Gas Prices Mania - I Cut My Usage in Half but My Bill Went up

eckorock on 02/08/2023 - 13:24
Last edited 02/08/2023 - 13:25

This time last year I used twice as much gas, yet my bill today is more expensive ($ cost/day).
Hard to believe it but the costs have effectively doubled.
This winter we have rarely used the gas heating, maybe once or twice a week on the absolute coldest nights, turning it on in the evenings for ~20 minutes before my daughter goes to sleep or has a bath. Downstairs in the living area we use reverse cycle A/C for heating.
Apart from that we use the hot water and gas cooktop as normal.

My wife sleeps in the bed with my daughter now to keep her warm.
In the morning the thermometer in my room is generally 9-12C, I stay warm by sleeping in 4 layers of clothing (singlet, thermals, jumper, and flanel pyjamas) and under a 2 layer doona + blanket. And Holeproof Explorer socks.

(I'm not relating that information for sympathy, just to demonstrate how I've managed to cut my gas usage down in half).

Retailer : Momentum / VIC

Current Bill

Usage: 4595MJ
Amount Due: $193
Days: 57

This time last year

Usage: 8360MJ
Amount Due: $196
Days: 63

Home & Garden Gas Supply

Comments

  • Aureus on 02/08/2023 - 13:27
    +5

    Worth looking at removing all of your gas appliances and going all electric. Probably a pretty quick ROI.

    • eckorock on 02/08/2023 - 13:29
      +3

      In my old apartment that I rented, I had instantaneous electric hot water (3 phase power) and it was hideously expensive. So I'm reluctant. Also my partner cooks a lot and would never go from gas cooktop to electric, (which we also had in the old apartment).

      • Aureus on 02/08/2023 - 13:34
        +4

        If you can go heat pump for hot water, it is very cheap. Tank + solar PV can be good also.

        A good induction cooktop is better then gas in almost every way.

        • Cheaplikethebird on 02/08/2023 - 13:52
          +3

          Yeah I always hear this but I follow a fair few chefs on Instagram and I'm yet to see one with an induction cooktop. Kenji from SeriousEats is a big supporter of induction but strangely has a gas cooktop in his home.

          I'll sign up once the sort of temperature control you see on the Breville Polyscience and the Hestan induction stoves is standard but I'm doubtful that sort of technology will ever make it to sort of stovetops being put in rentals.

          • Aureus on 02/08/2023 - 14:13
            +2

            @Cheaplikethebird: I dunno why the instagram chefs prefer gas cooktops. Maybe it is just what they are used to, or maybe it looks better on camera.

            I can just say from my own personal experience, as a non-chef, that a good induction cooktop is better then any gas cooktop.

            • Cheaplikethebird on 02/08/2023 - 14:19
              +2

              @Aureus: These aren't 'Instagram chefs' these are some of the most famous chefs in the world whose Instagram accounts I follow.

              • Aureus on 02/08/2023 - 14:28
                +2

                @Cheaplikethebird: Not meaning to dismiss them as "instragram chefs", just responding to you saying

                I follow a fair few chefs on Instagram

            • SydStrand on 02/08/2023 - 15:49
              +1

              @Aureus: Lots of those Instagram chefs were literally paid to shill gas.

          • SydStrand on 02/08/2023 - 15:56
            +1

            @Cheaplikethebird: Gas is pleasing aesthetically, and is superior for things like wok cooking. For purists and commercial kitchens with excellent ventilation, gas makes sense. But for the average wannabe-Masterchef home cook, induction is fine. It gets to temp much faster, is a far more consistent and controlled heat, and considerably more energy efficient, even if you're not self-consuming.

            • Cheaplikethebird on 02/08/2023 - 16:32
              +1

              @SydStrand:

              Far more consistent and controlled heat

              Not in my experience. Although it is really good at heating a specific spot in the pan. Also no visual indicator of heat.

              • SydStrand on 02/08/2023 - 23:24
                +1

                @Cheaplikethebird:

                Not in my experience. Although it is really good at heating a specific spot in the pan

                You're wrong. This is not even up for debate, it's physics. Induction coils generate eddy currents that circulate throughout the metal and heats uniformly, not just blasting a ring of metal via direct flame. It's also MUCH more efficient at heat conversion than burning natural gas (90% vs 50-60%).

                There's no visual indicator, but you can read your food, and will learn to correspond individual hob settings to low, medium, high, etc. This learning curve took me about a week.

                • Cheaplikethebird on 03/08/2023 - 07:01
                  +1

                  @SydStrand: Prob heats uniformly with things like tri-ply. You ever try using cast iron on an induction stove? You can literally see the ring it’s heating.

                • Cheaplikethebird on 03/08/2023 - 08:55
                  +1

                  @SydStrand: Here’s a photo of what I experienced. Except I wasn’t boiling water it just burnt a big fat hole in my seasoning.

                  From the chefsteps thread it was posted in -
                  “Induction hobs provide some of the spottiest, most uneven heat of all the burner technologies. While some of the more expensive induction ranges get around this problem by using a bunch of small induction elements, the vast majority of induction burners have a single coil beneath the cooktop and that's where the heat will be.”

                  So I guess I'm… not wrong and it… is up for debate.

                • Cheaplikethebird on 03/08/2023 - 11:05

                  @SydStrand: Oh looks like it's not just cast iron that has the issue, if you watch this video they're using a standard non-stick pan on a Bosch rangetop and only half the pan cooks. When they spin the pan it switches.

                  Here's a good rundown from a cooking instructor - "Induction is surgically precise" "Any part of the pan that is directly over a magnet works, as soon as it's not over a magnet even by 1 inch it does not work at all" "Unfortunately going from a 6 inch to a 9 inch magnet is insanely expensive"

        • eckorock on 02/08/2023 - 14:23

          OK so I'll look at replacing gas hot water with Electric heat pump then. Do I need anything else to make the electric heat pump hot water viable?

          • SydStrand on 02/08/2023 - 15:51
            +2

            @eckorock: Helps if you have solar PV. I upgraded to 270L electric heat pump water heater with Solar Vic rebate. Just set it to only heat during daylight hours (I set 11:00 - 17:00) and it's basically free water heating, excepting the loss of small feed in tariff.

            • eckorock on 02/08/2023 - 15:57

              @SydStrand: I don't have any solar panels right now - whats the ballpark cost of getting solar panels and a electric heat pump water system?

              • SydStrand on 02/08/2023 - 23:25

                @eckorock: Separate the purchases and get multiple quotes. I don't know what solar PV would cost now, with everything going so loopy. You may be eligible for different rebates.

      • Some Human on 02/08/2023 - 13:50
        +3

        Confirmed, electric cooktop is rubbish.

        • Indomietable on 02/08/2023 - 19:37

          Which one? The old heating element one or induction?

          • Some Human on 02/08/2023 - 20:05
            +1

            @Indomietable: The old one. I have a little gas campstove i use if i want to brown steaks

            • Indomietable on 02/08/2023 - 20:53
              +1

              @Some Human: Ah yes the old electric cooktop is rubbish, but the new electric induction is really good

    • 87percent on 02/08/2023 - 16:55
      +1

      Anyone ballpark how much it would cost to replace gas storage for a heat pump hws? I do have solar, but it’s only a 2kW system (old). I’m not eligible for the rebates either

      • eckorock on 02/08/2023 - 16:55

        yeah I would like to know this too.

  • CodeXD on 02/08/2023 - 13:28

    What is the breakdown of the amount due?

    Has the rates nearly doubled since last year?

  • angelkulit025 on 02/08/2023 - 13:29

    whats your current rate?

    • eckorock on 02/08/2023 - 13:30
      +2

      Daily $ 1.306800
      Usage $ 0.026400

      • Trance N Dance on 02/08/2023 - 14:13

        And that's why even with lower usage your bill has gone up. Compare your daily supply charge, a large portion of your bill in a working 2-3 person households would be supply charges.

        • eckorock on 02/08/2023 - 14:14
          +1

          yeah that's right, but what choice have we got? I can't control the daily supply charge, only the usage.

  • coffeeinmyveins on 02/08/2023 - 13:29
    +1

    In the morning the thermometer in my room is generally 9-12C

    Isn't there recent health advice around this sort of temperature being not conducive to long term health?

    Downstairs in the living area we use reverse cycle A/C for heating.

    TBH we've been using a heated blanket that was $50 from Kmart.

    The level of electricity usage is laughably low compared to an air conditioner.

  • Some Human on 02/08/2023 - 13:49
    +1

    Get daughter an electric blanket. This is a life/sleep saver in winter. No more spending 2 hours shivering yourself to sleep.

    • Muzeeb on 02/08/2023 - 14:18
      +3

      That means the misso might move back into bed with OP. OP might not want that.

      My wife sleeps in the bed with my daughter

    • JIMB0 on 02/08/2023 - 15:49
      -1

      I thought it was all Dan's fault as Albo wasn't even in power when the rises began.

      • jv on 02/08/2023 - 16:21
        -1

        Albo wasn't even in power when the rises began.

        He sure was…

  • bargaino on 02/08/2023 - 14:01

    Usage: 4595MJ
    Amount Due: $193

    That is only 16c/kWh . Your rates last year were very low by world standards, and now you are exposed to the global market.

    The question is how you are using so much gas, if the gas heating is rarely used. That is 80Mj/day, (or 22 kWh).
    Average daily household consumption in SA, where they don't heat much in winter, is only a quarter of what you are using.

    Could you have a leak in the water heater?

    • eckorock on 02/08/2023 - 14:06

      I didn't consider my usage was very high, but I figured my gas heating was sucking in a lot of gas so that's why we stopped using it as much as possible.

      Is 80MJ/day a high usage? Where can I find comparisons of average usage for gas?

      • bargaino on 02/08/2023 - 14:08

        It is a huge amount, given "we have rarely used the gas heating". See:

        https://www.finder.com.au/cost-of-gas#what-is-the-average-ga…

        • eckorock on 02/08/2023 - 14:11

          based on that link, the VIC average Winter usage for a ONE person house WITHOUT gas heating is 99MJ…

          so then I am well UNDER the average usage given I am a THREE person house WITH gas heating using 80MJ

          • bargaino on 02/08/2023 - 14:17

            @eckorock: Well that can't possibly be correct then.
            I was using around 22Mj/day for 2 people in winter water and cooking.
            Why would Victorians consume 5X as much as SA or WA if not for heating? And winter use double summer?

            • eckorock on 02/08/2023 - 14:21

              @bargaino: VIC is 100MJ/day and TAS is 200/day, so it has to be related to gas heating
              There is no other way to explain it

              • bargaino on 02/08/2023 - 14:26
                +1

                @eckorock: OP says "heating, maybe once or twice a week … for ~20 minutes".

                If not a water or gas leak, I reckon your wife is running the gas heater when you are not home.

                • eckorock on 02/08/2023 - 14:44

                  @bargaino: Just checked my Mum's bill and she is 8356MJ over 59 days (Autumn bill), she runs the gas heating a lot.

                  re: wife, no she wouldn't. But it might be a gas leak at the water, I guess I will have to check that. I presume I would be able to smell it too.

                  • bargaino on 02/08/2023 - 16:10

                    @eckorock: Yes, you'd smell if if in the nearby area. A hot-water leak would be more likely.
                    Poorly insulated storage tank?

          • lgacb08 on 02/08/2023 - 22:32

            @eckorock: No, that estimate is wrong, my 4 person household uses around 50-60mj/day for hot water heating and cooking (and we use gas stove a lot). This year in anticipation of rising gas price I've completely switched to reverse cycle heating, only use gas for hot water and cooking and the bill is still over $110 for 2 months so your few minutes of heating each day indeed cause the rise, and it will continue to be so your best bet is to get another aircon in the bedroom, ditch the gas hot water and go induction cooktop, which I'll be doing soon.

  • jv on 02/08/2023 - 14:01

    In the morning the thermometer in my room is generally 9-12C

    Have you checked the humidity? That has a significant effect on the temperature.

    • bargaino on 02/08/2023 - 14:10

      Using the reverse-cycle AC downstairs during the day will keep the humidity down, damp out.

    • eckorock on 02/08/2023 - 14:13

      OK I'll check it out , the humidity gauge is normally downstairs. I have an aluminium frame window in my bedroom which has become misaligned with the sash since the house was built 17 years ago and is now not properly closing, so I put window seal / foam on the window , but there is definitely a draft that comes in the gap.

      • jv on 02/08/2023 - 14:14

        I put a dehumidifier in my kids room. The humidity goes down from around 60-70% to just over 40% and this causes the temp to go from around 14C to about 19C

        • eckorock on 02/08/2023 - 14:16

          i have a reverse cycle AC in my bedroom so if I ran the dehumidifier mode on that (which generally has a cooling effect), you reckon that would increase the temp?

          • jv on 02/08/2023 - 14:49

            @eckorock:

            so if I ran the dehumidifier mode on that

            try it and post back…

            do it first thing in the morning when humidity is the highest…

        • GordonD on 02/08/2023 - 14:22

          I put a dehumidifier in my kids room. The humidity goes down from around 60-70% to just over 40% and this causes the temp to go from around 14C to about 19C

          That's complete nonsense. Yes, humidity can affect perceived temperature, but it doesn't affect measured temperature.

          • jv on 02/08/2023 - 14:48
            -1

            @GordonD:

            but it doesn't affect measured temperature.

            It sure does.

            I've been measuring it for a few weeks now…

            • lgacb08 on 02/08/2023 - 22:34

              @jv: you forgot to measure how much heating energy that dehumidifier used in the process. Humid air do cause heat loss but not to an extent of what you've described.

              • jv on 02/08/2023 - 22:39

                @lgacb08: All I know is that it works. I do not have the dehumidifier heating element on.

      • GordonD on 02/08/2023 - 14:24

        there is definitely a draft that comes in the gap

        That's job #1. If you can feel a DRAUGHT - a "draft" is something completely different - fix that.

        • eckorock on 02/08/2023 - 14:56

          I spoke to a window company in the Summer and they said there is no way to adjust the aluminium window if the sash is out of alignment, i would have to look at replacing the entire thing.

          I use the Raven foam draft stopper stuff on the window, is there any better way to fill that gap?

  • trapper on 02/08/2023 - 14:02

    If you were on a large discount with your provider (mine currently -50%) make sure this hasn't now expired and put you back onto the full rate.

  • trapper on 02/08/2023 - 14:05

    I stay warm by sleeping in 4 layers of clothing (singlet, thermals, jumper, and flanel pyjamas) and under a 2 layer doona + blanket. And Holeproof Explorer socks.

    Get an electric blanket, so nice and toasty.

  • bargaino on 02/08/2023 - 14:06
    +1

    my room is generally 9-12C, I stay warm by sleeping in 4 layers of clothing (singlet, thermals, jumper, and flanel pyjamas) and under a 2 layer doona + blanket. And Holeproof Explorer socks.

    That makes no sense. I sleep naked with a winter 50%-down doonah and am toasty warm on the coldest Perth night. OK, 9C I might be putting on a beanie.
    Buy yourself a decent down doonah.

    • franco cozzo on 02/08/2023 - 14:32
      +1

      isnt it doona?

      • bargaino on 02/08/2023 - 19:05
        +2

        Duvet is the proper word. Doona is local slang, so I'll spell it how I want :-)

    • Ghost47 on 02/08/2023 - 17:25

      A down or good wool doona can be quite warm, really doesn't take long to warm up either.

  • franco cozzo on 02/08/2023 - 14:37
    +1

    shit is bad…worked out we are currently paying around $10 a day for central, hot water and some cooking. 2 month bill is at around $540 with a concession so around $630 without.
    next bill will be even higher as the new rates will apply to the whole 60 days…it really is absurd that its gotten to this. supplier is agl

  • JimmyF on 02/08/2023 - 16:04

    Hard to believe it but the costs have effectively doubled.

    And everyone is crying about Dan removing gas from NEW BUILDS…….. Can you see why now?

    • eckorock on 02/08/2023 - 16:08
      +1

      Nope sorry… how does BANNING people from installing gas relate to the fact the usage and supply charges have doubled?

      What an absurd justification.

      • JimmyF on 02/08/2023 - 16:12

        how does BANNING people from installing gas relate to the fact the usage and supply charges have doubled

        LOL It was banned on new builds as gas prices are only going to up, don't lower greenhouse emissions. As you have found out, they have doubled and will keep going up and up. So better to cut off install of new gas houses now, than let that continue on.

        What an absurd justification.

        Enjoy your gas prices as they double every few years. No one is taking gas away from you if you have it.

        • franco cozzo on 02/08/2023 - 16:20
          -3

          enjoy your soaring electricity prices as more users flood the insuffiicient network…

          what a shitty attitude to have….were all going to be paying for these 'climate change' policies regardless of your energy needs & types

          • JimmyF on 02/08/2023 - 16:23
            +3

            @franco cozzo:

            enjoy your soaring electricity prices as more users flood the insuffiicient network…

            My solar power is basically free from here on in.

            what a shitty attitude to have….were all going to be paying for these 'climate change' policies regardless of your energy needs & types

            and gas will never be 'clean' or low emission, so why keep flogging a dead horse? As you said we're all going to be paying for it anyhow, so why keep paying and installing a dead product in brand new homes.

    • eckorock on 02/08/2023 - 16:10

      Maybe next he can BAN Mercedes and Porsche cars and force people to only buy Hyundai and Toyota, in order to save people money.

    • eckorock on 02/08/2023 - 16:12

      Or even better, he can ban people from buying lamb and beef and force them to only buy chicken because it's cheaper and better for the environment.

    • franco cozzo on 02/08/2023 - 16:18
      +2

      BS….

      this is all by 'design'

      • JimmyF on 02/08/2023 - 16:21
        -1

        this is all by 'design'

        Dan doesn't set the gas prices….. So do go on.

  • Ghost47 on 02/08/2023 - 17:22
    +4

    Crazy how much energy must be wasted in this country because houses are built like crap.

  • outlander on 02/08/2023 - 19:28
    +2

    Same here OP

    Gas started off ridiculously cheap because they had no way to transport it. It was either burn it off, or sell it for cents.

    Then they worked out how to liquify it and send it overseas, so thats what they do, and we were stupid enough to let them without mandating they reserve a portion for local use. So now, despite it being mined right here, we pay the same price as overseas. War pushed demand up, so we end up paying more to foreign companies who laugh as they make record profits.

    My plan is to switch to electric, utilizing Ambers cheap daytime power for water heating, and convert to LPG for smaller devices. But it's not something everyone can do. Heatpump tech has come a long way, so using that for water heating and house heating is cheaper than gas.

  • jpl on 02/08/2023 - 19:59

    Hey OP,

    Is this house or unit?

    Can you please paste the part from the bill where it is showing

    current reading, previous reading, BASE USAGE, heating value, PRESSURE FACTOR

    for both bills please?

    Most likely the pressure factor (conversion factor changed) if the base usage is similar.

    • eckorock on 02/08/2023 - 20:21

      3bd house.
      Volume x Heating Value x Pressure
      118 x 38.52404 x 1.01090

      Last year's bill:
      214 x 38.64841 x 1.01090

      Pretty much the same except the volume nearly halved.

      • jpl on 03/08/2023 - 11:05

        Looks like the Heating Value and Pressure Factor is normal.

        In this case it is the Charge/Rate increased. If you look at the detailed part of the bill breakdown for First xx.xx MJ/day and Next xx.xx MJ/day and Balance MJ/day, you can see the charge rate. Compare that with previous one you can see the difference there.

        I did a quick comparison, looks like the current bill is normal. Very likely that the previous year's charge/rate is cheaper.

  • Waltervp on 03/08/2023 - 09:08
    +2

    Don't forget there is a daily supply cost to gas as well, like $1/day!

    I swapped my gas heating to a heatpump electric one and that was not cheap as i needed a concrete spot outside for the tank, a new electricity circuit in the fusebox amd the hotwater system was not cheap. Gas hot water unit was worth next to nothing on 2nd hand market. I was out of pocket at least $3k, but i believe i save about $1000pa overall by doing this and perceive hot water is quicker now.

  • Member 0230 on 03/08/2023 - 10:47

    OP, just got our bill and found we used 36% less, but got a 5% higher bill. Need to shop around for gas to see if we can do better.

    Retailer: Powershop / VIC (Ausnet)
    Supply charge: 80.48 c/day before, 94.25 c/day now (14.6% higher)
    Usage charge: 2.16 c/MJ before, 3.51 c/MJ now (62.5% higher)

    • eckorock on 03/08/2023 - 15:55

      Yep, my first adjustment this year sent the usage rates 82% higher on my calculations.
      And then I got another letter last week with another adjustment

  • barratttc on 03/08/2023 - 12:59
    -1

    Thank Albo!

    • terrys on 03/08/2023 - 15:08
      +2

      Really? Did he set up the situation where our gas can be exported leaving us with a "shortage" and profiteering prices, or was it the crew in charge for well over a decade?

      Bear in mind gas is extracted and controlled on a state basis.

      It's a good thing that we didn't suffer the fate of those in West Australia under their commie regime otherwise we wouldn't be able to boast from the Eastern states regarding the size of our gas bills eh.

      • JIMB0 on 03/08/2023 - 16:43

        Apparently it was on Albo's watch.
        https://www.ozbargain.com.au/comment/14108380/redir

        • terrys on 04/08/2023 - 08:14

          As flagged by the companies before the election.

          Still, carry on with all the kleptocratic party have left - lambasting Labor for failing to reverse thirteen years of ideological vandalism in a few months.

  • Roney on 03/08/2023 - 17:14

    Isn't electricity cost going to spike again soon? Still a gut-wrenching cost impact by going for gas conversion to electricity.

    • terrys on 04/08/2023 - 08:15

      Added to which the price of gas has tumbled on international markets. Still, the northern hemisphere winter is approaching so that may change.

  • gesco on 04/08/2023 - 16:10

    Is the gas heating ducted? Check that the ducts are in reasonable condition. If the tape on the joints has let go, or the plastic cover over the ducts has holes then your expensive hot air will be escaping.

  • gesco on 04/08/2023 - 16:22

    I see a few people suggesting an electric blanket on the bed. Some electric blankets say not to have them turned on when there is someone in the bed - used only for preheating the bed.

    A hot water bottle is the more traditional way of preheating a bed and then keeping your tootsies warm. If you cover them (maybe with many layers of towels) they are not too hot and retain their heat for longer. Rocks heated in the fire predates them but is less practical for most today.

  • xylarr on 05/08/2023 - 16:28

    If it's 9-12 C overnight in the bedroom, you seriously need to look at the insulation of your home.
    This is seriously where the cheapest gains can be made.

    • eckorock on 07/08/2023 - 21:44

      What can I do about this, if the house has poor insulation?
      I've put door seals on the external doors and covered up the air con vents

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