in a nice house, etc., you of course still have the option to do a course at uni, if you want. You could do it part time … two units per semester while still earning huge bucks at your trade …
I wish I had been smart enough to realise all this way back in the day. Unfortunately I was 'caught up in the expectation' that just because I did well at high-school, I 'had'/'should' go to uni. That is an utter fallacy, and I respectfully suggest that in the current 'financial/job climate', becoming an electrician, a plumber, or a carpenter is a much smarter move.
Do you think it’s easy crawling under houses once you are in your mid thirties?
Lots of new migrants are entering the trade industry, such as young Indian men. Expect this to increase supply of trade services
If you're any good then by the time you reach mid thirties you'll have paid off your house, have money in the bank and can then go full time to uni. All your practical experience will be much valued when you graduate. Plus you'll be able to earn decent coin working part time while studying.
ATAR is calculated by assessment not at the end
Answer and submit everything.
Have multiple backups.
There is no right way.
Undergraduate degrees are simply an extension of your education. There is nothing wrong with having a generalist degree. That's what post grad is for.
Consider a school leavers program but be aware they will chew you up during the 12 months. Takes a high level of resilience to endure adult level office bs.
Do what you are passionate about with a minor in reality. Love English Lit? Study a teaching degree as well. Like crearive arts? Take a marketing minor etc.
Love it! Passionate major Reality minor
He wants to go to Uni and he's really looking forward to it. His savings from pt job should be around $6 to $8k, reduced his shifts to one per week to focus on a high ATAR for better scholarship opportunities.
Yes there are many pathways and a degree is not necessary in Australia but in many other countries, a deg is the minimum. Whether it's to have some competitive edge or grad program in corporate or where it's necessary i.e nursing, teaching etc
I'm sure he will change multiple careers too throughout his lifetime. Gap year has pros and cons but the main con is they just continue and never end up going to Uni. Then yrs later they may not be able to climb up the ladder without that piece of paper. Pros is that you don't waste money and time on courses that you end out dropping out because you hated it.
My discussion with my recent yr 12 grad was if he wanted a gap year, he had to have a plan.
Ended up in a school leavers program. About to quit. Think - little training, little support, lot's of ar$e kicking. If yours is 19, they might be ok, but at 16, it's been tough (albeit highly educational).
For us, we dont care what job he does this year, so long as he works. Work ethic is important.
As for uni, they kinda do need to have some idea where they might like to end up. Otherwise theyll get an Arts degree (which is fine, I have one), but get sucked into a grad program paying APS4 that they could've got without a degree.
What does your kid have their eye on? And have they spoken to someone in the field?
He has no idea. So a gap yr and maybe a trade or a cert in some specialised course could be an option.
I know he does want to experience the social life at Uni too. He's very by the rules, consumed with co curricular, never dated, doesn't go out much even with Ps etc I think this will all change after High-school.
I love the earlier suggestion of passionate major reality minor. BA is fine too with a useful minor.
Do exactly what Bezos did, but call your business Congo or Borneo because Amazon is already taken. Make your first 100 billion sooner though so you can enjoy it while you're still young.
This is what I would tell my younger sibling, if I had one.
Maybe look to get into a industry that’s recession proof, ChatGPT/technology proof..
Nursing and Disability are the two Industries that won’t be going anywhere for the next 25 years atleast. One can even eventually start a business and scale towards that top 5% income bracket through the NDIS madness where they are just throwing money around at the moment, based on my limited anecdotal knowledge this is exactly what I am trying to invest into at the moment.
A friend who's a carer earned $1k+ and he took the wheelchair bound patient to a club, drink and then took his home n slept.
You could look at a cleaning business, cert 3 in community services etc
NDIS is the biggest rort. There r so many dodgy registered NDIS suppliers. The other one is RTOs, just keep getting as many certificates as possible but still on welfare.
I like the part where taxpayers get to pay for prostitutes to give wristies.
Do a licensed trade.
Your son will copy what his friends do
Like others, I would say if you aren't sure what you want, uni can wait (I also work at one and have a few degrees/certificates). Work or trade cert is a start. I knew I wanted to study (wound up in a field that was not my original major, but eh), studied for ages and struggled by but ended up in a field I love. My brother couldn't decide, went to work as a warehouse storeman in the meantime and now is a district manager and happy with that aspect of life.
I would also say definitely don't pick a degree just cause it's cheap/quick/employable. If you aren't interested, it will suck and you'll struggle. At the very least double degree with something you enjoy or are interested in. Worked with enough students in PR degrees to know how much of a struggle it is when your heart's not in it. Had a few transfer to other degrees and were so much happier for it despite them being less 'scomo friendly ' in terms of job readiness (a debate for another thread).
Avoid gap years, get an easy 3 year degree like commerce (12 hour weeks with pretty easy classes when I was there). Try to get work experience even in something like McDonalds, any work experience is better than none. Obviously getting relveant industry work experience is better but usually reserved for the latter years of university.
Interesting that everyone has such unique snd differing opinions!
Taking income and supply/demand for jobs into account trades are a much better option
But having said that 99% of kids will have no idea what they want to do at that age so take a gap year and travel the world
what subjects is he good at, eg maths would be good at accounting etc. Dont have to do manual labour with that. What about teaching, say primary. Good holidays and primary teaching cant be that hard. The degree might not be that easy,but worth it. And there is other work, such as tutoring with it. Dont do a double degree with early childhood, that bit is hard
Electrician or Plumber.
Those things always go wrong and someone always wants something done.
Get accepted into uni then take a gap year.
Save some more money so not reliant on parents.
Travel, meet people, see if that degree is still the right one.
Move out of home during uni.
Whatever the degree, meet as any people in the industry as possible during the course.
First ask what your child what profession they want to get into and then from there you can give advice on that profession or get them help with getting into that profession. Be aware that things change and be prepared for you child to change what they want to do.
Software engineer, lawyer if they're a people person, data scientist, mathematics PHD in statistics, data science, finance, algorithms etc. , civil engineer, electrical engineer (power/telecom), mechanical engineer.
Go nuts
5 things i learnt at uni that i don't regret.
Your network/friend group is critical. Socialisation and the ability to communicate doesn't come naturally. i went to as many social events as possible and from that my platform was greatly improved which helped me through grad jobs and finally where i am today. Yes i did have a penchant for partying but it's paid dividends later on in life (not that my body appreciated it).
Do a degree that can't be replaced by Ai. Lawyers, Arts in some respects are in trouble. I'm an engineer/project manager and we're reasonably safe.
Take a gap year to decide what you're really into (i did and i don't regret it). 10 years later i love what i do, i have 30 year old friends who are going back to uni and basically starting their professional career again.
Good marks don't mean much once you're in the workforce (except if you're a doctor/lawyer).
Life balance is critical, friends would burn the midnight oil just for another 10% in grade, but really the sleepless nights, stress and expectations didn't eventuate to a lot more. Get into sport/social sports, go to the gym etc. Burnout is real when you're trying to balance living on pennies, paying excessive rents while accruing huge hex debts. Don't medicate with caffeine, it only gives you anxiety and makes it worse.
I heard Ritalin us very popular at uni now
Haha, yep
Amongst other things
Really interested how the gap year helped with deciding what you want to do. I feel like I'd probably have just as little idea. Were you able to get work in the gap year that helped identify what to do?
It was more i didn't want to sign myself up for a 5 year degree and hate myself for it. So needed that 1 year to really confirm what i was passionate about.
I've seen it happen many times when people just jump straight into a degree fresh out of high school and 4 years later end up changing direction because it wasn't what they were truly into.
I worked the entire year and built up a solid baseline which covered any unseen financial issues.
when I finished year 12 (very badly) I went to TAFE and did a 2 year accounting bridging course which would then get me in to 2nd year uni accounting. the course was full time weekend course so I had plenty of time during the week to also enrol in a programming course and an electronics course.
luckily (after 18 months) I realised that accounting was not for me and took 6 months off to work. programming was also dropped (it was fun but not for me) and electronics gave me a good basis for understanding circuitry and how not to electrocute myself.
during that time i spoke at length to a friend who was doing philosophy at melb uni - so I enrolled as fee paying student and did 4 Arts subjects there. then I enrolled a Monash full time doing Arts. and did undergrad B.A. and then started a postgrad course (left that to move to Japan for 4 years) . Later I went on to complete post grad psych. I now work in the legal field for government department.
moral of the story (and what I tell my 3 high school children) - sometimes it takes a little while to find something you're comfortable with and feel some level of interest. and ultimately what you end up doing maybe unrelated to your field of study anyway.
probably if I hadn't gone to a Melb private school (and grown up middle class) then I probably would have done a trade (which some times I regret not doing)
Abort
do a software engineering degree, maybe even specialise in mobile app development (especially android), high in demand roles and pay big $$$
Don't do a gab year as it will turn you into a lazy ass .
This is what I'm worried about!
gap year is a trap, it's better to dive into uni while you still have your studying habbits and work ethics from yr12, unless you have everything planned out for the gap year and know EXACTLY how you will be spending it then sure a gap year could be the wiser decision. Also it's a good idea to start off with 2/3 units for the first semester imo, eases you into the uni lifestyle which is completely opposite to highschool.
It's 4 units per semester so you are saying perhaps go part time? Study 2 or 3 units?
It seems like he really can't wait to go to Uni. He has yet to experience many things and he's waiting until Uni. This yr he is 100% focused on his studies. He won't date anyone.
Maybe a general BA With a useful minor. Better that he enjoys it so even if can't get a job later, at least he loved it.
Def no Bio Science. My staff studied Bio Science with no plan B, did not get into Med and is now doing Nursing, 5 yrs to become a nurse with huge HECS debt.
I'm late but I thought I'd shill my degree :)
I think a Bachelor of Surveying is a hidden gem for someone that's technically minded and wants the chance to work outdoors. For the right type of nerd it's basically perfect.
I was originally planning to do a software engineering degree, but after a gap year decided I didn't want to be stuck inside forever. Some pros:
I should cut my ramblings off eventually… Here's a useful link: https://www.alifewithoutlimits.com.au/
Interesting. Thank you for sharing
STEM, Medical, Trade, or any Free TAFE supported course (they're supported because we need those people)
As someone who works for one: uni isn't everything. If you don't intially get in and you really want to go, there are pathways to getting in.