![[Prime] Ledger Nano S Plus (Orange, Blue, Ice, or White) $97.30 Delivered @ Ledger via Amazon AU](https://files.ozbargain.com.au/n/79/780279.jpg?h=9af6bead)
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[Prime] Ledger Nano S Plus (Orange, Blue, Ice, or White) $97.30 Delivered @ Ledger via Amazon AU
153
sqheaven on 08/06/2023 - 20:09 amazon.com.au (783 clicks)
Last edited 08/06/2023 - 20:17 by 2 other users
Last edited 08/06/2023 - 20:17 by 2 other users
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$97.30*
Would this be a good device to get to transfer my crypto away from Binance?
😂 Don't keep it on a exchange, I am sure you know about Celsius and FTx
Solid advice, just add don't keep it on ledger to the mix
Im just scared to move it anywhere lol maybe ill try with a small amount first
Id use a trezor - just search ledger backdoor to see why
Maybe you should search and read. It has nothing to do with the hardware. Only if you decide to use the recovery cloud option. Which is an option to just not use.
youre being downvoted by clowns reacting to clickbait they read from infuencers and rage bait media
but totally correct, ledger is safe to use. these "backdoors" were optional features enabled via firmware, tech illiterate people acting like it was some flaw or backdoor being added by the team. falling for scary words like "backdoor" to make them sound smarter.
or you can explain why
but mostly likely cause you cant, because you read third hand misinformation
Your reason for negging the deal?
While their grammar an use of acronyms such as "TBT" were not optimal, I feel like you should have been able to interpret what they were saying pretty easily.
The original version was illegible jibberish, including the title (check revisions). Mods shouldn’t have to rewrite posts by experienced, but lazy posters to make them understandable on a public forum.
According to the revision history, the original listing was legible, just didn't meet the standard posting format.
As for the "laziness", it is part of the mods job to make moderate posts, which includes making changes to them.
If they genuinely believe someone is being repeatedly lazy with meeting posting standards, they can talk to the person about it.@ihuntbargains: Fair enough, but I maintain that the post provided zero actionable or discernible information about the deal or product, irrespective of any differing expectations of what the mod’s job entails or reasonable standards of legible English.
As someone unfamiliar with the product, the post did not contain one single piece of information which may have been useful in clarifying what the product may be or why it was a deal.
That’s a neg from me. Those who disagree could and should upvote accordingly.
Does it come with Ledger's online backup recovery service? Lol
Unfortunately given its closed source you'll never know
https://twitter.com/oskararnarson/status/1659598900473241601…
“You have always trusted us. Whether you knew it or not. B*tch”
Note that it could be that one of the reasons why Ledger are offering discounts is that they have been embroiled in some heavy controversy over a new feature that allows users to export the recovery key so that it can be restored. This is a problem because it's kind've a foundational principle of hardware wallets that the private key never leaves the device.
Yesterday I checked it went up to 139$, which is a 10$ increase in its usual price. You're making me feel like I wasted my money 😂 Not the first time though
The "update" has been postponed.
You're right but It's more than that though, they said for years that it was impossible to extract the seed from the secure element where it lives, even with a new firmware update.
Now they've openly shown their hand and said it was always extractable, but we always trusted them that they wouldn't hence all is ok apparently
"trust me bro"
This is a problem because it's kind've a foundational principle of hardware wallets that the private key never leaves the device
this is also a fallacy and misguided assumption by the masses (albeit perpetrated by the ledger team)
it was always possible to introduce these features via a firmware update and that data could leave the secure element, even more so given their code was a black box
you kinda just bought it because it was built on mutual trust, given their entire business model relied on them not releasing malicious firmware
but it was always possible. Its being nitpicky, but this nuance is important to differentiate whether the device is safe to use or not, which it is
Hello Ledger amateur PR team - is that you?
In all of Ledger's product information and advertising, they've stated ""Your private keys can never be extracted from the Secure Element, even with a firmware update."
Now they are saying a firmware update can in fact extract your private keys. But due to the huge uproar, we've paused this update. And btw, we'll never do anything malicious or adhere to government subpeona's to release your private keys. Just trust us bro.
Were they lying before, or are they lying now?
did ledger invent some new firmware<>secure element technology we didnt know about?
yes they lied. most smart cookies already knew this, but it really didnt matter because it was still secure and the best there is on the market
because inherently what they claimed was not possible
so what people are upset about is discovering the lie and getting emotional about it. But the tech itself has never changed
fundamentally the way this hardware works, it was always able to leave the secure element. A way to make it more secure is to encrypt the seed and made decipherable via software/firmware
thus the firmware<>hardware relationship is symbiotic. It was stupid of them to make absolute claims
its like saying something can never be hacked. as an example, a theoretical product for layman and general audiences, its simpler to reassure people that it is very very very very difficult to nigh improbable to be hacked, but its simpler to just say "it cant be hacked" as companies do.
in this case they made a claim which was inherently 99.99% true and people are learning about the 0.1% and blowing it out of proportionThey could have always written custom firmware that enabled the seed to leave the device.
its the "how" that makes a huge difference, and in this case the nuance is nothing to get worked up over.hardware and software can be objectively analysed. Your personal emotions are irrelevant to their functionality. But you are free to boycott the company based on your emotions of course, but its technically misinformation to make subjective claims about the product
I'm not familiar with Amazon, but is the seller verified Ledger themselves? I would only buy direct from ledger. buying from a reseller you risk the device being installed with malware.
It says, sold by Ledger. Great point.
It is a risk i hear a lot.
i am also worried about the ledger i bought on amazon prior to their latest shenanigans (too late to return).It shouldnt be already set up when you receive it
And the ledger app should say it is genuine.
Is that enough?
But also never use just one wallet?
https://support.ledger.com/hc/en-us/articles/4404389367057-I…
https://support.ledger.com/hc/en-us/articles/6178949486109-C…
Nothing personal against OP.
But a negative due to Ledger:
- not being open source
- being able to broadcast your seed to the internet with a subscription service (what were they thinking, even if requiring you to opt in)
- data leak a few years ago
- the way the CEO doubled down on critics even saying if subpoenaed by the government, they would hand over your three encrypted shards, giving access to your wallet.
If you are unfamiliar with all the recent controversies, a quick Google news search will provide all you need, or check r/Cryptocurrency or the like. People are quite literally burning and using hammers to destroy their Ledgers. Or treating it like a hot wallet.
They had one job to do and they failed spectacularly. I doubt they will ever bounce back, and hence why the 30% discounts going around through Ledgers website (which Amazon has also pricematched to). I ended up getting a Bitbox02 (BTC Only) to replace my Nano S.
Statement from co-founder and ex-CEO expressing his disappointment
Only positive is it's better than keeping your crypto on an exchange. Glad that people are finally taking ownership of their digital assets.
Not sure that ms a valid enough reason to neg. The price is pretty good on the retail and despite the recent news about the seed it’s still the best product out there that supports most coins and nfts
Not sure that ms a valid enough reason to neg. The price is pretty good on the retail
There is an issue with the product, so completely valid negative and within voting guidelines.
Appropriate uses of negative vote
Issue with productYou think they would have had a 30% off sale if everything was going well? The fact they could allow the ability to transmit your seed phrase through a fireware update should be a major concern for most. They have always marketed their products to say this was not possible.
except out of the list of 4 things you mentioned that is "wrong with the product" is mostly wrong with the company, shitty handling and undesirable features. The product still works
Open source - its never been open source since day 1, people still accepted because the whole system is based on trust and it was in their best interest not to code anything malicious. nothing has changed, so if you wouldnt have negged a ledger deal a year ago, its not valid to neg on this reason alone today
the subscription feature is optional, the fear people have is that the team was able to introduce such a feature. Well back to the previous point of the close sourced code…it was always possible for them to do this. Whether they release it or not is irrelevant the level of risk remains the same. if you dont opt into it or never update the firmware, your ledger is in the same state as it was before they introduced this. people have this belief that this is some backdoor, theres a clear lack of understanding of how this tech works. It was always fundamentally possible to do all this
data leak has everything to do with their customer details from ecommerce perspective and nothing to do with the product itself. they did not have private keys or source code hacked. my buddy is bombarded with spam calls due to it but knows the ledger is fine to use
People are generalising what data leak actually entails. theres layers and nuances to itif youre worrid about being subpoenaed, then dont opt into that feature? again issue with company and principles nothing to do with product
you guys can be cringe and smash a $100 device but the product itself is fine
enjoy using a BTC hardware wallet that cant store ERC20
even vitalik, a bunch of ETHereum devs and other reputable devs in this space came out admitting everything isnt what the sensationalist headlines make it out to be. go check their twitter feeds where theyve posted ELI5 diagrams to explain
i honestly am appalled at the crap product idea and execution (shouldve been a separate product) and handling of the aftermath (didnt help english was their second language either, making their explainations extra poor at calming the masses when they had the chance) but also appalled at how quickly everyone latched onto the misinformation propagated by "the influencers"
then we have posts like this perpetuating second hand misinformation
im not defending the company or product but disagree with your post in principle
@furythree: Ok if closed source is so good, what's stopping ledger from deploying a firmware that due to a Gov't subpoena (or compromised internal actor driven by gains), extracts the seed from your or another persons device.
You won't be able to opt out of such a firmware feature if the firmware is coded to extract it. It might be optin now, but who's to know?
Given as you've rightly stated, the seed is 100% not secure and all it takes is a firmware to extract it, hence why would you trust them?
Sure if they've had a clean record of being honest and transparent you might, but this is the very opposite of that.
@Kharn83: Firstly, holy crap your reading comprehension sucks
Where did i say "closed source is good". I said its never been opensource. its not some huge secret or revelation that was discovered recently that they had closed source firmware
it was in fact a critique on the product since day 1 and everyone accepted it for reasons such as they could slip in malicious features. Im merely stating a fact, not providing any opinions. If you want my opinion i would pefer open source, but close source has its advantages, primarily being able to keep the code a secret from reverse engineering. so its not a black and white issue
im merely clarifying that its a moot point bringing up closed source like its somehow a big deal all of a sudden, while people have been comfortably using this closed source device for half a decadeadditionally being open or closed source has no relevance to the cloud feature they introduced since they coudlve added it regardless of open or closed source.
secondly, nothing is stopping them
the point is nothing was ever stopping them. none of this is a new revelation. its just an edgecase people didnt think of and focus on until recently
meaning the product, features and capabilities has never changed since day 1. This includes end user features, as well as risk scenarios
The only new thing is they decided to stupidly act on it and added an unwanted feature. Now theyre feeling the "customer feedback". which they clearly knew was going to happen. THe crypto sphere is the one sphere u dont want to mess around in terms of trust, and they broke that rule for the sake of profits.people are just getting emotional over it cause their own lack of understanding behind the tech leading to the discovery of this new information makes them feel betrayed
its fine to feel that way. but objectively the the product has not changed
they didnt "introduce" anything new or "add backdoors"Take another scenario where on Earth 2, Ledger decided to roll out Ledger Nano B device with this sharded cloud backup feature isolated to that product
if that were to happen, it does not change the fact that the existing ledger nano devices always had the capability for them to flash firmware to move the seed
the fact that the only thing stopping them doing it to the nano S, being memory limits tells you the limitation isnt on the firmware or secure element side. Most technical people understood this inherently
im not defending them because i dont like this feature either. But facts are facts and people arent being objective here muddling emotions with what is really going on
if you perpetuate this, then they are going to address the backlash against the irrelevant issues by tackling your emotions, instead of waht is more important, which is the hardware and firmware
If you are familiar with crypto, the adage "not your keys not your coins" is heeded with caution.
After them saying they could now do something previously advised as impossible… They're either dishonest or genuinely incompetent. Either way I don't think you should trust ledger with your coins by exposing your keys to their 'secure element we can never extract your seed' firmware.
Don't know why you got downvoted for saying facts 🤷
Yep. Protect your assets and stick with trezor
Why would the CEO want to go to jail? As if you would if you are in his position
Crypto = Fraud Galore
Hate it when your seed gets broadcast all over the web
Not broadcast , sprayed…
That's a banger of a Reddit thread. The ex CEO is getting totally reamed
not being open source - Ok and? Has any ledger device ever been compromised?
being able to broadcast your seed to the internet with a subscription service (what were they thinking, even if requiring you to opt in) - The firmware has been pushed back, no date has been given. its more likely than not it won't happen.
data leak a few years ago - Ok fine, I'm with you here.
the way the CEO doubled down on critics even saying if subpoenaed by the government, they would hand over your three encrypted shards, giving access to your wallet. - Again, no ledger device has been compromised.
For people holding multiple coins, there isn't any other better solution. Ledger is still the best and most secure to use as a multicoin wallet. If you disagree, please provide an alternative..
the product itself works fine, better than trezor IMO.
only issue was with the new firmware. Once they decide not to go through with it, its the best product out there for altcoins loversMinus the fact it may send your private key and seed online via a closed source firmware update, it does work pretty well
its like you cant read and have no sense of logic and only latch onto the bait you fell for
he literally said that if they dont release that firmware then all the issues with the product are gone. So how exactly "may they release your seed online"?
as to whether the fact that they "could do this". From a fundamental dev/engineering perspective they were ALWAYS able to do this. Doesnt matter if the CEO lied and said keys dont leave the secure element
Fundamentally how this tech works meant that this was not true. The point was that it doesnt matter, because it requires firmware to enable it and the system is based on mutually assured destruction and trust not to release such a thing
please stop acting like an expert
If you trust a manufacturer where the CEO has lied about their product for years for whatever random reason, and you trust this company in terms of a blind firmware deployment of unknown functionality onto your device, that's up to you.
Not to mention they leaked millions of customers personal identifying details a year or 2 ago. If they can't handle customer data and have a track record of being openly dishonest, then who exactly are you trusting?
At least with open source firmware the community can tell if a rogue element has been deployed.
@Kharn83: the topic of trusting the CEO isnt relevant or being discussed here where we are discussing whehter the device is safe to use in terms of changes to the firmware and hardware
you are going off the rails on a technical topic with emotions
i am specifically talking about a singular point as to whether or not anything has objectively change regarding the security of the ledger nano devices. And have explained above in this thread how it has not
but all your responses continue to rattle off about subjective emotional reactions to the revelations than the actual technical capabilities
just like what is the relevance of the customer data leak with regards to the ledger hardware itself?
first of all youre literally playing a game of telephone here, misrepresenting what happenned. They had a data breach of retail customer ecommerce information.
this is very different to you saying they "leaked" customer data, which implies purposeful intentionsecondly the retail customer info has no relevance to the security information necessary to access ledger devices, so how is that even relevant?
name a company that hasnt had a customer data breach the past decade and tell me which of those youve boycoted because it has any relevance to the fundamental functions of products they sell themselves
This is like saying optus had a customer information data breach. therefore the mobile and internet services they sell must be insecure too. What a leap of logic
If you trust a manufacturer
Everyone who bought a Ledger trusts the manufacturer. You always have to trust the manufacturer - they can do whatever they like !
in terms of a blind firmware deployment of unknown functionality onto your device
This is every firmware update for every closed source device ever - you're always at the mercy of the manufacturer. There's nothing new here.
You trust Ledger to release new firmware with no glaring holes, just like you trust Sony to do the same thing with your TV firmware, and Tesla to do the same thing with your Powerwall firmware.At least with open source firmware
Irrelevant for Ledger - it doesn't have that option.
I'm not sure what you think has changed here - Ledger have always controlled the firmware for their devices and could always have decided to be untrustworthy and do something dodgy in their firmware - but you trust them not to.
Another solution is to just sell the lot
the game is buy low, sell high, not the other way around mate.
There's always one who thinks he know more than othters and rants on about things like 'pyramid scheme', doesnt hold value, etc.
Hoping for a trezor model t deal
Trezor is compromised as well
Use of passphrase or SD card protect would nullify pin brute forcing
trezor or ledger?
$97*